Noob questions

archsashiel
archsashiel Posts: 4 Arc User
edited November 2011 in Archer
Hi everyone,

I'm new to the game so give me a break if my questions sound too noobish...

...here's the deal

1) i've been told to put some extra str so i can wear fists at end game, deicide its the name, but i was wondering if all that extra str isnt gonna **** my damage in bow, or absorv points that could b put into vit, so my question is are those fists/claws realy a must have for a good archer or not at all? cause in my opinion i'm building an archer not a light armor bm...

2) whats the max constituition/vit a good tw archer should have at end game say lvl 100 or 90's?

3) in relation to tomes, knowing that a tome like love up and down is expensive and hard to get, whats the best a tome one with both vit and dext or just dex?

i thank you all for the awnsers, and if u can point me in the direction of a guide that gives usefull info on tw archers i would apreciate, i play in a pve server so i dont think i'm going to do much pvp and most guides i've been reading are all about pvp...i know that tw is a pvp event but its a litle diferent than west gate pvp...

Thank you all and have a good game
Post edited by archsashiel on

Comments

  • Ogedei - Dreamweaver
    Ogedei - Dreamweaver Posts: 10 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Hello!

    1) Wether you go for fists or not is totally up to you. Fists do **** up your damage with bow a bit, but on some bosses (especially debuffing bosses) fists is almost a must. As you need chi to triple spark to purify yourself. Chi is much slower to build up with bow. I myself is a pure dex archer, at level 100-101 I will get enough strength to use Gorenox Vanity wich in my opinion is more than good enough.

    2) That's all up to you to decide, I'm going to tell you that 10 vit = 150 hp. (Most end game classes hit 10k or more in pvp)

    3) I use strength tomes myself, so I can use better fists and wear warsoul helmet.
  • Kerona - Sanctuary
    Kerona - Sanctuary Posts: 1,771 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    1. Generally archers prefer to have fists. If perchance you get aggro as a ranged DD, a boss with a strong AoE will start to spam it, and can easily kill a squishy cleric or arcane. Fists enable an archer to do full damage from melee range. Yes you will lose some damage on your bows, but generally speaking it's not that much. Also, more STR enables you to wear HA helms such as Warsoul of Earth.

    2. Some archers will say "3 Vit". Adding vit as opposed to dex does decrease your damage, but it might be nice to have some while leveling or just starting TW. You can always restat it out later if you choose to go pure. You probably should not exceed 100 vit while leveling though if you plan to restat it as those can get expensive.

    3. I don't know of any guide but here are some videos of some archers on our server. There is two or three "ways" to play an archer in TW. One is the "push" archer the other is a more "tactical" archer (I'm just making up names for them). A "Push" archer will be the front of each push, generally take a lot of damage, usually needs a healer to survive, and does a lot of the main damage in a push. A "Tactical" archer flanks a lot out to the side to pick people off from an unseen place. These can also probably be broken down by level of gear or Rank 8 vs Rank 9.
    rfskkirby's Videos
    Lu$t's Videos
    If anyone else regularly records their PvP/TW I don't know 8D
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • _blood_rain - Sanctuary
    _blood_rain - Sanctuary Posts: 2,532 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Kerona - Sanctuary wrote: »
    rfskkirby's Videos
    Lu$t's Videos
    If anyone else regularly records their PvP/TW I don't know 8D


    XxKursesxX's Videos (HL)
    Curses's Videos (HL)
    Stayne's Videos (HL)
    Transcend's Videos (LC)
    Boogiepanda's Videos (RT)
    Thats all I can remember for now. I'm sort of a fan of TW/archer gameplay videos >.>

    And for the Lols
    Lucy_Black's Videos (DW?)
  • Salasyn - Heavens Tear
    Salasyn - Heavens Tear Posts: 286 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    _blood_rain - Sanctuary wrote: »
    And for the Lols
    Lucy_Black's Videos (DW?)

    Oh gawd. I could do better with the gear she/he has and I haven't played an archer for a ages.


    /kill her please
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • _blood_rain - Sanctuary
    _blood_rain - Sanctuary Posts: 2,532 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Salasyn - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    I could do better with the gear she/he has

    That's really not saying much :x
  • Astraea - Raging Tide
    Astraea - Raging Tide Posts: 544 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Ogedei - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Hello!

