G16 Xbow Vs Bow
KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear
Posts: 2,461 Arc User
Which would be an overall better weapon?
Kiyo brought up an interesting point. Since G16 can contend with r9 (kinda) The option for an Endgame Xbow is now available.
G16 Bow
G16 Xbow
Now assuming both are +10 and the crit rate value is 40%.
For the example we will use
Hp +350
Vit +18
Defense Level +1
That way there is no variance in the damage and output. Looking purely at weapon.
The G16 Bow has a Damage range of 1298-2410 +825 from +10 putting it at
2123-3235
The bow by default has an aps of .67. Using the DPS formula
[average attack]*1.[crit rate]*[APS]*[attack level bonus]
2679 * 1.4 * .67 * 1.4 = 3,518
The G16 Xbow has a Damage range of 1174-2737 +825 from +10 putting it at
1999-3562
The Xbow by default has an aps of .62. Using the DPS formula
[average attack]*1.[crit rate]*[APS]*[attack level bonus]
2780.5 * 1.4 * .62 * 1.4 = 3,379
So in weapon format only The bow has a slightly higher DPS, however the Xbow has a higher DPH.
I guess it comes down to addons, equipment, and playstyle for which you would prefer.
Kiyo brought up an interesting point. Since G16 can contend with r9 (kinda) The option for an Endgame Xbow is now available.
G16 Bow
G16 Xbow
Now assuming both are +10 and the crit rate value is 40%.
For the example we will use
Hp +350
Vit +18
Defense Level +1
That way there is no variance in the damage and output. Looking purely at weapon.
The G16 Bow has a Damage range of 1298-2410 +825 from +10 putting it at
2123-3235
The bow by default has an aps of .67. Using the DPS formula
[average attack]*1.[crit rate]*[APS]*[attack level bonus]
2679 * 1.4 * .67 * 1.4 = 3,518
The G16 Xbow has a Damage range of 1174-2737 +825 from +10 putting it at
1999-3562
The Xbow by default has an aps of .62. Using the DPS formula
[average attack]*1.[crit rate]*[APS]*[attack level bonus]
2780.5 * 1.4 * .62 * 1.4 = 3,379
So in weapon format only The bow has a slightly higher DPS, however the Xbow has a higher DPH.
I guess it comes down to addons, equipment, and playstyle for which you would prefer.
[SIGPIC]http://i48.tinypic.com/2r61kw3.jpg[/SIGPIC]
Ty Fon for the Siggy
The rare and exotic Sage Archer of HT. b:cute
Ty Fon for the Siggy
The rare and exotic Sage Archer of HT. b:cute
Post edited by KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear on
0
Comments
-
Usually, in this type of analysis, you'd want to bring up sample builds to compare the two. It gives a more realistic feel of the comparison, as the -interval from gear changes things.0
-
The same conversation has always come up with regards to bow vs xbow:
Do you nuke people to death? I guess xbow would probably yield a better Barrage though.
Gotta have both!Elena Costel: I wash my hands of this affair.
Legerity: *drags you back* *stains your hands with said affair*
Elena Costel: Noooo... I don't want to have a dirty affair with Lady Legerity...
Qui: b:dirty0 -
Ehh.. I think the choice would really come down to either the g16 sling or the g16 xbow to tell the truth. The only reason to get the g16 bow is if you are sharing the weapon with other classes.
The standard tradeoff will apply, the xbow will be better at spamming skills / barrage while a sling is better dps with normal shots. Generally I'd say the faster chi generation with fast weapons will offset the higher dph on an XBow since it will let you use more powerful skills more often.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Refining Simulator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/refiningsimulator.html (don't use IE)
Genie Calculator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/geniecalculator.html - (don't use IE)
Socket Calculator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/socketcalculator.html0 -
KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear wrote: »Which would be an overall better weapon?
It is just way to hard to compare... something that I am personally not willing to do since I have no intention of getting either (sling included). Just would like to point out... any additional -int will benefit the bow more due to its slightly higher base int. And any additional attack level would benefit the xbow more due to its slightly higher base.1. If I kill you; do something about it yourself, don't go complaining to my wife.
2. If you have less kill counts then me, don't expect me to take pk advice from you.
3. If you are hiding behind an alt, don't expect me to acknowledge your existence.
Tokichiro - Heavy Armor Fish / Kiyoshi - Dual Blade Elf0 -
Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »And any additional attack level would benefit the xbow more due to its slightly higher base.
