How to interpret the % drop?
Jaabg - Sanctuary
Posts: 2,256 Arc User
I was happily farming away these books
I got curious, how is the % factor interpreted.
For example take this mob that drops the book
How many times server count drop rate ?
1
That means the drop counter will run once (assuming non 2x)
Drop rate of severals items
0: 79.8231%
1: 15.1327%
2: 4.0354%
3: 1.0088%
The above are probabilities of getting 0~3 drops from that mob, depending on the random number chosen by the game.
Here is the main point of interest for me
Probability of additiolan items
1: 0.6094%
Q 1) Is that 0.6094% totally independent of all values? That means i have 0.6% roughly that the additional drop table will activate? I have 1 in 167 chance of getting this table to activate?
Since i am interested in the books that drop from the additional table, which are not affected by 2x, lvl difference, and amount of drops have no affect on this table.
Q 2) The drop percentage of the book is 0.1094%, how is that probability interacting with the probability of activating the drop table at 0.6094%
Q 3) In the default drop table, there are two values, Default drop rate and Real drop rate, how are those two numbers suppose to be interpreted?
I am guessing that because there is a chance to drop 0~3 items, the real drop rate is taking into account all the probabilities and giving you the chance of getting the item, hence the lower drop rate?
Q 4) Knowing that info, how does on know how many tt mats bosses will drop in tt runs? Since their counter is 1+ with 100% to drop 3 items.
Slightly confused and muddled myself. I did read up on these topic in forums, but still not clear on the how the stuff is calculated or understood.
I got curious, how is the % factor interpreted.
For example take this mob that drops the book
How many times server count drop rate ?
1
That means the drop counter will run once (assuming non 2x)
Drop rate of severals items
0: 79.8231%
1: 15.1327%
2: 4.0354%
3: 1.0088%
The above are probabilities of getting 0~3 drops from that mob, depending on the random number chosen by the game.
Here is the main point of interest for me
Probability of additiolan items
1: 0.6094%
Q 1) Is that 0.6094% totally independent of all values? That means i have 0.6% roughly that the additional drop table will activate? I have 1 in 167 chance of getting this table to activate?
Since i am interested in the books that drop from the additional table, which are not affected by 2x, lvl difference, and amount of drops have no affect on this table.
Q 2) The drop percentage of the book is 0.1094%, how is that probability interacting with the probability of activating the drop table at 0.6094%
Q 3) In the default drop table, there are two values, Default drop rate and Real drop rate, how are those two numbers suppose to be interpreted?
I am guessing that because there is a chance to drop 0~3 items, the real drop rate is taking into account all the probabilities and giving you the chance of getting the item, hence the lower drop rate?
Q 4) Knowing that info, how does on know how many tt mats bosses will drop in tt runs? Since their counter is 1+ with 100% to drop 3 items.
Slightly confused and muddled myself. I did read up on these topic in forums, but still not clear on the how the stuff is calculated or understood.
Post edited by Jaabg - Sanctuary on
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Agreed, read that post. Some clarification for you though:
Because that book is an additional drop, it is unaffected by drop count, times counted, 2x, etc. Additional drop in particular is simple. The "chance of additional drop" is exactly that, nothing modifies it. IF that chance fires, then the drop rate listed next to the book is your chance of that book being your additional drop.
With regards to the rest, real drop rate is just their "adjusted" chance of the drop considering the other listed factors. It isn't 100% accurate, but it helps you get a feel for how likely something is to go your way.
The one thing that isn't mentioned in that post is 2x. During 2x, non-fixed gold drops will be double what they otherwise would be, meaning a mob that always drops exactly 10k will still drop 10k, but one that drops 400-600 will drop 800-1200. Outside of that, drop rates themselves aren't touched, nor are chances of specific counts being dropped. The "times drop rate is counted" is doubled though.
I've heard reports that a few specific bosses have an exception preventing 2x from doubling their rates (Mostly in Warsong). As of yet, there is no way to tell exactly which ones have this exception without seeing firsthand. I can confirm not all fixed drop counts are this way, and notably both card bosses and Darksbane treasure map monsters will indeed drop double.0 -
The one thing that isn't mentioned in that post is 2x. During 2x, non-fixed gold drops will be double what they otherwise would be, meaning a mob that always drops exactly 10k will still drop 10k, but one that drops 400-600 will drop 800-1200. Outside of that, drop rates themselves aren't touched, nor are chances of specific counts being dropped. The "times drop rate is counted" is doubled though.
And let's just clarify that doubling the counts only doubles the quantity of total items you get, not the quantity of any specific item. On average, the quantity of a specific item that you will get from a boss is Default Drop Rate * Quantity of items dropped.I've heard reports that a few specific bosses have an exception preventing 2x from doubling their rates (Mostly in Warsong). As of yet, there is no way to tell exactly which ones have this exception without seeing firsthand. I can confirm not all fixed drop counts are this way, and notably both card bosses and Darksbane treasure map monsters will indeed drop double.
The thing is, Darksbane bosses only drop the specific items and a single Gem from the Additional Drop menu.
