Help: Herc or r8 ?

bikefire · August 2011

Hi.
Im level 100 and i dont know if i should spend 80M with full r8 and new gear or buy a Herc (or maybe a Nix). Atm my gear is medium, with TT, rank and quest gear.I have 2 ground pets: lvl 80 Armored Bear, and lvl 95 Cristaline Magnemite ( with all skils maxed)

I think it is better for me to buy a Herc and then start soloing TTs and/or FCs to make money to buy gear later.

What is your opinion?

BTW i will not buy gold with real money...

Elendirah - Sanctuary · August 2011

You could also keep those coins and wait for a very good sale . Instead of thinking that you have 80M to spend consider that you have 80M to invest. Specially if it's pretty much all you have.
Merchanting is a bit dead at the moment but something big might come very soon (pwi anniversary in september). You could multiply those 80M very easily and get both, r8 + herc/nix.

Purecat - Dreamweaver · August 2011

I just think the prices for the 2 'legendary pets' are waaaay to big!
If you know a glacial walker of lvl 90 with maxed out skills can kill a hercules of lvl 90... Then why would you buy a herc? And yes, indead the nix does a lot of damage... But look at it's defense... LVL 90 DPS chars can kill the nix in 1.2 sec????

So considder... It it worth the coins (CASH!)?

Crescendia - Harshlands · August 2011

r8, herc isn't needed at endgame anyways

Lythianaa - Dreamweaver · August 2011

I would say get r8 instead of the herc. There's not much need for a herc nowadays.

thumbs · August 2011

Crescendia - Harshlands wrote: »

r8, herc isn't needed at endgame anyways

Neither is rank 8. -Fail argument.

I'd suggest Herc. Skip the nix unless you get wealthy and want a squeak toy or you like PvP. For PvE; Nix is mostly just for grinding and sucks for it because of getting stuck in ground or sitting there at mob not attacking. Herc empowers you.

Vasanta - Lost City · August 2011

Lythianaa - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I would say get r8 instead of the herc. There's not much need for a herc nowadays.

Oh really? No one invites me to a squad, because my veno hasn't got a herc...b:surrender

Marengo - Lost City · August 2011

I'd say herc because it is way better support than r8 gear. Herc isn't that necessary nowdays, but empty +0 r8 is about nothing too, it won't grant you anything special. With herc you can do a bit more at least.

Desdi - Sanctuary · August 2011

I had acquired enough coins to buy a Phoenix but I chose to buy Rank 8 instead. In my case, however, I already have a Hercules.

I'm tempted to say Rank 8 as well because you will rarely find yourself using the Hercules at endgame. I mostly use my DD/debuff pet but nobody can deny the usefulness of the that legendary pet. I'm able to run TTs for my faction and people rely on me a lot (especially due to some lack of tanks in the faction at the moment). This is a decision you should take on your own and just use our comments as feedback but don't consider them the right choice.

I should warn you that farming for money with Hercules is not exactly what it used to be. Prices for materials have fallen and getting money via TTs is quite a slow process. As for FCC, although I could solo runs myself and sell heads, I haven't really done it since I need at least an hour or two if I do it on my own (tested it). I don't know how profitable that it (and I wouldn't really want to join that dirty business), you'll have to ask others. I rely on Nirvana to make my coins.

Though, I think you could save the money for now, like it has been suggested, and invest them into something. If nothing happens anytime soon, you could reconsider about spending them. Rank 8 is not that necessary on Venomancers but it's a very decent endgame weapon and gear if you don't have the time/patience/means of getting something better, like Nirvana.

bikefire · August 2011

TY all b:victory

I think im going to use the money to buy/sell stuff to make more money...and then maybe i will buy r8 and nix (for TW)...

Hexalot - Dreamweaver · August 2011

bikefire wrote: »

TY all b:victory

I think im going to use the money to buy/sell stuff to make more money...and then maybe i will buy r8 and nix (for TW)...

Wise choice. I started late in this game (November 2010) and bought into the hype of Venos with Hercs still being in demand and so bought one for my lvl 56 Veno (now retired) for the same 80 gold.

Worse investment in my life !

Even at that level there was no great demand for my Herc to tank anything so I was just stuck grinding for DQ items. And of course as has been noted by other posters, at end game (lvl 100+) people could care less about your Herc. Venos are in demand at that level purely for their debuff/amping skills.

Much better to use that money to merchant and build yourself a decent stash of coin.

Marengo - Lost City · August 2011

Desdi - Sanctuary wrote: »

I'm tempted to say Rank 8 as well because you will rarely find yourself using the Hercules at endgame.

