Got a herc?
Comments
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First of all, I'd like to point out that veno is a 'solo class' because we solo everything meant to be soloed the best. We're versatile, with our high phys def fox form, and choice in pets. But in a squad, I think the veno was always meant to play the support class - debuff, transfer spark, bramble, and some dd. Not that the herc isn't a great option to have... I mean it's great to have the freedom to tank even more things than we already can... but it is an option. This option does not turn the entire class into a tanking class.
And in my opinion, any tank that is afraid enough of repair bills not to tank... is not a tank.
At any rate, I have friends and a good faction to help me get my TT mats. If I can't solo a squad TT boss without paying ~$100... I won't.0 -
Shoshanne - Dreamweaver wrote: »First of all, I'd like to point out that veno is a 'solo class' because we solo everything meant to be soloed the best.
Maybe at lower levels with basic equips, but not at higher levels. Assassins have us beat there by a long shot.We're versatile, with our high phys def fox form, and choice in pets.
Wiz, BM, and other classes don't need to use another form / set of skills for extra pdef.But in a squad, I think the veno was always meant to play the support class - debuff, transfer spark, bramble, and some dd.
All classes do support.Not that the herc isn't a great option to have... I mean it's great to have the freedom to tank even more things than we already can... but it is an option. This option does not turn the entire class into a tanking class.
It's not like the option of going 5aps for BM: A Herc makes a bigger difference than that. BMs gimp their atk / AoE with 5aps while a veno only benefits from getting a Herc.At any rate, I have friends and a good faction to help me get my TT mats. If I can't solo a squad TT boss without paying ~$100... I won't.
Good thing Hercs can easily be obtained just by playing.Be kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.0 -
Ohh hello theres
In case there are people here that don't known about Tweakz let it be known that in every Veno Thread that contain the word"Herc",like in this one,he pop up stating how ultra-mega-super-awesome-wtfyoudoingwithoutanherc is the herc,even if the point(As been state by the op),of the thread was totally different,he keep ignoring the fact and keep bla bla bla.
I've quitted even if I still play my Veno,now I have a couple of lv.100s and I tell you,wasting all that money nowdays for an Herc is stupid --- levelling to 100 is quite fast with Hypers(90-100 in a month or less),and stating that its worth spending 100M just for doing FCCs for a couple of months its plain stupidity.I've been doing FCCs with my Veno just by building squads myself,and no one leaved because I didn't have an herc.
At 100+ Herc is mostly useless,not only he can't tank most of the things,but he can't keep agro NO matter what,any decent lv.100+ can steal agro from him.
Nirvana = Useless(Get a cheap DD pet instead since he's gonna die from most bosses and you don't have to feed it with Meat to restore his loyality)
BH100 Seat/Abandon:Other than soling mobs(Which any decent lv.100 any class can),don't even dream to hold agro from anything there.
BH Delta:Wut?,holding boss is cleric's job anyway.
BH Metal=Boss there **** and even good barbs
BH 3-3:Lol sure go ahead and tank that thing with your herc.
Soling TT:
No more possible since 3-x nerf and 2-x? Wurlord its NOT tankable by an Herc and its NECESSARY to kill him to get to other bosses.
TT solo mode? you can do it way faster if you spend the same money on a BM/Barb with decent -interval,or you can use a free pet,take about 15 mins for a 2-x run,not that much suffering.
Keep in mind players,Tweakz is an old player who probably got his Herc back then when Venos where considered the most DD class(Especially in TTs),and godly with an Herc,and furthermore when TT wasn't nerfed and they were able to farm millions in one day soling TT 3-x,AND Herc was priced something like 10-20M BACK THEN Herc was a great investment,now its just money *mostly* wasted.
Just get a Nix if you like PvP/PvE grinding in past maps.
Save your money for improve your equipment instead.
But off course,if you like soling *cough* mobs in the cool way go ahead,its your money.
