Aijou's Relevant VenoMANcer Guide
Aijou - Harshlands
Posts: 280 Arc User
Aijou s Relevant VenoMANcer Guide
I m going to be blunt, if you re going to power level to 100, cash shop full rank armor and run around with a bird that has bash on then you should leave immediately. I m only going to offend you.
I m sick and tired of seeing these **** venos running around in PVP zones and TW not knowing what the frig to do and it s starting to frustrate me. So I m writing a guide.
If you don t know any terms I m using go look at one of the out dated guides as a reference.
THE BUILDS
Pure Magic ($$$$$)
(1 STR 9 MAG) Every 2 Levels.
The ONLY end game gear that will justify this build: http://pwcalc.com/31257b61452466d6
PROS:
Hard Hitting (Somewhat)
Lots Of MP (Lol?)
Good Pet Heals Good for soloing TT.
CONS:
This build fails without extreme funding.
If you dont have a MINIMUM of a thousand USD to drop on your Veno, don t try it.
Mag/Vit Hybrid ($$)
(1 STR x MAG x Vit) Every 2 Levels (MAG & VIT to be capped and leveled out at your own choice.
PROS:
Good HP
Very well rounded build, perfect for anybody new or unfunded.
CONS: Magic attack will be slightly lower than pure magic.
Venomancers have one great thing about them that no other caster does: we get 12 HP per vit. Getting 2 more doesnt seem like a huge deal, but it is when it s added up.
Gear this build the same as any other Arcane build. (GARNET SHARDS. NOT. CITRINES.)
Pure VIT ($$$$)
(Min STR for gear, Min MAG for gear, rest to VIT)
Pros:
Lots of HP
Perfect for PVP
CONs:
Low(er) Magic Attack
Requires some funding
This build is great for PVP but requires you to do it right. You can easily hit massive amounts of HP (Like over 12k) with this build, sounds great right? It really is. The only thing you need to watch out for if you re attempting this build is that you will NEED to have very high defences to make all that HP actually worth something. Having loads of HP with low PDEF is the same as having no HP at all. Refine all your ornaments high, put the best garnet gems you can afford in your armor and get the level 95 rings that give P.Def. Weap will need high refines to make up for lack of magic attack.
LIGHT ARMOR ($$$)
DEX = (your current level)+4
STR = (your current level)+4
VIT = 3
MAG = Leftovers
PROS:
More Crit
Higher P Def Than AA
Higher HP (ONLY if you refine high)
CONS:
Lower Magic Attack
Low M Def
Very Squishy
Outdated build
Light armor used to be the ultimate for PvPing casters. It has however, become obsolete. I don t support this build, but here s a little information on it anyway.
So basically, you ll crit more (I guess?). You won t crit as much as a sin or archer this is a common misconception about LA builds. A lot of people will try to justify Light Armor by two things and two things only. "More Pdef and more crit". These are both true, but entirely not worth it. You ll only have about 5% more crit than an AA veno. Light armor which was once thought to be "the best of both worlds" has now downgraded to the "crappy in the middle option". Low P Def and Low M Def. Shard this build for Citrines and do not TOUCH vitality.
HEAVY ARMOR ($$$$)
STR = Req for HA
DEX = Req for HA
MAG = Minimum for weap (+ Whatever is left)
VIT = 3
PROS:
Incredible defences, great in TW and PVP
Great HP if you refine high
CONS:
Low M Def without well refined ornaments
Somewhat outdated
Hard to do and requires HIGH weapon refine
This build requires high refines, good shards and a nix.
You will have lots of P Def and HP but will suffer a great drop in magic attack.
Refine your weapon high and get a phoenix pet to make this build work.
I m going to be blunt, if you re going to power level to 100, cash shop full rank armor and run around with a bird that has bash on then you should leave immediately. I m only going to offend you.
I m sick and tired of seeing these **** venos running around in PVP zones and TW not knowing what the frig to do and it s starting to frustrate me. So I m writing a guide.
If you don t know any terms I m using go look at one of the out dated guides as a reference.
THE BUILDS
Pure Magic ($$$$$)
(1 STR 9 MAG) Every 2 Levels.
The ONLY end game gear that will justify this build: http://pwcalc.com/31257b61452466d6
PROS:
Hard Hitting (Somewhat)
Lots Of MP (Lol?)
Good Pet Heals Good for soloing TT.
CONS:
This build fails without extreme funding.
If you dont have a MINIMUM of a thousand USD to drop on your Veno, don t try it.
Mag/Vit Hybrid ($$)
(1 STR x MAG x Vit) Every 2 Levels (MAG & VIT to be capped and leveled out at your own choice.
PROS:
Good HP
Very well rounded build, perfect for anybody new or unfunded.
CONS: Magic attack will be slightly lower than pure magic.
Venomancers have one great thing about them that no other caster does: we get 12 HP per vit. Getting 2 more doesnt seem like a huge deal, but it is when it s added up.
Gear this build the same as any other Arcane build. (GARNET SHARDS. NOT. CITRINES.)
