Please me gentle....(demon vs sage) my thoughts, want advice

altweina
altweina Posts: 0 Arc User
edited May 2011 in Assassin
So I have an archer and I went sage thinking past the pretty red super attack demon spark.....problem is I can't get any of those cool sage archer skills cause they are really expensive or random attempts turn into crappy skills no one wants to buy...

Now I have a sin and I read....Only nobs go demon. I have read the skills and I like some of the sage and some of the demon. If my choice was just skills I would say sage cause bp healing 5 instead of 2% and a overall damage increase of devotion seems like it would be good for tanking.

All that being said, the demon spark increases attack rate.....so you can spark more often....equaling more damage thus more healing. Also I have found out that demon spark is negated by red bubble...not a big deal really.....but sage is negated by blue bubble...i think that is a bit more of an issue when grinding or group PvE.

So I have looked over skills but I would like some feedback pls....I have heard that sage is good but gonna cost alot of money. Sage might be better for PvP and demon better for PvE?
Post edited by altweina on

Comments

  • Olbaze - Sanctuary
    Olbaze - Sanctuary Posts: 4,242 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    altweina wrote: »
    Now I have a sin and I read....Only nobs go demon. I have read the skills and I like some of the sage and some of the demon. If my choice was just skills I would say sage cause bp healing 5 instead of 2% and a overall damage increase of devotion seems like it would be good for tanking.

    Sage Bloodpaint is 3%, not 5%. Also, Demon Dagger Devotion gets 75% and 2% crit, whereas Sage gets 90%. It's not actually that large of an increase, in the range of a few hundred points more.
    All that being said, the demon spark increases attack rate.....so you can spark more often....equaling more damage thus more healing. Also I have found out that demon spark is negated by red bubble...not a big deal really.....but sage is negated by blue bubble...i think that is a bit more of an issue when grinding or group PvE.

    That's actually not how it goes. RB overwrites all sparks, but BB only overwrites the damage reduction part of Sage spark. Which really isn't bad considering that BB is 50% and Sage spark is 25%.

    As for sparking more: At 2.22 aps with maxed chi skill and Sage Rising Dragon Strike, I can permaspark by rotating my chi skills in the right order.

    There are two things where Demons are clearly better: Farming and PvP. Farming because you get higher APS cheaper and therefore have easier access to good nirvana squads. Of course, if you already know the people who do those runs, the effect is null. As for PvP, most of the Demon debuffs are such that they guarantee the debuff instead of being a certain percentage, which makes them more useful in PvP.

    Basically, Demon sins have more damage whereas Sages have more durability.
    I am Olba. Not Ol, not Baze nor Blaze. And even less would I go by Olblaze. Please, take a second to read a person's username.
    If you see b:cute be sure to take a second, calm look at anything I said.
  • Empu - Sanctuary
    Empu - Sanctuary Posts: 1,154 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    altweina wrote: »
    Now I have a sin and I read....Only nobs go demon. I have read the skills and I like some of the sage and some of the demon.

    To be clear, anyone telling you something like "only nobs go demon" or "must be an idiot to go sage" should be ignored. Like you state yourself, both have good sides. Unfortunately, game is full of ppl who like 1 culti better, then make it godlike while trashing the other.
    altweina wrote: »
    All that being said, the demon spark increases attack rate.....so you can spark more often....equaling more damage thus more healing.

    Actually, on a sin that is not really the importance of aps imo. Like Olbaze said, a sin can easily keep permanent spark. Also, sage has sage bloodpaint healing 50% more. Both sparked with similar gear, just regarding the amount healed over time, sage should have an advantage. This advantage in healing depends on the initial aps though, so for simplicity I always tend to consider both culties healing ability +/- equal when sparked.

    However, sage has a clear advantage not sparked and with being able to buff others. Along with tidal protection and focussed mind, and the ability to continuously reduce damage by 25% with sage spark, sage gives a great survivability for soloing bosses and tanking stuff. This is the main thought behind going sage for me (I'm a sage sin). There are some other reasons ofc, like sage chill + subsea + rift being great for aoe, sage wolfemblem being really practical, a purge on shadow escape, and more you probably saw yourself when comparing skills.

    Demon on the other hand, even though naturally being more squishy, has an advantage as DD in squad. With buffs from others and a cleric healing (or bb), the demon spark becomes more in advantage. With eveyone judging on aps, getting squads will be a bit easier too. Demon also has good skills. Demon rib strike is something I'd really like to have. The longer stuns sure are usefull for pvp. Demon subsea on bosses is really smexy too. Well, my opinion may be a bit biaised to sage cause I choose that myself, but I can perfectly see the reasons for others to go demon.

    Besides culti, you should keep in mind the gear and sharding question too. An example : Is a demon sin with defence lvl shards and vit stones really squishier then a sage sin with att lvl shards? Gear also makes that the skill book question is really insignificant. Reaching 5 aps on demon costs a damn lot, the cost of a skill book even like bp is a joke compared to that. I believe that the size of someones wallet should have no influence on the choise of sage or demon. A good demon sin will want skills too, just like a good sage sin will love some -int.

    As a conclusion : It's really up to you to decide which you like better, so seems I didn't help much with this post b:chuckle
  • Tynne - Lost City
    Tynne - Lost City Posts: 34 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    Empu - Sanctuary wrote: »
    To be clear, anyone telling you something like "only nobs go demon" or "must be an idiot to go sage" should be ignored. Like you state yourself, both have good sides. Unfortunately, game is full of ppl who like 1 culti better, then make it godlike while trashing the other.



