How long did it take you?

Burgenstein - Harshlands
Burgenstein - Harshlands Posts: 41 Arc User
edited February 2013 in Assassin
Hey guys, Im just a bit curious about some of the math concerning full warsongs.
I've run 76 full runs now and i've never once seen the netherworld guidance mold drop (or trackless dimension...or Unicorns tragedy)

I realize that 3rd cast nirvana will soon be outdated as more and more people get 3rd cast r9. however I do like collecting rare weapons , especially daggers...

So im curious, how many runs did it take you guys to get the netherworld guidance mold, and does anyone know what the drop rate is? thanks

I just feel after 76 runs that it should have surfaced at least once :/
Post edited by Burgenstein - Harshlands on
Burg is the word

Comments

  • Jaabg - Sanctuary
    Jaabg - Sanctuary Posts: 2,256 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    One run two traceless dimensions dropped. It's a matter of luck. I have never seen a r9 bm axe drop after 120 runs. Other people have seen 6 of them drop in 50 runs.

    Best to ask your faction/friends, when at last boss, and no one in squad wants those molds to invite you, so you can get the mold.
  • Arocus - Archosaur
    Arocus - Archosaur Posts: 97 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    It took me about 45 full warsong runs to see (and get) the claw mold, which was all I was running for outside of badges. They dropped with the dual axe mold, another mold I had never seen drop before. I've seen daggers drop three times, with two of those daggers dropping together. I think it took me 20 runs or so to see the daggers?

    As far as I can tell, weapon drops are completely random. Your chance to see it would be 1 out of all the other possible drops (10 R9 weapons + 21 Nirvana weapons). It's about a 6.3% chance to get the daggers.

    And Jaabg: I've had the full set of Dervish molds since about my 10th run, including the weapon and I've seen it drop twice more since then, so it really is just a matter of luck. Hopefully you'll see yours soon!
  • Azizsixer - Raging Tide
    Azizsixer - Raging Tide Posts: 249 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    In over 100 runs I've seen the dagz drop 3 times....lol

    Once was like one of the first few runs we did...2nd time was like 30 runs later and the other well tht was recently...comes down to luck really.

    tbh I frequently see every single mold drop except dagz lol
    Even the R9 dagz drop more often -_-
  • Xainou - Sanctuary
    Xainou - Sanctuary Posts: 5,369 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    About 30 runs and pretty sure I've seen them 2-3 times. That is when we don't get spammed with R9 **** or useless g16 forks ._.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    Licensed tail brusher of ƙɑƙʊɱɑʊ ~ only the fluffiest
    Outrunning centaurs since 2012~
  • Jaabg - Sanctuary
    Jaabg - Sanctuary Posts: 2,256 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    Isn't that always the case? The mold you want will never seem to drop, and every other mold in the game will drop left and right b:chuckle. Pwi machine troll powers need to have fun as well.

    Thank you Arocus, it dropped for a friend who was doing warsong, i joined the squad after they killed the boss, picked the drop and ran away.
  • Sakubatou - Sanctuary
    Sakubatou - Sanctuary Posts: 4,001 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    I'm around 45 runs and seen 5 drop, including a double dagger drop. I didn't grab them at first because someone always needed them and I needed many other things (G16 Claws, Full AA magic armor, Magic Sword, and Daggers). It also took 9 rerolls for me to get -int on my claws so 9 x 20 + 60 original badges = 240 badges and I didn't have the badges to be rerolling claws and daggers anyways.

    So I let friends and squadmates take the first 4 sets. The 5th set that dropped I was on my cleric, said the only thing I need was daggers, and said it many many times. They dropped, I squealed with girlish delight, said I'd pick them up on my Sins account, and as I'm running back someone picked them up. "I didn't know anyone needed". So he was going to make them for me using his own badges for his mistake, but he got ****. Someone who shares his account was LF him in WC and when I talked to them he apparently logged in, changed his password, stripped his account, and hasn't been on in 3 weeks....

