Sage BM's Exist?

Deaths_Devil - Raging Tide
Deaths_Devil - Raging Tide Posts: 70 Arc User
edited May 2011 in Tideswell (East)
are there any sage bm's out there and why did u guys choose sage?
Post edited by Deaths_Devil - Raging Tide on

Comments

  • Rawrgh - Raging Tide
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide Posts: 6,790 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    They took the wrong quest by accident.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "My understanding of women only goes as far as the pleasure. When it comes to the pain, I'm like any other bloke - I don't want to know."
  • Julian - Dreamweaver
    Julian - Dreamweaver Posts: 216 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    If there's an option for it, they exist.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Deaths_Devil - Raging Tide
    Deaths_Devil - Raging Tide Posts: 70 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »
    They took the wrong quest by accident.

    don't post things like that plz
  • Boogiepanda - Raging Tide
    Boogiepanda - Raging Tide Posts: 4,682 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    What?
  • Rawrgh - Raging Tide
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide Posts: 6,790 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Deaths_Devil - Raging Tide wrote: »
    don't post things like that plz
    Why shouldn't I? It's the truth.


    Demon BM is just way better.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "My understanding of women only goes as far as the pleasure. When it comes to the pain, I'm like any other bloke - I don't want to know."
  • Bladed_Tony - Raging Tide
    Bladed_Tony - Raging Tide Posts: 956 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Sage.. non aps bm at your service
    what do ya need?
    Attacking at the speed of Suck since 2009
  • Julian - Dreamweaver
    Julian - Dreamweaver Posts: 216 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Why shouldn't I? It's the truth.


    Demon BM is just way better.
    It don't matter what's better. Especially if one isn't competitive.

    I lol'd at your first post though. b:laugh
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Revenge - Raging Tide
    Revenge - Raging Tide Posts: 834 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Why shouldn't I? It's the truth.


    Demon BM is just way better.

    true story, demon is better even when non competitive, in most regards. Sage has its upsides but, very very VERY few...
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    Spell_Caster: "+1 Revenge or should I say...Nuff_Said?

    I troll worse than a blonde... and for your information, blondes are pro trolls."
  • Bladed_Tony - Raging Tide
    Bladed_Tony - Raging Tide Posts: 956 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Revenge - Raging Tide wrote: »
    true story, demon is better even when non competitive, in most regards. Sage has its upsides but, very very VERY few...

    like higher magic defense.. im not a total 1 shot to those OP r9 Psys and wizzies
    b:dirty
    Attacking at the speed of Suck since 2009
  • lizrau
    lizrau Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    What's a "Sage" BM?.... I've never heard of this thing, is this a new Race???
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]


    Sig credits to Myra :D
  • Revenge - Raging Tide
    Revenge - Raging Tide Posts: 834 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Bladed_Tony - Raging Tide wrote: »
    like higher magic defense.. im not a total 1 shot to those OP r9 Psys and wizzies
    b:dirty

    yea but at great cost to your pdef, i still prefer demon marrows tbh, i meant sage bell is better in extended periods unless the demon wishes to constantly spam it every 15 seconds lol
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    Spell_Caster: "+1 Revenge or should I say...Nuff_Said?

    I troll worse than a blonde... and for your information, blondes are pro trolls."
  • MorningGlory - Raging Tide
    MorningGlory - Raging Tide Posts: 66 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Sage bms exist i promise b:pleased
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Born on DreamWeaver. Raised on Raging Tides.
    Vacation on Archosaur. Hiding in Momaganon.
  • ToyTank - Raging Tide
    ToyTank - Raging Tide Posts: 397 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    4aps sage bm will be good i think.
    Make it idiot proof and someone will make a better idiot.
  • Bladed_Tony - Raging Tide
    Bladed_Tony - Raging Tide Posts: 956 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    ToyTank - Raging Tide wrote: »
    4aps sage bm will be good i think.

    I think Grease is 4 aps
    and i think Aasimar was too if he still plays
    Attacking at the speed of Suck since 2009
  • Rawrgh - Raging Tide
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide Posts: 6,790 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Bladed_Tony - Raging Tide wrote: »
    like higher magic defense.. im not a total 1 shot to those OP r9 Psys and wizzies
    b:dirty
    But you're a one shot to that R9 archer.