Pure VIT ($$$$)
(Min STR for gear, Min MAG for gear, rest to VIT)
Pros:
Lots of HP
Perfect for PVP
CONs:
Low(er) Magic Attack
Requires some funding
This build is great for PVP but requires you to do it right. You can easily hit massive amounts of HP (Like over 12k) with this build, sounds great right? It really is. The only thing you need to watch out for if you re attempting this build is that you will NEED to have very high defences to make all that HP actually worth something. Having loads of HP with low PDEF is the same as having no HP at all. Refine all your ornaments high, put the best garnet gems you can afford in your armor and get the level 95 rings that give P.Def. Weap will need high refines to make up for lack of magic attack.
LIGHT ARMOR ($$$)
DEX = (your current level)+4
STR = (your current level)+4
VIT = 3
MAG = Leftovers
PROS:
More Crit
Higher P Def Than AA
Higher HP (ONLY if you refine high)
CONS:
Lower Magic Attack
Low M Def
Very Squishy
Outdated build
Light armor used to be the ultimate for PvPing casters. It has however, become obsolete. I don t support this build, but here s a little information on it anyway.
So basically, you ll crit more (I guess?). You won t crit as much as a sin or archer this is a common misconception about LA builds. A lot of people will try to justify Light Armor by two things and two things only. "More Pdef and more crit". These are both true, but entirely not worth it. You ll only have about 5% more crit than an AA veno. Light armor which was once thought to be "the best of both worlds" has now downgraded to the "crappy in the middle option". Low P Def and Low M Def. Shard this build for Citrines and do not TOUCH vitality.
HEAVY ARMOR ($$$$)
STR = Req for HA
DEX = Req for HA
MAG = Minimum for weap (+ Whatever is left)
VIT = 3
PROS:
Incredible defences, great in TW and PVP
Great HP if you refine high
CONS:
Low M Def without well refined ornaments
Somewhat outdated
Hard to do and requires HIGH weapon refine
This build requires high refines, good shards and a nix.
You will have lots of P Def and HP but will suffer a great drop in magic attack.
Refine your weapon high and get a phoenix pet to make this build work.
Post edited by Aijou - Harshlands on
0
Comments
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Somewhat ghetto filler PVP/TW Guide:
PVP: Stay in fox form as much as possible.
If you're demon this is even better. Demon fox form makes you run super fast. The main reason for chilling in foxform is because of the obvious Sin issue. If you're in foxform and a sin comes out of nowhere you have a much higher chance of not dying.
What I do in PVP: Chill in foxform->sin comes out->Absolute domain (time it right, dont waste it)->leave foxform and run to kiting distance->send bird to stun and also do lucky scarab->nuke/bleed whatever until it dies.
Even if your build is LA or Heavy or whatever, we're not tanks. Don't ever stand around, that's how you die.
Venos in TW.
Purge and amp clerics and cata barbs. If you have your myriad rainbow (foxform/aoe) then go into a big group and use it. I've been able to run into huge groups where some BMs and Wizzies were doing their thing, landed 0 defences on the whole group and see a completely empty lane. Veno's purpose in TW is to support. Debuff, debuff, debuff, set clerics on fire. (With the bird, not.. flaming scarab)
Keep everyone you can buffed. BRAMBLE IS NOT NERFED IN TW. Bramble hood when a sin or BM or both get on you. Any aps class really, fun to see idiots suicide.
Never stay in one place. Move a lot, go to the front to do your debuff thing and run back behind the rest of your squad immediately.
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Under construction PVP Guide:
Note: All of these are assuming you have a phoenix pet with the skill flesh ream.
Fighting Wizards
The first thing you'll need to do is purge them. They will probably have their skill earth barrieron, this will need to be removed before your phoenix bleeds them. The damage of bleed is based on the target's physical defense at the time of the bleed being inflicted. So unless you have their buffs completely removed before the bleed your bleed will be much weaker and your target will likely survive. Granted the wizard is not Rank 9 or insanely well geared, they should die easily within the course of a few debuffs and bleeds.
Things to watch out for: Most of their AOES will oneshot your nix so be very careful. When they seal your bird it will fly away like an idiot and they can easily oneshot your bird with a single skill. If you are an arcane veno that does not have ~10k+ HP blade tempest WILL oneshot you - so be very careful.
What not to do: Don't spend too long staying still and nuking. If the fight looks dismal you CAN kite ranged classes to an extent. (Demon foxform allows you to quickly sprint in and out of their casting range)
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Fighting Blademasters
If they are skilled they'll be using axes, if they are cheap they'll be using fists or claws.
Regardless of both, their ultimate goal will be to stunlock you and kill you with APS.
The most popular and cheapest blademaster PVP "strategy" is to run up to a target, use occult ice and auto-attack until it dies. You need to be READY for this kind of fighting at all times. Most APS classes will refuse to learn other strategies to kill targets and most targets will refuse to learn new strategies to escape APS classes.
