some next steps

FoosYu - Harshlands · October 2012

Hi fellow assassins!b:cool

right now my current gear is something like this http://pwcalc.com/9a260e436b21b1e4

i am currently trying to find 3rd cast netherworld guidance mold and farm a couple more badges and i'll have g16 daggersb:victory gonna also try and +10 my daggers.

if i get something like 40att/int/dex/range for example (or whatever kind of roll that has int), how much more survivability would i have compared to my current g15 DDT in TT 3-x?

i know it's like the worst thing to hear "what can i solo?" but since i havn't gotten the daggers yet, i want to know how much more i guess "easier" will it be with g16b:surrender

i got my deaden nerves and tidal protection ready with demon rib strike and i already feel i can survive just a bit longer than i usually do, but not sure how it'll be like with stronger daggers :P

was also wondering, would it be recommended to continue to pursue to +10 gear? or would +7 set already be good enough (most likely with buffs of course)? i was kinda thinking maybe i'd at least +10 orns first so i can get some more def

ty in advance for help b:thanks

Fonyan - Heavens Tear · October 2012

I'd get better shards + refines on that gear first if I were you. Seen too many g16 +10 wep sins die easily because their gear cannot support the damage they deal. b:surrender

HideYoHubby - Archosaur · October 2012

Fonyan - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I'd get better shards + refines on that gear first if I were you. Seen too many g16 +10 wep sins die easily because their gear cannot support the damage they deal. b:surrender

Actually he got enough hp&p.def to live most things. Full warsong can be bit irritating but with G16 you can use O`Malley and still keep aggro off everybody, unless there is another G16 sin or R9 with similar/higher refines. My G16 daggers rolled with 2x +18 vit and -int. Armors +7, orns +6, pants 4 soc vit stoned. I think my hp is 7.8k unbuffed.

@OP: I solo`d 3-1(GBA & Steelation included) during 2x, well I had my barb with me for for devour to kill things faster. I can solo PQ3 boss uncharmed, though barb buffs might be good just in case option. Ive also tanked 3-2 emperor in squad and he didnt feel that bad - back when my daggers were only +7. The only thing I can compare is my R8+10 and difference in BP heals and speed to kill stuff is plain ridiculous. I`m going to +11 my daggers next, after which I +10/vit stone my armors. You got enough hp/p.def to live lot of good farming instances and Id pursue more dps as long as armors get finished afterwards.

FoosYu - Harshlands · October 2012

now my gear is at http://pwcalc.com/b5bcbe413baf009bb:victory

i'm gonna try doing some solo stuff at first and i hope my hp is over 10k buffed

ty for the info hideyohubby, i've tried the genie boss in 3-1 and can do fine with regular bb/barb and dg, rarely die but this was before my +7 set. i've never actaully tried 3-3 so i'm gonna try that soon! hope i don't die b:surrender

also, yeah i feel like in a way my daggers are sorta like r8r-ish and i'm still 4aps b:shutup and damn killing faster/bp more sounds pretty good already to me so guess it's a good thing

i was thinking the same thing actaully, thinking of using extra coins to try to +11 or +12 the g16 daggers and then work on maybe +10/vit/dot but that'll be a while b:shocked

any more experience/opinion is welcomed b:thanks

SpeedxBolt - Sanctuary · October 2012

FoosYu - Harshlands wrote: »

now my gear is at http://pwcalc.com/b5bcbe413baf009bb:victory

i'm gonna try doing some solo stuff at first and i hope my hp is over 10k buffed

ty for the info hideyohubby, i've tried the genie boss in 3-1 and can do fine with regular bb/barb and dg, rarely die but this was before my +7 set. i've never actaully tried 3-3 so i'm gonna try that soon! hope i don't die b:surrender

also, yeah i feel like in a way my daggers are sorta like r8r-ish and i'm still 4aps b:shutup and damn killing faster/bp more sounds pretty good already to me so guess it's a good thing

i was thinking the same thing actaully, thinking of using extra coins to try to +11 or +12 the g16 daggers and then work on maybe +10/vit/dot but that'll be a while b:shocked

any more experience/opinion is welcomed b:thanks

edited the link so it worked, since you included the b: victory smilied right at the literal end of the url, which made the bbcode think it was part of the url

Sakubatou - Sanctuary · October 2012

I would focus on +10ing your belt and your pants. I'm a big fan of pdef over hp for sins. My view is its better to lose less hp than have more hp but lose it easier since its easier to replace when less is lost.