    1) Wether you go for fists or not is totally up to you. Fists do **** up your damage with bow a bit, but on some bosses (especially debuffing bosses) fists is almost a must. As you need chi to triple spark to purify yourself. Chi is much slower to build up with bow. I myself is a pure dex archer, at level 100-101 I will get enough strength to use Gorenox Vanity wich in my opinion is more than good enough.

    2) That's all up to you to decide, I'm going to tell you that 10 vit = 150 hp. (Most end game classes hit 10k or more in pvp)

    3) I use strength tomes myself, so I can use better fists and wear warsoul helmet.

    10 vit is not 150 hp instantly, specially for archers. each class gets different amount of hp per vit.
    barb = 17
    bm / seeker = 15
    archer / sin = 13
    veno = 12.6 (yes ive played with it and 10 vit did give me 126 hp instead of simply 12)
    cleric / wiz / psy / mystic = 10

    most ppl would advise against adding vit on most mag classes aside from venos/barbs/seeker/bms. the main DD classes like archer sin wiz psy and to an extent mystic and cler are more advised to go pure mag/dex whichever their main stat is and add nothing to vit.

    also fists are purely a PvE build so dont really NEED per-say more str than whats needed to wear the fists. most archers id assume would stat the minimal str and use blazing arrow to cover the low str to still do somewhat good dmg (ofc not as much as sin/str build bm but on par to barbs)
    "Common sense isn't so common anymore." ~ Yusiong - Lost City
    b:surrender
  • Ogedei - Dreamweaver
    Ogedei - Dreamweaver Posts: 10 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Seems like I mixed up archer and seeker :) Anyway, even less reason to add vit.
  • Tricannon - Dreamweaver
    Tricannon - Dreamweaver Posts: 337 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Vital_Slash - Sanctuary wrote: »
    that supposed to be a joke right?.............................BANNED b:victory

    Naaaahhhh jk.....should i click the link??????....naaaaaaahhh

    you should seems totally legit.
    If I sound like I hate you, please don't take it personally...chances are I actually do.
  • Salasyn - Heavens Tear
    Salasyn - Heavens Tear Posts: 286 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    That's really not saying much :x

    I knowb:chuckleI'm pretty crappy at archer myself.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Aesthor - Heavens Tear
    Aesthor - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,845 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Kerona - Sanctuary wrote: »
    1. Generally archers prefer to have fists. If perchance you get aggro as a ranged DD, a boss with a strong AoE will start to spam it, and can easily kill a squishy cleric or arcane. Fists enable an archer to do full damage from melee range. Yes you will lose some damage on your bows, but generally speaking it's not that much. Also, more STR enables you to wear HA helms such as Warsoul of Earth.

    2. Some archers will say "3 Vit". Adding vit as opposed to dex does decrease your damage, but it might be nice to have some while leveling or just starting TW. You can always restat it out later if you choose to go pure. You probably should not exceed 100 vit while leveling though if you plan to restat it as those can get expensive.

    3. I don't know of any guide but here are some videos of some archers on our server. There is two or three "ways" to play an archer in TW. One is the "push" archer the other is a more "tactical" archer (I'm just making up names for them). A "Push" archer will be the front of each push, generally take a lot of damage, usually needs a healer to survive, and does a lot of the main damage in a push. A "Tactical" archer flanks a lot out to the side to pick people off from an unseen place. These can also probably be broken down by level of gear or Rank 8 vs Rank 9.
    rfskkirby's Videos
    Lu$t's Videos
    If anyone else regularly records their PvP/TW I don't know 8D
    I play the snipe n' kite style (my defenses suck compared to GoldDigr damage outputs).

    Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2fdgM-EqAkQ
    Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEMfmBDRQ40
    Part 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcd2k-IyVmM

    Although I don't record much cuz fraps makes my computer sad.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    ಥ_ಥ MOAR.
    SkyKoC - How long is yours?
  • Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,385 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Kerona - Sanctuary wrote: »
    A "Push" archer will be the front of each push, generally take a lot of damage, usually needs a healer to survive, and does a lot of the main damage in a push. A "Tactical" archer flanks a lot out to the side to pick people off from an unseen place.