    So now I'm back on the hunt. Has been about 15 runs and no daggers. Worse, every squad I run with has 2 or 3 people LF daggers it seems.
    Seven 100+ characters leveled the hard way. Free to play. Mystic, Psychic, and Wizard left to level. b:victory
  • Salari - Raging Tide
    Salari - Raging Tide Posts: 2,102 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    Can't remember exactly how many runs but it was below 10, and it has been so long since i reroll'd the daggers i can not remember that either but its less than 5. Which gave me this

    http://imgur.com/Mm3NL

    I just happen to decide to reroll with my +6 refines and to my amazement was only 4 stones. So it was a win win

    b:victory
    Marine - Marshall - Raging Tides - Retired
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    DEMHEALSMAN - Dreamweaver
    Yes, because people really need 900+ dex or 1000+ magic just for the lulz
  • Fissile - Archosaur
    Fissile - Archosaur Posts: 607 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    They dropped on run number 74 for me. Took me over 100 runs to get my sleeve mold. Go figure. I do want to make another set that I can reroll over and over til I get 2x or 3x int without ruining the ones I already have.b:surrender
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Geshwur - Raging Tide
    Geshwur - Raging Tide Posts: 570 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    In over 100 runs I've seen the dagz drop 3 times....lol

    Once was like one of the first few runs we did...2nd time was like 30 runs later and the other well tht was recently...comes down to luck really.

    tbh I frequently see every single mold drop except dagz lol
    Even the R9 dagz drop more often -_-
    Seen Netherworld drop 3x, and R9RR only once. (Bought the mold for my sin, got them and it dropped in the first run after making my Adversity and getting to +10)

    FORTUNATELY for me, nobody else in squad wanted, and we were unable to sell them, so I was allowed to pick them in case I'm ever ready to get them on my sage sin (Who is more likely to be the one I go full R9RR on if I do so, since I like being able to spam MORE chi-req skills in PvP than my demon can without Apoth)

    (As in, spark + Headhunt + Powerdash while still being able to stunlock)
    Current Gears
    pwcalc.com/90f636550cbd5beb
  • skaitavia
    skaitavia Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    Can't remember exactly how many runs but it was below 10, and it has been so long since i reroll'd the daggers i can not remember that either but its less than 5. Which gave me this

    http://imgur.com/Mm3NL

    I just happen to decide to reroll with my +6 refines and to my amazement was only 4 stones. So it was a win win

    b:victory

    Wow. I am legitimately jealous of those daggers. :x
  • Salari - Raging Tide
    Salari - Raging Tide Posts: 2,102 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    Skaitavia wrote: »
    Wow. I am legitimately jealous of those daggers. :x
    b:cute

    Yes it is not as much as having 2x int i like so much is the range +1. I kinda get a bit of the best of both worlds. The extra int to give me a slightly higher dps while chilled in r9 gear and the range which is helpfull in pve as much as it is in pvp/tw ect. The only downside so far is that they do not have the dph potential that my R8 daggers have yet, even having them +9 now and +11 on my R8's. Maybe once I get them to 10 and atleast 2x 75 garnetts I can get a better damage comparison. DPS wise they beat out the R8's obviously(5aps v 3.33). I was messing around with a video program and posted it below for a loose look at it's damage on a ? boss and I believe demon HF. This was with +9 with a 32 shard.


    http://youtu.be/Qz-IvXgJmK8

    All in all I am very happy with them. Next step is to get them and my leggs(+8) to +10, then work the rest of my armor to 10. Get a int tome and replace those tt99 orns with something more appropriate, so i am farm more efficiently. Next is refining and recasting my R9 armor to s2 and deciding on what shards if any i will put in them
    Marine - Marshall - Raging Tides - Retired
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    DEMHEALSMAN - Dreamweaver
    Yes, because people really need 900+ dex or 1000+ magic just for the lulz
  • Jesusisback - Raging Tide
    Jesusisback - Raging Tide Posts: 480 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    The only downside so far is that they do not have the dph potential that my R8 daggers have yet, even having them +9 now and +11 on my R8's.