Your belt will refine for better pdef than your ring. Your neck and belt will refine the same but if you are account stashing gear pieces to other chars its normally the belt. And your pants are the highest refining piece of gear you have.

While you do that save coin for +10ing a weapon. For most people this is a 1-6 is done with mirages for little cost, 7*, and 3 x 10* orbs so about 135m. G16ing a weapon really isn't expensive, it just requires alot of duty badges. Cost besides the duty badge are essence of offense and 2m coin, so about 5 mil a reroll. Half of what rerolling G15 was. Its also harder to spam rerolls since you need 20 badges each time. So while you are working on getting your belt, pants, and the items needed to +10 a weapon you can be farming G16.

I think it will make a significant increase in survivability. First, it'll be a significant jump in dd. Not sure exactly how much but 25% when you hit 5.0, and probably around 15% more than G15 itself (even inlcuding the sac strike). So a 30-40% (just guessing) dd jump and more paint heals. Plus you'll be losing alot less hp from not using sac strike.

Azizsixer - Raging Tide · October 2012

Only thing i think others missed is restatting tht vit into dex if u hit 3 vit/mag you'd get a nice dmg increase and some crit

Empu - Sanctuary · October 2012

FoosYu - Harshlands wrote: »

i know it's like the worst thing to hear "what can i solo?" but since i havn't gotten the daggers yet, i want to know how much more i guess "easier" will it be with g16b:surrender

Tbh, I doubt G16 will give you much, if any, improovement survivability wise when soloing or tanking. You got G15 +10 on a small hp pool (well, your hp are pretty good, but not amazing), so I think extra bp heals won't change much. You'll just solo a bit faster.

In squads, I'm pretty sure you already know where to hold back and where you can tank. It won't change much. You'll hold aggro over more sins, for any other class you already did. You'll just do more damage.

So, if you now already struggle staying alive or have to hold back or need to search for buffs all the time, upgrade your armor. If you, for what you are used to doing and what you like to do, have no problems with your current survivability, go directly for the weapon. Your hp and defence aren't amazing, but still pretty good. Your armor surpassed the stage where you could become one of those totally outbalanced "damage vs survivability" sins. Imo it's more a choice between soloing/tanking more (upgrade armor 1st) or soloing/tanking the same at higher speed (upgrade weap to G16).

Sakubatou - Sanctuary wrote: »

G16ing a weapon really isn't expensive, it just requires alot of duty badges. Cost besides the duty badge are essence of offense and 2m coin, so about 5 mil a reroll. Half of what rerolling G15 was.

G16 is expensive when coming from a +10 G15 though, which is the OP case. G16 is cheap considering you go from r8 +5 straight to G16 and only then put in good refines/shards, which is not a very realistic case. Orbs and shards have gone up in price to become a major part of a weapons final price.

FoosYu - Harshlands · October 2012

I feel at least in my opinion i can survive for the most part except for the bosses that hit like over 20k dmg (which i'm not sure any sin can really survive but prove me wrong!)

for the most part, i'm gonna be getting those g16 daggers (whenever the hell netherworld guidance mold drops >_>) and i have a bunch of coins so i'm wondering....would +11 be a significant jump compared to +10 daggers? i don't really know the math for it and i've never even touched a +11 so i have absolutely no idea the secrets behind +11 (and i guess +12) b:surrender

as well, i know that i have some higher-grade gears than others but i don't feel exactly any reason to +10 only certain things. at the moment i'm thinking either +7 set or go and get me +10 set (maybe even +12 by the time we have rank 20 b:shutup) but my mind might be changed once i start doing more consistant 3-3/nirv.

thank you everyone for the great suggestions/opinions, hope to hear some more b:thanks

Olbaze - Sanctuary · October 2012

Sakubatou - Sanctuary wrote: »

I would focus on +10ing your belt and your pants. I'm a big fan of pdef over hp for sins. My view is its better to lose less hp than have more hp but lose it easier since its easier to replace when less is lost.

