Veno Help plz

SoullessKit - Raging Tide
SoullessKit - Raging Tide Posts: 8 Arc User
edited November 2011 in General Discussion
Ok... I know I'm not suppose to use Bramble Guard on clerics, but what about the other classes: sin, mystic, archer, wizard, psychic, and other lower level venos. I always do the tank*seeker, barb, bm*. Just getting mad at people when they say that they didnt want bramble guard..so plz help me out!b:puzzledb:surrender
Post edited by SoullessKit - Raging Tide on

Comments

  • VenusArmani - Dreamweaver
    VenusArmani - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,009 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Actually, just ask the whole squad first. If they want to be stupid, let em be.
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    Thanks Silvy for the superb sig <3

    VenusArmani's word of the moment: Expand your Vocabulary, Expand your horizons!
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  • Atlantasia - Sanctuary
    Atlantasia - Sanctuary Posts: 78 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Most arcane classes don't ever want bramble because if they get aggro its not coming off them as easily. So as a rule, unless they ask I don't bramble Wizards/Psychics/Clerics/Venos/Mystic, I also don't bramble Archers unless they ask. Not sure about low level assassins but higher level ones (about 80-90+) it should definitely be fine to bramble. Basically, rule of thumb, if they're melee they generally can handle the aggro and you can bramble them. :) Hope that helps.
  • VenusArmani - Dreamweaver
    VenusArmani - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,009 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Atlantasia - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Most arcane classes don't ever want bramble because if they get aggro its not coming off them as easily. So as a rule, unless they ask I don't bramble Wizards/Psychics/Clerics/Venos/Mystic, I also don't bramble Archers unless they ask. Not sure about low level assassins but higher level ones (about 80-90+) it should definitely be fine to bramble. Basically, rule of thumb, if they're melee they generally can handle the aggro and you can bramble them. :) Hope that helps.

    That is who shes been brambling and she's still getting yelled at.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Thanks Silvy for the superb sig <3

    VenusArmani's word of the moment: Expand your Vocabulary, Expand your horizons!
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  • SoullessKit - Raging Tide
    SoullessKit - Raging Tide Posts: 8 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    wow thanks guysb:thanks this helps me out soooo much b:victory
  • WhiteWiIIow - Archosaur
    WhiteWiIIow - Archosaur Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Best rule of thumb, is to only put Bramble on the tank. Bramble builds aggro quickly and holds it strongly. So .... whichever party member is designated as the tank and needs to hold the aggro is the only one who should get bramble.
  • SoullessKit - Raging Tide
    SoullessKit - Raging Tide Posts: 8 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    VenusArmani - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    That is who shes been brambling and she's still getting yelled at.
    lol but thanks anyway ^_^
  • stinks
    stinks Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Yes always Brable Mele classes, Tank 1st and formost.
    There are times when you can brable the magic classes to but only during PvP events simply because players dont act or think like mobs do. (Eg: TW a lot of ppl will try to kill the cleric 1st to prevent them from healing BRABLE THEM ^^) If they don't like it KICK EM IN THE NUTS!
  • Alasen - Heavens Tear
    Alasen - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,874 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    i dot' bramble anyone but the tank..... kinda helps when stupid **** happens... or esp if the cleric dc's. Least the barb /seeker might stay alive lol
  • FoxRunning - Heavens Tear
    FoxRunning - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,048 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Im from the old days of the game, and we venos we were told that all members of the squad were to be brambled, excepting the cleric. so now its like a whole new set of rules now, and its very confusing..b:question
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  • Ikarium - Dreamweaver
    Ikarium - Dreamweaver Posts: 631 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    stinks wrote: »
    Yes always Brable Mele classes, Tank 1st and formost.
    No.....don't always bramble melee classes. Unless you want to help that 80's sin who can't tank but accidentally stole aggro keep it for longer. Tank yes, all others...ask them.
  • thumbs
    thumbs Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    I request bramble on my cleric, wiz, and mystic. I expect it on my barb, and assassin.
  • MageMERC - Harshlands
    MageMERC - Harshlands Posts: 1,600 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    WhiteWiIIow - Archosaur wrote: »
    Best rule of thumb, is to only put Bramble on the tank. Bramble builds aggro quickly and holds it strongly. So .... whichever party member is designated as the tank and needs to hold the aggro is the only one who should get bramble.

    ...my veno is 93 and i play it a lot.....

    To clarify what is said above:

    Your tank wants to keep aggro, so bramble helps then keep aggro.

    If another high level players gets aggro every now and then and wants to lose aggro back to the tank, then IF they are brambled, it will be harder for them to lose aggro back to the tank.

    For FC for example, often 3 or 4 high levels will be killing mobs and swapping aggro at the bosses. In that scenario, you want to ask them if they want bramble, primarily because you dont know how well they will handle aggro on a boss, nor do you usually know what gear they carry because you wouldnt normally waste time checking everyones gear, nor do you know there personal preferences.

