Abadon and SOT boses

KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear · May 2012

Cody_tylor - Sanctuary wrote: »

I can't tell who is more full of themselves who think they're legit because they are 105, a derp sparking person who "doesn't" goon glitch nor "spend a dime" on this game or a cash shopping goon glitch abuser who thinks they are the true .0001%.
Uhh see you have no clue about me. I've been merchanting since 09 and I actually did level to 105 legit if you played on my server you would know.
I bet no one would bother leveling to 105 by goon glitch (or even camp FC for that matter), otherwise, they'd forget about the pointless extra 25 stat points / extra genie affinity, they might even be retired by level 85 or something. We'd have 105s before the tideborn expansion in the first place if people wanted to cap back in the day.
Someone just seems upset that they aren't this level cap while they post on a non-banned alt b:chuckle
To finish off this off-topic DE-railing: Who cares?

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver wrote: »

When I pulled it with my sin, it did about 35k dmg to it. And my sin is fairly average geared, though I don't have the nirvy leggings yet or a good helm. Anyway, all I did was deaden nerve and then spark and that first suicidal hit ceased to be a problem. I mean, you can't be one shot if you're using deaden nerve so any sin that says they were one shot when they pulled. Start using it. Really that simple. Did the instance just fine with 1 other sin, 1 seekers, 2 barbs and a cleric. None of who were in super OP gear....the boss didn't take THAT long either. Any barbs in level 79 mold armor top, tt90 greens and no refines/gear of that calibur while they wait work on their rank gear is going to have to gear up a bit. But other than that, it seems like as long as you got a good tank in squad it won't be an issue.

edit: like how bosses used to work. :P

Try using an archer. It doesn't hit me when I pull it with STA. It only puts up the melee buff and attacks me regularly.

Squeakytoy - Dreamweaver · May 2012

KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Try using an archer. It doesn't hit me when I pull it with STA. It only puts up the melee buff and attacks me regularly.

I've tried pulling with my herc. It got one shot before it could even hit the boss.

KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear · May 2012

Squeakytoy - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I've tried pulling with my herc. It got one shot before it could even hit the boss.

Herc is melee. Archers can attack safely from 30-34meters. (Which I believe is out of this range.) Testing needs to be done.

PaTMaN - Dreamweaver · May 2012

I've done a good amount of testing on Leaf Rain Dryad in Abaddon focusing on the first attack she does (Yellow crosshair like animation at feet that turns to purple and fades. Anyone know what it is?). Actually the first attack is repeated later on... found out by sitting in Healing Trance for about a minute when the boss didn't find me amusing anymore.

The attack appears to be related to your physical defense and your health. For example I ran the same gear setup with and without a barb health buff on (Beast King's Inspiration lv 10, 30% health increase) and the damage taken was different. When graphing my data I've found the damage taken follows an inverse exponential curve according to health and slightly offset by physical defense. Basically, the more health you have the better off you are at surviving the hit.

My test method was as follows:

Adjust health through removing gears
*SCREENSHOT CHAR INFO*
Full chi
Deaden nerves
Maze Steps
Wolf Emblem (to get triple spark ready)
*RECORD VIDEO*
Approach boss
Spark as soon as hit by the first attack to purify bleed
*STOP VIDEO*
Holy Path, Windpush, Holy Path away to safety of water and get out of range for boss reset

Data for anyone who wants it. As you will find, tests 2-9 I tried to keep a linear decline in health by removing gears to find the best data point. First test is no gear, last test full gear. Tests 7 and 10 show same gear setup with and without health buf. Tests 4 and 5 best shows how physical defense has some effect. Also note that there is no min-max damage from this boss for the first attack (and melee attacks):

Test,Health,PDef,MDef,DamageTaken
1,2665,25,2,92956
2,3375,640,4,79824
3,4477,2374,1749,57725
4,5571,2855,2433,49398
5,6654,1952,1162,49312
6,7740,2760,2209,39950
7,8836,5481,5464,26155
8,9880,4948,4653,23433
9,10913,3708,3528,21972
10,11147,5512,5464,17670

Other information:
Sin level: 101
Def level: 0
Boss level 150

I've done some testing on the boss's other bufs but haven't reviewed the footage yet. When you see the red buf (Lyago (Raging Tide) mentioned it being like the new Barb's Morai skill Blood Rush), hitting the boss makes her attack stronger for a short period of time. The heal buf heals for 30k every few seconds but I'm not certain what triggers it since in a squad I've seen her health recover much faster than that. She doesn't do any bufs for about 20 seconds so that is the period in which she hits you for very little melee damage, a few magic (possibly) attacks, and can be aps'd to death.

