The Typical question: demon or sage ?

xmizukax
xmizukax Posts: 0 Arc User
edited March 2012 in Psychic
So yeah i cant decide yet.
Like 90% of psys told me to go sage but that one guy told me that demon is much better for PVP and I do PVP a lot and planed to get into ranking on momaganon server with my psy.

so yeah...demon or sage if I just wanna pwn in PVP?
Post edited by xmizukax on

Comments

  • _Asuma - Lost City
    _Asuma - Lost City Posts: 17 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    from what i know
    sage:
    more chi
    bubble of life becomes a purify
    earth vector has 50% chance to cost one spark
    SOR recovers 15% of max health
    SOV cost no mana
    effect form SOS increases to 5 more sec
    psychic will give 10 sec immunity

    Demon:
    more crits
    earth vectors range extends to 8meters
    landslide give more crit chance
    tide spirit give more crit chance
    soul burn cooldown reduced by 5 seconds
    glacial shards has a 75% chance to immobilize
    sandburst blast weakens earth resistance by 20% for 8 sec





    well thats what i got if u want to see all of em go to ecatomb.net to see them n all the other classes skills

    sounds like beause of crit demon can be nice n pvp butfrom the looks of it sage can perfome well to so i guess its up to what you like more hope this helped
  • xmizukax
    xmizukax Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    already checked ecatomb and the decition is as same as hard. Both seems to have good PVP sites. I really use the physical immunity skill a lot and 10secs for it would be even better.

    also if u got the time for it u could just sage spark pew pew, since its 700% and demon one only 500%

    but also that demon ranged Earth Vector is a damm nice advantage...
  • Eoria - Harshlands
    Eoria - Harshlands Posts: 6,118 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Sage.

    [/thread]
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    "subtraction has the butt of an angel" - Paulrogers
    I <3 Subtraction.
    /blatant sig copy is blatant

    105/105/105 obtained! b:cute
  • XKurayami - Lost City
    XKurayami - Lost City Posts: 17 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Sage.

    [/thread]

    ...and why?
    We'll never find out of epic Perfect World would have turned out with their original developers :/
  • Shayd - Raging Tide
    Shayd - Raging Tide Posts: 475 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    ...and why?
    Sage for the usual attacks, Demon for buffs, Soul of...
    Mystic: 99 lvl (Main)
    Psychic: 96 lvl (Alt)
    Assassin: 78 lvl (Retired)
    Cleric: 75 lvl (Retired)

    Big bumpy ride since 2008
  • Desdi - Sanctuary
    Desdi - Sanctuary Posts: 8,680 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Not trying to be biased here but Sage also has 72 Defence levels from White Voodoo. It's up to you, really. Nobody can decide for you. It's about how well you take advantage of your choice.

    [SIGPIC]http://i.imgur.com/MtwcqjL.png[/SIGPIC]
    ★ Venomancer videos - tinyurl.com/k6ppkw4 ★ Desdi - Demon ♪ Wyvelin - Sage ★
  • xmizukax
    xmizukax Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    So its not like one site got the better or more advantages for PVP?
  • Subtraction - Harshlands
    Subtraction - Harshlands Posts: 690 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    xmizukax wrote: »
    So yeah i cant decide yet.
    Like 90% of psys told me to go sage but that one guy told me that demon is much better for PVP and I do PVP a lot and planed to get into ranking on momaganon server with my psy.

    so yeah...demon or sage if I just wanna pwn in PVP?

    90% told you to go Sage.
    One person told you to go Demon.

    You expect a different answer? Go Sage.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "Ewa Sonnet has the best pair of jugs ever. Nothing else compares." - Eoria.
    HE'S OVERALL KNOWLEDGE OF THE CLASS IS LEGIT.
  • _Perses_ - Lost City
    _Perses_ - Lost City Posts: 1,917 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Sage and Demon are Equal in PvE
    Sage owns Demon in PvP.



    That make it clear enough?


    /****ingretardsinthisgamelatelymakemewannasmashmyheadthroughmyscreen
    Nothing worthwhile to mention here, enjoy the animated signature~

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Euthymius - Heavens Tear
    Euthymius - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,162 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Sage>Demon for PvE imo becase of Sage SoV/Bubble, and more consistant power from Black Vodoo and masteries. Demons may get more spike damage from their crit-boosting skills and their masteries, but Landslide only has a 30% chance of working and Tide Spirit costs 2 sparks...

