Share tactics to kill sins

Zliss - Lost City · September 2011

i think an archer is a dead archer -.-

Fleuri - Sanctuary · September 2011

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

And hope the sin doesn't know how to use throatcut or knife throw. Also I don't think your +5 armor gives you enough HP to survive 28-40 dagger strikes during the 10 seconds of town portal / incense channeling...

You are absolutely right: I do not have that much HP.

But could you perhaps explain your thinking for me?

So, for example, let's say that my hope fails, and that assassin uses throatcut on me. Most likely, my channelling has been interrupted, and I cannot use skills for four seconds. Are you really telling me that you expect me to just stand there not just for those four seconds but for another however many seconds after that while the assassin attacks me? I mean... our assassin even did the courtesy of saving me from having to worry about fumbling on my escape key.

Or, did assassins get purge, somehow, when I was not looking? I did mention that I was using wings of grace first, did I not? Do you think that in a case where I scared the assassin into using force stealth that I really have to worry about waiting out a seal while I am purged? (If they have a lunar bow with purge, four shots should give the assassin a 15% chance of purging me, if the base purge chance is 4% -- but should I be taking zero shots while this is happening?)

So there I am, immune to movement debuffs, facing an assassin with no force stealth. I have eleven alacrity, maybe even apothecary, awaken, winged shell (because I was not smart enough to have it up before I used town portal), condor and so on, if I can just survive a few seconds so I can use them, but right now my only option is movment.... and I am supposed to just stand there while he kills me with melee attacks?

Well... ok... all I can think to say is: thank you for this insight into how i should be playing.

Or, lesson learned: If I was doing this "for real" (instead of just chit-chatting here in the forums) I really should put winged shell up before I use town portal...

NoXide_ - Heavens Tear · September 2011

Fleuri - Sanctuary wrote: »

You are absolutely right: I do not have that much HP.

But could you perhaps explain your thinking for me?

So, for example, let's say that my hope fails, and that assassin uses throatcut on me. Most likely, my channelling has been interrupted, and I cannot use skills for four seconds. Are you really telling me that you expect me to just stand there not just for those four seconds but for another however many seconds after that while the assassin attacks me? I mean... our assassin even did the courtesy of saving me from having to worry about fumbling on my escape key.

Or, did assassins get purge, somehow, when I was not looking? I did mention that I was using wings of grace first, did I not? Do you think that in a case where I scared the assassin into using force stealth that I really have to worry about waiting out a seal while I am purged? (If they have a lunar bow with purge, four shots should give the assassin a 15% chance of purging me, if the base purge chance is 4% -- but should I be taking zero shots while this is happening?)

So there I am, immune to movement debuffs, facing an assassin with no force stealth. I have eleven alacrity, maybe even apothecary, awaken, winged shell (because I was not smart enough to have it up before I used town portal), condor and so on, if I can just survive a few seconds so I can use them, but right now my only option is movment.... and I am supposed to just stand there while he kills me with melee attacks?

Well... ok... all I can think to say is: thank you for this insight into how i should be playing.

Or, lesson learned: If I was doing this "for real" (instead of just chit-chatting here in the forums) I really should put winged shell up before I use town portal...

have you even pvp`d before? or do you just run your mouth on these forums?

simple fact Sin Vs Archer, Sin will win. expel? pfft any decent sin will condensed thorn and stun/seal your *** again.

only way to win is to force log out.

/Close

Quilue - Sanctuary · September 2011

The obvious answer is 0 chan pill -> town port!
WOOOOSH!

ryo510 · September 2011

NoXide_ - Heavens Tear wrote: »

have you even pvp`d before? or do you just run your mouth on these forums?

simple fact Sin Vs Archer, Sin will win. expel? pfft any decent sin will condensed thorn and stun/seal your *** again.

only way to win is to force log out.

/Close

Doesn't force log out just closes the client process which will cause you to time out after some time? He'd still kill you and anyways, it'd be a draw.

BIaze_ - Heavens Tear · September 2011

ryo510 wrote: »

Doesn't force log out just closes the client process which will cause you to time out after some time? He'd still kill you and anyways, it'd be a draw.

no, force log does log you out

Fleuri - Sanctuary · September 2011

NoXide_ - Heavens Tear wrote: »

have you even pvp`d before? or do you just run your mouth on these forums?

simple fact Sin Vs Archer, Sin will win. expel? pfft any decent sin will condensed thorn and stun/seal your *** again.

only way to win is to force log out.