    Sage doesn't really have any benefits other than bell. Marrows are good on paper but when's that last time in PvP you ever only took one type of damage? Maybe in a 1v1 but even then only against a couple classes. You use sage pdef marrow against a BM or sin and they'll use condensed thorn or w/e their watter attack buff is, or DBB and **** you. Fist mastery is good but you can't get 5.0 with a G15 weapon so that really hurts you.


    And then you have the awesomeness that is an extra 1.5 seconds of stun from demon's drake bash, 100% on demon roar, extra 3 seconds of demon HF, chance to get 100% crit buff from demon glacial, extra fire damage from DBB, etc.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "My understanding of women only goes as far as the pleasure. When it comes to the pain, I'm like any other bloke - I don't want to know."
  • Blaydewind - Raging Tide
    Blaydewind - Raging Tide Posts: 116 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Deaths_Devil - Raging Tide wrote: »
    are there any sage bm's out there and why did u guys choose sage?

    My bm was my first character and I chose sage, mainly wanting the sage weapon masteries, quicker use of roar of the pride, and sage bell's defense in an extended period. This choice was based on the fact that I only do PvE. Back then, I was also unaware of how relevant APS was for farming instances like nirvana and how sage/demon skills interacted with endgame activities. Aside from APS, demon HF and GS are some of the best squad damage support a BM can do by endgame, and sage's only real team contributing skill is bell.

    With enough knowledge of the game now, I slightly regret not picking demon, but I just deal with it, picking up the best sage skills when I get the opportunity. I'm mostly a solo player, anyways, so some of the sage skills help with solo play (highland cleave crit buff, weapon mastery, quicker use of roar of the pride, 180% phys marrow, sage spark, etc). I have 4 APS with relentless courage (still need nirvana pants for 5 APS) to slightly make up for my lack of demon spark. My main activities are nirvana, delta, bh100, TT, and sometimes FC (when I need spirit or to help/teach a group). Sage suffices, but doesn't have much of a "wow" factor like demon.

    Even though most of the people telling you to go demon don't seem serious, they are actually being helpful, so I would take their advice. Consider how much more demon helps with PvE team play and PvP. (See the post above mine for reference)


    P.S.: Our server is nicknamed "Trolling Tides" for a reason. "Serious" responses in this forum may vary. b:chuckle
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Spell_Caster - Raging Tide
    Spell_Caster - Raging Tide Posts: 2,216 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    No sage bm
    If someone hates you for no reason, then give that **** a reason!b:chuckle
  • Dylena - Raging Tide
    Dylena - Raging Tide Posts: 1,416 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »
    But you're a one shot to that R9 archer.



    Sage doesn't really have any benefits other than bell. Marrows are good on paper but when's that last time in PvP you ever only took one type of damage? Maybe in a 1v1 but even then only against a couple classes. You use sage pdef marrow against a BM or sin and they'll use condensed thorn or w/e their watter attack buff is, or DBB and **** you. Fist mastery is good but you can't get 5.0 with a G15 weapon so that really hurts you.


    And then you have the awesomeness that is an extra 1.5 seconds of stun from demon's drake bash, 100% on demon roar, extra 3 seconds of demon HF, chance to get 100% crit buff from demon glacial, extra fire damage from DBB, etc.

    Are you serious? Theres more then APS to this game..LOL.

    IF you can afford a sage BM and want to be a end game character, Sage is what all BMs should aim for. The reason for that is BM is a support class not a heavy DD thats supposed to solo all it can see. Link to check skill difference.

    You can easily see the difference between a sage and a demon BM in group PVP or TW, the sage will survive by far longer then a demon could ever do.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Drigan - Raging Tide
    Drigan - Raging Tide Posts: 154 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Frankly, survivability wise the main things that differs from sage and demon is bell and marrow..

    Sage mag marrow would be recommended more to refine endgame might rings to help balance out the poor pdef after marrow. Im not sure a sage Bm would disagree on this, nothing to lose, all to gain there in terms of pdef.