Melee classes are THE most fun class to PVP as a veno. Kite, kite, kite. If they cannot catch you they cannot stun you. If they cannot stun you they cannot kill you. If you have vacuity powders or any anti-stun skills now is definitely the time to use them. Occult ice can be nasty, if you're caught in it my only suggestion would be to use absolute domain. Remember to time absolute domain properly, as it does not last very long. Don't use it as SOON as you are placed in the bubble, use it as soon as the BM reaches you. (As he/she will likely cast OI on you from a range - since you should be kiting)
Things to watch out for:
If they manage to cast heaven's flame on you (two orange dragons) get the FRICK away from them immediately. Most of their skills are also AOES so watch your phoenix as it has a high chance of getting caught in one of their aoes and dying.
What not to do:
Stand around. Always be moving, never let them catch you.
Never use expel on yourself when fighting a melee class (such as BMs, Barbs, Sins and even archers). It seals for a long time at the cost of immunity to PHYSICAL attacks - meaning you can still nuke them during this time.
Fighting Barbarians:
If the barb is well geared, be ready for an extremely long fight.
Keep them debuffed and just stay away from them when they use shell. Kite as much as you can as they also won't be able to kill you from a distance. Their main killer is the skill armageddon, if you see them doing a little mid air flip/dance you're probably dead. Luckily they have **** accuracy so there's a 80% of it missing. Regardless, don't stand around and let yourself be hit.
Things not to do:
Stay still.
Fighting other Venomancers
Depending on their gear you have two options.
If it's similar to yours or much better than yours you should kill their phoenix. (If you're heavy armor don't bother with their bird and LOL when it ticks you for 200)
If it's not so good then go straight for the veno and watch them drop in a few bleed ticks.
Things that will probably happen:
When you kill their phoenix they'll probably run for safezone.
Things to watch out for:
If the veno is demon and you have the physical defense debuff symbol - run.
Fighting Psychics:
Debuff -> Bleed.
Their AOEs will oneshot your pet.
Fighting Assassins:
STAY IN MOTHA FRICKING FOX FORM YOU IDIOTS. c:
Things to have ready at all times (because sins are ALWAYS lurking):
Your 79 Skill Myriad Rainbow (Fox Form) - This acts as an instant casting AOE with a HUGE range. Knocks all sins in the area out immediately.
Absolute Domain - If you're stunlocked or put in occult ice.
Expel - USE IT ON THIS SIN AND NEVER ON YOU.
Bramble hood doesn't reflect in open PVP, but the damage reduction still works. If you have 2 spare sparks feel free to use it so you can survive a lot of hits.
Sins die EASILY. Even the r9 and nirvana ones.
Fighting Archers:
Stay close to them, keep them stunned and immobilized in place. Archers have a 50% damage reduction to targets that are near them. (excluding their metal/magic skills - which shouldn't be a big deal if you're an arcane veno anyways)
Nuke, bleed, stun. Purge them if they use wings of protection (time your purge as for the start of the skill they will have immunity to everything including purge)
Fighting Clerics:
Purge->Bleed->Dead.
Fighting Mystics:
Purge->Bleed->Laugh at them for being wannabes.
Fighting Seekers:
Die->Cry->Wait for me to write more.0 -
Sage and Demon Skill Overview
Venomous Scarab
Sage: 20% chance of getting more chi.
Demon: -30% wood resistance. (Amazing in PvE and PvP, especially when you're teamed with another veno or mystic)
Ironwood Scarab
Sage: Lasts for double the amount of time. (Great in PvE and Nirvana)
Demon: 20% chance of 0 P.Def (Great in PvP - if it works)
Frost Scarab
Sage: More damage over time. (I'm not a fan of DoT skills, ever. I don't think anybody really is)
Demon: Immobilizes target for 3 seconds. (Great in PVP and an 80% chance of success)
Noxioius Gas
Sage: Hits harder (Always good)
Demon: Lower Cooldown (Always good)
Lucky Scarab:
Sage: Longer Stun
Demon: Lower Cooldown
This comes down entirely to personal preference and playstyle choice. I personally only use this skill to stop people from chasing me and to stun wizzies when they cast their ultimates so lower cooldown is best for me. If you utilize the stun aspect of it then sage may be the right one for you.
Parasitic Nova:
Sage: More Damage
Demon: It's a weaker version of a Blademaster's HF/Heavens Flame. (30% Additional Damage - Stacks with Amplify Damage and Subseastrike/Extreme Poison.
Demon all the way, it's a noticeable debuff and it's killer in PVP.
It's also ridiculously expensive regardless of cultivation.
Wood Mastery:
Sage: More wood damage (+)
Demon: 2% Crit (Yay 4 pr0 LA ven0z)
Lending Hand:
Sage: Chance to not use up a spark
Demon: Chance to send two sparks
Note: Both of these skills are GREAT to have as sage/demon level skills because you can use them to potentially give yourself sparks. The only thing I can say is that I WOULD prefer demon only because it would be more useful in a support situation where the other person would get two sparks.
Bramble Guard:
Sage: Lasts double the time
Demon: Lasts 5 minutes longer and also reflects 15% more damage.
Demon wins as this skill only works in TW and Duels. Duels never last more than 20 minutes so? In territory wars, the people that will be mainly being hit by bms and sins (the people that will potentially kill themselves on bramble) are the people who don't last more than 20 minutes without a death anyway. The longer time is just outshined by more reflect entirely.