/Close

And I imagine I should ask if you have learned to comprehend the words you read?

I think you should go read again, the posts that talk about "expel" in this thread. And then you should notice the names on them, paying special attention to how they are spelled. And then you should count how many have names spelled "Fleuri". Or, I could give you that count without you having to do all that horrid work. (zero)

But, hey, I totally agree with your underlying thesis that you should not allow little things like facts from getting in the way of a good slam. Totally. Yes. Your point is therefore utterly valid and without flaw.

And, thank you, so much for sharing your wonderful knowledge with me.

P.S. The point of town portal would be to either leave or force the assassin to fight you when you are movement debuff immune. Expel would not so good because you are sealing yourself for a lot of that movement debuff immune time. You are better off just using winged shell which can soften one initial attack and then kiting and fighting after that.

P.P.S. force log out is on a timer, when you are in combat, and has been for a year or so.

Decus - Dreamweaver · September 2011

Fleuri - Sanctuary wrote: »

P.S. The point of town portal would be to either leave or force the assassin to fight you when you are movement debuff immune. Expel would not so good because you are sealing yourself for a lot of that movement debuff immune time. You are better off just using winged shell which can soften one initial attack and then kiting and fighting after that.

P.P.S. force log out is on a timer, when you are in combat, and has been for a year or so.

You're doing it wrong.

NoXide_ - Heavens Tear · September 2011

Fleuri - Sanctuary wrote: »

And I imagine I should ask if you have learned to comprehend the words you read?

I think you should go read again, the posts that talk about "expel" in this thread. And then you should notice the names on them, paying special attention to how they are spelled. And then you should count how many have names spelled "Fleuri". Or, I could give you that count without you having to do all that horrid work. (zero)

But, hey, I totally agree with your underlying thesis that you should not allow little things like facts from getting in the way of a good slam. Totally. Yes. Your point is therefore utterly valid and without flaw.

And, thank you, so much for sharing your wonderful knowledge with me.

P.S. The point of town portal would be to either leave or force the assassin to fight you when you are movement debuff immune. Expel would not so good because you are sealing yourself for a lot of that movement debuff immune time. You are better off just using winged shell which can soften one initial attack and then kiting and fighting after that.

P.P.S. force log out is on a timer, when you are in combat, and has been for a year or so.

that would mean id have to read this entire thread and anything with your name on it is 99% of the time aload of **** thats come from someone that knows absolutly nothing about pw. lifes too short for that id rather just troll your dumbness and move on b:bye

Fleuri - Sanctuary · September 2011

NoXide_ - Heavens Tear wrote: »

that would mean id have to read this entire thread and anything with your name on it is 99% of the time aload of **** thats come from someone that knows absolutly nothing about pw. lifes too short for that id rather just troll your dumbness and move on b:bye

Oooooo........

Ok!

And do let us know when you have anything to say that means anything?

Vindis - Dreamweaver · September 2011

Fleuri - Sanctuary wrote: »

And I imagine I should ask if you have learned to comprehend the words you read?

I think you should go read again, the posts that talk about "expel" in this thread. And then you should notice the names on them, paying special attention to how they are spelled. And then you should count how many have names spelled "Fleuri". Or, I could give you that count without you having to do all that horrid work. (zero)

But, hey, I totally agree with your underlying thesis that you should not allow little things like facts from getting in the way of a good slam. Totally. Yes. Your point is therefore utterly valid and without flaw.

And, thank you, so much for sharing your wonderful knowledge with me.

P.S. The point of town portal would be to either leave or force the assassin to fight you when you are movement debuff immune. Expel would not so good because you are sealing yourself for a lot of that movement debuff immune time. You are better off just using winged shell which can soften one initial attack and then kiting and fighting after that.

P.P.S. force log out is on a timer, when you are in combat, and has been for a year or so.

*fixed.

Let us get back on topic. Sins are dumb. While they faceroll the keyboard, anyone else have any interesting ways to defeat them? (Maybe some kind of obscure genie skills or something?)

WoG+Lawbreaker before seal seems like it would work, but I'm way too lazy to build a nice genie that can have AD, Expel and Lawbreaker on it.

