Whats better?

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Kodama_xx - Archosaur
Kodama_xx - Archosaur Posts: 19 Arc User
edited November 2011 in Archer
I'v been researching and tryna go over which would be the better choice, a sage rank 9 archer, or going aps with demon spark no rank 9 or partial rank 9. If someone could perhaps tell me the benefits of both and the negatives, and all, cause im sure there will be lots of personalities and specualtion of which is actually better or w/e, and is it even possible to achieve a 3.33 base aps as an archer? since the starting base aps as archer is low with a bow.
Post edited by Kodama_xx - Archosaur on

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  • Keliska - Raging Tide
    Keliska - Raging Tide Posts: 768 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    Allowing others to answer this ...

    From what I hear armor doesn't make much of a difference. All are supposely capable of one shotting others.

    Maybe a Tank like toon it would be okay.

    Archers using claws can gain 5 aps faster then all classes. As they gain earlier -intervel gear.

    I'd say up to you. Use a perfectly geared Archer or be one of the aps cs-ers. :)

    EDIT: Do note that Archers can't gain BP so there weaker close range, but you should know this by now. ;)
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  • Ikarium - Dreamweaver
    Ikarium - Dreamweaver Posts: 631 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    Kodama_xx - Archosaur wrote: »
    is it even possible to achieve a 3.33 base aps as an archer? since the starting base aps as archer is low with a bow.
    No, not with a bow. The max APS you can have ranged (if I recall) is 2.5aps, and that's with all interval gear including a sling with a full -0.1 on it.

    With claws/fists archers can hit 5.0 base. Archer at 3.33 base with claws or fist is pretty easy to obtain (compared to other classes). The common thing to do with fists/claws is to stat the minimum strength for whatever melee weapon you intend to use, most often Deicides. The problem with this is you have very low strength, and no mastery (blazing arrow buff applies tho), resulting in a cheap, quick route to 5aps, tho it is weak aps compared to one made to be built that way (BM, Sin).
  • Keliska - Raging Tide
    Keliska - Raging Tide Posts: 768 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    Blaze Arrow applies to other weapons whuut? ._.
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  • Kodama_xx - Archosaur
    Kodama_xx - Archosaur Posts: 19 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    so going the pure bow sage archer route is the best idea rather then going a pure bow aps archer?
  • truekossy
    truekossy Posts: 7,021 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    You can have 4.0 demon sparked while wearing full rank 9 with fists/claws that have-0.1 int So it's really more a question of if you want to have the option of 4.0 claws or if you plan to stick to your bow.... and even then, assuming you can afford to shard and refine your gear to the types of levels a full set of R9 would suggest, you'd be at the point where gear > culti.


    As for with purely bow, the most you'll get is about 1.43 or somewhere around there while demon sparked (too lazy to check atm). You'll wind up with more overall damage by just using full rank 9 with either culti, though.... so once again, cultivation choice wouldn't make much of a difference except if you didn't use R9 for whatever reason, demon would be better thanks to the spark.
  • Keliska - Raging Tide
    Keliska - Raging Tide Posts: 768 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    lol that makes me wonder how many sins go to lvl 80-90 before doing all there cultis ._. Alt FCC run wise xD
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  • Kodama_xx - Archosaur
    Kodama_xx - Archosaur Posts: 19 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    okay well i guess ill plan to go pure bow, so next question, is it worth getting any aps at all with rank 9 or just go full rank 9? cause i could do something like r9 bow top pants, wrists and boots, then have a lionheart neck and belt for the aps, plus a energetic robe for interval as well, or is it better to just stick with the r9 belt and go full r9?
  • Keliska - Raging Tide
    Keliska - Raging Tide Posts: 768 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    Full Rank Gear.

    Unless you decide to go fist/claw.

    Open a new thread as we answered your question. D:
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  • Aesthor - Heavens Tear
    Aesthor - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,845 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    The attack level you get from full r9 is better than any -int boost you get from TT pieces.
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  • Kodama_xx - Archosaur
    Kodama_xx - Archosaur Posts: 19 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    alright so if i got the money go full rank 9, what about a budget build?
  • Keliska - Raging Tide
    Keliska - Raging Tide Posts: 768 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    For that I would say 'Google it.'
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  • _Perses_ - Lost City
    _Perses_ - Lost City Posts: 1,917 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    Ok this guy is annoying...posted the same damn thread in the assassin sub form =.=''
    Nothing worthwhile to mention here, enjoy the animated signature~

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  • Kodama_xx - Archosaur
    Kodama_xx - Archosaur Posts: 19 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    is that a problem? lol im looking at both an archer and a sin? whats wrong with that lol.
  • _Perses_ - Lost City
    _Perses_ - Lost City Posts: 1,917 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    Nothing wrong, just a personal annoyance as for neither thread did you clearly state in the opening post what you were specifically looking at gearing towards.


    nor did you bother to give examples of what you were thinking of gearing towards with a pwcalc.com or other gear calc's
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  • Kodama_xx - Archosaur
    Kodama_xx - Archosaur Posts: 19 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    probably because i didnt have any ideas? derp? hence why im sitting here asking
  • Aesthor - Heavens Tear
    Aesthor - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,845 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    If you are gearing up an archer for end-game PVP r9 is the best way to go.