Summer Sprint:
Sage: Purify
Demon: Antistun
Demon is better as you can stack them with ironguards and feral concentration for 12/10 seconds of complete damage immunity respectively.
Fox Form:
Sage: More P.Def
Demon: 60% Additional walkspeed.
I have this skill in demon and I love it. You can spam it as much as you want and it allows you to walk at mount speed with demon level summer sprint. More physical defense is always great, but I personally would never give up my ability to kite flawlessly for the ability to take hits. (Which we don't want to take hits anyway)
Purge:
Sage: AOE Purge
Demon: Lower cooldown.
Sage purge is AMAZING in group PVP and TW. Even though a 5 meter radius doesn't sound very big at first. It's a 10 meter diameter. It's 5 meters in all directions of you. (Including in the air and below)
Amplify Damage:
Sage: 5% more amp.
Demon: 6 additional seconds.
Sage amplify has a higher amplify.
Demon amplify lasts longer.
Soul Degeneration:
Sage: Reduces Targets Maximum HP by 20%
Demon: Not note worthy.
Crush Vigour:
Sage: Eats chi?
Demon: Gives you a spark? Any clarification.
MYRIAD RAINBOW (FOX FORM)
THIS WORKS AS A SIN CHECK WITH A HUGE AREA OF EFFECT. SPAM THIS ON PEOPLE AND MOBS IN PVP HEAVY AREAS AND WATCH SINS GET KNOCKED OUT OF STEALTH LIKE YOU WOULDNT BELIEVE. MUST HAVE FOR ANY PVPING VENO.0 -
It's her guide and she can make it as biased as she wants. It's relatively obvious that her opinion on certain things is purely subjective. Let her make her guide.
I'll just make a small note here: if this guide is aimed at combating FC CSers, you should probably not discount pure MAG as a viable build since actually it's the absolute best build possible if you're a CSer.
Being a heavy CSer means you can basically buy +10/+12 refines very easily, so low pdef or HP isn't an issue for a heavy CSer. Also, JoSD remedies the shortcomings of any build, no matter what it is. A CSer should actually not do anything other than pure mag and facerolling with super gear. Pure MAG for the unrivalled offense and $$$ to give the defense with JoSD, G11 shards and refines. The point of the other builds (HA, LA, etc) is to combat mid-game low pdef. As we all know, CSing basically fixes all, so really there is no logical reason not to be pure MAG if you're a CSer.
Doing LA, HA or any other thing as a CSer really makes no sense...actually LA makes no sense whether or not you're a CSer, so do with that what you will. There is one case where HA makes sense, but your guide doesn't seem to lean in that direction, so I'd stick my neck out to say that for your guide, pure MAG or VIT-MAG hybrid is the only thing you should be focusing on.Valhalla disband. That is all \o/
"The thing about winners is... they get to write the history books, and they get to analyze everything from high atop their winner's perch.
Doesn't matter what the circumstances are." -- Burnout, Harshlands, Wizard.0 -
@Above.
LA is outdated for all casters in my opinion, period.
Yes this is a biased guide. That's why I said "Aijou's Guide" not. "Your guide" or anybody elses.
Anyway yes. Pure mag if you're a huge CSer. But anyone willing to put that kind of money on a char they wont learn to play should put it on a faceroll class (sin/psy/archer).
Venos, in my opinion, have never been a point->click->own class. Maybe way back when when nixes were OP and TT90 was endgame.
Yes if you're going to get full R9 on a veno that's great. I've killed a full r9 veno in 1v1 with an aquadash. Venos are never going to be about who has the better refines, like a psychic - simply because of our general roles in group pvp.0 -
About the *biased* thing , i dont mind it , it ur guide and well , the info u provide is applicable and tested by many venos so thats ok . Just 2 things:
Sage Venomous isn't completely fail ( More chi means More ironwood , more spark transfers , more Nova , more myriads , sparks etc) For a veno who finds him/herself in squads a lot (and not just with mystics) Sage venomous helps.
I think u didnt put much attention to sage foxform. Its useful for arcane venos as well. Summer sprint to purify u from a slow or curse status , holy path or Bramble Hood or Feral Concetration and Sage fox form gives u a big protective boost (bigger combined with those lovely Cube and Warsong ornaments). Also More accuracy helps HA venos who, well, have a small lack of it.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
<--- MALE Veno ..... Moved to G W 2 or maybe not completely , don't know ...... PW addiction
{That TT xbow chain is one that describes someone's bowel movements after having too much spicy food. A loud **** (Thundercrack), then a burning sensation (Flash Fire), followed by an explosion of multi-colored poo-confetti (Blinding Radiance). Excellent...} By Quilue0 -
Phoenix_Eye - Heavens Tear wrote: »About the *biased* thing , i dont mind it , it ur guide and well , the info u provide is applicable and tested by many venos so thats ok . Just 2 things:
Sage Venomous isn't completely fail ( More chi means More ironwood , more spark transfers , more Nova , more myriads , sparks etc) For a veno who finds him/herself in squads a lot (and not just with mystics) Sage venomous helps.