Fresh_Corpse - Sanctuary · September 2011

buy rank 9 > hunt level 30 sins in SP > die to a 10x sin > log on your 105 sin and faceroll it>????>Profit

Sint - Harshlands · September 2011

NoXide_ - Heavens Tear wrote: »

that would mean id have to read this entire thread and anything with your name on it is 99% of the time aload of **** thats come from someone that knows absolutly nothing about pw. lifes too short for that id rather just troll your dumbness and move on b:bye

will someone please remove this halfwit from the thinking side of the forums?

Also, i have never met a "decent" sin who did anything to me while i was expelled. Let us not forget people who make sins make sins to faceroll people. NoXide likely made a sin for that purpose, and runs his mouth on forums so people will think he can actually play one.

Also, Expell, even if you get stunned trough it, is awesome because it gives yoru charm time to cool down, and, if timed correctly, wastes the sin's 2 longest stuns, and outlasts immobilize. Wich is why people expell.

There isnt a sin around who would attack you while you are antistunned, unless they know they are geared enough to roll you in half a second.

Fresh_Corpse - Sanctuary · September 2011

Sint - Harshlands wrote: »

will someone please remove this halfwit from the thinking side of the forums?

Also, i have never met a "decent" sin who did anything to me while i was expelled. Let us not forget people who make sins make sins to faceroll people. NoXide likely made a sin for that purpose, and runs his mouth on forums so people will think he can actually play one.

Also, Expell, even if you get stunned trough it, is awesome because it gives yoru charm time to cool down, and, if timed correctly, wastes the sin's 2 longest stuns, and outlasts immobilize. Wich is why people expell.

There isnt a sin around who would attack you while you are antistunned, unless they know they are geared enough to roll you in half a second.

even an idiot sin can count to 8 and hit tele stun

XPenancex - Harshlands · November 2011

c'mon archers i wanna read/know more.....

Allynna_ - Dreamweaver · November 2011

Crazy idea, expel the Sin.

Not sure how effective it would be, but randomly sealing the Sin (and considering how few anti-seal genie skills there are) might do something. Might even cause them to WTF for a few while you pummel them.

Was thinking of it as a crazy attack against HA classes, but might work on a Sin to.

(Results not guaranteed)

Vindis - Dreamweaver · November 2011

It can work, but for some reason, at least when I have tried expel does not like to work on everyone. I feel it must be the buff filters or something. I still prefer boa+expel to immune all their damage (aside from that water skill) for 9 seconds.

truekossy · November 2011

Only stupid players tend to run around without the neutral buff screen (aka the anti-expel feature) on in PK most of the time.

... Then again, "stupid players," describes a large portion of the assassin playerbase.

lolzeek · November 2011

Is it a question on how archers can beat sins, or any class? I for one don't think they're unbeatable. I've seen plenty of HA players beat them, psychics, and a few r9+12 archers beat them.

ineye11 · January 2012

I'd fortify + ws stun arrow run a little aim low finish

****

_blood_rain - Sanctuary · January 2012

kewl necro?

Vindis - Dreamweaver · January 2012

I remember this..good times.

J_Voorhees - Heavens Tear · February 2012

Fleuri - Sanctuary wrote: »

And all the archer has to do, if the assassin decides to run away, is: wings of grace, town portal. (Or, teleport incense, if town portal is too hot...)

Or Wedding ring from 300 hearts :P which would be pro too.I never got to use it tho, so no idea about the channeling time.

G_tar_God - Dreamweaver · February 2012

Alrighty, I play a full r9 archer so this is coming from my view. I've come up against many diff sins, r9/G13/G15.

With my genie setup...

