Why did PWI saturate the market with Tideborn weapons via Weapon Token Quests?

sig1043a
sig1043a Posts: 74 Arc User
edited February 2011 in General Discussion
I get the point that weapon token quests for tideborn is supposed to serve. It was (probably) a 'catching up' feature for the year+ old market of existing weapons/classes and (I think) the only method with which to obtain new tideborn legendary weapons. Not to mention that tideborn are generally limited to daggers and soulspheres.

But what was the point of saturating the weapon market for just two classes? Providing the new classes with a method to obtain their legendary weapons is necessary, making that method 10x - 20x+ easier than any other weapon mold is stupidity.

IMO, the reward rate of tideborn legendary molds needs to be nerfed (so far I have had 75% reward success for weapon token molds, which is absurd since the rate at which any other class gets a legendary weapon mold is probably closer to 1%) and there needs to either be weapon tokens for existing classes or the drop rate of legendary weapon molds needs to be increased for FBs. I know this is a futile post, but I wanted to put it out there anyway.
Post edited by sig1043a on
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Comments

  • Vitenka - Dreamweaver
    Vitenka - Dreamweaver Posts: 4,125 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    Pretty sure you nailed it in one - it's a catchup feature.

    There are hundreds, thousands even, of legendary molds and weapons in existence on the established servers.
    There are nowhere near that many tideborn molds, and there are a LOT of tideborn players. They need weapons!

    At some point it will need to be balanced again. The simplest solution would be to just delete every sin.
  • Annalyse - Heavens Tear
    Annalyse - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,618 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    Wow, well consider yourself lucky... my psy is getting her TT weapons now and she has never gotten a weapon from her token quest. And how is it hurting you if the market is, as you believe, "saturated?" Hell, it is far more "saturated" with cudgels of ancient alloy, those things drop so much people throw them on the ground because they don't even sell anymore. So many molds are simply worthless now because of the drop rate. Whereas when I wanted to buy weapons for my psy I couldn't actually find any a couple of times and luckily managed to borrow one from a friend to get me through 20 levels until my TT.

    I don't see a problem. Yes, they rushed the expansion and it was a silly way to deal with it, I'll give you that. But it isn't hurting the game in any way.
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  • phenixmoon
    phenixmoon Posts: 24 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    Moar QQ b:sad
    This forum is amazing... QQ about every single feature ingame lol
  • SilversMoon - Heavens Tear
    SilversMoon - Heavens Tear Posts: 292 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    Well, it just so happens TB molds aren't dropped by any bosses.
    Maybe it was too much scripting, maybe the devs didn't wanna, who knows.

    But one thing I know is, it's too late to whine about TB's, for if you wait a little tad longer,
    Everyone gets to start nagging at the new race's op aspects.
    [SIGPIC]http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh111/lord-leo7th/SilversMoonsig.png[/SIGPIC]
  • Angel_Spawn - Sanctuary
    Angel_Spawn - Sanctuary Posts: 3,034 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    The luck you can get the mold after weapon token quest is very slim, I have never gotten any of the molds, only mirages, so it is kinda fair, in addition those molds cannot be farmed in any instance, unless you farm a tb itself lol.
    [SIGPIC]http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=14516063001&dateline=1364756666[/SIGPIC] Ty Silvy :)
  • LenieClarke - Heavens Tear
    LenieClarke - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,275 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    on my 'sin so far, i've got the daggers (WT1) and mirages (WT2). on my psy, i got the weapon for WT1, haven't run WT2 yet. that's not enough of a sample size to generalize from, though.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] Heaven's Tear alts: KenLubin, Sou_Hon, JudyCaraco --- level 5x chars.
  • sig1043a
    sig1043a Posts: 74 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    Oh I am sure the new race will have the same effect, but that is my point. Why saturate the weapon market just for the new races?

    The high end market will always be saturated to a degree due to the mature server population (and by mature I mean character level, not player mentality) in conjunction with the stereotypical min/max disease of mmorpgs (i.e. the benefits of one build, such as aps, is superior to pretty much any other build.)

    You would think that a pay to win mmorpg would want to encourage players to make new characters no matter what the class instead of railroading them to just one race in particular. It is a bit messed up when it is cheaper to gear out a new class over older classes.