Generally, I look at the amount of pdef reduction you get and compare that to refining for HP.

Your belt will refine for better pdef than your ring. Your neck and belt will refine the same but if you are account stashing gear pieces to other chars its normally the belt. And your pants are the highest refining piece of gear you have.

Untrue, actually. Sign of Frost:Chaos gives +802 pdef on +10, whereas Lionheart Belt gives +735. Since we're not talking about getting a whole new piece of gear here, the starting pdef on the Lionheart Belt is irrelevant.

Empu - Sanctuary · October 2012

FoosYu - Harshlands wrote: »

I feel at least in my opinion i can survive for the most part except for the bosses that hit like over 20k dmg (which i'm not sure any sin can really survive but prove me wrong!)

It's more about what you do and want to do. For instance, I doubt you can solo 3-2/3-3 Emperor with your current gear, but do you even aspire to do that ? Your refining/shard progres should be based on that. Once you actually got G16 and +10ed them, you will probably find that in squad nirvana the time gain is pretty much inexistend (as you already were at the point you can enter squads that take more time to reset and re-enter then actually running the instance). Then you'll be probably going for either 3man nirvana and focus go for +11, or soloing higher TTs/be pissed about the lack of barbs for bh and focus on armor.

Well, it's more an example, but that's how it usually goes.

btw, I wonder which bosses hit you over 20k xD

FoosYu - Harshlands wrote: »

for the most part, i'm gonna be getting those g16 daggers (whenever the hell netherworld guidance mold drops >_>) and i have a bunch of coins so i'm wondering....would +11 be a significant jump compared to +10 daggers? i don't really know the math for it and i've never even touched a +11 so i have absolutely no idea the secrets behind +11 (and i guess +12) b:surrender

as well, i know that i have some higher-grade gears than others but i don't feel exactly any reason to +10 only certain things. at the moment i'm thinking either +7 set or go and get me +10 set (maybe even +12 by the time we have rank 20 b:shutup) but my mind might be changed once i start doing more consistant 3-3/nirv.

thank you everyone for the great suggestions/opinions, hope to hear some more b:thanks

Personally, I would go for armor. +11 vs +7 seems to become a to big gap to me. But your choice.

In any case, don't directly +11 your daggers. Keep them at +10 a few weeks at least before deciding what you do. +11 costs a lot for not much compared to how you could spend it on your armor.

FoosYu - Harshlands · October 2012

Empu - Sanctuary wrote: »

btw, I wonder which bosses hit you over 20k xD

warsong bosses sometimes hit me for like 32k b:sad

also, after i get +10 daggers i'll see whether i need more dmg or more tanky-ness (if that's a word?). i'm guessing it'll probably be to refine armour/orns buuuuuut we shall see!

i'm thinking maybe at least do duo 3-2/3-3 with my friend(s) so not soloing yet xD i sorta figured with my hp and def that i wouldn't stay alive for too long.

man +7 is pretty awesome hp, wonder what it's liek at +10/+12 b:chuckle

Jesusisback - Raging Tide · October 2012

empu - Sanctuary wrote: »

I Doubt You Can Solo 3-2/3-3 Emperor With Your Current Gear

Well he can definetly solo all of the 3-2/3-3 hard bosses if he can manage to stay focused

Personally with http://pwcalc.com/57a1167ef16a81fa being my current gears i'm able to solo Emp/Steelation/GBA on 3-2/3-3 (even though it's hard and I tend to die ALOT sometimes depending on how unlucky I am with debuffs) buffed on Emp/GBA and not always buffed for Steel. xD He does need an OMalleys blessing and apoth ready though.....even with sage spark + OMalleys on, Emp can still manage charm ticking hits b:surrender

Empu - Sanctuary · October 2012

FoosYu - Harshlands wrote: »

i'm thinking maybe at least do duo 3-2/3-3 with my friend(s) so not soloing yet xD i sorta figured with my hp and def that i wouldn't stay alive for too long.