If a sin stuns...Ill expel as soon as i can. Now most the time, ull be able to start running while ur expel is on b4 the sin Tackling Slashes or tries a diff stun on yah. As soon as i can start running, ill pop my apo because u can use apo even while u hav the seal on from ur expel. Ofc if the sins pretty good/lucky, you wont get a chance to hit that apo, so ur basically dead xD

Dependin on the situation/my buffs ill rather Vacuity/shadow binder or Dew star.
After that, its all about gettin ur Wings of Grace off, kiting and pew pew'in. I'll usually use Wings of Grace first, then time Elven Alacrity to use straight after WoG wares off. Using WoG first means if ur lucky, ull b alive long enough to use WoG again when the Cooldowns up. Im demon so a demon quick shot is my best friend. Ill use stunning arrow prayin that their Tidal protection doesnt kick in but if not, hey its demon, woot for 10% more crit!
If you keep kiting, mayb even fly around ull live for abit. I like to try keep my 3 sparks so if i get Tackling slashed by a sin I can spark it off then mayb Occult or stun n pew pew afterwards. Also being demon, throw in a Mo-whats-his-face taunt. Sure sins hav chi skills, but that 50 chi u drain could be the different between a demon sparked sin and a sin forced to just stun lock.

Also, not sure how many ppl know about this, but i'll do this if its a sin i can kill quick. If a sin uses Throatcut on ya and u get sealed, sometimes ill use Expel and the seal that Expel gives turns into the Throatcut seal which only lasts 4 secs or so. When the Throatcut seal comes off, all of a sudden im still immune to phsy damage but I dont have a seal on so i can anti stun/fight back.

One thing ive noticed though...atleast when sins are aren't cleric buffed, even when they are for the most part...archers metal skills hit hard no matter wat refined armor a sin has. None of em hav magic defense xD. That may be though cos I hav a r9 +12 bow but still, sins are squishy so alotta luck is involved in killing a sin.

The most important thing.....if a sin triple sparks....gtfo of there xD

If ur curious, my genie skills are:
Occult
Expel
Frenzy
Tangling Mire
Absolute Domain
Cloud eruption
Holy path

With 78 str, 74 magic, 66 vit n 3 dex. I kinda like to hav higher magic so I can get things like Occult or Expel bak faster also faster regenin genie for TW is great.

Overall though, sins kill everything so expect to die alot to a sin. But if you put up a good fight, be proud of it cos like i said...sins kill everything

ineye11 · February 2012

How to kill a sin depends if u can take a few hit or not

Pre-req get lotsa pdef

1) U get stun, expel + Dew
2) Wog
3) Stun arrow or Aim low (if one miss do the other .. if both misses run till ur expel cooldown, pop antistun during cooldowns)
4) Auto to finish cause they are squishy

Same tactic work for all melee classes, except that step 4 u mite need to 3 spark in order to kill it.

simpa961 · February 2012

Sint - Harshlands wrote: »

I propose we just ignore OllieTheKid on acount of him being lvl 80, and likely a failure.

Fighting sins: 1v1 is the only situation where you'll have any problem with them. Generally, i find i could probably make a pk macro on a sin to kill an equally geared archer. Evidence? Sin comes out of stealth double sparked, and you get hit with Headhunt. If the sin is even close to your gear level, this will hurt. Thre is no way you' going to live trough the next few seconds of pain without burning your genie, either. Faith, AD, and Expell are all viable alternatives. BoC might work, depending on dex.

If you do get out of it, all the sin has to do is hit his stealth button. If you used any of the first 3 skills, you have probably lost already. All the sin has to do is sit in stealth untill headhunt cools down (30 seconds?) Unless you built your genie specifically to do this, you cant use expell, ad or faith when he comes out of stealth again, and you get fried. If you somehow do (a smart sin will have read this straight off your character info), all the sin has to do is teleport to a nearby mob(if you AD or Expell), AD himself and keep DDing(Faith), use Condensed and immobilize you when his stun is wearing off(Expell). Then seal. Then Occult once your expell wears off. Your chances of getting out of THAT if the sin is wearing gear even remotely comparable to yours ar slim to none.

Both shadow teleport and Occult Ice will stun you trough Expell.

As for the nub approach: if you unstealth a good sin, that sin will:
a) Stealth again.
b) Shadow teleport to you and pwn you
c) Shadow jump/teleport away and lol at you.
d) Throw up CoD and Tidal Protection, pull out a bow, (double spark?) and **** you.
e) Occult Ice.
f) Maze Steps > walk into your range > lolpwn
g) Any of the above, All of the above, Several of the above, Other tactics wich i have not mentioned, such as:
h) Roll face across keyboard. Then tell you how noob you are because you died.
(because most good sins ar still morons.)

