Class vs Weps

Daedallus - Sanctuary wrote: »

As to barb weapons I love my dual axes, but since we have bikes now, can I pleas have a shotgun? b:laugh

Sir_Puma - Raging Tide wrote: »

This thread has been multiple times, I agree.

This time will try to take a different approach

I do not want this to turn into a OP or APS thread keep it construtive please

Here's a breakdown of classes and what weps I "think" they should use.


Sins :

Daggers and bows. Bows because they have the dex for it and some monsters have either strong AoE's or some kind of debuff that can mess them up

Works for me. My bow on my Sin did 2500 damage per hit at level 53 (when I could first equip it) vs 1100 damage per hit on my daggers. Melee mobs were 1/2 dead by the time they got to me.

Mystics :

Magic swords. They are very magic relevant. I don't see them anything but that. They need the mp.

And what about the other magic weapons? >_> Excluding Balls, there is a variety of other weapons that have pros and cons depending on MAttack, +magic adds, and -channeling, just to mention a few.

Seekers :

Swords. They were made to use that, can only use that. Fine.

Would be nice if they could use bows I suppose, like EVERY OTHER CLASS (but Mystic). QQ.

Wizards :

See Mystics.

Psychics :

They have their own soulspheres. Perfect.

Blademasters :

Should be called "Wepmasters". So mostly all of them. Although i've yet to see a Bm use a magic wep.

Arcane build BM can faceroll in 1v1 PK, apparently, on a magic build caster. This is a 'for teh lulz' thing, and not something you would, say, take into TW. b:shocked Also, a bow is somewhat nice to have on a BM, especially if you have fists. It's not gonna do lots of DPS like a Sin, but you can use it to pull mobs or such.

Clerics :

See Mystics

A lazy one you are... >_>


Now for the more technical ones..


Barbs :

Should be able to use mainly axes/poleaxes/hammers. They have "normally" the str for those kinds. Those who put more dex on them could use low level bows. But personnaly "claw barbs" makes me shrug.

Using a bow in FCC on heads is good. Better than standing there doing almost nothing. However, axes can be more effective in FCC at the heads, since they can AOE and get like 3+ at once... As for claws, they are completely pointless unless you have dumped a BUNCH of money into getting to 4.0 or 5.0.

Archers :

Primary weps. Bows/Crossbows/Slingshot. They are "supposed" to be distance attackers. They do have the dex for claws and daggers, but daggers are class specific. So not too sure..They just really need to be up close to a very few mobs in game. I "think" they should stay long ranged.

They might have the DEX for fists/claws, but they don't naturally have the STR. Putting in enough STR for fists is great, but a HA BM with NO Mastery in Fists is gonna out DD an Archer, 5.0 vs 5.0, simply because the BM has a ton more STR, and STR is what's used for the damage calculation on fists, not DEX. "Oh, but you idiot, blazing arrow, blah blah blah, QQ, blah blah!" Then you're forgetting BM DOES get Fist mastery, on top of that STR, so Blazing Arrow really doesn't make up for the lack of STR.

And the choices for endgame slingshots is kinda thin... After Wind and Clouds, there's not really a lot to choose from. =\ You can get Nirvana, but the rest of the Slings don't have -int, which makes them somewhat pointless.

Veno :

See Mystic. But..Some do want to try heavy or light venos and mostly use fox form. Although , same as barb, seeing a veno with dual-axes makes me shrug..

Hum de dum. Your typical LA Veno is going to use a magic weapon. Your typical HA veno is gonna use... A magic weapon. There's NO mastery for melee weapons. Just a fox form melee mastery, which... You are required to use a magic weapon to get INTO fox form (or glitch). Glitching with really high DPS axes would probably give one of the highest DHP outputs in the game, but the APS is so low, it's pointless. DPM with fists/5.0 would be vastly higher. Fox form is about skills, can't use them when glitched (hell, you cannot switch out of fox form if you glitch). Alternate weapons on Veno is... Pointless, other than maybe Bows on a LA or HA build for heads in FCC.


Observations :

People love customizations, I admit. but let's try to get a intelligent conversation going..


- Should mage classes be allowed anything else then magic weps ? I don't think so. I see venos raging here and maybe some *chuckles* dex clercs..

Venos are more or less useless. What are we going to do in instances? Amp and purge? Doesn't seem like anyone even wants us for that anymore.

- Should archers be able to use anything else then long range ? I don't think so. I see some raging here about gaining chi back..

I'm a sage archer. Even with Cloud Eruption and the Chi skill, I cannot perma spark. Archer was supposed to be the 'high dps' DD. 5.0 changed that, you CANNOT keep up with an unrefined, crappy gear 5.0, even if you have refined R9.

- Should melee classes be able to use any other weps known to man. ? I don't think so either. I do not say a claw barb is not good, it just sounds weird. As weird as a veno (if they go pure fox form way) with axes..

I like using Bow on my BM. And take claws/fists away from Barbs, and give them better aggro on their tank skills. Fix them, and get it over with.


I forsee people saying : "Well we want to be efficent, whatever happens" (Archers having to get close for very few mobs, barbs using bows on very few mobs). But let's just say.. This is a online game. We are suppose to make teams. As in any other "normal" Rpg's, the general rule is simple :

Melee classes : Gets close and personnal
Wizards/Psys : Cast
Achers : Pew Pew from afar
Healers heal (and DD if needed)
Venos/Mystics : Should let pet tank and heal/assist them

Is this balance just too hard to achieve back ? b:surrender

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

Blademasters shouldn't really be able to use fists since that's not even a bladed weapon. If they were supposed to use fists they'd be called fistmasters.

Solandri - Heavens Tear wrote: »

The magic weapons all have the same average magical damage, and vary only in damage range. In terms of physical damage (mostly of interest to venos), their averages are very different.

Magic attack:
All have the same average damage.
wand: 100% +/- 1%
m.sword: 100% +/- 10%
glaive: 100% +/- 20%
pataka: 100% +/- 30%

Physical attack:
Average damage varies, comparisons use m.sword average damage as 100%.
m.sword: 100% +/- 20%
glaive: average damage: 94.5% +/- 15%
pataka: average damage: 83.4% +/- 10% (adjusted for slower attack rate)
wand: 77.8% +/- 10%

Patakas get worse the more interval gear you have compared to the other weapons, so add a little interval gear and the pataka is worse than an equivalent wand. Which is why I never could figure why they decided wizards should get a magic sword for R8, while venos (arguably the only caster class which will melee) would get a pataka for R8.

Sarrafeline - Sanctuary wrote: »

Uhhhhhh... There is this skill called 'knockback arrow'. Use it on mobs taht 'get too close'.

I use claws on Dreadindra. I build up max sparks/chi on him, then when a bishop spawns, triple spark and kill it. If I get immobilized, I use my crossbow and shoot it while sparked until its either dead or runs up to me so i can punch it. But that's an instance where you have to be too close to use a ranged weapon on archer...

And I've got unrefined, unsharded claws that are just temporary. >_> I use crossbow 99% of the time otherwise.

Sir_Puma - Raging Tide wrote: »

Archers :

Primary weps. Bows/Crossbows/Slingshot. They are "supposed" to be distance attackers. They do have the dex for claws and daggers, but daggers are class specific. So not too sure..They just really need to be up close to a very few mobs in game. I "think" they should stay long ranged.

DaKillanator - Raging Tide wrote: »

Nobody cares what you "think" our class locked weps should be. If I want to make a clawzard, I'ma make a clawzard damnit