And don't mind Tweakz,he just can't get over the fact that now APS classes rule and that is shining herc isn't that cool thing anymore.Iam Segreta,Queen of the Chicken Kingdom,proud owner of the legendary Blue Chicken,BEHOLD Mortals o,o^
Current # Chickens:
^,^ <- My Cleric
o,o <- My Veno
n_n <- My Bm
=,= <- My Barb *Used as Mount*
>,o <- My Sin(Stealth all the time for no reason)0 -
Segreta - Sanctuary wrote: »Ohh hello theres
In case there are people here that don't known about Tweakz let it be known that in every Veno Thread that contain the word"Herc",like in this one,he pop up stating how ultra-mega-super-awesome-wtfyoudoingwithoutanherc is the herc,even if the point(As been state by the op),of the thread was totally different,he keep ignoring the fact and keep bla bla bla.
I've quitted even if I still play my Veno,now I have a couple of lv.100s and I tell you,wasting all that money nowdays for an Herc is stupid --- levelling to 100 is quite fast with Hypers(90-100 in a month or less),and stating that its worth spending 100M just for doing FCCs for a couple of months its plain stupidity.I've been doing FCCs with my Veno just by building squads myself,and no one leaved because I didn't have an herc.
At 100+ Herc is mostly useless,not only he can't tank most of the things,but he can't keep agro NO matter what,any decent lv.100+ can steal agro from him. It's not like I was addressing the OP, and it's not like I brought up this poster's pedo fetish.
Nirvana = Useless(Get a cheap DD pet instead since he's gonna die from most bosses and you don't have to feed it with Meat to restore his loyality)
BH100 Seat/Abandon:Other than soling mobs(Which any decent lv.100 any class can),don't even dream to hold agro from anything there.
BH Delta:Wut?,holding boss is cleric's job anyway.
BH Metal=Boss there **** and even good barbs
BH 3-3:Lol sure go ahead and tank that thing with your herc.
Soling TT:
No more possible since 3-x nerf and 2-x? Wurlord its NOT tankable by an Herc and its NECESSARY to kill him to get to other bosses.
TT solo mode? you can do it way faster if you spend the same money on a BM/Barb with decent -interval,or you can use a free pet,take about 15 mins for a 2-x run,not that much suffering.
Keep in mind players,Tweakz is an old player who probably got his Herc back then when Venos where considered the most DD class(Especially in TTs),and godly with an Herc,and furthermore when TT wasn't nerfed and they were able to farm millions in one day soling TT 3-x,AND Herc was priced something like 10-20M BACK THEN Herc was a great investment,now its just money *mostly* wasted.
Just get a Nix if you like PvP/PvE grinding in past maps.
Save your money for improve your equipment instead.
But off course,if you like soling *cough* mobs in the cool way go ahead,its your money.
And don't mind Tweakz,he just can't get over the fact that now APS classes rule and that is shining herc isn't that cool thing anymore.
- A fail and shining example of the quality and care taken of these forums.Be kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.0 -
Segreta - Sanctuary wrote: »Ohh hello theres
In case there are people here that don't known about Tweakz let it be known that in every Veno Thread that contain the word"Herc",like in this one,he pop up stating how ultra-mega-super-awesome-wtfyoudoingwithoutanherc is the herc,even if the point(As been state by the op),of the thread was totally different,he keep ignoring the fact and keep bla bla bla.
I've quitted even if I still play my Veno,now I have a couple of lv.100s and I tell you,wasting all that money nowdays for an Herc is stupid --- levelling to 100 is quite fast with Hypers(90-100 in a month or less),and stating that its worth spending 100M just for doing FCCs for a couple of months its plain stupidity.I've been doing FCCs with my Veno just by building squads myself,and no one leaved because I didn't have an herc.
At 100+ Herc is mostly useless,not only he can't tank most of the things,but he can't keep agro NO matter what,any decent lv.100+ can steal agro from him.
Nirvana = Useless(Get a cheap DD pet instead since he's gonna die from most bosses and you don't have to feed it with Meat to restore his loyality)
BH100 Seat/Abandon:Other than soling mobs(Which any decent lv.100 any class can),don't even dream to hold agro from anything there.
BH Delta:Wut?,holding boss is cleric's job anyway.
BH Metal=Boss there **** and even good barbs
BH 3-3:Lol sure go ahead and tank that thing with your herc.