Also for sins, Shadow Teleport and immediate triple spark seemed to resist the first attack effectively where as sprinting to the boss was a little random at resisting the attack.

Edit 5/28/12
-Changed magic defense suggestions to physical according to Empu (Sanctuary) testing
-Added physical defense to test data

Empu - Sanctuary · May 2012

KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Herc is melee. Archers can attack safely from 30-34meters. (Which I believe is out of this range.) Testing needs to be done.

At some point, after hearing a wizard saying something similar of not getting the bleed, I tried out to pull boss with knife throw (skill out of aggro range) to see if getting hit by a ranged skill would prevent boss from doing the bleed. I did get hit by bleed though. Maybe I should try with another class cause knife throw is still "melee" ?

PaTMaN - Dreamweaver wrote: »

The attack appears to be related to your magic defense and your health. For example I ran the same gear setup with and without a barb health buff on (Beast King's Inspiration lv 10, 30% health increase) and the damage taken was different. When graphing my data I've found the damage taken follows an inverse exponential curve according to health and slightly offset by magic defense (which element I am not sure). Basically, the more health you have the better off you are at surviving the hit.

Sorry, just had to highlight it b:laugh I know it's just the way you wrote it down, but I found it a really funny sentance after such a "scientific" part.

On serious side, the problem with your data is that hp and magic def both vary the same way, so you can't say if the variation of the damage depends on the hp or the magic defence.

Cody_tylor - Sanctuary · May 2012

KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Try using an archer. It doesn't hit me when I pull it with STA. It only puts up the melee buff and attacks me regularly.

I am nowhere near upset, you sound upset on the first person who capped when people barely caped back in the day. If I actually cared, I would be 100 a couple of years ago with 2 chars. I am not like a nerd like you, there is such thing as hobbies, do you know what hobbies are? Plus I bet you open packs to merchant 24/7. Really bro, chill out, it is a game, no one that have a life cares if you capped or not.

KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear · May 2012

Empu - Sanctuary wrote: »

At some point, after hearing a wizard saying something similar of not getting the bleed, I tried out to pull boss with knife throw (skill out of aggro range) to see if getting hit by a ranged skill would prevent boss from doing the bleed. I did get hit by bleed though. Maybe I should try with another class cause knife throw is still "melee" ?

Yes try another class to help test this.

Sorry, just had to highlight it b:laugh I know it's just the way you wrote it down, but I found it a really funny sentance after such a "scientific" part.

On serious side, the problem with your data is that hp and magic def both vary the same way, so you can't say if the variation of the damage depends on the hp or the magic defence.

Cody_tylor - Sanctuary wrote: »

I am nowhere near upset, you sound upset on the first person who capped when people barely caped back in the day. If I actually cared, I would be 100 a couple of years ago with 2 chars. I am not like a nerd like you, there is such thing as hobbies, do you know what hobbies are? Plus I bet you open packs to merchant 24/7. Really bro, chill out, it is a game, no one that have a life cares if you capped or not.

Uh I'm on maybe 2-4 hours actively on a day? I'm at work most of the day or doing things with a few of my friends or husband. I love how once again you assume about the personal life of someone without knowing a thing about them. b:chuckle

Cody_tylor - Sanctuary · May 2012

KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Uh I'm on maybe 2-4 hours actively on a day? I'm at work most of the day or doing things with a few of my friends or husband. I love how once again you assume about the personal life of someone without knowing a thing about them. b:chuckle

You are caped on an mmorpg yet have no idea how to read? I said MERCHANT 24/7 not play 24/7. I spend a lot more time outside and most likely my computer stays off to save energy. We need earth day every month LOL.

KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear · May 2012

Cody_tylor - Sanctuary wrote: »

You are caped on an mmorpg yet have no idea how to read? I said MERCHANT 24/7 not play 24/7. I spend a lot more time outside and most likely my computer stays off to save energy. We need earth day every month LOL.