    We have names for them... Your "push" archer is known as a dead archer. And your "tactical" archer is known as a breathing archer.
    1. If I kill you; do something about it yourself, don't go complaining to my wife.
    2. If you have less kill counts then me, don't expect me to take pk advice from you.
    3. If you are hiding behind an alt, don't expect me to acknowledge your existence.

    Tokichiro - Heavy Armor Fish / Kiyoshi - Dual Blade Elf
  • Sint - Harshlands
    Sint - Harshlands Posts: 579 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Astraea - Raging Tide wrote: »

    veno = 12.6 (yes ive played with it and 10 vit did give me 126 hp instead of simply 12)

    notice how 120 /20 = 6? take off your sky demon's pearl, play some more.

    Also, kiyoshi enjoys fapping at how awesome he thinks he is, while sitting on the far end of his faction's base wall. Pixels dont breathe. That's why you can take stupid risks if the situation justifies it. If you get pwned, you can hit one of the three ress options.
  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    We have names for them... Your "push" archer is known as a dead archer. And your "tactical" archer is known as a breathing archer.

    "Push" anything with good damage and gear works against unorganized and unprepared factions. In those situations, wall of ranged DD supported by clerics can gain a lot of momentum. They just tower dive and kill people when the opponent is just getting into position and perhaps still on their mounts. It's what you'd do to roll a faction as soon as possible.

    In most fights against equally-prepared factions you don't do that obviously.
    Elena Costel: I wash my hands of this affair.
    Legerity: *drags you back* *stains your hands with said affair*
    Elena Costel: Noooo... I don't want to have a dirty affair with Lady Legerity...
    Qui: b:dirty
  • Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973
    Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 Posts: 7,881 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    It's not bad to stay up at the front. Just make sure to have your escape options ready (like AD + alacrity). If your escape options are on cooldown shift to the back until they are ready again. As long as you aren't a one shot you'll be fine.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Refining Simulator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/refiningsimulator.html (don't use IE)
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  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Aesthor is like me with Ruvil's hair b:chuckle
    Elena Costel: I wash my hands of this affair.
    Legerity: *drags you back* *stains your hands with said affair*
    Elena Costel: Noooo... I don't want to have a dirty affair with Lady Legerity...
    Qui: b:dirty
  • Aesthor - Heavens Tear
    Aesthor - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,845 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    But...I don't know what your archers look like :<
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    ಥ_ಥ MOAR.
    SkyKoC - How long is yours?
  • Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,385 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Sint - Harshlands wrote: »
    Also, kiyoshi enjoys fapping at how awesome he thinks he is, while sitting on the far end of his faction's base wall. Pixels dont breathe. That's why you can take stupid risks if the situation justifies it. If you get pwned, you can hit one of the three ress options.

    The day that I am the forward most attacker/defender in any tw... will be the day I leave whatever **** guild that i am in. Considering that I have the longest consistent range in the game... and there is only 2 other tw capable archers that can match my range (1 of whom i share a guild with). Hence... if i am the very first one... that means no one else in my guild is doing jack ****.
    Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »
    It's not bad to stay up at the front. Just make sure to have your escape options ready (like AD + alacrity). If your escape options are on cooldown shift to the back until they are ready again. As long as you aren't a one shot you'll be fine.

    I would argue that only works to certain extent... also heavily dependent on your opponents. Nothing ends a push faster then being hit by 4 +12 r9 bows at the same time... at least 1 of them being full dots.
    1. If I kill you; do something about it yourself, don't go complaining to my wife.
    2. If you have less kill counts then me, don't expect me to take pk advice from you.
    3. If you are hiding behind an alt, don't expect me to acknowledge your existence.