I wouldn't call r8 endgame gear any more (concerning veno. wep isn't perfect, though damage is good). If only you are going for r9...
I still use herc as my main pet because it's just more reliable than all the others. you don't need to heal it often, it's easier to pull mob from a squishy partymate with herc, if you suddenly have to tank for a bit you don't bother to resummon, it never dies when you lure with it. so it's much more convenient to use it since no1 cares your pet's damage.

Though, I think you could save the money for now, like it has been suggested, and invest them into something. If nothing happens anytime soon, you could reconsider about spending them. Rank 8 is not that necessary on Venomancers but it's a very decent endgame weapon and gear if you don't have the time/patience/means of getting something better, like Nirvana.

There is not much of a difference between r8 and hh90 armor if it's not well refined. yes, ranc is cool, but requires investments too. Otherwise it's not a big deal what to wear.

I don't want to say "don't buy r8", no

) just a... fact.

I think im going to use the money to buy/sell stuff to make more money...and then maybe i will buy r8 and nix (for TW)...

If you don't solo grind, this might be better x)

Desdi - Sanctuary · August 2011

@Marengo-
Well, rank 8 is as far as I could go in terms of gear. Rank 8 and TT99. I refined weapon to +7 with two sapphire gems and the rest of my gear is +5 with ornaments being +3 at the moment. I'm PvE though and it works great as endgame gear for me. I wanted something decent that can give me good survivability and good damage. The pataka works for me because I rely on critical hit a lot (14-17% critical depends on form) and having high high-end damage allows me to do strong criticals.

As for what pet you use for endgame, it's just preference really. Though I simply find DD/debuff pet more useful for me. With Howl I have more chances to kill the mob before I die (because I'll steal aggro from pet and if it's not me then someone else will) and Pierce makes up for my Demon Ironwood when it doesn't proc. But this is how I play.
For pulls, Kowlin/Cactus rarely dies, it's the timing that matters there. Though I see your reasoning but like I said..whatever fits your playstyle b:chuckle

@ OP - Had I known you're PvP oriented I would have favored rank8/Phoenix. Either way your choices were good.

thumbs · August 2011

You'd have to be trailing behind constantly, lazy, avoiding PvE like the plague to say Herc isn't useful end game. Rank 8 is only good for the shirt, and weapon, and neither gives as much advantage as a Herc PvE wise unless you're one of those chicken hawks fighting mobs from the air.

Nyxyo - Harshlands · August 2011

hercule->rank8->nyx
my 2 cents

Caramell - Harshlands · August 2011

Well i got first my herc and farmed then for r8 and nix.
But I got my herc befor all these aps people populated the server.
Befor that herc was rly usefull, he holded aggro in tt from nearly everything and was like THE TANK in tt and soloing tt did make sence too. Nowerdays its better you run 5 tts with aps ppl in same time you would run 1 solo.^^ So i think better get nix if you like to pvp. (nix is a bit better in pvp then r8 if you have to decide and try to get demon or sage amp so you will easily get a nirvana/tt squad to farm money

Greetings Caramell

JanusZeal - Heavens Tear · August 2011

Good choice on r8 and nix. Re-checking TT prices for mats that a veno can solo farm, the profit margin has gone to ****, and one can only rely so much on farming other things like card bosses as DPS farmers like sins, BM's, and barbs do the same thing and much faster, add onto that other classes do things like solo wraithgate or solo FF for plvl which obviously isn't much of an option for veno's in competition. The necessity for a herc endgame is pretty much nil, and be wary of people using arguments from between early 2009 to early 2010 where hercs could actually damage enough to tank over others, and when veno's were amongst top farmers not having to share with people who kill far more quickly and efficiently.

Understanding the roles, expectations, and limitations of veno's today will certainly help in enjoyment out of the class. Ignoring people who preach like they're reading from a bible of veno advice of yore is also a wise idea, times have changed for almost every class, especially veno's.

Nyxyo - Harshlands · August 2011

keep in mind that in any serious instance your pet will die in first boss aoe if is not hercule and you will be a veno...no moreb:laugh

Caramell - Harshlands · August 2011

Nyxyo - Harshlands wrote: »

keep in mind that in any serious instance your pet will die in first boss aoe if is not hercule and you will be a veno...no moreb:laugh

Well bosses dont rly 1 hit pets that easely when they are level 100+, you just have more work with healing pet because you have to heal him after every aoe attack.

Crescendia - Harshlands · August 2011

I don't really like to be elaborate in my responses to explain my decisions, but since some people don't seem to be satisfied with my answer, here you go.