    Bell buffwise... on paper 15% more pdef. Its not alot when i found its 700pdef more for me personally. Depending how ur pdef was with demon.. say... 15k.. sage would give 15.7k. 15k and 15.7k= same % dmg reduction. If say u had 15.3k and bell gives u 700 pdef and gets u 16k then yes u get 1% more.
    I guess u can decide to start splitting hairs if u want and say wat IF someone pdef debuff ur 15kpdef, 50% of ur pdef drops to 7.5k vs 7.85k of sage. And indeed yes 7.85k pdef prolly gives like.. 6% dmg reduction more than 7.5k. Sage buff will win in that scenario.

    Simply saying for an endgame HA, ur pdef is so far past the point of diminishing return, the most u get from 15% pdef is between 0-1% more dmg reduction. Surivivabilty increases exponentially for LA and AA still, since a hypothetical gain of 800 pdef still may = 5-6%.

    Suvivability factors besides, buffs, gear, player skill is.. Chi management.. Demon Bms will struggle to manage chi, this ends up going back to playing style as opposed to which is better. If you cant manage your chi well sage may very well survive better. Since everything a demon Bm can do to get chi, a sage BM can do better. Ofc this is if u dont count the extra 1.5 sec u can aps with drake bash or -1sec cd on roar - and again yes this is splitting hairs. But those 2 stuns may be wat a demon Bm needs to use to compensate vs sage BM skills.

    Also lately its pdef/mdef + def level. ><

    I have nothing against sage Bms. I do believe its can be a harder path if you talk in terms of APS tank for all ur gear. But in summary,
    1) Sage bell, close to void for urself in some cases, it benefits AAs and LAs far more.
    2) Extreme sage marrows = more attention needed to refine ornaments to balance stats and it does not make it a fail marrow.
    3) Poor chi management 'may' = demon < sage. All relates to playing style here.
    4) Neither is better even if you can afford the world, its how the player focuses on using the strengths of the character to compensate for the weaknesses.

    b:bye
  • Rawrgh - Raging Tide
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide Posts: 6,790 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Dylena - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Are you serious? Theres more then APS to this game..LOL.

    IF you can afford a sage BM and want to be a end game character, Sage is what all BMs should aim for. The reason for that is BM is a support class not a heavy DD thats supposed to solo all it can see. Link to check skill difference.

    You can easily see the difference between a sage and a demon BM in group PVP or TW, the sage will survive by far longer then a demon could ever do.
    Quick question, no troll or anything.


    Can you read?

    Cause I BARELY even mentioned aps in my post and that's the one thing you point out, so I assume that aps is the only word short enough for you to comprehend.



    Sage marrows will get you killed. You will never only be taking one form of damage in serious PvP.

    Even in a 1v1 most classes have ways of dealing both physical and magical damage. And if you play a BM as a support class then you're going to be in group pvp which means there's no way in hell you're only taking one form of damage. You use sage magic marrow and that R9 archer is gonna use demon QS and attack you twice and you're dead. You use sage physical marrow and you get one shot by any random aoe from a mage.


    100% stun on demon roar and a lower cooldown compared to 10 chi which is negligible.

    Extra 1.5 second stun on drake bash makes a huge difference and leads to incredibly long stun locks.

    Sage has the slightly better fissure and highland cleave, but sage HF doesn't even compare to demon HF.

    Demon glacial spike gives insane crit bonus and can be CCed. As a support in large scale PvP you will never be using glacial spike so it's really only useful in 1v1 scenarios where you will be CCing it.