How can I be "opening packs to merchant 24/7" if im not there 24/7? And actually you're quite wrong on your assumptions of what I do on and off the game again. And My computers not on 24/7 either but nice try ;p

You know someones upset when they try to attack your personal life. b:chuckle

Quilue - Sanctuary · May 2012

Ranged character can definitely still get the bleed from the SoT boss, but IIRC it wasn't applied at the beginning but it was near the end of the fight for us. It must have been at least 7k+ because our tanking archer went from 15k+ hp to half (hence I pointed out "nasty bleed" earlier). I would assume that it's very possible for an average geared barb or bm in phys marrow to tank this. Before you ask me what kind of OP gear the tanking archer had, realize that any self respecting barb at lv 10x should probably have more than 15k hp in tiger anyway. Vit barbs at 7x can easily have 10k hp in tiger, for that matter.

Cody_tylor - Sanctuary · May 2012

KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear wrote: »

How can I be "opening packs to merchant 24/7" if im not there 24/7? And actually you're quite wrong on your assumptions of what I do on and off the game again. And My computers not on 24/7 either but nice try ;p

You know someones upset when they try to attack your personal life. b:chuckle

Lol, you are funny bro. So you admit you open packs? Cool story bro. And merchanting does not require you to sit on the computer andon see whoa bought/sold your stuff. I admit I leave my computer on to merchant overnight sometimes. I don't lile heated discussions, if you don't admit you CS or merchant everyday for long hours, fine with me. Do whatever you want.

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver · May 2012

KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Try using an archer. It doesn't hit me when I pull it with STA. It only puts up the melee buff and attacks me regularly.

I tried pulling with knife throw, and still got the same result, but it's entirely possible I was a little too close to him. I didn't really make a huge effort to be at max range, just guesstimated. If you do test it out, please do post the results. I'd be curious to know.

KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear · May 2012

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I tried pulling with knife throw, and still got the same result, but it's entirely possible I was a little too close to him. I didn't really make a huge effort to be at max range, just guesstimated. If you do test it out, please do post the results. I'd be curious to know.

Well knife throw is a melee attack. Try it with a non melee attack. I still haven't been hit by this skill with my archer yet... /shrug

Nenor - Dreamweaver · May 2012

I pulled Leaf in aba with STA the 1st day .. was out of range, boss moved into ranged, and cast bleed on me. Insta death (7800 hp). Also tried with lightening attack, same results.

Was healing for sot boss earlier this morning, watched archer pull with STA, boss moved into range, cast bleed, insta death. (not sure of hp)

Im demon btw, not sure what path sot archer was.

My gear is nothing spectacular, r8 top tt99 legs, boots, arms, refined to +3/4. Lunar necklace +6 warsong belt+6 unicorn helm (g13) +10 and lunar cape+6. rank ring and heaven jail +3.

KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear · May 2012

Nenor - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I pulled Leaf in aba with STA the 1st day .. was out of range, boss moved into ranged, and cast bleed on me. Insta death (7800 hp). Also tried with lightening attack, same results.

Was healing for sot boss earlier this morning, watched archer pull with STA, boss moved into range, cast bleed, insta death. (not sure of hp)

Im demon btw, not sure what path sot archer was.

My gear is nothing spectacular, r8 top tt99 legs, boots, arms, refined to +3/4. Lunar necklace +6 warsong belt+6 unicorn helm (g13) +10 and lunar cape+6. rank ring and heaven jail +3.

interesting.. perhaps its a sage thing then?

Mayfly - Dreamweaver · May 2012

Pulled with eldergoth in Abaddon in range mode, eldergoth died before I could stow.

So_Wet - Sanctuary · May 2012

lol aba boss bh one is easy like easiest bh ever for aps people im not op but ye very easy the bh seat however i died so many times whenever i get from headhunter now ima just trash it talk about un-aps friendly lol

_RockHard_ - Lost City · May 2012

1 cler 1 bm lvl11 drags and some sins maybe a caster and it dies in about 10 sec's assuming its an aps squad least so guildmates have told me lol

Ebrithalia - Dreamweaver · May 2012

_RockHard_ - Lost City wrote: »

1 cler 1 bm lvl11 drags and some sins maybe a caster and it dies in about 10 sec's assuming its an aps squad least so guildmates have told me lol

did it with my facmates yesterday. boss dropped while demon hf was still there b:chuckle. so yeah, this new bh aba boss is either aps it to dead fast, or get a good tank if dps aint possible for that

Empu - Sanctuary · May 2012

Sam and I did some testing today with aba boss (bh today). I can now confirm that boss bleed damage decreases strongly on hp and also (but a bit less) on physical def. Also, the 2nd bleed tick is lower then the 1st. Was surprised to see that.