    Easy solution, ask.

    Consider also, if you have a high level player melee player who DOESN'T want aggro, I'd be careful around them and I would question their ability until I saw them in action.
  • Itori - Lost City
    Itori - Lost City Posts: 151 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    at 100+ I bramble everyone...

    if they cant handle a simple little buff by then...time to go back and learn to play?
    I mostly brambled barb/bm/sin at lower levels, no matter how squishy they always get in melee range to take ADVANTAGE of the buff. Who cares if I bramble the cleric if they never get hit in melee range. If they die it's usually cause someone else died first, or they got heal aggro, not cause bramble is some buff that tells the mobs to beat them up. I have demon and I like to bramble anyone I can.. last time I got yelled at for brambling someone was long ago, some 9x wizard with barely like 4k hp. My new rule became 5k+ hp unbuffed lol. Now I kinda dropped that, most people fit it anyways, but if the person is dying so much maybe it's not brambles maybes it's *GASP* the person for not controlling their aggro? Guess thats a foreign concept, dont brambles lols.

    Sad when I had to constantly ask venos for bramble on my barb though. Just cause they wont give it to the cleric doesnt mean dont give it to anybody b:sad
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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  • Havilah - Sanctuary
    Havilah - Sanctuary Posts: 212 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    I always bramble melee and sometime archer if they going melee and can handle (and I'm actually paying attention XD), myself (HA/AA build) and anyone who actually ask. I also bramble full squad if I know the upcoming boss is doing a physical aoe that is reflectable, like 1-x drummer, 2-x general feng and fcc oceania, might as well get the extra damage in (I'm sure there is more, but rarely entered FB99s, warsong and delta in those 2 years I played, casual gamer for you...).
  • Ukkie - Sanctuary
    Ukkie - Sanctuary Posts: 120 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Itori - Lost City wrote: »
    at 100+ I bramble everyone...

    if they cant handle a simple little buff by then...time to go back and learn to play?
    I mostly brambled barb/bm/sin at lower levels, no matter how squishy they always get in melee range to take ADVANTAGE of the buff. Who cares if I bramble the cleric if they never get hit in melee range. If they die it's usually cause someone else died first, or they got heal aggro, not cause bramble is some buff that tells the mobs to beat them up. I have demon and I like to bramble anyone I can.. last time I got yelled at for brambling someone was long ago, some 9x wizard with barely like 4k hp. My new rule became 5k+ hp unbuffed lol. Now I kinda dropped that, most people fit it anyways, but if the person is dying so much maybe it's not brambles maybes it's *GASP* the person for not controlling their aggro? Guess thats a foreign concept, dont brambles lols.

    Sad when I had to constantly ask venos for bramble on my barb though. Just cause they wont give it to the cleric doesnt mean dont give it to anybody b:sad

    Ow wait, you actually mean persons have to have something called "skill" b:laugh

    Anyway, Bm/Barb/Seeker should have Bramble I think. They are mostly the HA classes and should be taken all punches. Furthermore I agree with Itori, if the cleric dies, it problably is to lousy playing or tank not holding aggro which als can be brought back to lousy playing :) (and yes, I know what I'm talking about, I've been playing cleric for over 3 years :P )
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  • CyanideTail - Heavens Tear
    CyanideTail - Heavens Tear Posts: 23 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Atlantasia - Sanctuary wrote: »
    I also don't bramble Archers unless they ask./QUOTE]

    really? not even archers. I bramble everyone except cleric. I'm a pure mag veno so I'm squishy as the next mag based toon and never complain onceb:chuckle
  • Ikarium - Dreamweaver
    Ikarium - Dreamweaver Posts: 631 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Itori - Lost City wrote: »
    at 100+ I bramble everyone...

    if they cant handle a simple little buff by then...time to go back and learn to play?
    lolz.....or go back and learn who and what to buff with an aggro keeping buff?
  • Itori - Lost City
    Itori - Lost City Posts: 151 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Ikarium - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    lolz.....or go back and learn who and what to buff with an aggro keeping buff?

    If someones over 100 and they cant handle being brambled thats quite sad.
    You think I bramble everyone back when I was 6x? nah just the barb. but I didnt stay 6x forever and leveling is incredibly easy in this game..

    All I see brambles is a buff to do a little extra damage when getting hit by melee. Not much more. I'd also like to see the old 'dont bramble this or that' be put to rest when over 100, just pointless.... the PVE you do at 100 should be quite faceroll easy... enjoy the hoolahoop.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    There is no shame in losing when there is no honor in winning.
  • Alasen - Heavens Tear
    Alasen - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,874 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Itori - Lost City wrote: »
    If someones over 100 and they cant handle being brambled thats quite sad.
    You think I bramble everyone back when I was 6x? nah just the barb. but I didnt stay 6x forever and leveling is incredibly easy in this game..

