Should squad mode TTs have a minimum number of squadmates required?
Sakubatou - Sanctuary
Posts: 4,001 Arc User
Aps in now a way of life in PWI and has been for some time. If your aps character isn't your main, then most of us at least have a farming alt that we've invested our coin in to make more coin.
Most of us spam Nirvana's. Do our daily BHs. And... That's about it. The expansion somewhat revitalized interest in Lunar and Warsong and what is beautiful is it opened up interest in the entire instance, not just the single BH path. BH Seat and Aba were altered to expand gameplay by, if not eliminating aps use, making other forms of gameplay more effective. You know what I mean when your normal 20k attacks are reduced down to 800 damage on the Seat boss while the casters enjoy full damage outputs making them valuable DDs.
My point is squaded play is not at risk. But I don't always want to rely on others for making my coin. I'm a father and sometimes I want to make my coin at my own leisure while constantly hopping up to say "don't eat that", "don't sit on the dog", "get down from there", "go tell your mother you're stinky." Sometimes, squad play just isn't for me because rl calls.
So when I hop on to quickly farm a TT it's a little disheartening that it takes me 20 minutes to gather the people to open a TT so I can farm it. I WC, offering coin, I harass faction mates, I corral friends into teleporting in and out. Some people I've offered 100k to stone in then fly for 10 minutes. By the time I get my instance opened I can no longer play.
Many of us have TT opener alts. I've been in several factions that offered a TT account name and password with buff hoars used for opening TT. These clog up our server and sometimes force multiclienting.
My point is, since there is no more point in needing a full squad for TT why do we have 4 people minimum as a requirement? It's better to solo, or at least duo, and it hinders our gameplay experience to require more than that. Squad mode is a nice challenge with harder bosses and rewards better drops, making it more fun than solo mode. Solo mode, at this point in the game, has become ridiculously easy as a "solo" instance and with the availability of chips in the boutique and the overwhelming amount of mats on the market solo mode is simply a waste of time. We get 6 keys for our BH but are required to do squad mode to get the mirage chests yet making that squad is more hassle than its worth most the time.
To evolve with the player base and game play I think the 4 player requirement should be removed from opening squad mode.
Most of us spam Nirvana's. Do our daily BHs. And... That's about it. The expansion somewhat revitalized interest in Lunar and Warsong and what is beautiful is it opened up interest in the entire instance, not just the single BH path. BH Seat and Aba were altered to expand gameplay by, if not eliminating aps use, making other forms of gameplay more effective. You know what I mean when your normal 20k attacks are reduced down to 800 damage on the Seat boss while the casters enjoy full damage outputs making them valuable DDs.
My point is squaded play is not at risk. But I don't always want to rely on others for making my coin. I'm a father and sometimes I want to make my coin at my own leisure while constantly hopping up to say "don't eat that", "don't sit on the dog", "get down from there", "go tell your mother you're stinky." Sometimes, squad play just isn't for me because rl calls.
So when I hop on to quickly farm a TT it's a little disheartening that it takes me 20 minutes to gather the people to open a TT so I can farm it. I WC, offering coin, I harass faction mates, I corral friends into teleporting in and out. Some people I've offered 100k to stone in then fly for 10 minutes. By the time I get my instance opened I can no longer play.
Many of us have TT opener alts. I've been in several factions that offered a TT account name and password with buff hoars used for opening TT. These clog up our server and sometimes force multiclienting.
My point is, since there is no more point in needing a full squad for TT why do we have 4 people minimum as a requirement? It's better to solo, or at least duo, and it hinders our gameplay experience to require more than that. Squad mode is a nice challenge with harder bosses and rewards better drops, making it more fun than solo mode. Solo mode, at this point in the game, has become ridiculously easy as a "solo" instance and with the availability of chips in the boutique and the overwhelming amount of mats on the market solo mode is simply a waste of time. We get 6 keys for our BH but are required to do squad mode to get the mirage chests yet making that squad is more hassle than its worth most the time.
To evolve with the player base and game play I think the 4 player requirement should be removed from opening squad mode.
Seven 100+ characters leveled the hard way. Free to play. Mystic, Psychic, and Wizard left to level. b:victory
Post edited by Sakubatou - Sanctuary on
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Comments
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And while you're at it, why not make it so Nirvana can be opened by only one person...
/facepalmI love puppies.... and sharp objects. b:pleased0 -
I'd rather see some changes to solo mode to make it more viable for farming while keeping squad mode relevant.