    As far as the reward rate of legendary molds, the market speaks for itself. IMO, the devs should be adjusting drop rates based on the existing market/server population.
  • mylittleseeker
    mylittleseeker Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    from what i have read the new race use existing weapons. that means your point is pointless.

    why should new players be penalised because they do not want to pay for their molds. the game should always offer the chance to farm items where possible. I understand the pack/event gear as an incentive to sell boutique items, however even these can be farmed with effort.

    pwe do not nerf drop rates or you will only hurt those who are already suffering - non APS/casters/free players.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • sig1043a
    sig1043a Posts: 74 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    mylittleseeker wrote: »
    from what i have read the new race use existing weapons. that means your point is pointless.

    why should new players be penalised because they do not want to pay for their molds. the game should always offer the chance to farm items where possible. I understand the pack/event gear as an incentive to sell boutique items, however even these can be farmed with effort.

    pwe do not nerf drop rates or you will only hurt those who are already suffering - non APS/casters/free players.

    Woosh! Thats the sound of my pointless point going over your head. Maybe try re-reading it and you might see that I think that there should be an increase in the drop rates of the non-tideborn weapons and that the tideborn weapon mold reward rate are the ones that need to be nerfed.
  • Xarathox - Dreamweaver
    Xarathox - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,657 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    sig1043a wrote: »
    Woosh! Thats the sound of my pointless point going over your head. Maybe try re-reading it and you might see that I think that there should be an increase in the drop rates of the non-tideborn weapons and that the tideborn weapon mold reward rate are the ones that need to be nerfed.

    Why? Have you even looked under the mold section of AH? It's filled to the brim with original class molds, and hardly any TB molds.
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  • Escorian - Dreamweaver
    Escorian - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,802 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    this troll seems to be pretty well fed.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    ty Nowitsawn

    Everything has its beginnings, but it doesn't start at one. It starts long before that... The world is born From zero. The moment zero becomes one is the moment the world springs to life. One becomes 2. 2 becomes 10. 10 becomes 100. taking it all back to one solves nothing. so long as zero remains... One.. Will eventually grow to 100 again.
  • mylittleseeker
    mylittleseeker Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    Yes Escorian. I am new here so I have yet to learn troll recognition skill. I should know better I guess. The fact that the majority of posts in the thread were already by one person should have given me a clue. Lesson learned.

    what's that? 1million coin for Troll Shield? sigh better get saving now.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    Some of the lower level molds are still hard to find. How often do you see Moonlight Bows on your server's AH? For how much? 1m? 2m?
    Elena Costel: I wash my hands of this affair.
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  • sangodoc
    sangodoc Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    sig1043a wrote: »
    Why saturate the weapon market just for the new races?
    The claim that the dagger/soulsphere mold market is "saturated" is debatable. Also, the odds of getting them from the quests is 50%, not 75% (see an example here).

    Anyways, as stated previously in this thread, the reason for the Weapon Token quests was that the FB bosses do not drop any Tideborn weapon molds. In order to be fair, there had to be some way for Tideborn classes to get weapon molds as well, so they created the Weapon Token quests for the Tideborn.

    We could debate whether the drop rate from the quest is too high or not, but there has been very little complaint regarding it, so I'd say it seems fair, overall.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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  • Xarathox - Dreamweaver
    Xarathox - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,657 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Some of the lower level molds are still hard to find. How often do you see Moonlight Bows on your server's AH? For how much? 1m? 2m?

    Those molds are pretty much a non-factor. Those are lvl 20-30, and it literally takes less than 4 hours to out grow them on a low lvl toon. Unless you're yulk, ofc.
    Some people risk to employ me

    Some people live to destroy me

    Either way they die
  • Okeano - Harshlands
    Okeano - Harshlands Posts: 4,943 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    PWI didn't do it, the devs in China did, so you might wana ask the forum in PW-CN.
  • flamingahole
    flamingahole Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    Be glad you don't need to charge zen for TB weapons. b:beatup
    You have three chances to guess the reason for the post above.
  • CandyCorn - Raging Tide
    CandyCorn - Raging Tide Posts: 1,547 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    flamingahole wrote: »
    Be glad you don't need to charge zen for TB weapons. b:beatup

    ^this why complain about free legendary weapons?
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  • Tygurr - Sanctuary
    Tygurr - Sanctuary Posts: 296 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    sig1043a wrote: »
    Why did PWI saturate the market with Tideborn weapons via Weapon Token Quests?

    Because they can... that's why.
    Somewhat retired from PWI, now playing Hellgate Global full time
  • Xarathox - Dreamweaver
    Xarathox - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,657 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    Blahbla - Raging Tide wrote: »
    this is for all of you from me <3

    Nice 404.
    Some people risk to employ me

    Some people live to destroy me

    Either way they die
  • X_trigger_X - Heavens Tear
    X_trigger_X - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,301 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    Because the devs over at PW-CN don't possess the ability to modify or add to most coding pre tideborn. Hence they can't add the tideborn weapons to bosses, so needed another solution.

    See the xpac thread for the reasons etc b:bye


    It's the only game I know of where the actual devs don't have the rights or knowledge to use coding for their own game.......
  • Xarathox - Dreamweaver
    Xarathox - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,657 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    X_trigger_X - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    It's the only game I know of where the actual devs don't have the rights or knowledge to use coding for their own game.......