    Actually, on a sin that is not really the importance of aps imo. Like Olbaze said, a sin can easily keep permanent spark. Also, sage has sage bloodpaint healing 50% more. Both sparked with similar gear, just regarding the amount healed over time, sage should have an advantage. This advantage in healing depends on the initial aps though, so for simplicity I always tend to consider both culties healing ability +/- equal when sparked.

    However, sage has a clear advantage not sparked and with being able to buff others. Along with tidal protection and focussed mind, and the ability to continuously reduce damage by 25% with sage spark, sage gives a great survivability for soloing bosses and tanking stuff. This is the main thought behind going sage for me (I'm a sage sin). There are some other reasons ofc, like sage chill + subsea + rift being great for aoe, sage wolfemblem being really practical, a purge on shadow escape, and more you probably saw yourself when comparing skills.

    Demon on the other hand, even though naturally being more squishy, has an advantage as DD in squad. With buffs from others and a cleric healing (or bb), the demon spark becomes more in advantage. With eveyone judging on aps, getting squads will be a bit easier too. Demon also has good skills. Demon rib strike is something I'd really like to have. The longer stuns sure are usefull for pvp. Demon subsea on bosses is really smexy too. Well, my opinion may be a bit biaised to sage cause I choose that myself, but I can perfectly see the reasons for others to go demon.

    Besides culti, you should keep in mind the gear and sharding question too. An example : Is a demon sin with defence lvl shards and vit stones really squishier then a sage sin with att lvl shards? Gear also makes that the skill book question is really insignificant. Reaching 5 aps on demon costs a damn lot, the cost of a skill book even like bp is a joke compared to that. I believe that the size of someones wallet should have no influence on the choise of sage or demon. A good demon sin will want skills too, just like a good sage sin will love some -int.

    As a conclusion : It's really up to you to decide which you like better, so seems I didn't help much with this post b:chuckle

    QFT!b:victory

    Personally, i prefer sage rib than demon ;3
  • bangtidy
    bangtidy Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    hi i must agree with all the quotes above, my main is a sage sin and tbh i was tempted to go demon by so many pplsaying if u go sage ure a * ***** ....but i like the look of the skill path ect of sage so i went with my heart n personally i cant say i regret a thing u can still get aps ect but not 5.0 but thats not a biggy ...also i get pesterd for sage bp by alot of demon sins so they can solo fcc ect all i can say is they both have there pros n cons n it just depends wat gameplay ect u want out of the game so just go with ure heart
  • altweina
    altweina Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    "There are two things where Demons are clearly better: Farming and PvP" Oblaze....

    This is new, I had heard that demon was better for farming but that sage was better PvP? Thank you all for your feedback, I agree it seems there are benefits to both paths...

    My ideal toon would be one that is always busy.....I hate logging in and waiting and waiting to try and find something in WC. A friend of mine, granted its a L101 or 102 5APS barb just solos TT for money when he is bored. I started a sin because I heard they were really good at soloing once they got higher. I enjoy playing with squads but I want to be able to just play and feel like I accomplished something when I have the free time. I figured that maybe telling you this might help you advise me. I have seen both sage and demon sins mostly solo FC. I think the demons did it easier but they have been really well equipped toons.

    Thank you again to all who commented on my post:)
  • Empu - Sanctuary
    Empu - Sanctuary Posts: 1,154 Arc User
    edited May 2011
    altweina wrote: »
    "There are two things where Demons are clearly better: Farming and PvP" Oblaze....

    This is new, I had heard that demon was better for farming but that sage was better PvP? Thank you all for your feedback, I agree it seems there are benefits to both paths...

    My ideal toon would be one that is always busy.....I hate logging in and waiting and waiting to try and find something in WC. A friend of mine, granted its a L101 or 102 5APS barb just solos TT for money when he is bored. I started a sin because I heard they were really good at soloing once they got higher. I enjoy playing with squads but I want to be able to just play and feel like I accomplished something when I have the free time. I figured that maybe telling you this might help you advise me. I have seen both sage and demon sins mostly solo FC. I think the demons did it easier but they have been really well equipped toons.

    Thank you again to all who commented on my post:)

    Personally, I'm not convinced there is a culti better for farming, or a culti better for pvp. It's just my view but, demon can probably solo-kill a boss a bit faster, but sage can probably solo-kill a given boss a bit earlier. For pvp, demon has an obvious advantage with it's stunns. Sage has an advantage for those who kill on spike damage with higher att lvl from chill. Most demons I see seem to sleep > spark > stun > kill (just a general view). A sage sin with chill seems to kill on high hits on their skills, also keeping a stunlock if possible ofc. I doubt 1 methode to kill others is really more efficient then the other.

    From what you're looking for, both culties will allow you to do what you look for. However, what matters most is your gear and not really your culti. What makes ppl get pm'ed all the time to join squads is their gear. r9 should come with a fl expension b:chuckle What allows you to solo bosses, is also your gear. Demon might have a slightly easier start for joining squads thanks to the demon sparks. You can give a higher aps when ppl ask, so get accepted easier. But in the end, once ppl added you to fl and all, that isn't all that important anymore. Sage will allow you to start soloing bosses easier at the start. A boss like fragrance in fcc for example, is easier to solo for sage then for demon when gear isn't at the top yet.

    So the ultimate solution to not getting bored is +12 rank9 weap and all +10 armor/ornaments b:laugh Then nobody even cares if you're sage or demon, and you can solo all you want.

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