Attack level benefits the damage of both by the same percentage. the sling though would receive a higher percentage increase from aps gear due to the ridiculous exponential returns.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Refining Simulator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/refiningsimulator.html (don't use IE)
Genie Calculator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/geniecalculator.html - (don't use IE)
Socket Calculator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/socketcalculator.html0 -
Meh I'll do that for my lunch break I suppose.Elenacostel - Heavens Tear wrote: »Usually, in this type of analysis, you'd want to bring up sample builds to compare the two. It gives a more realistic feel of the comparison, as the -interval from gear changes things.
And there in lies the question :PQuilue - Sanctuary wrote: »The same conversation has always come up with regards to bow vs xbow:
Do you nuke people to death? I guess xbow would probably yield a better Barrage though.
Gotta have both!Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »Ehh.. I think the choice would really come down to either the g16 sling or the g16 xbow to tell the truth. The only reason to get the g16 bow is if you are sharing the weapon with other classes.
The standard tradeoff will apply, the xbow will be better at spamming skills / barrage while a sling is better dps with normal shots. Generally I'd say the faster chi generation with fast weapons will offset the higher dph on an XBow since it will let you use more powerful skills more often.
I will have to disagree with the sling being an option. My reasoning is the DPH is so low that the DPS advantage isn't really enough to kill someone. Even when you DPS a target you still use skills which is where a sling isn't the best option.
G16 Slingshot
The G16 Sling has a Damage range of 1400-2100 +825 from +10 putting it at
2225-2925
The Sling by default has an aps of .71. Using the DPS formula
[average attack]*1.[crit rate]*[APS]*[attack level bonus]
2575 * 1.4 * .71 * 1.4 = 3,583
Notice it has a small DPH as well as the DPS advantage is only 65 damage more then the bow before multipliers.
You would need a vast amount of -.int for the sling to really outshine the bow.[SIGPIC]http://i48.tinypic.com/2r61kw3.jpg[/SIGPIC]
Ty Fon for the Siggy
The rare and exotic Sage Archer of HT. b:cute0 -
You are ignoring like 500 weapon damage from rings / ammo /level / garnet gems
Also try it with a realistic amount of interval gear instead of none at all.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Refining Simulator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/refiningsimulator.html (don't use IE)
Genie Calculator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/geniecalculator.html - (don't use IE)
Socket Calculator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/socketcalculator.html0 -
K revamping to include a full set for the example.
All scenarios include 40% crit And a fully decked out with interval archer With Demon masteries +10 weapon and 2 garnet gems. (Without going into r8 recast for further interval etc)
Added 45 attack to make up for the grade difference in refining.
Arrows were left out of the equation because not all archers can obtain the Faction base Arrows.
G16 Bow
Physical Attack
13239-18803
Using the DPS formula
[average attack]*1.[crit rate]*[APS]*[attack level bonus]
16,021 * 1.4 * .95 * 1.77 = 37,715
G16 Xbow
Physical Attack
12619-20439
Using the DPS formula
[average attack]*1.[crit rate]*[APS]*[attack level bonus]
16,529 * 1.4 * .87 * 1.77 = 35,634
G16 Slingshot
Physical Attack
13749-17251
Using the DPS formula
[average attack]*1.[crit rate]*[APS]*[attack level bonus]
15,500 * 1.4 * 1.05 * 1.77 = 40,329
After PvP reductions your looking at this.
Bow - 16,021 * 1.4 * .95 * 1.77 *.25 = 9,429
Xbow -16,529 * 1.4 * .87 * 1.77 *.25 = 8,908
Sling - 15,500 * 1.4 * 1.05 * 1.77 *.25 = 10,082[SIGPIC]http://i48.tinypic.com/2r61kw3.jpg[/SIGPIC]
Ty Fon for the Siggy
The rare and exotic Sage Archer of HT. b:cute0 -
Aesthetics demands that 3% DPH is sacrificed.0
-
Aesthetic demands that archers use G15 TT Nirvana bow or none at all0
-
Frankly..it's hard to choose from the damage difference from DPH and DPS, since archers needs both for different situation..
xbow would be useful for barrage, lightning moves, when u are using skills like stunning arrow and aim low etc...