Perhaps something along the lines of:
-All bosses in squad mode can be encountered in Solo Mode
-Solo Bosses have similar drop-rates for green items, but no chance at gold ones
(it would probably still be less than squad, but nowhere near as bad as it is currently)
-Bosses drop Mirages instead of P.Stones
Squad
-Bosses drop Fairy Boxes (moreso than P.Stones)
-An additional quest, rewarding them with a random material (greens or gold) from any of the bosses the party has killed (via NPC spawning in the boss' room or a quest given once the instance has been opened). Requires 4 players minimum to complete the quest.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]Remember: OP may be a duck|OP/GMs/Devs may not deliver|Search function is your friend|Lurk more|Be wary of Mods: they can't be trusted|This place isn't a hugbox|Your tears sustain me|Know what Bait is|"Soon" may never come|Postcount, Dubs, and other GETs are important|Don't revive long dead threads|There is a section for everything|You can be banned for anything|No Fun Allowed outside of OT|Sweetiebot rules OT|"Circlejerks" are inevitable|Threads can be derailed and saved|Those who use"XD" should off themselves at their earliest convenience|0 -
You don't need aps to solo TT. b:surrender I like farming my own mats but always having others around to open stinks.
In the end it is like you said. People will just pull up 4 clients. lol[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Licensed tail brusher of ƙɑƙʊɱɑʊ ~ only the fluffiest
Outrunning centaurs since 2012~0 -
TempleSlave - Lost City wrote: »And while you're at it, why not make it so Nirvana can be opened by only one person...
/facepalm
Nirvana actually has some validity as an instance that requires squads. It's harder to solo than 3-3, at least. Although, I still have paid the same price as for TT for people to use their daily keys to help me open to duo, trio or 4 person the instance
Plus Nirvana spam is based on 3-4 keys a day, meaning it has a limit to how much it can be farmed. People actually need to give something up to enter it or help open.
Plus, its mats aren't in the cash shop like TTs, so there is more aim to farming Nirvana than TT. Since chips are in the boutique people can chose to chip the TT gold mats or farm them, meaning there is more a demand for actually farming Nirvana mats hence its popularity. Sure, people can just sell their gold for coin and buy the vana mats, but that causes the demand of farming them to go up, too. While chipping TT mats actually causes the demand for the farmed one to go down.
They're different instances, different difficulties, different requirements, different payouts.Seven 100+ characters leveled the hard way. Free to play. Mystic, Psychic, and Wizard left to level. b:victory0 -
Sakubatou - Sanctuary wrote: »Nirvana actually has some validity as an instance that requires squads. It's harder to solo than 3-3, at least. Although, I still have paid the same price as for TT for people to use their daily keys to help me open to duo, trio or 4 person the instance
.
Name a Nirvana boss that can match Emperor,Steelation or Dark Colloust.... b:surrender
Nirvana bosses are a joke compared to "revamped" 3-x bosses.The only way to beat a troll is....to troll him back b:angry0 -
This is an MMORPG game and requires people to work together to achieve common goals.
I have the same issues as I am also a single parent and at certain times of the day cannot play PWI so then I play another offline RPG.There are old Warriors, and bold Warriors,
but there are very few old bold Warriors. b:chuckle0 -
The requirement puts easy coin in the hand of the failest of players. It's a solution: not a problem.
Creating a better teleport system to and from TT would also resolve your issue.Be kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.0 -
The problem is for TT you need 4 persons to teleport in the instance to open, while for FC you only need one person in squad to open, not even need to tele in, maybe if they change that the people don't need to tele in the instance to open, more people will say yes, cause actually people are just lazy/cheap to teleport in TT.
So i vote no need 4 people to open, but i think that could be a other solution like the one i said.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
b:dirty "I **** rainbows and love everyone"-Longknife b:cute0 -
doesnt rly matter, ppl solo and solo open TT. and solo/duo Nirv with all their alts and/or accounts of friends who quit. lol105 - 105 - 105 (14th march 2014)
Join date: November 2008 - HT.0 -
Most the comments I am seeing are along the lines of keep pretending we are using it as a squad mode and understand that no one really is. Why keep pretending? Bella, I accept your solution, but isn't that just the same thing as solo opening with an extra step and pretending like it makes a difference?
Berserk. The second Nirvana boss, Slasher (running boss), and the flaming chicken all prove a more worthy opponent than Emperor, Collouseast, and Steelation because they're not 2 spark bosses. Sometimes Steely will buff himself early and that sucks. Usually Slasher is easy to take down in one spark but if people are slower he can easily become more dangerous than any of the three you listed.
