Archer bow damage vs. Seeker sword damage
Elenacostel - Heavens Tear
Posts: 2,822 Arc User
Assuming no fists / claws, which class does more damage? Seeker or Archer?
Let's say with R8 gear, level 100.
Let's say with R8 gear, level 100.
Post edited by Elenacostel - Heavens Tear on
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My main is a seeker but I'm gonna have to go with archer on this one.0
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R8 archer still has -.1 on chest and bow. Skill spamming class can't really go up against that in terms of dps.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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Seekers have a max aps of 2.5 sparked with the rank 8 blade (unless I'm forgettign something) at roughly half an archers base dph
Archers have 1.43 aps sparked with max int last i looked with far higher crit and DPH
Its clear that archers greatly out DD seekers in the short term as well as unsparked, however at what point would the seekers ability to spark more overtake the archers dps. Or is the gap so large that seekers never catch up.
I'm to damn lazy/do not care enough to figure the last question out. If somone wants to have fun with it go ahead.
In short, Archers in the short term or unsparked > seekers. Long term, who cares nothing lives that long.Gifs are hard to make work here0 -
Congratulations on 105, Lady Asterelle.
I was in a squad for BH Metal with a R8 Seeker with an R9 ring. I was ranged attacking the boss (I have difficulty surviving melee attacks against the boss), and I stole aggro once from the Seeker. However, he was getting fed chi from two venos, and took aggro back.
Not sure if this means anything, though. Both of us had +6 weapons. I had Immacs; I forgot what he had.0 -
Thanks.. its nice to retire the TT90 avatar ;o[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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Archer. Much better weapon damage. More crit. Bonus fire elemental damage per hit. More accuracy.
The only way seekers can have better damage is if they get their R9 GoF sword.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Joshcja - Sanctuary wrote: »Seekers have a max aps of 2.5 sparked with the rank 8 blade (unless I'm forgettign something) at roughly half an archers base dph
Of course, any Seeker building aps is a moron.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Chars:
CptMaggots 101 sage R8/NV Seeker
LovesTragedy 100 demon R8 Cleric
~Finally quit this god forsaken game~
Enjoy the rest of the downward spiral. See you in SWtOR b:bye0 -
I don't care about the actual thread, but congratulations Asterelle. 104-105..so quick b:sin0
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Bow always been 2nd best farmable item in the game.(Except for hercules <<) Fist just made archers useless.
I hardly doubt the seeker coulda keep up aggro with your cri damage. Only way for him to do so.. woulda be with higher refines.
b:chuckle you shoulda go old skool style and stop every 5-6 atacks.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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LovesTragedy - Lost City wrote: »Of course, any Seeker building aps is a moron.
+1
And I doubt the archer can keep aggro if the Seeker knows what he's doing or is simply using Vortex.0 -
Randamu - Harshlands wrote: »+1
And I doubt the archer can keep aggro if the Seeker knows what he's doing or is simply using Vortex.
This is precisely why I am asking. I do not know the Seeker class at all, so I do not know if they skill-spam or use normal attacks to deal max damage.0 -
I think that if a Seeker is just using vortex, then he or she would keep aggro. Otherwise, the Archer would have it. Seekers are definitely skill spammers, or at least they are in my opinion. But a good Heart Shatter/Soulsever debuff/proceed to set up vortex Seeker would keep aggro from almost every class, in my opinion. It's not saying much due to it being situational, or maybe it is, but in my FB79 at level 79 I kept aggro from a level 91 Archer who demon sparked at the boss just by keeping vortex alive. I'm sure being an R8 Archer with more APS would definitely make a difference, though, so I can't exactly say.
To sum it up, with vortex, possibly. With skill spamming and no vortex, definitely not.Donate towards my endgame build, please.
pwcalc.com/400d2e22e4b852e20 -
LovesTragedy - Lost City wrote: »Of course, any Seeker building aps is a moron.
+1
Also building aps would require the Seeker to go demon and that's not a good choice for Seekers since sage is ways better.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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They gave Battousai aggro ability just like FR, and that's how some Seekers hold aggro. As for Vortex, it doesn't tick every 3 seconds like other zhens. Actually, I don't even know if other zhens tick every 3 seconds, after what I tested on Vortex. I set it up on Ancient Sea Dragon, my test dummy, and it does a triple tick once about every 5 seconds. So it actually does that much damage every 1.5 seconds. I haven't been on my Seeker for a while and noticed that Vortex now says 1.5 instead of every 3 like before. So I guess it was just a typo in the skill description before, and when frankie posted the news about it ticking every 1.5 second, it was correct.
This explains a lot actually, like how a team of mostly Seeker without BM or Barb can do full GV, because their zhen are considerably more powerful than Archer or Wiz. Base damage + 100% weapon damage + 7842.8 or 8300 every 1.5 second is pretty substantial DPS (Heart shatter applies to Vortex since it's skill damage and not auto attack so that's 30% more there). If you *really* want to find out, I suppose someone can build 2 calc and compare the DPS of Archer auto with demon spark and Seeker's Vortex, but that's a job for someone less lazier than me.0 -
I doubt vortex does more dps than a demon archer. The cast rate of 1.5s is like an attack rate of 0.67. Just R8 chest + bow would give an attack rate of .87 which is 30% more. The an archers base attack with a bow is already like 60% more than a seeker's sword? Archer also has another 15% crit or so. This is before using any kind of skill to amp damage like demon spark or quickshot.