While demon quickshot proc with slingshot is....b:surrenderb:surrenderb:surrender
Edited: Anybody has a screenshot how the G16 xbow and slingshot looks like..? And, if possible, post the G16 bow as well..?0 -
DarkMarch - Lost City wrote: »Frankly..it's hard to choose from the damage difference from DPH and DPS, since archers needs both for different situation..
xbow would be useful for barrage, lightning moves, when u are using skills like stunning arrow and aim low etc...
While demon quickshot proc with slingshot is....b:surrenderb:surrenderb:surrender
Edited: Anybody has a screenshot how the G16 xbow and slingshot looks like..? And, if possible, post the G16 bow as well..?
Well you also have to consider not everyone is demon. I am sage though I made this setup because 95% of archer are demon.
As for the weapons they all share the same image as Lunar nirvana.
But here you go
G16 Bow
G16 Xbow
G16 Sling
Edit. For self amusement I realized there was no TT nirvana Slings as there is no High End TT slings and so I looked at the slings on pwdatabase and saw the OHT Slingshot and that unique add on is boss.
Knockback.
Has a chance to interrupt opponent's channeling and knock it 10 meters back
Imagine if that worked in PvP >_>
Wonder what the probability to even get that is.. considering its a 60% chance to get a unique addon...[SIGPIC]http://i48.tinypic.com/2r61kw3.jpg[/SIGPIC]
Ty Fon for the Siggy
The rare and exotic Sage Archer of HT. b:cute0 -
KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear wrote: »For self amusement I realized there was no TT nirvana Slings as there is no High End TT slings
Beg pardon?
Even if there are no high-end tt99 slings, you've always been able to make a nirvana version of any weapon style from any other base weapon. That's why casters used the cheapo tt99 pataka to make the Nirvana glaive/wand/sword.
On a related aside, I spam made slingshots once when I farmed dex mats in 3-3 and didn't get any fun proc
Hurrdurr - Lothranis wrote: »Aesthetic demands that archers use G15 TT Nirvana bow or none at all
I agree. Why did they choose the lunar variants only? >:(Proving that not only archers do math since 2009. b:victory
Current math challenge: pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1029711&page=45
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
"Any skills that can be used to kill you will interrupt BB when successful." -truekossy | "...Sage archers are kind of like Mac owners. They are proud of the weirdest and most unnecessary things." -Aesthor | "We ALL know Jesus doesn't play PWI. He may have suffered a lot for humanity, but he'd NEVER punish himself this way." -Abstractive | "I approve of bananas." -SashaGray0 -
Decus - Dreamweaver wrote: »Beg pardon?
Even if there are no high-end tt99 slings, you've always been able to make a nirvana version of any weapon style from any other base weapon. That's why casters used the cheapo tt99 pataka to make the Nirvana glaive/wand/sword.
On a related aside, I spam made slingshots once when I farmed dex mats in 3-3 and didn't get any fun proc
I stand corrected. I never even noticed that lol.
That sucks :<[SIGPIC]http://i48.tinypic.com/2r61kw3.jpg[/SIGPIC]
Ty Fon for the Siggy
The rare and exotic Sage Archer of HT. b:cute0 -
It has the most awesome picture on ecatomb: http://www.ecatomb.net/pwi/arme/weapon16/r100(2).jpg0
-
Elenacostel - Heavens Tear wrote: »It has the most awesome picture on ecatomb: http://www.ecatomb.net/pwi/arme/weapon16/r100(2).jpg
Remove the link please. That link could be used to further promote the myth that us male elves like to play hide the sausage with other male elves. Or sheath the arrow in the Canal of Dark Terrors. Which is entirely not the case. Not that there's anything wrong with male elves who may wish to participate in such activities.0 -
Meh that being said @ OHT weapon. (Yes I'm derailing my own thread now.)
27 common add ons +33% unaccounted for.
16 unique add ons
a total of 3 addons you can get with only a 60% chance of getting a unique....
6/10 having a unique in the weapon.. with another 1/16 of it being the knockback addon..