Soling TT:
No more possible since 3-x nerf and 2-x? Wurlord its NOT tankable by an Herc and its NECESSARY to kill him to get to other bosses.
TT solo mode? you can do it way faster if you spend the same money on a BM/Barb with decent -interval,or you can use a free pet,take about 15 mins for a 2-x run,not that much suffering.
Keep in mind players,Tweakz is an old player who probably got his Herc back then when Venos where considered the most DD class(Especially in TTs),and godly with an Herc,and furthermore when TT wasn't nerfed and they were able to farm millions in one day soling TT 3-x,AND Herc was priced something like 10-20M BACK THEN Herc was a great investment,now its just money *mostly* wasted.
Just get a Nix if you like PvP/PvE grinding in past maps.
Save your money for improve your equipment instead.
But off course,if you like soling *cough* mobs in the cool way go ahead,its your money.
And don't mind Tweakz,he just can't get over the fact that now APS classes rule and that is shining herc isn't that cool thing anymore.
umm can't u just run past Wurlord to kill rest of bosses?0 -
So can someone tell me when it was such a huge deal that venos have more options and a different form? All that TRYING to be said here without people that feel they have to make everyone see it their way budding in is that; venos are getting po'ed cause squads dont accept them sometimes when they dont have a herc, if your squad does good for you stop giving the people who have to deal with morons like that a hard time.0
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I'd like to say of my earlier forum post (that tweakz couldn't resist dissecting) that I was generalizing, in order to make it short...Maybe at lower levels with basic equips, but not at higher levels. Assassins have us beat there by a long shot.
What I mean is that from a very low level, up until as far as I've experienced, the venomancer is the constant, solid solo class. Yes, at higher levels, assassins have us beat, but at lower levels, they are VERY squishy.Wiz, BM, and other classes don't need to use another form / set of skills for extra pdef.
Though it's in the form of another 'form', it's nevertheless a useful +pdef skill. I don't know why it needs to be argued that wizards and blademasters also have pdef buffs, I know they do. I've played both classes in lower levels and they have their obvious weak spots. I was simply elaborating on the fact that venos are versatile. While in human form, they can use a number of spells to inflict direct damage, in fox form they can debuff as assistance to their pet's damage. Do I have to mention that in many cases having a summonable meat shield increases survivability? (And by that, I mean any battle pet in general).All classes do support.
I'm getting the impression tweakz just likes to argue. Yes, all classes do support. But some are more dd focused, or more tank, or more healer. All these classes work together in a squad... or at least, that's the intent of having a squad... to work together to accomplish what you couldn't on your own... *proceeds to go crosseyed*It's not like the option of going 5aps for BM: A Herc makes a bigger difference than that. BMs gimp their atk / AoE with 5aps while a veno only benefits from getting a Herc.
Yes, I think we can all agree that as the herc is a pet, not gear that requires a change of stats... getting a herc doesn't hurt your character. It just hurts on coins or rl money, whichever route is chosen.Good thing Hercs can easily be obtained just by playing.
Wow, I really haven't found that to be the case. And I won't sacrifice my gear to get a herc, I like being able to survive a little aoe so I can debuff bosses in squad.
I am not saying that having a herc is bad. I am just saying it shouldn't be expected of a veno to have a herc. Which is one of the reasons I don't plan to get one.
Do you understand my point of view now tweakz?0 -
- A fail and shining example of the quality and care taken of these forums.
That is ur opinion , other venos who seek advice and come here usually leave with more information and with more ways to have FUN ( which is sth some people have forgotten a lot time ago for the sake of EFICIENCY which ironically , depends on the person ). but no no0 , we have to force our opinions on others , because that's the right care we should give to the forum.
Shoshanne : no he won't understand , cause every veno has to get a herc , havent u understand anything ? b:sad
Getting ready to be trolled with a fail post ...............
kthnxbai b:laugh[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
<--- MALE Veno ..... Moved to G W 2 or maybe not completely , don't know ...... PW addiction
{That TT xbow chain is one that describes someone's bowel movements after having too much spicy food. A loud **** (Thundercrack), then a burning sensation (Flash Fire), followed by an explosion of multi-colored poo-confetti (Blinding Radiance). Excellent...} By Quilue0 -
Phoenix_Eye - Heavens Tear wrote: »That is ur opinion , other venos who seek advice and come here usually leave with more information and with more ways to have FUN ( which is sth some people have forgotten a lot time ago for the sake of EFICIENCY which ironically , depends on the person ). but no no0 , we have to force our opinions on others , because that's the right care we should give to the forum.