I think u didnt put much attention to sage foxform. Its useful for arcane venos as well. Summer sprint to purify u from a slow or curse status , holy path or Bramble Hood or Feral Concetration and Sage fox form gives u a big protective boost (bigger combined with those lovely Cube and Warsong ornaments). Also More accuracy helps HA venos who, well, have a small lack of it.
Sage venomancers are indeed very *not* fail. They're definitely the more popular choice for TW. But personally I prefer demon for open PVP. Sage's chi skill isn't as amazing as it seems. Veno's aren't a really a class that requires a lot of chi to be honest. (Like a wizard for example) In PvE you can easily keep ironwood permanently on a target (pre sage/demon) simply by casting venomous scarab in between ironwood's cooldown.
Feral Concentration is a waste in my opinion, if you do not have demon summer sprint. It does give an amazing 10 seconds of invincibility, but it also stuns you for 10 seconds. Having lots of chi for bramble hood is always good but the chi issue for demon's is easily fixed with Cloud Eruption (the genie skill).0 -
12, but still nice yep. It seems 13 with +5%HP itemsAijou - Harshlands wrote: »Venomancers get a delightful 13 HP per VIT point, higher than any other caster.0 -
Interesting guide but I have some things I want to give my input in.
Full Magic Venos aren't **** at all. The extra magic attack boost venos gain can be necessary to be up to par with other casters. With mid-high refines, they can easily gain the HP they'll lose with adding vit. All AA classes do not have enough HP unless they choose to get great gears anyway.
Also, PVE-wise when you're going to rely on your pet to tank bosses (yes, some people still farm TTs with their venos) the extra m.att is nice for healing. For lower levels, I would say Full Mag/Mag-Vit builds are the best.
Sure, HA build is "trending" right now for venos but it does not make AA venos obsolete at all. More survivability for HA is definitely welcomed, though. Especially with its HP refines.
About Sage Venomous Scarab being fail, having a veno's role as support (amp/purge/send sparks/etc) will require chi. I personally find Sage Venomous Scarab helpful when it comes to bosses and passing the tank sparks when you can as well as having some for yourself to spark with (along with Cloud Eruption to cast Nova and such). It gives you an edge and allows yourself to deal intense damage.
Sage/Demon Amplify Damage is not equal at all - to me, at least. Additional 5% > Longer Effect (when you can easily re-cast it the second time as sage).
Sage/Demon Venos are really balanced compared to other classes, really. So there's no argue about that. Both are equally good in PVP/PVE it just depends on how the player utilizes it.
My two cents. b:surrender[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Cocobelle - Sanctuary wrote: »Interesting guide but I have some things I want to give my input in.
Full Magic Venos aren't **** at all. The extra magic attack boost venos gain can be necessary to be up to par with other casters. With mid-high refines, they can easily gain the HP they'll lose with adding vit. All AA classes do not have enough HP unless they choose to get great gears anyway.
Also, PVE-wise when you're going to rely on your pet to tank bosses (yes, some people still farm TTs with their venos) the extra m.att is nice for healing. For lower levels, I would say Full Mag/Mag-Vit builds are the best.
Sure, HA build is "trending" right now for venos but it does not make AA venos obsolete at all. More survivability for HA is definitely welcomed, though. Especially with its HP refines.
About Sage Venomous Scarab being fail, having a veno's role as support (amp/purge/send sparks/etc) will require chi. I personally find Sage Venomous Scarab helpful when it comes to bosses and passing the tank sparks when you can as well as having some for yourself to spark with (along with Cloud Eruption to cast Nova and such). It gives you an edge and allows yourself to deal intense damage.
Sage/Demon Amplify Damage is not equal at all - to me, at least. Additional 5% > Longer Effect (when you can easily re-cast it the second time as sage).
Sage/Demon Venos are really balanced compared to other classes, really. So there's no argue about that. Both are equally good in PVP/PVE it just depends on how the player utilizes it.
My two cents. b:surrender
This guide is PVP and TW oriented. You're on a PvE server, so naturally the playstyle is rather different.
Sage venomous scarab is fail. It's better than level 10 no argument, but compared to demon it's a waste of money. Sage and Demon amp are in my opinion equal. Everyone has their own thoughts about this skill. I guess it boils down to personal playstyle and such. But I also don't think anybody picks one path or another based purely by one skill alone. (Except for APS classes with their spark I guess)
Personally for me I picked demon because it had MORE skills overall that appealed to me, versus a few sage skills that were "nice".
I have played my veno as many different builds. Full magic, full vit, mag/vit and HA. I've used all the builds in PVP and PVE both. Pure magic did have nice hits and heals, but it's just not worth it. If your veno is built only to do ONE thing, then that's a different situation. But I don't think anybody makes a character for one use and one use only.0 -
Updated most of the first section.
Sorry for lack of apostrophess and dashes, the PW forums seem to hate them.0 -
Another guide trying to justify a fail vit build.
We have no decent attacks based on our HP. We have plenty defense and immune options. HP from vit is pathetic (even if best for casters) -for what you lose in atk. We're the last option as a tank.