I don't think the bonus damage from vortex is enough to counter that much of a deficit.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »I doubt vortex does more dps than a demon archer. The cast rate of 1.5s is like an attack rate of 0.67. Just R8 chest + bow would give an attack rate of .87 which is 30% more. The an archers base attack with a bow is already like 60% more than a seeker's sword? Archer also has another 15% crit or so. This is before using any kind of skill to amp damage like demon spark or quickshot.
I don't think the bonus damage from vortex is enough to counter that much of a deficit.
^ Its just like when barbs used to tank, no matter how much aggro skill they spam. Archer cant just go all in n expect to not get aggro.
3 Spark < frenzy or any other genie skill[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Face the fear. Face a war. Face the world.
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A seeker's vortex will not be able to match the damage done by an archer with a bow of the same refine.
Seeker's vortex does damage to a target 3 times (3 damage ticks) with intervals of about 4-5 seconds of non damage for each attack cycle. An archer's normal bow damage is much more rapid and consistent. Factoring the higher crit rate, and the ability to gain chi and triple spark, archer with no doubt has more damage potential for single targets, they do kill much more faster than a seeker.
A good way to tell currently and judge for yourself with numbers is to see how much points one can obtain on the final boss during the celestial tiger event with a r8 archer using a bow and a r8 seeker using vortex. Of course, you will have to do this more than once as the time you spend on the boss varies due to the number of 5 aps participants at your tiger. From my experience using both of these classes for the event many times, the archer scores a lot higher (without using fists with archer on the final boss).0 -
Neodaystar - Sanctuary wrote: »A seeker's vortex will not be able to match the damage done by an archer with a bow of the same refine.
Seeker's vortex does damage to a target 3 times (3 damage ticks) with intervals of about 4-5 seconds of non damage for each attack cycle. An archer's normal bow damage is much more rapid and consistent. Factoring the higher crit rate, and the ability to gain chi and triple spark, archer with no doubt has more damage potential for single targets, they do kill much more faster than a seeker.
Every part of this is basically true, especially the red. Archers have better damage output than even vortex, but as in the red, that is for single targets. If you get an archer and a seeker and make them fight a whole group of mobs at once, the archer loses the advantage. But that should be expected from a class that's main skills are aoes anyways.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Chars:
CptMaggots 101 sage R8/NV Seeker
LovesTragedy 100 demon R8 Cleric
~Finally quit this god forsaken game~
Enjoy the rest of the downward spiral. See you in SWtOR b:bye0 -
LovesTragedy - Lost City wrote: »Every part of this is basically true, especially the red. Archers have better damage output than even vortex, but as in the red, that is for single targets. If you get an archer and a seeker and make them fight a whole group of mobs at once, the archer loses the advantage. But that should be expected from a class that's main skills are aoes anyways.
I think that's kind of hard to be sure on. The obvious advantages of vortex over BoA is that seekers get bp to work with their vortex and no damage reduction is applied to mobs at melee range, and will remain continuous until no available mp or manually canceled. BoA follows the target and is more easy to use with range/air mobs. Damage wise, barrage might do more damage.
Demon BoA:
Consuming 655 Mana every 2.5 seconds, release countless arrows
into the sky delivering devastating damage to the target and enemies within
a 12.0 meter radius of the target, inflicting base physical damage
plus 200% of weapon damage plus 6639.0.
Sage Vortex:
Drains 435 Mana every 1.5 seconds. Deals constant Physical damage
to targets within a 12 meter radius. The damage is equal
to base damage plus 100% of weapon damage plus 8300.
Spell will channel until you either run out of Chi or cancel
the spell.
A difference of 100% weapon damage (lvl 10 barb buff is 40%) between the 2 skill is quite significant as a bow has much higher weapon attack than a sword. For every 5 secs, the archer under goes 2 attack iteration, while the seeker under goes about 3 iteration (but these 3 attack iteration doesn't happen like the skill description implies - it's more like an out burst of damage every 5 secs). An archer also has 2 times the crit% of a seeker too. If both were wielding r9 weapons, then the seeker may be the superior one with vortex because of the frenzy effect on the sword.0 -
Boa could do also AoE debuffs depending on the weapon.. Like the stun/seal/freeze on nirvana weapons.
Only difference is that boa requires a constant target to keep up or mana. Target: its easy to drop party and open barrage on barb.. it will never stop. And for mana, mana charm and mp helmet does the trick for the most part.
I duno who does gv anymore except for culti or to help out... << kinda useless to do tbh.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Face the fear. Face a war. Face the world.
Leeching CQ salary since 09'
Many names, Common Faces.0
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