6/160 or 1/27 odds?[SIGPIC]http://i48.tinypic.com/2r61kw3.jpg[/SIGPIC]
Ty Fon for the Siggy
The rare and exotic Sage Archer of HT. b:cute0 -
XxZavxX - Raging Tide wrote: »Remove the link please. That link could be used to further promote the myth that us male elves like to play hide the sausage with other male elves. Or sheath the arrow in the Canal of Dark Terrors. Which is entirely not the case. Not that there's anything wrong with male elves who may wish to participate in such activities.
b:laughb:laughb:laugh0 -
Oh, totally forgot to post what I really wanted to say about the tr00 case of Bow vs Xbow...
Let us cast #s aside for a second It all comes down to BoA.
Remember to cast the #s to the side...
Sure, the new Xbow does not look very threatening. However, once you use BoA you are waving your hand around like a gangsta. Compare that to with the bow's stance of doing a Tim Tebow like pose....
I rest my case. I rest my case.0 -
KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear wrote: »Edit. For self amusement I realized there was no TT nirvana Slings as there is no High End TT slings and so I looked at the slings on pwdatabase and saw the OHT Slingshot and that unique add on is boss.
Knockback.
Has a chance to interrupt opponent's channeling and knock it 10 meters back
Let's see how much you like that proc when the mob you are barraging is knocked out of barrage range. Most archers I know who have encountered this proc just found it annoying.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Refining Simulator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/refiningsimulator.html (don't use IE)
Genie Calculator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/geniecalculator.html - (don't use IE)
Socket Calculator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/socketcalculator.html0 -
Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »Let's see how much you like that proc when the mob you are barraging is knocked out of barrage range. Most archers I know who have encountered this proc just found it annoying.
I think you completely missed the part in my post where I wondered aloud if it worked in PvP. since it said Opponent not enemy (which to me sounds like a player)[SIGPIC]http://i48.tinypic.com/2r61kw3.jpg[/SIGPIC]
Ty Fon for the Siggy
The rare and exotic Sage Archer of HT. b:cute0 -
KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear wrote: »I think you completely missed the part in my post where I wondered aloud if it worked in PvP. since it said Opponent not enemy (which to me sounds like a player)
I admit I rarely read all of your posts
But no it doesn't work in PVP. Mystics still have the only pvp knockback in the game.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Refining Simulator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/refiningsimulator.html (don't use IE)
Genie Calculator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/geniecalculator.html - (don't use IE)
Socket Calculator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/socketcalculator.html0 -
Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »I admit I rarely read all of your posts
But no it doesn't work in PVP. Mystics still have the only pvp knockback in the game.
knockback would be a ****0 -
/shrug it's not like i make TLDRs. And yay for another useless trait then.Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »I admit I rarely read all of your posts
But no it doesn't work in PVP. Mystics still have the only pvp knockback in the game.SpazzMcAps - Harshlands wrote: »knockback would be a ****
That's what I said when I saw it if the proc was high enough. the bm would be like trying to get to you and then get knockbacked, try to get in range again only to get knocked back yet again b:chuckle[SIGPIC]http://i48.tinypic.com/2r61kw3.jpg[/SIGPIC]
Ty Fon for the Siggy
The rare and exotic Sage Archer of HT. b:cute0 -
Culti might play a role in deciding. A sling would be awesome for a demon with quickshot. A crossbow would be nice for a sage with higher DPH.0
-
XxZavxX - Raging Tide wrote: »Sure, the new Xbow does not look very threatening. However, once you use BoA you are waving your hand around like a gangsta.
Good point, xbow barrage is pretty hilarious. He just sort of waves it around without even trying to aim it
Proving that not only archers do math since 2009. b:victory
Current math challenge: pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1029711&page=45
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
"Any skills that can be used to kill you will interrupt BB when successful." -truekossy | "...Sage archers are kind of like Mac owners. They are proud of the weirdest and most unnecessary things." -Aesthor | "We ALL know Jesus doesn't play PWI. He may have suffered a lot for humanity, but he'd NEVER punish himself this way." -Abstractive | "I approve of bananas." -SashaGray0 -
KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear wrote: »Which would be an overall better weapon?
Kiyo brought up an interesting point. Since G16 can contend with r9 (kinda) The option for an Endgame Xbow is now available.
G16 Bow
G16 Xbow
Now assuming both are +10 and the crit rate value is 40%.
For the example we will use
Hp +350
Vit +18
Defense Level +1
That way there is no variance in the damage and output. Looking purely at weapon.