Vit casters kill slower, and at higher cost. Let's be honest; they're mooches. The only way for that build to make sense is if it's used to mooch (not present a fair contribution to squad and only used in squads).0 -
Another guide trying to justify a fail vit build.
We have no decent attacks based on our HP. We have plenty defense and immune options. HP from vit is pathetic (even if best for casters) -for what you lose in atk. We're the last option as a tank.
Vit casters kill slower, and at higher cost. Let's be honest; they're mooches. The only way for that build to make sense is if it's used to mooch (not present a fair contribution to squad and only used in squads).
Idk mang.
I'm an HA veno.
Didnt they make all venos mooches when they made us the sexiest class in game?
b:shutup0 -
Aijou - Harshlands wrote: »Idk mang.
I'm an HA veno.
Didnt they make all venos mooches when they made us the sexiest class in game?
b:shutup
b:victory uber proud mooch here as well.
with all those debuffs we have why not b:chuckle
Prolly the only class in the game that won't do that much damage and still get the job done if you time your debuffs right
In fact were so moochy we even get separate skills on out pets so we can cast some spells mana-free (pet skill)0 -
Nine_Lives - Raging Tide wrote: »Prolly the only class in the game that won't do that much damage and still get the job done if you time your debuffs right
Other toons have better pdef / mdef debuffs. Other toons have arguably better amps. Sage Archers have equivalent or better HP debuff than sage veno. Wanna do your job right? - quit acting as if your debuffs are what defines a veno.0 -
This guide seems more than a rant than anything else.
Vit build where the vit is supposed to be the major factor in hitting 12k HP is just silly. 100 vit(wich would be so much it seriously cuts into your magic attack) is only 1.2k HP.
Its funny that you tell LA to shard Citrines, when LA got pretty much the same pro as a HA build does: Higher HP gain from refines. To get this build RIGHT, Ill strongly suggest putting Garnets into the armor to really gain any p.def from this build. The HP should come from refines, and with some proper work, youll have a higher p.def as any AA Veno, and most likely, higher HP.
Since you wont be getting either or when youve chosen your path as sage or demon, theres no reason to do a rant bout the comparison on certain skills.
Your look on Crush vigor is also clearly biased and not tried. Sage gives 15 chi loss per hit on target. Want to see the cata barb waste his chi needing invoke too soon in fear of not being able to use it at all? Combining this skill with a melee follow up really works too awesome in TW, and in some open PvP if the barb is hard to kill. It also drains chi on the reflect from bramble.
I could probably go on and on how bad this guide really is, just hope the new players makes sure to read the comments, before they follow the advices of a 14 year old hyper on sugar and anger ^^No I dont have a herc, I AM the herc! b:mischievous
Youtube channel for NW vids: /channel/UCV9DguJZ0LGMlv5IorA5kVg
Please do drop by n tell me hints on how to improve c:
Current build for pwcalc: /bd6d5c1459cf7d940 -
SmurfJegeren - Dreamweaver wrote: »This guide seems more than a rant than anything else.
Vit build where the vit is supposed to be the major factor in hitting 12k HP is just silly. 100 vit(wich would be so much it seriously cuts into your magic attack) is only 1.2k HP.
Its funny that you tell LA to shard Citrines, when LA got pretty much the same pro as a HA build does: Higher HP gain from refines. To get this build RIGHT, Ill strongly suggest putting Garnets into the armor to really gain any p.def from this build. The HP should come from refines, and with some proper work, youll have a higher p.def as any AA Veno, and most likely, higher HP.
Since you wont be getting either or when youve chosen your path as sage or demon, theres no reason to do a rant bout the comparison on certain skills.
Your look on Crush vigor is also clearly biased and not tried. Sage gives 15 chi loss per hit on target. Want to see the cata barb waste his chi needing invoke too soon in fear of not being able to use it at all? Combining this skill with a melee follow up really works too awesome in TW, and in some open PvP if the barb is hard to kill. It also drains chi on the reflect from bramble.
I could probably go on and on how bad this guide really is, just hope the new players makes sure to read the comments, before they follow the advices of a 14 year old hyper on sugar and anger ^^
12k with a VIT/MAG hybrid requires incredible CSing and several vit/citrine gems. 12k HP on a full VIT veno. Learn to read before you btcih.
LA sharded for garnets is the stupidest thing I've heard in a VERY long time. Unless you already have a full set of +10 LA nirvana coming from a different char then low-refine LA should DEFINITELY go for citrine shards.
HA and LA builds are GHETTO. They're a GHETTO way of getting HP and Defense. The main POINT is that LA is not only ghetto, but OBSOLETE GHETTO.
If you have the money to get an extremely well refined and sharded light armor set that's SPECIFICALLY for your VENO, go for a better build.
The skills and PVP/TW guide were done in like 10 minutes each. The TW section was mainly just a note to venos to get their butts back in fox form and start purging catas.