To the OP, at 100+ these are the things I do/did ok

Celestial tiger event
Guild base quests
CoA
PvP tournament
BH's
OHT daily
Nirvana
TT
TW
Marriage quest

I have a blessed herc and the only times I find myself using it is in TT, BH or CoA and even then, the hercs presence was so insignificant next to an APS user, i just don't even use it anymore. Nearly every squad im a part of has an APS class and I only take out my herc to lazily lure things.

Now for things that I consider aid me in my gamestyle and financially, I almost always use my nix. Things like Celestial Tiger event, pvp, TW, OHT daily, Guild Base Quests. Pretty much, anything that takes me out of an instance.

If i knew back then what I know now, I would have never gotten a herc, much less bought a scroll to give it blessing.

just my opinion, maybe it's different for other veno's

Edit: oh and nice choice to merch for both, thats even better then choosing ^^ just be aware with r8 +6 & jones blessing, u will probably outdamage the herc lol

Caramell - Harshlands · August 2011

Crescendia - Harshlands wrote: »

I don't really like to be elaborate in my responses to explain my decisions, but since some people don't seem to be satisfied with my answer, here you go.

To the OP, at 100+ these are the things I do/did ok

Celestial tiger event
Guild base quests
CoA
PvP tournament
BH's
OHT daily
Nirvana
TT
TW
Marriage quest

I have a blessed herc and the only times I find myself using it is in TT, BH or CoA and even then, the hercs presence was so insignificant next to an APS user, i just don't even use it anymore. Nearly every squad im a part of has an APS class and I only take out my herc to lazily lure things.

Now for things that I consider aid me in my gamestyle and financially, I almost always use my nix. Things like Celestial Tiger event, pvp, TW, OHT daily, Guild Base Quests. Pretty much, anything that takes me out of an instance.

If i knew back then what I know now, I would have never gotten a herc, much less bought a scroll to give it blessing.

just my opinion, maybe it's different for other veno's

So true.^^ Hercs became nearly useless.

SNuppzH - Harshlands · August 2011

i have herc.. i NEVEr use it..useless trash pet !! lol kk xDb:shutup

..lol tt is worth nothing-.- lose more then u get 4 it XD..and u wil be bored solo tts and don't get anything for it..Z_Z

Marengo - Lost City · August 2011

Crescendia - Harshlands wrote: »

just be aware with r8 +6 & jones blessing, u will probably outdamage the herc lol

i used to outdamage nix with 1 crit using r8 +0 wep (half vit build)

)

thumbs · August 2011

Let's sit around all day waiting for aps class to tank BHD for us (most sins cannot solo it). Lets wait for aps class to tank mob before we even sage soul degen or amp it. Lets just be a gimped mage with a cute pet.

There are many including me that feel 95%+ of venos are fail and utterly a waste of squad space. Keep up the good work! Hercs are useless. -lol

Some rare TTs and Warsong Metal are only times I'd stow a Herc.

Hexalot - Dreamweaver · August 2011

thumbs wrote: »

Let's sit around all day waiting for aps class to tank BHD for us (most sins cannot solo it). Lets wait for aps class to tank mob before we even sage soul degen or amp it. Lets just be a gimped mage with a cute pet.

There are many including me that feel 95%+ of venos are fail and utterly a waste of squad space. Keep up the good work! Hercs are useless. -lol

Some rare TTs and Warsong Metal are only times I'd stow a Herc.

Bring your Herc out in Nirvana and you're guaranteed to **** off just about every DD in squad (with you subsequently being booted if you don't put it away when told).

Edit... speaking of Nirvana, looks like in the new "Caster" version Hercs are totally useless there too. I simply don't know how anybody could argue that Hercs are even remotely worth the purchase price you pay now... unless you plan to forever stay sub 100 that is.

Nine_Lives - Raging Tide · August 2011

Hexalot - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Bring your Herc out in Nirvana and you're guaranteed to **** off just about every DD in squad (with you subsequently being booted if you don't put it away when told).

Edit... speaking of Nirvana, looks like in the new "Caster" version Hercs are totally useless there too. I simply don't know how anybody could argue that Hercs are even remotely worth the purchase price you pay now... unless you plan to forever stay sub 100 that is.

+1

sent a lot of venos in my fac nearly to tears in the caster nirv on this one. Just when they thought they can safely use their well bought herc ''it's caster nirvy, dammit! we're casters right?'' they just found out that the bosses have patk immunityb:shocked

Edit: I did ask some of them if they will delete some of their herc's skills to make way for elemental bashes, still no one gave me a straight answer...only said i'll have to break out my glacial/treefrog again.

''Hides magmite with 3 elemental bashes''

Help: Herc or r8 ?

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