    (I wont deny that the thought of chaining Demon Sandburst with Stone Smasher would be amazing though b:dirty) In pvp, its likely going to depend more on your skill/gear than your cultivation choice.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]Remember: OP may be a duck|OP/GMs/Devs may not deliver|Search function is your friend|Lurk more|Be wary of Mods: they can't be trusted|This place isn't a hugbox|Your tears sustain me|Know what Bait is|"Soon" may never come|Postcount, Dubs, and other GETs are important|Don't revive long dead threads|There is a section for everything|You can be banned for anything|No Fun Allowed outside of OT|Sweetiebot rules OT|"Circlejerks" are inevitable|Threads can be derailed and saved|Those who use"XD" should off themselves at their earliest convenience|
  • xmizukax
    xmizukax Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    hmm am rather more for sage atm cuz never had sage char and I like the faster chi gain.
    also ya masteries more dmg and voodo aswell and phyicall immune up to 10 secs which I use a lot.
  • Psychel - Dreamweaver
    Psychel - Dreamweaver Posts: 98 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    I personally take sage because of its sage effects on the skills. Increased damage power from Black voodoo, Chi gain skills, Lovely add on damage on masteries, nice increased in range of landslide, longer duration of psy will and Soulburn, and the chance of not taking sparks from spells such as red tide and earth vector.

    I do find demon are also balanced because of its spike damage due to high crit and its wonderful add-on effects of its skills like it kicks in. I have been to squads with demon psy before, and in fact they are quite a killer. I will personally like demon earth vector and some other skills over the sage.

    If you love being a nice support without attracting too much aggro attention, be equally a good constant damager, go sage. If ya love to be a centre of attention, wanna kill things in your way ahead of squad, love the insane damage you deal with crits, go demon. That is what I observe through my in game experience.

    In all, I think its up to your own play style that determines which path you go.

    Edit:
    Note: What I just said is based on PvE, not PvP.
    Wow, I see you... Now you don't... isn't that trolling? b:shutup
  • UrDian - Harshlands
    UrDian - Harshlands Posts: 81 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Psy PVP absolutely revolves around effective use of your chi. Among many other advantages, sage psy is far superior in chi regen.

    Many have said it: if you want PVE, choose whatever floats your boat. For PvP, sage wins hands down.
  • evolution1234
    evolution1234 Posts: 157 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Sage and Demon are Equal in PvE
    Sage owns Demon in PvP.



    That make it clear enough?


    /****ingretardsinthisgamelatelymakemewannasmashmyheadthroughmyscreen


    minor changes - demon > sage in PVE [but no where near as much as sins] - because of the 3 spark channel and critical strike boosts
    On LC server, there is a r8+10/hh99/nv demon psychic who beats the r9+12 24josd psychics in tiger event.

    sage >demon in pvp - psychic will, earth vector, soul burn are the most frequently used skills in pvp; all of them use a spark. [all the new morai skills need 30 chi to 299 chi] demon run out of chi too quickly. Genie clouderuption and chi pot can only be used in pve. In pvp, faith, expel, ironguard are more important.
  • Kerona - Sanctuary
    Kerona - Sanctuary Posts: 1,771 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Beating r9 Psy in tiger event has nothing to do with skill or cultivation, and everything to do with effective use of seeker alts.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Mesro - Heavens Tear
    Mesro - Heavens Tear Posts: 44 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Yo, Im a Demon Psy, with a bit of tanking ability.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • TheDendra - Harshlands
    TheDendra - Harshlands Posts: 222 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    My advice would be - compare every psy skill and ask yourself in what way do you use the skill. This is pretty much the way I did it for myself based on my preferences and play style:



    Aqua Impact(vote sage) - I simply don't use aqua impact frequently enough to make the demon's 20% chance to reduce chi count. Overall, it's not like I'm thrilled with a 10% extra speed reduction sage provides, but at least it's reliable based on the number of times I will use aqua impact instead of other skills at my disposal.

    Spirit Blast(vote demon) - Just like aqua impact, I won't use this skill frequently enough in pvp to make that 20% sage chance to gain chi count. For pve, I def. prefer sage, but overall I'd give slight edge to demon version.

    Aqua Cannon (vote demon) - Easy choice because I don't really rely on aqua cannon to kite my opponents nor do I get a chance to use aqua cannon all that often. In addition, primary reason I cast aqua cannon is to nuke the sh* out of the target(s) next to me - so demon wins in every possible way for me.

    Landslide(vote sage) - I don't like fighting at close range, so the extra range sage provides comes in handy. Also I don't think demon's 30% chance to increase your crit rate is high enough to be reliable, especially when you look at the amount of times you find yourself fighting close range. If for some reason you like fighting at closer range, demon version is probably more beneficial to you.