You have NO idea how many venos I have seen IGNORING their main roles in TW.0 -
oops , oh yeah i remember what your definition of a veno is. Solo DD tank class whatsisit, and yes i am fully aware that some nirvy squads are going venoless because they think HF is greater than amp. Thicket is really a multi-debuff for myst which is definitely better than our once in a blue moon full proc myriad ( mana over spark, who do you choose?)Other toons have better pdef / mdef debuffs. Other toons have arguably better amps. Sage Archers have equivalent or better HP debuff than sage veno. Wanna do your job right? - quit acting as if your debuffs are what defines a veno.
Still wondering why your examples of ''better amps and debuffers'' are still not getting more invites in squads and wc's though besaide the random dd.
Edit: or those playing those classes nowadays are too powerleveled to learn and read what they got in their skills list?0 -
Nine_Lives - Raging Tide wrote: »oops , oh yeah i remember what your definition of a veno is. Solo DD tank class whatsisit, and yes i am fully aware that some nirvy squads are going venoless because they think HF is greater than amp. Thicket is really a multi-debuff for myst which is definitely better than our once in a blue moon full proc myriad ( mana over spark, who do you choose?)
Still wondering why your examples of ''better amps and debuffers'' are still not getting more invites in squads and wc's though besaide the random dd.
HF /is/ better than amp.
But what's better than both HF (AND) AMP? Nobody goes on vana without a BM anyway.0 -
Every NEW char IS powerleveled.0
-
Aijou - Harshlands wrote: »Every NEW char IS powerleveled.
God help this gameb:chuckle
Nowadays I even have to tell some venos in my fac if they join me in any of the runs they have not to be afraid to amp the bosses while being careful just in case the boss launches a nasty aoe.
One response i will never forget from a level 5x veno who only played 3 days on his/ her toon ''What is amplify damage?''
b:surrender0 -
Aijou - Harshlands wrote: »12k with a VIT/MAG hybrid requires incredible CSing and several vit/citrine gems. 12k HP on a full VIT veno. Learn to read before you btcih.
LA sharded for garnets is the stupidest thing I've heard in a VERY long time. Unless you already have a full set of +10 LA nirvana coming from a different char then low-refine LA should DEFINITELY go for citrine shards.
HA and LA builds are GHETTO. They're a GHETTO way of getting HP and Defense. The main POINT is that LA is not only ghetto, but OBSOLETE GHETTO.
If you have the money to get an extremely well refined and sharded light armor set that's SPECIFICALLY for your VENO, go for a better build.
TW.
You probably cant read that well youreself I guess. As I said, 100 vit would cut into your magic attack. Going even higher will seriously hamper it, and you might as well got for a LA build. IF you can afford to refine AA to to 12k HP, think bout how much HP youd be in LA~
Honestly.. who uses the word ghetto like that?
if LA garnet sharding is stupid, you really havent looked into LA builds at all. Wich isnt suprising since your writing is so biased, its probably just assumption over try and see. You can shard AA to have more phyiscal defence than LA, but you cant refine it to have more HP. So if LA shard the same way as a garnet sharded AA. Itll still have mroe p.def, and more HP on same refines.
http://pwcalc.com/6ba45fc034af2e48
This is a relatively cheap set-up, and its easy to see this being a pretty decent build. 24% crit, possibility of higher magic attack than the normal HA builds would have. Its stupid cause youre too narrow minded to see it otherwise. Ignorance is bliss~No I dont have a herc, I AM the herc! b:mischievous
Youtube channel for NW vids: /channel/UCV9DguJZ0LGMlv5IorA5kVg
Please do drop by n tell me hints on how to improve c:
Current build for pwcalc: /bd6d5c1459cf7d940 -
SmurfJegeren - Dreamweaver wrote: »You probably cant read that well youreself I guess. As I said, 100 vit would cut into your magic attack. Going even higher will seriously hamper it, and you might as well got for a LA build. IF you can afford to refine AA to to 12k HP, think bout how much HP youd be in LA~
Honestly.. who uses the word ghetto like that?
if LA garnet sharding is stupid, you really havent looked into LA builds at all. Wich isnt suprising since your writing is so biased, its probably just assumption over try and see. You can shard AA to have more phyiscal defence than LA, but you cant refine it to have more HP. So if LA shard the same way as a garnet sharded AA. Itll still have mroe p.def, and more HP on same refines.
http://pwcalc.com/6ba45fc034af2e48
This is a relatively cheap set-up, and its easy to see this being a pretty decent build. 24% crit, possibility of higher magic attack than the normal HA builds would have. Its stupid cause youre too narrow minded to see it otherwise. Ignorance is bliss~
http://pwcalc.com/c08923d94f9e91a9
More HP and (a lot) more magic attack - at the cost of 200 pdef.
Since somehow G9 shards are "cheap" I used those. The money that wasnt spent on getting t99 necklace and tt99 pants and whatever top that is and event shoes went to getting 4sockets on the cape (which is really only like 1mil more actually) and t99 boots. R8 top and pants can easily be made 4 sockets within a few tries, unless you're SUPER unlucky.
My guide is biased against LA as a build because LA is an obsolete build.0 -
Nine_Lives - Raging Tide wrote: »God help this gameb:chuckle
Nowadays I even have to tell some venos in my fac if they join me in any of the runs they have not to be afraid to amp the bosses while being careful just in case the boss launches a nasty aoe.