    If you're looking for a "budget" build and have a sin you can carry the -int items over. I would recommend not using the -int necklace; even a sky demon pearl is better if you can't get a cube necklace. It's quite easy to get 5 aps even without the necklace anyways (if you're demon). If you're sage...Um, sage is not ideal unless you pretty much max out your gears. If you can't play to the advantages of sage you should just go demon.
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  • Kodama_xx - Archosaur
    Kodama_xx - Archosaur Posts: 19 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    sounds awesome then. sounds like r9 is the way to go for any class xD
  • _blood_rain - Sanctuary
    _blood_rain - Sanctuary Posts: 2,532 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    Kodama_xx - Archosaur wrote: »
    sounds awesome then. sounds like r9 is the way to go for any class xD

    Yea, but dont go sage.
  • Sint - Harshlands
    Sint - Harshlands Posts: 579 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    _blood_rain - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Yea, but dont go sage.

    i'm fairly certain that was the idea.

    I still personally prefer my partial r9/aps proyect, but that's personal preference. Even though i'm fairly certain, (@Aesthor) that after Quickshot proc, int bow dmg > full r9 bow dmg. (the 30 additional attack lvls, when using a jones blessing, give you only about 18% additional dmg. I admit my build lacks defense. Said deficiency does tend to get me pwned.
  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    Effect of additional attack levels depends on target defense level as well. Also, not sure where you got 30 extra attack levels being 18% additional dmg with Jones...
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  • Joshcja - Sanctuary
    Joshcja - Sanctuary Posts: 3,502 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Effect of additional attack levels depends on target defense level as well. Also, not sure where you got 30 extra attack levels being 18% additional dmg with Jones...

    160/130 = 1.23 so ya, i dont know where he got it either...
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  • Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,385 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    _Perses_ - Lost City wrote: »
    Ok this guy is annoying...posted the same damn thread in the assassin sub form =.=''

    LOL. You do know that anyone who needs to ask gear advice on the forums... more then likely can't afford r9 anyways. When is the last time you actually see a named r9 (or someone who went on to become a named) player ask for gear advice here.
    1. If I kill you; do something about it yourself, don't go complaining to my wife.
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  • Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973
    Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 Posts: 7,881 Arc User
    edited October 2011
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    Sint - Harshlands wrote: »
    i'm fairly certain that was the idea.

    I still personally prefer my partial r9/aps proyect, but that's personal preference. Even though i'm fairly certain, (@Aesthor) that after Quickshot proc, int bow dmg > full r9 bow dmg. (the 30 additional attack lvls, when using a jones blessing, give you only about 18% additional dmg. I admit my build lacks defense. Said deficiency does tend to get me pwned.

    Full r9 is 93 attack levels (with jones) at .87 aps
    Full int with r9 bow is 60 attack levels (w/ jones) at 1.05 aps

    1.93*.87 = 1.68
    1.6*1.05 = 1.68

    So both builds have roughly the same DPS when firing normal arrows. Once you factor in the skill damage and damage from aoes full r9 will have higher damage overall. Looking at skill damage is important since even against arcane you will always lead with stunning arrow then quickshot then normal arrows. In TW AOEs are huge and they don't benefit at all from int.

    The only advantage full int keeps is greater chance to purge and more chi generation (although spamming skills is still the best way to generate chi with a bow). I don't think that is all that much when compared to the massive gains in hp / defense / attack you get from full r9.
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  • Sint - Harshlands
    Sint - Harshlands Posts: 579 Arc User
    edited November 2011
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    @Asterelle:

    The aps build i proposed was one i thought up for my own playstyle, wich involves a fair amount of quickshot spamming. (1.54 max aps with bow) i also considered it to be slightly better for twing against factions where most players use worse gear than mine (the variety that gets 1shot by a rank 9 crit)

    Off topic: the other reason i made my build was because i found it more enjoyable than full r9. PvP actually involvs some risk this way, as opposed to full r9, where pvp becomes a tad boring. The possibility of losing makes pvp more interesting for me.
  • Aesthor - Heavens Tear
    Aesthor - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,845 Arc User
    edited November 2011
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    Sint - Harshlands wrote: »
    i'm fairly certain that was the idea.

    I still personally prefer my partial r9/aps proyect, but that's personal preference. Even though i'm fairly certain, (@Aesthor) that after Quickshot proc, int bow dmg > full r9 bow dmg. (the 30 additional attack lvls, when using a jones blessing, give you only about 18% additional dmg. I admit my build lacks defense. Said deficiency does tend to get me pwned.

    I don't understand what you mean...Are you saying you would forgo the r9 belt and cube necklace for extra -int in TW?

    If that is your preference then by all means; you know what you like best after all. Personally I TW against a faction with more R9s than my own, so I wear the full set + cube necklace, because their r9s hurt enough even with those defenses. I don't even wear the -int cape, because I'm getting the 2 piece set bonus from my nirvana hat + cape. My build is based off attack levels.
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