    I find that really hard to believe considering that t3 daggers have +40 atk levels and r8 doesn't. b:surrender
  • Salari - Raging Tide
    Salari - Raging Tide Posts: 2,102 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    R8 has max patt + 185 x2 which scales with Dagger Devotion and ends up being more than 40 attack lvl's give on the high side and attack lvl's scale with nothing. What the G16's do give is more lower end damage and better refines. At +10 the G16's will be an almost exact match lower to upper bound refinement wise to my R8's. i will do a test on vid to see and show how they match against my R8's. Below is my char screen spark damage which will help you some.

    http://imgur.com/JBoRK G16
    http://imgur.com/NCg0W R8

    PS you have to remember too having a higher refine rate on G16's is even more an issue in PVP/TW as it's attack level's will be negated by any defense levels the other char has.
    Marine - Marshall - Raging Tides - Retired
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    DEMHEALSMAN - Dreamweaver
    Yes, because people really need 900+ dex or 1000+ magic just for the lulz
  • Maelael - Heavens Tear
    Maelael - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,497 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    R8 has max patt + 185 x2 which scales with Dagger Devotion and ends up being more than 40 attack lvl's give on the high side and attack lvl's scale with nothing. What the G16's do give is more lower end damage and better refines. At +10 the G16's will be an almost exact match lower to upper bound refinement wise to my R8's. i will do a test on vid to see and show how they match against my R8's. Below is my char screen spark damage which will help you some.

    http://imgur.com/JBoRK G16
    http://imgur.com/NCg0W R8

    PS you have to remember too having a higher refine rate on G16's is even more an issue in PVP/TW as it's attack level's will be negated by any defense levels the other char has.

    I now present to you, the same arguement I've had all weekend with like 9 people:

    http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1397441

    Do eet. You'll find R8 is not as good as you think when you calc in the attack levels vs opponent defense levels (Do 15, 30, 40, 50, 75, and 100 def levels FYI).

    You'll find at the higher def levels the 40 attack levels extremely shine.

    (Just recast those R8 daggers for Def level R8r in case you get silly and wanna pull a flag under fire)

    But DAMN Im jelly of the 2x int you guys get.
    pwcalc.com/bb6fc16982637a5c / pwcalc.com/28948ee5778526f5
  • Sakubatou - Sanctuary
    Sakubatou - Sanctuary Posts: 4,001 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    R8 has max patt + 185 x2 which scales with Dagger Devotion and ends up being more than 40 attack lvl's give on the high side and attack lvl's scale with nothing. What the G16's do give is more lower end damage and better refines. At +10 the G16's will be an almost exact match lower to upper bound refinement wise to my R8's. i will do a test on vid to see and show how they match against my R8's. Below is my char screen spark damage which will help you some.

    http://imgur.com/JBoRK G16
    http://imgur.com/NCg0W R8

    PS you have to remember too having a higher refine rate on G16's is even more an issue in PVP/TW as it's attack level's will be negated by any defense levels the other char has.

    R8 range adjusted with 1.38 attack levels = 25502-35333
    G16 range adjusted with 1.78 attack levels = 28516-35118.

    Comparing +9 G16 to +11 r8. So G16 has a much higher lower end and a similar upper end, despite r8 having +228 more in refines. Not to mention that G16 is attacking 50% faster.
    Seven 100+ characters leveled the hard way. Free to play. Mystic, Psychic, and Wizard left to level. b:victory
  • Salari - Raging Tide
    Salari - Raging Tide Posts: 2,102 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    Maelael - I know what you are saying pvp wise, but my comment was more directed to pve.
    I would also like to reroll my R8's but until my G16's out DPH my R8's in PVP I will not(and getting the mats is another matter, my barb needs rerolling of r8r ect first)

    On double int, I was not going to reroll those daggers because they had good add's for TW. I just happen to have enough badges and decided to reroll them again. I am glad I did, chilled with R9 armor I am .83(around)APS chilled. The range and int help alot in that aspect.

    ----
    Sakubatou - Yes you are right, but in game it does not work out that way atleast for me. Personally I do not think att/def levels work exactly as we all think they work or should work. I think they could also be given different weight in different circumstances. Say after opponents pdef reaches x, each attack level is reduced by x and looses x value per x pdef to a predetermined maximum loss(very loose example). Same with mdef on a caster. The DPH my R8's do, exceed what the G16's do pve and pvp wise at current refinement and shards in every test i have done. In TW, instances mini bosses and NW.