One response i will never forget from a level 5x veno who only played 3 days on his/ her toon ''What is amplify damage?''
b:surrender
I was doing nirvana on my sin one day and the veno in our squad was... special, to say the least.
She didn't know what amp was and didn't purge the second boss, needless to say she didn't last long with us.0 -
The top is a quest reward, Ive seen it sold for 6 mill. The HR boots are pretty cheap, just 30ish mill, wich honestly dont open for much other improvements. Im simply holding down the number of shards since I figured it would stop you from QQ on price, but I guess you always find something to QQ about, too cheap? Here we go:
http://pwcalc.com/cec66039460440e3
Saved money on pants, sleeves, necklace, and afforded myself a better helmet. Same HP, 1.2k higher def, close to 10 times your accuracy in fox form, with the physical damage surpassing you with enough to actually have an effect.
The points of the LA build isnt purely on defence, its about being able to use both forms effectively. AA builds dont do that, just as HA builds is noticably weaker as a caster. LA is a cheaper way to play both forms. Let people play how they like, and instead of calling em out as fails because of their build. Let em have fun, and in the end its skill that determine the good venos.No I dont have a herc, I AM the herc! b:mischievous
Youtube channel for NW vids: /channel/UCV9DguJZ0LGMlv5IorA5kVg
Please do drop by n tell me hints on how to improve c:
Current build for pwcalc: /bd6d5c1459cf7d940 -
SmurfJegeren - Dreamweaver wrote: »The top is a quest reward, Ive seen it sold for 6 mill. The HR boots are pretty cheap, just 30ish mill, wich honestly dont open for much other improvements. Im simply holding down the number of shards since I figured it would stop you from QQ on price, but I guess you always find something to QQ about, too cheap? Here we go:
http://pwcalc.com/cec66039460440e3
Saved money on pants, sleeves, necklace, and afforded myself a better helmet. Same HP, 1.2k higher def, close to 10 times your accuracy in fox form, with the physical damage surpassing you with enough to actually have an effect.
The points of the LA build isnt purely on defence, its about being able to use both forms effectively. AA builds dont do that, just as HA builds is noticably weaker as a caster. LA is a cheaper way to play both forms. Let people play how they like, and instead of calling em out as fails because of their build. Let em have fun, and in the end its skill that determine the good venos.
Accuracy and physical attack helps venos how?0 -
SmurfJegeren - Dreamweaver wrote: »...
http://pwcalc.com/6ba45fc034af2e48
This is a relatively cheap set-up, and its easy to see this being a pretty decent build. 24% crit, possibility of higher magic attack than the normal HA builds would have. Its stupid cause youre too narrow minded to see it otherwise. Ignorance is bliss~
OMG, please stop linking this fail LA calcs.
i fixed your first posted calcs for you.
http://pwcalc.com/412ead829cb11bf0
this calc has exactly same refines on each piece of gear like my AA set and i couldnt be drunk enough to prefer this LA shi t instead of my AA.
okay, like i posted your LA has almost same pdef, but 3k less mdef, 2k less hp, and almost 4k less matk, it only wins in crit rate (6%+) so it failed.
Even the R8 weap on this light veno is waste of every single invested coin. Damage output is laughable.
You would be dead without making your opponents charm tick.
LA is NO option !0 -
_Morigan_ - Harshlands wrote: »Even the R8 weap on this light veno is waste of every single invested coin. Damage output is laughable.
You would be dead without making your opponents charm tick.
LA is NO option !
What do you mean man?? Veno is about versatility and flexibility and playstyle! It's her playstyle, man. Don't hate b:cry
EDIT: Lol, I took the time to actually read Smurf's post and wow, just /facepalm. I don't even know where to start.I seriously wonder: people who don't RPK, if you play the board game "Sorry!" and you roll the dice so that you land on an opponents piece and send it back to the beginning, do you sincerely apologize and ask everyone if you can have a do-over roll so you can give your victim another chance? It's a god damn game..
--LongKnife0 -
What do you mean man?? Veno is about versatility and flexibility and playstyle! It's her playstyle, man. Don't hate b:cry
there is no hate at all.
But there is no single argument PRO LA. If your playstyle demands to go LA okay, but better do pve only. Theese days pwi is full of csed, hyper lvling R9ers with high/highest refines. NO way to face this kind of gear with light gear on a veno.
The, if done correct, decent pdef doesnt rise winning chances. Any R9 caster (decent refined) kills you instant even if he misclicks. The missing mdef (around 50%) is significant and deadly and the loss in matk wont deal noticable dmg to ppl with a few def lvls. Having around 20% crit rate cant fix it.
I m no pvp pro at all, but one thing for sure, LA doesnt work.0 -
I was being sarcastic there, btw >.>I seriously wonder: people who don't RPK, if you play the board game "Sorry!" and you roll the dice so that you land on an opponents piece and send it back to the beginning, do you sincerely apologize and ask everyone if you can have a do-over roll so you can give your victim another chance? It's a god damn game..
--LongKnife0 -
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