    All I see brambles is a buff to do a little extra damage when getting hit by melee. Not much more. I'd also like to see the old 'dont bramble this or that' be put to rest when over 100, just pointless.... the PVE you do at 100 should be quite faceroll easy... enjoy the hoolahoop.

    You're right, lvl 100 people... like in FF if they can't handle being the tank.... hell my sin's 88... i tanked holeen (with BB) oceania, the first boss with the exploding circels.... etc etc.

    But um.. that part i bolded, please dont' tell me that's all u think bramble does.


    and I dont mean to completely change the subject but since this thread's got veno in the title..... lol

    Does anyone know a water mob over 91 i can friggin lvl my turtle on? there's the 91 undines in hell.... but 92+ they won't give the pet 15 exp....

    Then there's the lvl 100 Nightspike Cavaliers around the boss in Frozen River, they dont' even link, and i can shoot them to pull one out. But they dont' DROP anything..... then there's lvl 105 plumpfish in heaven... plumpfish....... ugh....

    There's gotta be another mob 92... 93+ isnt' there?
    b:surrender b:sad
  • Havilah - Sanctuary
    Havilah - Sanctuary Posts: 212 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Alasen - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    You're right, lvl 100 people... like in FF if they can't handle being the tank.... hell my sin's 88... i tanked holeen (with BB) oceania, the first boss with the exploding circels.... etc etc.

    But um.. that part i bolded, please dont' tell me that's all u think bramble does.


    and I dont mean to completely change the subject but since this thread's got veno in the title..... lol

    Does anyone know a water mob over 91 i can friggin lvl my turtle on? there's the 91 undines in hell.... but 92+ they won't give the pet 15 exp....

    Then there's the lvl 100 Nightspike Cavaliers around the boss in Frozen River, they dont' even link, and i can shoot them to pull one out. But they dont' DROP anything..... then there's lvl 105 plumpfish in heaven... plumpfish....... ugh....

    There's gotta be another mob 92... 93+ isnt' there?
    b:surrender b:sad

    You're in luck then, the recent expansion added a new set of justice order, which meant new mobs too in this case. Go at the new town for lv100+(Elysium village?), there are lv100 crab mob underwater, the one I poked for fun seemed to be pure melee and at the very least, it gave me some coins. I wouldn't be surprised th drop rate is not great though, since we're talking about new mob being added, at high lv AND probably the fact it's linked to a justice order grinding quest 100+. Still, sound like your best choice for now (or could hunt the siren mob lv103 that was also added or simply both for mixing it up).

    Unless past map 2 to 4 contain some, I do have acces to the 2nd one, since there is water on that map,but I only did the chronos chain quest and then grinded on metal jackal for a while for a helm, so my brain didn't registerer if their was mob underwater...
  • Aizza - Harshlands
    Aizza - Harshlands Posts: 719 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    VenusArmani - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Actually, just ask the whole squad first. If they want to be stupid, let em be.

    ^ This

    Most times I did this to lower levels I was helping w/ FB's and BH's...and they get snitty thinking it is going to pull aggro TO them. Hello.. your 50 and my Veno is 100... as is her Herc.. I doubt it.

    Higher classes always say it to me - 'Keep me brambled' or 'Don't bramble me please'. Same with my Psy and her buffs.. Alot don't want due to the mp leech. So I ask...
  • Amenvampire - Sanctuary
    Amenvampire - Sanctuary Posts: 11 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    VenusArmani - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Actually, just ask the whole squad first. If they want to be stupid, let em be.

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  • Mayfly - Dreamweaver
    Mayfly - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,094 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    WhiteWiIIow - Archosaur wrote: »
    Best rule of thumb, is to only put Bramble on the tank. Bramble builds aggro quickly and holds it strongly. So .... whichever party member is designated as the tank and needs to hold the aggro is the only one who should get bramble.

    No, bramble does not build aggro quickly or hold it strongly. I've AOE ground with a herc (with level 5 Reflect, which returns more damage than all but demon bramble guard) and it's easy to pull mobs that haven't been bashed a few times off the herc with a single noxious or nova. One hit should be enough to pull the attention of a mob off a cleric or other squishy, brambled or not.
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  • Havilah - Sanctuary
    Havilah - Sanctuary Posts: 212 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Ok, it would appear that we need to come back to the basic here.

    Bramble guard is a buff that deal damage to the attacker if it used a melee strike, the damage being based on %. It doesn't add anything else than that extra damage, no agro on your atk and even less on the reflect.

    An example would be a veno grinding with her herc. Let's say the mob get reflected 800 by hit and herc is atking nothing, and your noxious gas hit for 14k, you need to wait for a good twenty hit before even casting it once and you need to include heal agro also.

    Short version: bramble is simply extra damage that count as the buffed's own damage, helpfull to help keeping agro and finishing that boss faster.

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