    Because they didn't create it. It's more or less stolen property.
    Some people risk to employ me

    Some people live to destroy me

    Either way they die
  • phenixmoon
    phenixmoon Posts: 24 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    Why everyone seems to know the universal truth in this forum? xD

    It's so funny to see all those posts with smart azz people knowing it all :P
  • CandyCorn - Raging Tide
    CandyCorn - Raging Tide Posts: 1,547 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    phenixmoon wrote: »
    Why everyone seems to know the universal truth in this forum? xD

    It's so funny to see all those posts with smart azz people knowing it all :P

    You know what i can't even find the right picture for what you said..so go ahead and pick any one of these pictures.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] Move along..move along
  • Xarathox - Dreamweaver
    Xarathox - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,657 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    I'm sorry, but...
    Some people risk to employ me

    Some people live to destroy me

    Either way they die
  • LenieClarke - Heavens Tear
    LenieClarke - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,275 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    Sangodoc wrote: »
    Anyways, as stated previously in this thread, the reason for the Weapon Token quests was that the FB bosses do not drop any Tideborn weapon molds. In order to be fair, there had to be some way for Tideborn classes to get weapon molds as well, so they created the Weapon Token quests for the Tideborn.

    this explanation sounds reasonable, until you consider that open map mobs drop non-legendary TB weapons. clearly they had to have been modified to do that, so why the roundabout method of weapon token?

    UNLESS... tideborn legendaries were meant to be rarer than classic legendaries. sure, 50% sounds like a high chance of getting a mold --- but you can only run each weapon token once per character. compared to the molds being dropped in umpteen BH quests each day, that's a severely restricted supply.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] Heaven's Tear alts: KenLubin, Sou_Hon, JudyCaraco --- level 5x chars.
  • ThanosQRt - Dreamweaver
    ThanosQRt - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,457 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    LenieClarke - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    this explanation sounds reasonable, until you consider that open map mobs drop non-legendary TB weapons. clearly they had to have been modified to do that, so why the roundabout method of weapon token?

    UNLESS... tideborn legendaries were meant to be rarer than classic legendaries. sure, 50% sounds like a high chance of getting a mold --- but you can only run each weapon token once per character. compared to the molds being dropped in umpteen BH quests each day, that's a severely restricted supply.

    the basic issue is that for a couple of years people farmed, willingly or not, weapons for the 6 classes. even if they added the tideborn molds as drops in fb bosses, those molds would be ultra rare since nobody farmed them for a long time... and therefore a tideborn would have to pay a lot more for a legendary weapon.
  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    A lower lvl LG weapon for any of the old classes is still only for the rich or really lucky. Find me a 3x robe who can afford an Order of the Stars on his/her own, or find me an archer with Lightcatcher, how many of those can you find? Every other lowbie is still going around in mob drops and the occasional 3star, yet Tideborns have this weapon token quest.

    2x, 3x molds can still easily go for 2m on my server even after all this time, way out of reach of any starting player. That just shows how rare that stuff drops - but not Tideborn molds.

    At least make it the same for everyone. Maybe make lower level molds chip-able
    Elena Costel: I wash my hands of this affair.
    Legerity: *drags you back* *stains your hands with said affair*
    Elena Costel: Noooo... I don't want to have a dirty affair with Lady Legerity...
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  • Daizengar - Sanctuary
    Daizengar - Sanctuary Posts: 142 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »
    A lower lvl LG weapon for any of the old classes is still only for the rich or really lucky. Find me a 3x robe who can afford an Order of the Stars on his/her own, or find me an archer with Lightcatcher, how many of those can you find? Every other lowbie is still going around in mob drops and the occasional 3star, yet Tideborns have this weapon token quest.

    2x, 3x molds can still easily go for 2m on my server even after all this time, way out of reach of any starting player. That just shows how rare that stuff drops - but not Tideborn molds.

    At least make it the same for everyone. Maybe make lower level molds chip-able

    There's a new daily in Genesis that allows you to farm these tokens you can exchange for lower level molds. Problem already solved.
  • sig1043a
    sig1043a Posts: 74 Arc User
    edited February 2011
    Daizengar - Sanctuary wrote: »
    There's a new daily in Genesis that allows you to farm these tokens you can exchange for lower level molds. Problem already solved.

    Thanks for the info.

    Its kind of messed up when the rank 4 - Rank 8 tideborn weapons and molds outnumber all other rank 4 - rank 8 weapons and molds combined (on dreamweaver, right now). Glad to see PW is doing something about it, but they almost had too if the new race uses existing weapons.

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