And I understand this is a MMORPG and teamwork, squading, and a mass player environment is important but I also feel like a game should offer the choice of solo play without being penalized by dumbed down mobs and low drop rates.Seven 100+ characters leveled the hard way. Free to play. Mystic, Psychic, and Wizard left to level. b:victory0 -
Maybe easier solution is for you to get another cheapy PC, dual log some alts on that and your main PC and get your own 4 person squad.
I agree with another post that was on here, make all bosses that are in squad mode available in solo mode, ofc with a lower drop rate.0 -
I bring BM+cleric+barb. Friend brings sin+veno. There's a five person squad, lol.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
"subtraction has the butt of an angel" - Paulrogers
I
Subtraction.
/blatant sig copy is blatant
105/105/105 obtained! b:cute0 -
Eoria - Harshlands wrote: »I bring BM+cleric+barb. Friend brings sin+veno. There's a five person squad, lol.
I helped you to open once, i'm so nice ♥. b:chuckle[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
b:dirty "I **** rainbows and love everyone"-Longknife b:cute0 -
Well squad mode should have at least two people for a squad.
I can open WS with a two person squad why not HH?0 -
This to me is just another fledgling gamer assuming that they're smarter than the programmer /devs. People that think despite all the effort put into pong; they could make it better. People that don't think about why such a rule would exist to begin with. I mean the devs just put it there to **** people off and for no other purpose? Everyone wants their OP to be even more OP: http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1383291
If TT is not worth doing because of your trouble of finding help; then find something else to do. Everyone else in this game does that.Be kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.0 -
TT is one of the main sources of gear in PWI and it shouldn't be made easier to open.0
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I would like it for myself, but not for others. :P
The requirement of four ppl is a wanted slowdown.
If ppl would be able to open HHs faster, ppl would be able to spam way more runs per day.
--> all mats would become way cheaper/ almost worthless
--> at the end of the day not good for farmers like me xD
This.Heartz - Dreamweaver wrote: »doesnt rly matter, ppl solo and solo open TT. and solo/duo Nirv with all their alts and/or accounts of friends who quit. lol0 -
Lets say they change it so no requirement to open tt squade mode. Imagine this. Newbie reaches lvl 90 so wc, LFM for TT run. repeats*. repeat*. repeat*.
Turns to Guild. "anyone want to do tt"? and guildies reply, "sry, can't. I'm in one atm" (soloing to keep 100% of drops).
Ask in guild chat again, "anyone can help with tt? pretty please... begs for help but rarely gets help.
Turns to wc, and begs, LF bored 5aps to help with TT.
Eventually reaches lvl 100 and unnessarily gets a bad name for being poorly geared and lack of skills/experience due to a lack of certain runs such as tt.0 -
Banndit - Heavens Tear wrote: »Lets say they change it so no requirement to open tt squade mode. Imagine this. Newbie reaches lvl 90 so wc, LFM for TT run. repeats*. repeat*. repeat*.
Turns to Guild. "anyone want to do tt"? and guildies reply, "sry, can't. I'm in one atm" (soloing to keep 100% of drops).
Ask in guild chat again, "anyone can help with tt? pretty please... begs for help but rarely gets help.
Turns to wc, and begs, LF bored 5aps to help with TT.
Eventually reaches lvl 100 and unnessarily gets a bad name for being poorly geared and lack of skills/experience due to a lack of certain runs such as tt.
I don't know what kind of awful guilds you're in, but if that happened with me it would be more something like this.
"Newbie reaches lvl 90 so wc, LFM for TT run. repeats*. repeat*. repeat*.
Turns to good, Guild. "anyone want to do tt"? and guildies reply "what mats are you after? Oh, sure I run that one a lot, come with me and we can pick up a few"
Actually, low levels never run TT anyway. Even now I'd still be like "sure, if you can multi an alt to open I'll bring you through for a run", but never been asked to TT in months.
I agree with the OP on one point, since the mechanic does nothing more than burn 50k opening and a few tele's and highly reward those with multiple computers. But rather than change it, I'd rather see solo mode revamped and made to be actually worth it. Heck it doesn't even have to be more than 200k profit a run, just something more than repair+subs. Running a solo for no greens and a few perfect stone just sucks.0 -
I understand the point, and I agree it's pretty lame you need 4 to open to just solo the instance. It's a lame protection that has no use anymore.
However, I wouldn't want TT to be opened solo. I would rather see it converted back to a real squad instance. Not that I see an efficient and realistic way to do that. Those with multiple pc's can easily bypass anything I can come up with like a 4 ppl in range requirement for bosses. That is why I voted to keep the requirement as it is.
At least, it would be nice if there was an increased benefit from doing it with squad and/or within the lvl range from pillar.0 -
_DarkSeph_ - Sanctuary wrote: »I don't know what kind of awful guilds you're in, but if that happened with me it would be more something like this.