    Tokichiro - Heavy Armor Fish / Kiyoshi - Dual Blade Elf
  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Aesthor - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    But...I don't know what your archers look like :<

    Like you but with blond hair parted from the top ><
    Elena Costel: I wash my hands of this affair.
    Legerity: *drags you back* *stains your hands with said affair*
    Elena Costel: Noooo... I don't want to have a dirty affair with Lady Legerity...
    Qui: b:dirty
  • AckIes - Sanctuary
    AckIes - Sanctuary Posts: 80 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Waaa :O

    All these Archers in one thread and no equations yet.
    Gorenox Vanity fists

    Decide claws
    If you are going to take advantage of 4/5 APS stick with Gorenox since Decides require 11 more str and I find the Proc on the fists to be more beneficial. Plus that frees up 11 stats that can go back into Dex.
  • Sint - Harshlands
    Sint - Harshlands Posts: 579 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    The day that I am the forward most attacker/defender in any tw... will be the day I leave whatever **** guild that i am in. Considering that I have the longest consistent range in the game... and there is only 2 other tw capable archers that can match my range (1 of whom i share a guild with). Hence... if i am the very first one... that means no one else in my guild is doing jack ****.

    Nobody said you had to be in front of everyone else, you're just talking out of your ***. Wich isnt unusual, but it IS tiresome.

    Also, if you are indeed full +10 with JoSDs, you would have to be veeery slow to NOT get to your AD button on time. OR all of them would have to crit, wich isnt very likely.

    Given how you just proclaimed yourself one of 3 tw capable sage archers, that would mean they would probably stun you for just 3.5 seconds. (I really dont think anyone would waste a spark to immobilize you in tw, and even if thy did, you could use an IG and outlast it.) It would take about 1.2 seconds for them to fire another shot, and since they're demon, they're likely channeling quickshot. So you would have to fail to get to AD in 1.6 seconds. Wich leads us to:

    You're either cripple or stupid.

    Have a nice day.
  • Aesthor - Heavens Tear
    Aesthor - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,845 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Kiyo got full jades? Last I checked (and this was like 1-2 weeks ago) he was still being lazy with immacs.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    ಥ_ಥ MOAR.
    SkyKoC - How long is yours?
  • Thartharlay - Sanctuary
    Thartharlay - Sanctuary Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    archsashiel wrote: »

    1) i've been told to put some extra str so i can wear fists at end game, deicide its the name, but i was wondering if all that extra str isnt gonna **** my damage in bow, or absorv points that could b put into vit, so my question is are those fists/claws realy a must have for a good archer or not at all? cause in my opinion i'm building an archer not a light armor bm...

    I suggest to use str tome for fist/claw

    http://pwcalc.com/f1e894971cdd23db

    http://pwcalc.com/5e22cf333aed05de

    U don't need to put extra str for farming b:cool




    p.s dex 14 from vana pant=add dex 6 from ring engraving b:surrender
  • BladedZero - Sanctuary
    BladedZero - Sanctuary Posts: 211 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    archsashiel wrote: »
    Hi everyone,

    I'm new to the game so give me a break if my questions sound too noobish...

    ...here's the deal

    1) i've been told to put some extra str so i can wear fists at end game, deicide its the name, but i was wondering if all that extra str isnt gonna **** my damage in bow, or absorv points that could b put into vit, so my question is are those fists/claws realy a must have for a good archer or not at all? cause in my opinion i'm building an archer not a light armor bm...

    2) whats the max constituition/vit a good tw archer should have at end game say lvl 100 or 90's?

    3) in relation to tomes, knowing that a tome like love up and down is expensive and hard to get, whats the best a tome one with both vit and dext or just dex?

    i thank you all for the awnsers, and if u can point me in the direction of a guide that gives usefull info on tw archers i would apreciate, i play in a pve server so i dont think i'm going to do much pvp and most guides i've been reading are all about pvp...i know that tw is a pvp event but its a litle diferent than west gate pvp...

    Thank you all and have a good game

    1) http://pwcalc.com/04cfe0d196983264 You can add +str helms, rings, accessories, tomes to lower the str cost of equiping fist. If you improvise enough you can probably follow the standard 1str and 4dex per level.

    2) 3 if you have massive refines and shards, vit just doesn't add noticable health and a dead target is more likely to deal less damage than one you're trying to tank/kite.

    3) Personally I'd carry a str tome so you can get enough str to wield deicides for dungeon runs and switch back during TW and have a standard TW bow build. However if you can afford one, getting a pan gu or love up and down will do it all for you.

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