    A good example pve wise is say Minister in 3-3. With full buffs (cleric + barb) mire and lvl10 subsea or power dash the G16's spike upto 19k, my R8's have reached 25k DPH but generally spike around 22-23k. Conventional thinking would say this could not happen but it does. I learned just to use formulas here in posts as more of a guide. If you also notice in the video I spiked around 40k dph, I have hit over 70k before with the same BM with my R8's. That is a big margin.


    Thanks for the feedback guys and HF b:bye
    Marine - Marshall - Raging Tides - Retired
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    DEMHEALSMAN - Dreamweaver
    Yes, because people really need 900+ dex or 1000+ magic just for the lulz
  • Maelael - Heavens Tear
    Maelael - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,497 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    Maelael - I know what you are saying pvp wise, but my comment was more directed to pve.
    I would also like to reroll my R8's but until my G16's out DPH my R8's in PVP I will not(and getting the mats is another matter, my barb needs rerolling of r8r ect first)

    On double int, I was not going to reroll those daggers because they had good add's for TW. I just happen to have enough badges and decided to reroll them again. I am glad I did, chilled with R9 armor I am .83(around)APS chilled. The range and int help alot in that aspect.

    ----
    Sakubatou - Yes you are right, but in game it does not work out that way atleast for me. Personally I do not think att/def levels work exactly as we all think they work or should work. I think they could also be given different weight in different circumstances. Say after opponents pdef reaches x, each attack level is reduced by x and looses x value per x pdef to a predetermined maximum loss(very loose example). Same with mdef on a caster. The DPH my R8's do, exceed what the G16's do pve and pvp wise at current refinement and shards in every test i have done. In TW, instances mini bosses and NW.

    A good example pve wise is say Minister in 3-3. With full buffs (cleric + barb) mire and lvl10 subsea or power dash the G16's spike upto 19k, my R8's have reached 25k DPH but generally spike around 22-23k. Conventional thinking would say this could not happen but it does. I learned just to use formulas here in posts as more of a guide. If you also notice in the video I spiked around 40k dph, I have hit over 70k before with the same BM with my R8's. That is a big margin.


    Thanks for the feedback guys and HF b:bye

    Yes but...is it the same BM, with the same def levels, with the same pdef...you get the idea. Thats why the damage calc is there, and every time Ive compared to in game hits - its correct (I did a lot of damage testing on my Barb...).

    Im not sure where else to respond given Im not sure on the point youre making (either its wrong, or Im reading it wrong?)
    pwcalc.com/bb6fc16982637a5c / pwcalc.com/28948ee5778526f5
  • Burgenstein - Harshlands
    Burgenstein - Harshlands Posts: 41 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    I finally got them :D ...ended up buying a recraft service for 50m x.x

    Now on run 98 and they still havn't dropped lol...but the damage is smexy :D
    Burg is the word
  • Sakubatou - Sanctuary
    Sakubatou - Sanctuary Posts: 4,001 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    So now I'm back on the hunt. Has been about 15 runs and no daggers. Worse, every squad I run with has 2 or 3 people LF daggers it seems.

    42. Took me 42 runs to see another one.

    I got in the habit of grabbing an warsong inscription each time so I could keep track, not because I needed one. Kind of like putting bottle caps in your pocket when out drinking so you can remember how many beers you've had.
    Seven 100+ characters leveled the hard way. Free to play. Mystic, Psychic, and Wizard left to level. b:victory
  • AshenSkies - Heavens Tear
    AshenSkies - Heavens Tear Posts: 949 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    There's those random G16 fists on HT with 3x 0.05 int. SO jelly of those :*(
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    _Surreal_
    Thank you Silvychar for my siggy :)
  • Bhavyy - Raging Tide
    Bhavyy - Raging Tide Posts: 1,083 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    3 runs it was trolltastic - and i picked it up :3
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    youtube.com/bhavenmurji
    pwcalc.com/65816fd7725681e1
  • Dragonreaper - Harshlands
    Dragonreaper - Harshlands Posts: 20 Arc User
    edited February 2013
    SHUT UP SINS, YOU'RE ALL OP demon SIN flubbercake