Synthetic results:
-Sin with hp buff (12.5k roughly) with different buffs to change defenses :
def : 5.4k => 12k bleed
def : 8.8k => 9.7k bleed and 2.8k 2nd tick
def : 12.3k => 7.8k bleed, 2.2k 2nd tick
def : 12.7k (+10 def lvl) => 7.6k bleed, 2.1k 2nd tick (confirmed that as expected from a dot, def lvl doesn't matter)
def : 12.6k => 6.2k bleed, 1.3k 2nd tick

-bm without hp buff, 10.5k hp
def : 11.8k => 12.6k bleed (gotten obvious here)
def : 24k (marrow, so mag def crushed) => 7.3k bleed

-relogged sin to get hp buff off, 9.3k hp
def : 16.7k => bleed 12.2k

-for lolz, logged barb, 26k hp
def : 14k => 2.5k bleed
def : 18k => 1.8k bleed

So it's pretty obvious now why barbs tank it so easily, and why fully buffed ppl with all +10 gear have no problems. Also shows that it wasn't the skill spamming Kyougu did was on no influence at all on the dying problem of most, it was his/her gear+buffs that made it easy.

_DarkSeph_ - Sanctuary · May 2012

So_Wet - Sanctuary wrote: »

lol aba boss bh one is easy like easiest bh ever for aps people im not op but ye very easy the bh seat however i died so many times whenever i get from headhunter now ima just trash it talk about un-aps friendly lol

Control your damage and let the barb hold agro? I mean, this is very basic stuff back from fb/bh69 where nublet sins and archers would learn not to go crazy sparking if they didn't want to get squished.

thumbs · May 2012

_DarkSeph_ - Sanctuary wrote: »

Control your damage and let the barb hold agro? I mean, this is very basic stuff back from fb/bh69 where nublet sins and archers would learn not to go crazy sparking if they didn't want to get squished.

Sins no longer Rib Strike, Barbs no longer Frighten, Mystics do their 20% debuff over much better buffs.. People complain about PW, and seem to ignore the dodgy player base.

PaTMaN - Dreamweaver · May 2012

Empu - Sanctuary wrote: »

Sam and I did some testing today with aba boss (bh today). I can now confirm that boss bleed damage decreases strongly on hp and also (but a bit less) on physical def. Also, the 2nd bleed tick is lower then the 1st. Was surprised to see that.
...
-bm without hp buff, 10.5k hp
def : 11.8k => 12.6k bleed (gotten obvious here)
def : 24k (marrow, so mag def crushed) => 7.3k bleed

I ran on my BM today and threw on phys marrow. Confirmed what you have discovered as well and I modified my previous testing post to reflect such, including my physical def values for the tests.

I was at 11k health and 19.4k pdef and the first hit on me was around 7.5k. I'm glad you both did some testing. b:victory

Kitamura - Lost City · May 2012

Killing Abaddon BH boss -> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENqULQWdNsA

Will frap SoT soon.

Empu - Sanctuary · May 2012

PaTMaN - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I ran on my BM today and threw on phys marrow. Confirmed what you have discovered as well and I modified my previous testing post to reflect such, including my physical def values for the tests.

I was at 11k health and 19.4k pdef and the first hit on me was around 7.5k. I'm glad you both did some testing. b:victory

I was really surprised by the impact of hp. Sage hp buff on sin cut bleed in half. It does explain all the "why do ppl complain, bosses are easy"-vids around, and why a crappy geared barb would still do better then a good geared sin (which was the main curiousity for me).

I hope this info will make it some easier to make squads. There are quite some bms and seekers that could tank those bosses (especially with those +30% hp pills from maiden chest), but squads are to chicken to even let them try.

On vids, I'd rather see some of slow kills then the regular super-geared solo or super-fast squad. Not out of jealousy or something, but just because it's misleading and makes the average squad fail. It took a squadwipe and a lot of explaining of me and squadmaker, for the other 4 to get how boss could easily be done with just teamwork and no veno. Highest hp there was 14k barb, best weapon was +5 r8. Those vids around just make ppl believe bosses are killed with spark>poke in every squad setup.