The G16 Bow has a Damage range of 1298-2410 +825 from +10 putting it at
2123-3235
The bow by default has an aps of .67. Using the DPS formula
[average attack]*1.[crit rate]*[APS]*[attack level bonus]
2679 * 1.4 * .67 * 1.4 = 3,518
The G16 Xbow has a Damage range of 1174-2737 +825 from +10 putting it at
1999-3562
The Xbow by default has an aps of .62. Using the DPS formula
[average attack]*1.[crit rate]*[APS]*[attack level bonus]
2780.5 * 1.4 * .62 * 1.4 = 3,379
So in weapon format only The bow has a slightly higher DPS, however the Xbow has a higher DPH.
I guess it comes down to addons, equipment, and playstyle for which you would prefer.
So many things that are missing from this. The G16 Bow would improve more from addition interval gear, having a higher base aps. You should use a standard build for this to make it more applicable. But I guess your disclaimer is "playstyle". Since maybe the archer would be R9/warsong/cube/+45dex instead of full interval, making the higher base aps meaningless. So Im wrong but I'm not gonna delete this.
Also, titties. b:victory[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
I wonder whether the weapon knockback disrupts channel in PvP...still not that useful even if it did though.Elena Costel: I wash my hands of this affair.
Legerity: *drags you back* *stains your hands with said affair*
Elena Costel: Noooo... I don't want to have a dirty affair with Lady Legerity...
Qui: b:dirty0 -
ImNotFiveAps - Dreamweaver wrote: »So many things that are missing from this. The G16 Bow would improve more from addition interval gear, having a higher base aps. You should use a standard build for this to make it more applicable. But I guess your disclaimer is "playstyle". Since maybe the archer would be R9/warsong/cube/+45dex instead of full interval, making the higher base aps meaningless. So Im wrong but I'm not gonna delete this.
I think you missed this entire post then.KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear wrote: »K revamping to include a full set for the example.
All scenarios include 40% crit And a fully decked out with interval archer With Demon masteries +10 weapon and 2 garnet gems. (Without going into r8 recast for further interval etc)
Added 45 attack to make up for the grade difference in refining.
Arrows were left out of the equation because not all archers can obtain the Faction base Arrows.
G16 Bow
Physical Attack
13239-18803
Using the DPS formula
[average attack]*1.[crit rate]*[APS]*[attack level bonus]
16,021 * 1.4 * .95 * 1.77 = 37,715
G16 Xbow
Physical Attack
12619-20439
Using the DPS formula
[average attack]*1.[crit rate]*[APS]*[attack level bonus]
16,529 * 1.4 * .87 * 1.77 = 35,634
G16 Slingshot
Physical Attack
13749-17251
Using the DPS formula
[average attack]*1.[crit rate]*[APS]*[attack level bonus]
15,500 * 1.4 * 1.05 * 1.77 = 40,329
After PvP reductions your looking at this.
Bow - 16,021 * 1.4 * .95 * 1.77 *.25 = 9,429
Xbow -16,529 * 1.4 * .87 * 1.77 *.25 = 8,908
Sling - 15,500 * 1.4 * 1.05 * 1.77 *.25 = 10,082[SIGPIC]http://i48.tinypic.com/2r61kw3.jpg[/SIGPIC]
Ty Fon for the Siggy
The rare and exotic Sage Archer of HT. b:cute0
![http://i48.tinypic.com/2r61kw3.jpg[/SIGPIC]](http://i48.tinypic.com/2r61kw3.jpg[/SIGPIC]){kind=link}
.jpg){kind=link}
.jpg){kind=link}
.jpg){kind=link}
.jpg){kind=link}
Categories
- All Categories
- 181.9K PWI
- 697 Official Announcements
- 2 Rules of Conduct
- 264 Cabbage Patch Notes
- 61K General Discussion
- 1.5K Quality Corner
- 11.1K Suggestion Box
- 77.4K Archosaur City
- 3.5K Cash Shop Huddle
- 14.3K Server Symposium
- 18.1K Dungeons & Tactics
- 2K The Crafting Nook
- 4.9K Guild Banter
- 6.6K The Trading Post
- 28K Class Discussion
- 1.9K Arigora Colosseum
- 78 TW & Cross Server Battles
- 337 Nation Wars
- 8.2K Off-Topic Discussion
- 3.7K The Fanatics Forum
- 207 Screenshots and Videos
- 22.8K Support Desk