"Newbie reaches lvl 90 so wc, LFM for TT run. repeats*. repeat*. repeat*.
Turns to good, Guild. "anyone want to do tt"? and guildies reply "what mats are you after? Oh, sure I run that one a lot, come with me and we can pick up a few"
Actually, low levels never run TT anyway. Even now I'd still be like "sure, if you can multi an alt to open I'll bring you through for a run", but never been asked to TT in months.
I agree with the OP on one point, since the mechanic does nothing more than burn 50k opening and a few tele's and highly reward those with multiple computers. But rather than change it, I'd rather see solo mode revamped and made to be actually worth it. Heck it doesn't even have to be more than 200k profit a run, just something more than repair+subs. Running a solo for no greens and a few perfect stone just sucks.
So its should be all about coins and worth doing or not? The original problem is that theres a lack of squade doing tt runs. What some of you want is to sweep that problem under the rug so you can get more coins from it accepting squades as impossible. If you guys were to say, reduce bh reward and re-alocate those fund towards tt then yes that could work but otherwise, I don't support this.
To generate growth or value is not a solo thing, but with 2 people or more. This is why Europe is in the situation they in atm.0 -
Sakubatou - Sanctuary wrote: »Nirvana actually has some validity as an instance that requires squads. It's harder to solo than 3-3, at least.
I guess you're not capable of soloing either, or you wouldn't be saying that.I love puppies.... and sharp objects. b:pleased0 -
Heartz - Dreamweaver wrote: »doesnt rly matter, ppl solo and solo open TT. and solo/duo Nirv with all their alts and/or accounts of friends who quit. lol
Wow! That's a lot clients to open! Must have a booty load of ram!Lonely man with a big heart.0 -
Reshanta - Sanctuary wrote: »Wow! That's a lot clients to open! Must have a booty load of ram!
Not really. On my last setup, a C2D with 4gb I could have 7 or 8 windows open before it caused any major issues.I love puppies.... and sharp objects. b:pleased0 -
maybe they can make the new BH boss in abbadon, solo mode mob for high lv TT soloers lol...... b:laugh anti aps solo gogo[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]lagunal8.deviantart.com
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TempleSlave - Lost City wrote: »Not really. On my last setup, a C2D with 4gb I could have 7 or 8 windows open before it caused any major issues.
Isn't that against the rules? be kinda funny if it is because i'm sure many do it then come on here and scream bloody murder over someone taking advantage of a glitch lol0 -
Leave squad mode as it is and increase the bosses in solo modeb:laugh0
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FragiIe - Dreamweaver wrote: »Isn't that against the rules? be kinda funny if it is because i'm sure many do it then come on here and scream bloody murder over someone taking advantage of a glitch lol
yes, but since when has that ever stopped anyone. I was performancet testing on my PC, which is like 5 years old, and discovered that I can open 7 clients without issue, and on the 8th my PC starts to drop. And that was with using a launcher that made it so the clients didn't freeze when it lost focus.
The point is, so many people have high-level toons now, that they can just to the runs themselves for their alts. It's just another pointer to the dying state of the game where we aren't really seeing new players, we're seeing old players making new accounts.
I say leave the requirement where it is, and make it so that 5APS can't go in and solo. It is really hilarious though, people complained about veno's being OP and soloing TT, so they made the bossses harder, and now veno's have trouble soloing, but it's simple for a well-built APS toon. It needs to be re-designed so that it requires teamwork to complete the instances.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
SylenThunder - Sanctuary wrote: »yes, but since when has that ever stopped anyone. I was performancet testing on my PC, which is like 5 years old, and discovered that I can open 7 clients without issue, and on the 8th my PC starts to drop. And that was with using a launcher that made it so the clients didn't freeze when it lost focus.
The point is, so many people have high-level toons now, that they can just to the runs themselves for their alts. It's just another pointer to the dying state of the game where we aren't really seeing new players, we're seeing old players making new accounts.
I say leave the requirement where it is, and make it so that 5APS can't go in and solo. It is really hilarious though, people complained about veno's being OP and soloing TT, so they made the bossses harder, and now veno's have trouble soloing, but it's simple for a well-built APS toon. It needs to be re-designed so that it requires teamwork to complete the instances.
Have to agree with you 100% on this0 -
IF your Able to Solo an Instance, I dont see why not let us open it with 1 or 2 people , I mean pw shouldnt care they way we farm it, if we need more people then we bring more, if we can solo it then we solo it.. why should someone care.
If they wanted this game to remain Squad and Team oriented in all places and times, they shouln't have introduced the OP Chars..0
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