Duo'ing (or even dualling) with a barb, cleric, mystic or wiz (at least with my high channel wiz) is pretty easy. Or at least way way way easier then doing it solo. Easiest way for me to do Emperor is to just go with barb to spam fleshream/stomp a while, then go with sin and kill it fast. The bosses are said hard because LA tank them now, but on a vit barb he hits like nothing at all. If you have someone healing you, it's very easy as well (considering you won't be a 1 shot with your gear).

Jesusisback - Raging Tide wrote: »

Well he can definetly solo all of the 3-2/3-3 hard bosses if he can manage to stay focused

Maybe it's also because of my vocabulary I say that. For me, solo = alone and self-buffed only b:laugh In any case, solo'ing with a lot of pots and charmticks isn't really worth it besides the "WOOOT! I just solo'ed Emp 3-3!" effect the 1st time. If you can do it with your gear, good job !

Buff_me - Raging Tide · October 2012

Depending on what stats u will get on g16 daggers, i would do something with Orns. If u get lucky and it will come out with 2x intervals, i would make R9 belt and Cube neck, and refined them to +10, so u can farm w/o problems

FoosYu - Harshlands · October 2012

most likely i got my 9k unbuffed hp cleric AWESOMESAUCE friend to heal me (or probably metal mage b:surrender) so i think for the most part we should be fine in duo-ing.

man wtf is this, i've seen like every other mold except for netherworld guidance

wish the molds didn't have to be so strict on being bound -.-"

that reminds me, what's the dmg like in 3-3? is it mostly magic or physical? i might actaully be forced to buy some stuff to boost magical defense like charms and what not b:shocked

i can probably get sage bell for pdef which i actaully start to find a notice after like 10k pdef and i've died less in WS for some strange reason....hmmm...

Empu - Sanctuary · October 2012

FoosYu - Harshlands wrote: »

that reminds me, what's the dmg like in 3-3? is it mostly magic or physical? i might actaully be forced to buy some stuff to boost magical defense like charms and what not b:shocked

Damage isn't all that bad in 3-2 or 3-3. Most bosses don't get over 4~5k, Physical or magical depends on the bosses. The thing is there are quite a few bosses that purge, amps, seal, stun, sleep, dot, and such things. And tidal protection won't save you all the time (they do it more frequent then once per 10sec) nor will you be able to kill them before the buff runs out. So you can't just run in and spark every 15sec like you're used to doing on most bosses.

For that same reason, with a healer of some kind or a barb that can snap aggro when sealed (or better builds a bit aggro before you go in), the bosses are actually pretty easy. But you have to make your way to them ofc b:laugh

FoosYu - Harshlands · October 2012

Sweet! Funny thing is, i had barb and cleric buffs, was doing a full lunar run with some friends and i survived 20+ mobs on me with only bb b:shocked

doing duo with cleric for 3-2/3-3 should be easy then and maybe we'll find a bm to ddg? might speed up the run a bit quicker per boss and can have someone to aggro boss incase i die

man wtf is up with pwi trolling and not dropping netherworld guidance mold

Buff_me - Raging Tide · October 2012

FoosYu - Harshlands wrote: »

Sweet! Funny thing is, i had barb and cleric buffs, was doing a full lunar run with some friends and i survived 20+ mobs on me with only bb b:shocked

doing duo with cleric for 3-2/3-3 should be easy then and maybe we'll find a bm to ddg? might speed up the run a bit quicker per boss and can have someone to aggro boss incase i die

man wtf is up with pwi trolling and not dropping netherworld guidance mold

Duoing any instance with a good cleric is just a piece of cake for a sin. Id say, only Harpy would make a trouble there

FoosYu - Harshlands · November 2012

someone help me find some voodoo magic book to get interval on my daggers b:surrender

least i finally got the g16 dagger b:victory just wish it didn't cost so much chienkun

some next steps

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