    Another good thing about demon version is nuking cata barb, because that's one of those situations in which you get to engage in close combat and get to use the bonus crit rate if it procs.


    Sandburst Blast(vote demon) - Even though it's just 20% chance, the demon version is still more useful overall because I'm not really much of a fan of that sage range increase - mostly because I'm used to its current range and I wouldn't find myself in a lot of situations where that extra range would really make a difference, whereas the demon's 20% chance to debuff will mean hella lot every time it procs.

    Glacial Shards(vote sage) - For me it came down to reliability of the freeze proc rate. Demon 75% chance will still be as much of a reliable combo spell for me as the sage 60% is - in other words, even if I had demon glacial shards, I would still prepare my next spell as if the freeze didn't proc because I can't count on it.

    So if the freeze procs, I change my following combo and for that situation I'd prefer to have my opponent frozen for 2 more seconds.

    Torrent/Sand Trap(vote sage) - I like my DoTs to keep constant pressure and I'll usually use them on a harder target to stack up damage and have an easier time bypassing charm ticks. Besides that, sage version is also better for pve, so that gives me two reasons why to go sage. Demon's positive side is that it allows more pressure on the target in a shorter amount of time, so it comes down to your play style and which combos you like to use.

    Bubble of Life(vote sage) - One of most common reasons why people choose sage psy in the first place. It allows you to purify yourself+nearby squad members. Perhaps one good thing not that known about it is that you can use bubble of life+expel combo which works great in pvp.

    Soul of Vengeance(vote sage) - I chose sage version because I don't like getting hit and the sage version allows me to buff others - i.e. a barb can use my SoV buff much more because he gets hit a lot more in TWs. Same applies to pve where I can buff the barb in gv and such.

    Demon version has its benefits and if I was focusing entirely on myself, I would say demon is better for pvp - so this comes down to personal preference, if you like turning yourself into a thistle, go for demon (because following the same logic you will probably prefer demon soul of retaliation as well, as it also reflects more damage).

    Soul of Silence(vote sage) - A r9+12 psy's soul of silence procs frequently as it is, so I'd rather have that seal last longer on my opponent. I can see merit to both versions, so it just comes down to comparing the percentages for each version based on your gear plans and then deciding for yourself which one would suit you more.

    Soul of Stunning(vote sage) - A r9+12 sage psy's soul of stunning lasts longer. Which one would benefit you more depends on your endgame gear plans, so do the math and see which stun will last longer based on your endgame soulforce.

    Soul of Retaliation(vote sage?) - I view this more as a defensive skill, to protect me against the first hit which is why I chose sage. In retrospect, I didn't know sage SoR healed upon casting it, I thought it healed you once it's triggered. That is why I put a question mark next to my vote because I need to be r9 first and see how it's healing helps me out in combat - as it stands now, I would give an edge to demon SoR because it reflects more and still saves me from that 1st shot just like the sage version does.

    Soulburn(vote sage) - In all the fights where I use soulburn, I need those 2seconds sage provides a lot more than I need the cooldown to be 5seconds lower. So this is a pretty simple vote based on how applicable sage and demon version are in combat.

    Psychic Will(vote sage) - Easy choice once again, sage version's 2seconds extra mean a lot and that demon 20% chance to cost no spark is laughable.

    Earth vector(vote sage) - one of most frequently used skills, so the 50% chance to cost no spark allows me to use it more often, whereas the demon range increase isn't all that noticeable because in the situations I'd stun multiple targets, I'd most likely stun them with or without that extra range.

    Red Tide(vote sage) - sage 50% chance to save 1spark increases your fighting efficiency (if you hit n run, you have more chi for next attack and if you stay in a battle, you have more chi to keep your efficiency high). For example, sage earth vector+red tide can cost a total of 1spark whereas demon always have to spend 3sparks.

    On the other hand, the demon red tide gives you more power over a short period of time, so this skill comes down to your play style and other factors such as TW partners - if you have a veno chi hoe allowing you keep a high pace with demon psy, you pretty much eliminate the benefit sage psy skills have over you.

    (if you say you don't need a veno because you have chi pots and cloud eruption - well that again allows sage psys to use the pot cd for i.e. ironguard and use genie energy for ad or whatever situation requires)

    Tide Spirit(vote demon) - sage only gets 3more seconds of increased channelling while demon get +20% crit rate for 15sec, so obv. demon is waaaay better.

    Empowered&Diminished Vigor(vote sage) - Sage version makes your charm tick faster or opponent's tick slower which is in my eyes much better than the demon version (if you are one of them cheap psys who fights with nothing but crab meat, I suppose demon emp.vigor would benefit you more).