And another 2 discoveries
b:shocked Stupid boss kept chasing my cleric all the way to exit of cave
b:shocked Boss followed me in the water wit 0/1 hp

Xainou - Sanctuary · May 2012

Empu - Sanctuary wrote: »

b:shocked Stupid boss kept chasing my cleric all the way to exit of cave

She does eventually lose agro. But yea, I also brought the big lake between me and her and she couldn't get over, I even walked out of mini map range and she was still on me.

Only when I moved way further I lost her ._.

Tbh I wish they would just fix the fact that an OP aps squad can **** the boss before it even buffs up. I like the new challenge, hell, it's easy if you got a smart squad.

It being cheated so easily just has a very sour taste to me...

Angel_Spawn - Sanctuary · May 2012

Slightly pimped up my phy def, now can survive the bleed for a short while with heals 12k ish hp and 10k phy def, but still not every time the boss goes smoothly unless you have aps monkey squad that can kill before boss buffs, the better hp and defense, the easier it is like many already said, hence for r9 `ers it`s even too easy.

tweakz · May 2012

Empu - Sanctuary wrote: »

And another 2 discoveries
b:shocked Stupid boss kept chasing my cleric all the way to exit of cave
b:shocked Boss followed me in the water wit 0/1 hp

-Someone will find glitch soon then PW will fix that. lol

Xainou - Sanctuary wrote: »

She does eventually lose agro. But yea, I also brought the big lake between me and her and she couldn't get over, I even walked out of mini map range and she was still on me.

Only when I moved way further I lost her ._.

Tbh I wish they would just fix the fact that an OP aps squad can **** the boss before it even buffs up. I like the new challenge, hell, it's easy if you got a smart squad.

It being cheated so easily just has a very sour taste to me...[/COLOR]

Actually the ones being cheated are the ones that invested in aps and whatever to get to the point that they could solo those BH's then having it's value thwomped. -Gotta look at it from all angles.

Empu - Sanctuary · May 2012

Xainou - Sanctuary wrote: »

She does eventually lose agro. But yea, I also brought the big lake between me and her and she couldn't get over, I even walked out of mini map range and she was still on me.

Tbh I wish they would just fix the fact that an OP aps squad can **** the boss before it even buffs up. I like the new challenge, hell, it's easy if you got a smart squad.

It wasn't a joke. Testing damage with bm/sin/barb, I reset boss each time somewhere between 2nd bridge/crossrode to 2nd fb boss. On cleric, I litterally had to portal out to reset it while avoiding the walkers still alive b:laugh

And I agree. They should make the buff thing trigger on 1st hit or something.

tweakz wrote: »

Actually the ones being cheated are the ones that invested in aps and whatever to get to the point that they could solo those BH's then having it's value thwomped. -Gotta look at it from all angles.

1st, that statement would only relate to sins. For any other "aps" toon, I think the faster run without wine cost is not such a bad change to force to squad.

2nd, nobody sane in his/her mind invested time or money in an "aps sin" for the sole purpose of soloing bh seat and aba. That was more a convenient side effect then a purpose on itself.

3rd, bh seat and aba bosses were way to easy. We really needed a few harder bosses to get rid off those +10~12 weap DoT sins with 5k hp and 2k phys def. Those are the only ones that QQ about these new bosses. 1 even posted in this thread, while in bh before update he was telling how sins don't need hp/def but just attack.

tweakz · May 2012

Empu - Sanctuary wrote: »

1st, that statement would only relate to sins. For any other "aps" toon, I think the faster run without wine cost is not such a bad change to force to squad.

No; the way I was running it (wined) could've been done with a BM or any other aps toon. 1/2 hour and get aps toon and alt box BH100 done. (Faster than the average random squad)

2nd, nobody sane in his/her mind invested time or money in an "aps sin" for the sole purpose of soloing bh seat and aba. That was more a convenient side effect then a purpose on itself.

Maybe not the sole purpose but it was a big factor in how well geared they became, or are you one of those people that thinks Assassins should spend night and day in Nirvana? (I typically only do 99 key runs).

3rd, bh seat and aba bosses were way to easy. We really needed a few harder bosses to get rid off those +10~12 weap DoT sins with 5k hp and 2k phys def. Those are the only ones that QQ about these new bosses. 1 even posted in this thread, while in bh before update he was telling how sins don't need hp/def but just attack.

Attack should still be first priority.

Abadon and SOT boses

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