Shoshanne : no he won't understand , cause every veno has to get a herc , havent u understand anything ? b:sad
Getting ready to be trolled with a fail post ...............
kthnxbai b:laugh
Oh gawd. Please. For the love of God. Learn2English.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
☆Heavy Armor Venomancer since level 1☆
Previously known as _Surreal_b:avoid
Sig by me.
[=>theempire.ucoz.com<=]0 -
LShattered - Heavens Tear wrote: »Oh gawd. Please. For the love of God. Learn2English.
not my mother language , i have the right to make mistakes. Though instead i would prefer a comment on the things i wrote ......[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
<--- MALE Veno ..... Moved to G W 2 or maybe not completely , don't know ...... PW addiction
{That TT xbow chain is one that describes someone's bowel movements after having too much spicy food. A loud **** (Thundercrack), then a burning sensation (Flash Fire), followed by an explosion of multi-colored poo-confetti (Blinding Radiance). Excellent...} By Quilue0 -
Shoshanne - Dreamweaver wrote: »Though it's in the form of another 'form', it's nevertheless a useful +pdef skill. I don't know why it needs to be argued that wizards and blademasters also have pdef buffs, I know they do.
Because it's not as useful as there's. We can't use a lot of great skills in fox form while they remain unlimited by them. A good example is BH3-3 where some of us have to remain in Fox amap rather than keeping the tank brambled.I'm getting the impression tweakz just likes to argue.
Yet who's the one here flame baiting?Yes, all classes do support. But some are more dd focused, or more tank, or more healer. All these classes work together in a squad... or at least, that's the intent of having a squad... to work together to accomplish what you couldn't on your own... *proceeds to go crosseyed*
Veno is as much dd as any other class.I am not saying that having a herc is bad. I am just saying it shouldn't be expected of a veno to have a herc. Which is one of the reasons I don't plan to get one.
Then likewise don't expect a Barb to have sufficient HP to tank, a BM to HF, an Assassin to have Subsea for RB, a Cleric to have enough Matk to heal a tank properly or a Wiz to have Dragon's Breath. Every class is expected to have a degree of competence and value to a squad. Herc venos are a dime a dozen, and never difficult to find for a squad. -Why bother with non Herc venos? Gimp your own game: fine. Lead others down your path of fail, and it affects the rest of us and should be countered.Be kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.0 -
Then likewise don't expect a Barb to have sufficient HP to tank, a BM to HF, an Assassin to have Subsea for RB, a Cleric to have enough Matk to heal a tank properly or a Wiz to have Dragon's Breath. Every class is expected to have a degree of competence and value to a squad. Herc venos are a dime a dozen, and never difficult to find for a squad. -Why bother with non Herc venos? Gimp your own game: fine. Lead others down your path of fail, and it affects the rest of us and should be countered.
gtfo idiot i have a lvl 100 sin and i did lots of bh 3-3 with herc and non-herc venos and the non-herc venos were doing their job well.And stop imposing players to get hercs and try to listen to others opinions and you'll see that no one will argue with you .You just post your opinion and never listen to others you think your opinion is the best of all,only it matters,you htink you're right everytime but you didn't wonder why others are arguing with you,because you are wrong sometimes but you don't wanna admit it!Well Miss Coc.ky you're not the centre of the universe so try to be more openned to others opinions and stop thinking that you're everytime right,no one is perfect!0 -
b:chuckle wow i honestly dont want to believe that someone asked for herc for 39
I've had all those happenThen likewise don't expect a Barb to have sufficient HP to tank, a BM to HF, an Assassin to have Subsea for RB, a Cleric to have enough Matk to heal a tank properly or a Wiz to have Dragon's Breath. Every class is expected to have a degree of competence and value to a squad. Herc venos are a dime a dozen, and never difficult to find for a squad. -Why bother with non Herc venos? Gimp your own game: fine. Lead others down your path of fail, and it affects the rest of us and should be countered.