    Disturb Soul(vote sage?) - I had a tough time with this one, mostly because you don't have enough time in combat to waste it on casting disturb soul since you will pretty much always have 2-3 better options to use rather than that spell.

    If you are a person who really likes to use this spell, I'd vote demon because it saves you time. If you only use it in certain situations, chances are that sage longer duration will help you more.

    Black&White Voodo(vote sage) - This is one of main crossroads where you have to decide what to do based on your play style. The differences in these skills pretty much give you a blueprint on how you should shard your psy - if you plan to shard JoSD, demon psy will benefit from it a lot more. If you plan to go for DoTs, sage psy will benefit from it more.

    Obviously you can be a lazy psy and go full JoSD even as sage but you won't reach your maximum potential as a r9+12 (looks at urdian for a perfect example - though I heard rumours that he changed his mind and started re-sharding some DoTs, wise choice if rumours are true). To explain the whole deal on att/def levels would take a topic in its own, so to keep it simple - if you like to keep a balance between att/def levels, go demon, if you like to go full attack and full defence mode based on the situation, go sage.

    Earthen&Aqua spirit(vote irrelevant) - I say irrelevant because it doesn't give an advantage to either path. If you choose to go demon, you can easily shard sapphires to make up for the lost bonus damage and if you go sage, you can easily shard crit gems (which 99.9999% pwi players have no idea about since they've never heard of balancing crit rate with dmg output because at a certain point +dmg shards become less beneficial than % crit bonus)
  • Changuita - Harshlands
    Changuita - Harshlands Posts: 145 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    I don't think that any Demon Psy has ever stolen aggro from me in nirva... pretty sure that means I'm hitting harder.

    More chi = more big damage skills I can do and they can't = more of them being dead.

    Honestly... going sage is worth it for the purify bubble of life alone.


    I will say one thing though: Demon books are going to be WAY CHEAPER... (because nobody goes demon..)
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Shadwrage - Sanctuary
    Shadwrage - Sanctuary Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    Sage>Demon for PvE imo becase of Sage SoV/Bubble, and more consistant power from Black Vodoo and masteries. Demons may get more spike damage from their crit-boosting skills and their masteries, but Landslide only has a 30% chance of working and Tide Spirit costs 2 sparks...

    (I wont deny that the thought of chaining Demon Sandburst with Stone Smasher would be amazing though b:dirty) In pvp, its likely going to depend more on your skill/gear than your cultivation choice.

    This is probably the most help you're gonna get from people in this game lol. Everyone says go Sage for the Chi. Meh. My Psy is still low (currently lvl 50) but just looking at skills, and looking at how the game is played- it's entirely up to the player, not to choose their cultivation, but to take advantage OF their cultivation. My BM is a Sage, and everyone wants demon for the easier APS and demon HF- whoop-dee-doo. I have more fun as a Sage. However my Psy will be demon for sure. As Euthymius said, it's about your skill as that class- not your cultivation. So, choose your side, practice your skills, and you're set. Besides, in TW you can take your time if you need chi, and in duels.. well who doesn't get full chi before they start? Anybody? No? Didn't think so. Plus: Who's gonna cast Master Li's Secret Technique while they're dueling? (the big Chi skill for Sage everyone loves). Seriously though, choose whatever you want. Psy's are unique, so just have fun with it! b:victory
  • TheDendra - Harshlands
    TheDendra - Harshlands Posts: 222 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    That's the thing, you can't take your time in TW to take chi.

    I can count on my fingers how many times I had 3sparks in a TW in the last 8months. Most of the time you are fighting with 1-2 sparks and having that ability to save sparks is great for either hit n running or staying on a high efficiency in a long fight.

    If you use chi pots, you have cooldown on ig. If you use cloud eruption, you need energy to cast AD/etc.. Third way to get chi is if you have a veno tagging along with you and obviously whenever you have free time, you can hit the binding totems or spam skills.

    Bottom line being sage psy has less strings attached to his chi than a demon does. If you find an efficient way to bypass tht disadvantage that works well with your play style, go for it.

    Far as I'm concerned, the chi usage is not the only reason I went sage, as sage also has higher survivability and the way it works, full att/full def mode it suits me more, espec for endgame gear plans.
  • Dai_Viper - Archosaur
    Dai_Viper - Archosaur Posts: 142 Arc User
    edited March 2012
    With my experience:
    To kill ppl who have the same gear or better gear, demon is the better choice with crit skills
    Gear info: pwcalc.com/ca03cfa26484422eb:victory