For Card bosses, it looks like you're getting double the quantity of Materials, but that isn't the reality. It's caused by the Card Bosses having a ridiculously high rate of dropping Materials, such as Abyss Rider with his 8/9 chance.I am Olba. Not Ol, not Baze nor Blaze. And even less would I go by Olblaze. Please, take a second to read a person's username.
If you see b:cute be sure to take a second, calm look at anything I said.0 -
So this is why my rough fur farming for my quests is going so terribly!
Ugh! I just thought I was having strings of bad luck, now I know my level 70 attempting to farm furs to get her blacksmith quest done is inefficient. I can't really say that I like that now that I've seen it, it only encourages people to skyrocket the prices of low level materials, I swear rough fur is between 25k-30k each no matter where I look, which is really depressing knowing how many I'll need for the quest q.q..
What am I suppose to do? Strike gold and buy everything? Or just make new characters to grind and then delete them when they get too high?![:\](https://forum.arcgames.com/pwi/resources/emoji/confused.png ":\")
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Nyarian - Heavens Tear wrote: »What am I suppose to do? Strike gold and buy everything? Or just make new characters to grind and then delete them when they get too high?
Most people just grind on stuff for their appropriate levels to get the coins to buy from the shops.
Another option would be leveling an alt to mid to high 30s and farm the furs with them.I am Olba. Not Ol, not Baze nor Blaze. And even less would I go by Olblaze. Please, take a second to read a person's username.
If you see b:cute be sure to take a second, calm look at anything I said.0 -
Olbaze - Sanctuary wrote: »Most people just grind on stuff for their appropriate levels to get the coins to buy from the shops.
Another option would be leveling an alt to mid to high 30s and farm the furs with them.
This. In addition, you can just leave those alts level 30 if you want use them as hay farmers. One good thing about the way drops work is it gives low levels a chance to farm materials everyone needs to make money for their skills/gear etc. I mean they gotta have some avenue, especially since now DQ in that level range has been nerfed to npc for one coin each.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Thanks Silvy for the superb sig
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Olbaze - Sanctuary wrote: »Most people just grind on stuff for their appropriate levels to get the coins to buy from the shops.
Another option would be leveling an alt to mid to high 30s and farm the furs with them.
I'd much rather the second option, I'm not giving a single one of those greedy high priced cat shops a single coin of my money! b:angry
At least this post opened my eyes to why I wasn't getting rough fur at the drop rates I read about online 0 -
Make a new character to grind your mobs at their level, give the character mirages and make genies to keep them from leveling. If you happen get a genie with good lucky points, you can sell it for coinage for more mats.Nyarian - Heavens Tear wrote: »So this is why my rough fur farming for my quests is going so terribly!
Ugh! I just thought I was having strings of bad luck, now I know my level 70 attempting to farm furs to get her blacksmith quest done is inefficient. I can't really say that I like that now that I've seen it, it only encourages people to skyrocket the prices of low level materials, I swear rough fur is between 25k-30k each no matter where I look, which is really depressing knowing how many I'll need for the quest q.q..
What am I suppose to do? Strike gold and buy everything? Or just make new characters to grind and then delete them when they get too high?
EDIT: I sort of recommend a mystic, the earthguard quests level them quickly, you don't have to grind to level your personal pocket tanks, and if you stay below 31 you can get free mana charms daily.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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Nyarian - Heavens Tear wrote: »I'd much rather the second option, I'm not giving a single one of those greedy high priced cat shops a single coin of my money! b:angry
At least this post opened my eyes to why I wasn't getting rough fur at the drop rates I read about online
They aren't being greedy. The supply is limited which naturally makes the price higher and low levels don't have a lot of avenues for making coins. Many of them don't really merchant that much, the lowbie stuff you see in the Auction House is usually grinded. The stuff in the catshops tends to be merchants though. Not to mention to get a good amount they gotta grind for quite a long time. Low Levels have the worst coin to effort ratio IMHO.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Thanks Silvy for the superb sig
VenusArmani's word of the moment: Expand your Vocabulary, Expand your horizons!
pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=17992481&postcount=189
Pusillanimous:
1) lacking courage or resolution; cowardly; faint-hearted
2) Proceeding from or indicating a cowardly spirit0 -
Jeremied - Sanctuary wrote: »Make a new character to grind your mobs at their level, give the character mirages and make genies to keep them from leveling. If you happen get a genie with good lucky points, you can sell it for coinage for more mats.
This seems like a good option.. I have a level 25 Assassin that I do enjoy killing things on...0 -
Olbaze - Sanctuary wrote: »And let's just clarify that doubling the counts only doubles the quantity of total items you get, not the quantity of any specific item. On average, the quantity of a specific item that you will get from a boss is Default Drop Rate * Quantity of items dropped.
The thing is, Darksbane bosses only drop the specific items and a single Gem from the Additional Drop menu.
For Card bosses, it looks like you're getting double the quantity of Materials, but that isn't the reality. It's caused by the Card Bosses having a ridiculously high rate of dropping Materials, such as Abyss Rider with his 8/9 chance.