IMO a lot of venos see herc as alighty and act incompetent when they have it. dud a bh59 with one of those, and she led to 2 wupes and 4-5 of her own deaths. she just kept stealing aro from hercy. i tend to not care about a veno with herc, just cause you have a cash pet doesnt mean your awesome. its the same as the old cashshopper debate, you may have the best gear +12 but doesnt mean your any good. skill > cash....well that aplied a lot more before0 -
Then likewise don't expect a Barb to have sufficient HP to tank, a BM to HF, an Assassin to have Subsea for RB, a Cleric to have enough Matk to heal a tank properly or a Wiz to have Dragon's Breath. Every class is expected to have a degree of competence and value to a squad. Herc venos are a dime a dozen, and never difficult to find for a squad. -Why bother with non Herc venos? Gimp your own game: fine. Lead others down your path of fail, and it affects the rest of us and should be countered.
Barb having decent Hp to tank = Decent equips(Maybe slightly little more better than a BM's or any other class)
BM Lv.10 HF cost :4.060.000 coins (Around 20m if Demon)
Sin Lv.10 Subsea : 4.060.000 coins (Around 20m if Sage/Demon)
Wiz lv.10 Drag.Breath : 1.071.000 coins (Dunno about Sage/Demon prices)
Cleric : Decent Weapon?(Cheap lv.89 Legendary one + some refines + shards 5M at max)
And he compare the above with
Veno Herc cost:Around 100M coins
In the end:
Competence=PricelessIam Segreta,Queen of the Chicken Kingdom,proud owner of the legendary Blue Chicken,BEHOLD Mortals o,o^
Current # Chickens:
^,^ <- My Cleric
o,o <- My Veno
n_n <- My Bm
=,= <- My Barb *Used as Mount*
>,o <- My Sin(Stealth all the time for no reason)0 -
I know this is kind of like typing/talking at a brick wall, but for any other venos reading who may be prone to tweakz advice, a veno having a herc is not even close to as vital as a barb having HP, or a cleric having enough magic attack to heal.Then likewise don't expect a Barb to have sufficient HP to tank, a BM to HF, an Assassin to have Subsea for RB, a Cleric to have enough Matk to heal a tank properly or a Wiz to have Dragon's Breath. Every class is expected to have a degree of competence and value to a squad. Herc venos are a dime a dozen, and never difficult to find for a squad. -Why bother with non Herc venos? Gimp your own game: fine. Lead others down your path of fail, and it affects the rest of us and should be countered.
The reason not to bother with non herc venos is because herc venos never tank anything anymore. Not even in 80s FF.. the sins with the -int gear/weapon does. I found the run better with a seamonster guardian having claw (cost 15m coins when I bought it) than a herc.
Far more important than having a herc is having a pet that can simply DD, being a veno who uses their debuffs, and knows how to effectively utilize their stats to maximize the efficiency of their build. For instance, a LA veno build being in fox form with crit/-int gear on single targets. Or a veno with high -chan / high refined magic wep for rebirth using AOE's.
Lastly, there's nothing more representative of the necessity of a herc than what people simply want in a squad. Squads looking for FF almost never ask for a herc anymore, instead want a veno who is going to debuff and AOE. The era of a dominant herc pet is over and there's not much justifiability in spending 100-150m+ on a pet that isn't needed or anywhere near as vital as tweakz says.0 -
If you want to follow the pack, wait for them to get aggro, depend on a Sin or BM pet with a mind /life / exp/ drops of their own: By all means go make another mooch bag veno. The servers are filled with this kind who go around telling people their value is as a debuffer yet they can't even do something simple like Sage Soul Degen until after someone's already put significant damage on a boss. -b:chuckle
Even at level 102: there are many occasions where other pets just don't cut it. If you want to be a non-solo class: then roll a wiz, psy, etc. We have enough venos.Be kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.0 -
b:chuckle Bussiness as usual...0
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This message is hidden because tweakz is on your ignore list.