    Demon sutra gives a good crit bonus compared to sage giving a negligible amount of healing.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "My understanding of women only goes as far as the pleasure. When it comes to the pain, I'm like any other bloke - I don't want to know."
  • Bladed_Tony - Raging Tide
    Bladed_Tony - Raging Tide Posts: 956 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »
    But you're a one shot to that R9 archer.

    um.. almost any low refined geared person is.. but only a few r9 archers on server..
    and like 2-3 of them actually pk..
    i can beat most of those r8 +5/7 Archer with ease.. even after that rank sale..
    and heres the fun part about it.. i dont have to marrow..

    now heres the fun thing.. when ur fighting a 2-3 aps sin and a archer w/HS.. they tend to spark a lot but somehow a fail sage bm (i.e. me). tanks the archer and kills them both...
    not having to use a marrow..

    ur argument of marrows against archers is good.. but how many archers on server actually know how to play their class?
    Attacking at the speed of Suck since 2009
  • tame14
    tame14 Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Lol at Sage Blademasters.
  • Rawrgh - Raging Tide
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide Posts: 6,790 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Bladed_Tony - Raging Tide wrote: »
    um.. almost any low refined geared person is.. but only a few r9 archers on server..
    and like 2-3 of them actually pk..
    i can beat most of those r8 +5/7 Archer with ease.. even after that rank sale..
    and heres the fun part about it.. i dont have to marrow..

    now heres the fun thing.. when ur fighting a 2-3 aps sin and a archer w/HS.. they tend to spark a lot but somehow a fail sage bm (i.e. me). tanks the archer and kills them both...
    not having to use a marrow..

    ur argument of marrows against archers is good.. but how many archers on server actually know how to play their class?
    True most cant play their class.


    Still imagine you're in TW.


    You use sage mdef marrow and you're like, **** yea those mages and psys cant touch me.


    And then some barb with full +10 R9 uses armageddon

    Or some Archer with a +10 R8 uses demon QS and attacks you 3 times

    Or that sin looks at you

    Or that mage uses blade tempest
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "My understanding of women only goes as far as the pleasure. When it comes to the pain, I'm like any other bloke - I don't want to know."
  • Lavoslav - Raging Tide
    Lavoslav - Raging Tide Posts: 43 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »
    True most cant play their class.


    Still imagine you're in TW.


    You use sage mdef marrow and you're like, **** yea those mages and psys cant touch me.


    And then some barb with full +10 R9 uses armageddon

    Or some Archer with a +10 R8 uses demon QS and attacks you 3 times

    Or that sin looks at you

    Or that mage uses blade tempest

    I just love you man, lets have a quickie.
  • _blood_rain - Sanctuary
    _blood_rain - Sanctuary Posts: 2,532 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    May I recommend looking for a sage BM on your server, maybe an experienced TW BM or any oldschool sage BM and ask him/her why they went sage.

    That happens to be one question that is meaningless to be asked on these forums because everyone will say just about the same thing, which is that sage sucks and demon is better and a bunch of other egocentrical stuff.
  • ObviousAlt - Raging Tide
    ObviousAlt - Raging Tide Posts: 655 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    OMG rawrgh.. so funny
    Archers hardly atk me in tw..
    but i have been hit by those OP Barbs..
    no sins though
    and Wizies just sutra and try to gush me to death..
    even spell hehe (he did mountain seize me once for 8.9k.. ofc i survived)
    _blood_rain - Sanctuary wrote: »
    May I recommend looking for a sage BM on your server, maybe an experienced TW BM or any oldschool sage BM and ask him/her why they went sage.

    That happens to be one question that is meaningless to be asked on these forums because everyone will say just about the same thing, which is that sage sucks and demon is better and a bunch of other egocentrical stuff.

    i am the sage bm.. i was told by many that i was one of the 3 best TW BMs..
    (i being the only sage one)

    pre-rep sale

    edit: whoops forgot i switched avatars lol
    Bladed_Tony btw hehe
    102 Celestial Demon Archer (2nd Rebirth 102)
    101 Celestial Sage Blademaster (Rebirth 100)
    101 Demon Sin (Rebirth 100)
    101 Sage Seeker (Rebirth 100)
    101 Sage Wiz (Rebirth 100)
    101 Sage Cleric (Rebirth 100)
    101 Sage Barb (Rebirth 100)
    101 Demon Duskblade (2nd Rebirth 101)
  • Lavoslav - Raging Tide
    Lavoslav - Raging Tide Posts: 43 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    ObviousAlt - Raging Tide wrote: »
    i am the sage bm.. i was told by many that i was one of the 3 best TW BMs..

    Yap, you are great BM, but that doesn't have anything with sage/demon cultivation.

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