If I understand what you're saying properly, I have to disagree. Darksbane bosses will drop two of an item (or six for Enlightened) when normally they only drop one (or three). The gem of course isn't doubled, being an additional. With regards to card bosses, you do get double the materials. I killed Stone Brain two days ago (normally 100% 3 drops, 8 times counted, 24 drops total) and a total of 48 materials dropped.
If I did misunderstand what you're saying, my apologies.0 -
If I understand what you're saying properly, I have to disagree. Darksbane bosses will drop two of an item (or six for Enlightened) when normally they only drop one (or three). The gem of course isn't doubled, being an additional. With regards to card bosses, you do get double the materials. I killed Stone Brain two days ago (normally 100% 3 drops, 8 times counted, 24 drops total) and a total of 48 materials dropped.
If I did misunderstand what you're saying, my apologies.
Ah... right. By "Material", I meant the respective Stamina/Power/Dexterity/Spirit Material, not the Desert Tower Miniature, Stone of Scarred, Tear of Heaven or Leaf of Unicorn Forest that also drops. What I meant to say is that the reason why the quantity of Stamine/Power/Dexterity/Spirit Material might seem to double is simply because they have an extremely high drop rate.
The reason the Darksbane bosses drop exactly double is because they have a 100% chance to drop the specific drop item. Thus, the quantity that they drop depends fully on the counts, as every count gives you a 100% chance to get the drop.I am Olba. Not Ol, not Baze nor Blaze. And even less would I go by Olblaze. Please, take a second to read a person's username.
If you see b:cute be sure to take a second, calm look at anything I said.0 -
In that case yes, I agree. We're on the same page. Sorry for the confusion there.0
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Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »
I did read that
, but still could come to terms how the probabilities are to be interpreted inside the additional drop table.
That would result in the book drop to be about 0.000006666836, or about 0.0006666836%, that would mean 1 book every 15k mobs i kill, potentially?
As for rough fur, or other lower mats. Make a low lvl alt, in that lvl range. Get your daily t3 charms from Harbinger of Fortune Woyn Get a decent weapon for that level, my archer for that lvl kills them in 5~7 shots. Drop rate is not the best or worst, but in about 20~40 minutes i had about 30 rough fur.0 -
The original post asks more about the additional or secondary drop tables.
Everyone is saying they are not affected by 2x - which I get that part.
However, using the OP mob, the additional table has 0.6094% chance of being accessed. I understood this to mean that every time the drop count cycle was run there was a 0.6094% chance the table would be accessed? So that on 2x, you would still increase the chance, however slightly, that the additonal table would be accessed (without affecting the percentages of the drops inside that table and that the table itself is only run once in the case that it is accessed)?
I dont know if what I'm trying to say is clear there.....but am I wrong in thinking that?0 -
Cotillion - Dreamweaver wrote: »However, using the OP mob, the additional table has 0.6094% chance of being accessed. I understood this to mean that every time the drop count cycle was run there was a 0.6094% chance the table would be accessed? So that on 2x, you would still increase the chance, however slightly, that the additonal table would be accessed (without affecting the percentages of the drops inside that table and that the table itself is only run once in the case that it is accessed)?
I dont know if what I'm trying to say is clear there.....but am I wrong in thinking that?
You're a bit off.
What 2x Drops does is it doubles the amount of counts for drops. However, Additional Drops are not part of these counts: Additional Drop is always rolled only once. This can easily be observed with bosses like Dragon Eel, who has a 100% for Additional Drop. If 2x drops affected Additional Drops, you would always get 2 shards from killing Dragon Eel, or any of the other level 5 Treasure Map bosses. However, this isn't true as you always get 1 shard.I am Olba. Not Ol, not Baze nor Blaze. And even less would I go by Olblaze. Please, take a second to read a person's username.
If you see b:cute be sure to take a second, calm look at anything I said.0 -
The part of regular drops I was right in thinking, you just worded it far better than I could, lol. I was under the wrong impression of the additional drop table though, thanks.Olbaze - Sanctuary wrote: »You're a bit off.
What 2x Drops does is it doubles the amount of counts for drops. However, Additional Drops are not part of these counts: Additional Drop is always rolled only once. This can easily be observed with bosses like Dragon Eel, who has a 100% for Additional Drop. If 2x drops affected Additional Drops, you would always get 2 shards from killing Dragon Eel, or any of the other level 5 Treasure Map bosses. However, this isn't true as you always get 1 shard.
I did not realize there was a mob that had a 100% secondary drop table, which would have clarified that right away b:thanks
Now....in past 2x people have claimed multiple books dropping from Hellfire/Peaches, I have not personally seen this nor claim it to be true. This was however, in part, the basis for how I thought the second table would work. Given what I've read in this topic would render that impossible, yes?0 -
Cotillion - Dreamweaver wrote: »Now....in past 2x people have claimed multiple books dropping from Hellfire/Peaches, I have not personally seen this nor claim it to be true. This was however, in part, the basis for how I thought the second table would work. Given what I've read in this topic would render that impossible, yes?
Correct.0
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