Life as a veno is so much better ever since I got told how to do that
I have a herc. My herc is great. There's no reason (other than affordability) to NOT have a herc, and very few things a veno could get for that coin that would be as effective for the majority of the game.
But yeah - I've hit 90. The herc has pretty much stopped being any use, because people are way too impatient to let it tank. I can still tank low TTs, but that's about all.
The herc is also the most damaging of my dungeon-capable pets, though I'm levelling up a kowlin (purely to watch tweakz explode with rage)
Which is a real freakin shame. I'd much prefer other pets to be a viable alternative in dungeons the way they are out in the main world map.
Anyway - yes, the lowbie demanding a herc was an **** and a fool.
People saying "Don't get a herc" on principle are... silly. It's still a freakishly good pet. A veno with a herc CAN do more things than a veno without it.
But a veno without it can still do a heck of a lot.0 -
The reason i dont get a herc is because i have people - friends to squad with and do things together for fun , also most random squads are excited when i use amplify cause they think that most venos dont do it ( wrong , fail venos dont understand they have a awesome skill in their arsenal).
What tweakz can't understand is that getting a herc is really damn easy when already have money to invest , start ur own in-game business ( as silly that may sound ) and start making money. Some people just dont have this ability , because either they are not good in economics or they just dont ****ing care , they play just for fun and not to have a rude player who shouts at them or forces his opinion on them. the other problem is that he believes that non herc venos simply dont know how to play ( some call it a herc makes the veno pro , but that isnt the case here). I think that most non-herc venos he met in his squads just happened to be less strong / experienced / worse geared.
The purpose of this game is to have fun , escape from boredom when u have nothing better to do in real life , or just meet up with friends and fool around. Do not let people with no other interests or proper manners spoil ur game. If u want to be efficient and competitive , join a nice faction make friends and start working together , i do not think PW aims is to make people mindless - no life hollow shells. or at least , that isn't its original aim.
that's not nerdrage , nor do i care if i get flamed by other forum members or banned by mods. I said what i wanted to say and hope other people appreciate my effort ( even if this seems too melodramatic)
Phoenix_Eye b:bye[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
<--- MALE Veno ..... Moved to G W 2 or maybe not completely , don't know ...... PW addiction
{That TT xbow chain is one that describes someone's bowel movements after having too much spicy food. A loud **** (Thundercrack), then a burning sensation (Flash Fire), followed by an explosion of multi-colored poo-confetti (Blinding Radiance). Excellent...} By Quilue0 -
The necessity of a herc is dependent upon what you do. There are things that it can do that other pets can't.
BH's aren't really a reason to get a herc. I generally run ahead of the group and clear while people are still on their way. If I gimped my damage enough to keep the aggro on the herc, I wouldn't get half as far as I normally do. The active pet in these cases is whatever I feel like having out - pets themselves don't do much 1v1 on mobs at endgame.
I still use him on bosses that AoE (even when not tanking). But this is for the convenience of not having to heal him as often.
If there is no barb/bm/sin available and you need a tank, a herc can make the difference.
Herc is still the best pet, but it's far from as necessary as it once was.0 -
it was a lot of reading, but i feel i have to write someting. i have herc about 4 weeks. i payed real cash for it. it was a lot of money, but i did it only for one thing - not to spent more money. i've been on FC without herc, it was fun. i was in hh/tt (you name it) without herc and I enjoyed it. i helped my friends with their quests without herc. it was fun. herc changes nothing to veno who know how to use pet skills and his/her own skills. support others (chi, amp), do damage, don't get killed in the process. mmorpg isn't for solo playing. even veno has its pets b:cute0
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b:chuckle
This is a game.
We are given options in this game.
We decide what's best for our char.
If we haven't totally nerfed our char, we level and are happy.
I'm still levelling, and I don't have a herc.
People still want me in a squad, and I don't have a herc.
Therefore, a herc isn't everything to a veno.
b:chuckle
In fact... many think I'm a pretty good veno! To the comments earlier about amp and soul degen, yes they're awesome, and people just love when a veno amps... if they know what it does. 0
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