I do really appreciate your analysis but I think when a sin attacks an archer archer AD and survive (very hard I know) an archer might have a chance when the sin go invisible simply by using detection potion it's a long shot but with WOG on it might help against some sins

Vindis - Dreamweaver · February 2012

Most sins are nabs and will try to throatcut out of stealth. I normally try to time Wings of Grace to keep the antistun up. IF they do get a stun on you, cast expel on yourself. Then, that should give you time to get out of stunlock, and should also give time for their Maze Steps to wear out. You should be moving away from them now, preferrably with Alacrity if/when WoG goes down. After their maze step wears out, hit them with aim low, TS, LS. They should be dead now.

If they restealthed, then you have to start over and try again. Most sins however, are pretty easy targets and expel is a life saver. I think I mentioned in this thread previously, but WoG+BoA+Expel is a nice tactic for restealthing sins.

XKi - Lost City · February 2012

For sin it'z ez: roll face onto da keyboardz and voila, dead sin. b:dirty b:dirty b:dirty b:dirty b:dirty

Niner - Dreamweaver · February 2012

G_tar_God - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Alrighty, I play a full r9 archer so this is coming from my view. I've come up against many diff sins, r9/G13/G15.

With my genie setup...

If a sin stuns...Ill expel as soon as i can. Now most the time, ull be able to start running while ur expel is on b4 the sin Tackling Slashes or tries a diff stun on yah. As soon as i can start running, ill pop my apo because u can use apo even while u hav the seal on from ur expel. Ofc if the sins pretty good/lucky, you wont get a chance to hit that apo, so ur basically dead xD

Dependin on the situation/my buffs ill rather Vacuity/shadow binder or Dew star.
After that, its all about gettin ur Wings of Grace off, kiting and pew pew'in. I'll usually use Wings of Grace first, then time Elven Alacrity to use straight after WoG wares off. Using WoG first means if ur lucky, ull b alive long enough to use WoG again when the Cooldowns up. Im demon so a demon quick shot is my best friend. Ill use stunning arrow prayin that their Tidal protection doesnt kick in but if not, hey its demon, woot for 10% more crit!
If you keep kiting, mayb even fly around ull live for abit. I like to try keep my 3 sparks so if i get Tackling slashed by a sin I can spark it off then mayb Occult or stun n pew pew afterwards. Also being demon, throw in a Mo-whats-his-face taunt. Sure sins hav chi skills, but that 50 chi u drain could be the different between a demon sparked sin and a sin forced to just stun lock.

Also, not sure how many ppl know about this, but i'll do this if its a sin i can kill quick. If a sin uses Throatcut on ya and u get sealed, sometimes ill use Expel and the seal that Expel gives turns into the Throatcut seal which only lasts 4 secs or so. When the Throatcut seal comes off, all of a sudden im still immune to phsy damage but I dont have a seal on so i can anti stun/fight back.

One thing ive noticed though...atleast when sins are aren't cleric buffed, even when they are for the most part...archers metal skills hit hard no matter wat refined armor a sin has. None of em hav magic defense xD. That may be though cos I hav a r9 +12 bow but still, sins are squishy so alotta luck is involved in killing a sin.

The most important thing.....if a sin triple sparks....gtfo of there xD

If ur curious, my genie skills are:
Occult
Expel
Frenzy
Tangling Mire
Absolute Domain
Cloud eruption
Holy path

With 78 str, 74 magic, 66 vit n 3 dex. I kinda like to hav higher magic so I can get things like Occult or Expel bak faster also faster regenin genie for TW is great.

Overall though, sins kill everything so expect to die alot to a sin. But if you put up a good fight, be proud of it cos like i said...sins kill everything

Your genie regen is nothing compared to mine! my Zeal is at 3.52 mag regen a second

and yes it has around 125 ot 126 magic lmfao, i love me my fast regen genies!

Oh and would this combo work? a sin jumps outta stealth, you expel him then just start spamming mag attacks?

_blood_rain - Sanctuary · February 2012

Niner - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Oh and would this combo work? a sin jumps outta stealth, you expel him then just start spamming mag attacks?

Only if he's noob.

(this had been covered already)

What I find amusing about this thread is it keeps getting necroed with people posting tactics that are the same as the previous posters have already explained. and they pretty much all rely on Expel. If someone is going to necro this again, new/different/yet unmentioned tactics plx?

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