Still worth working on aps gears?

TheMagicPimp - Raging Tide · January 2011

So like...with all the r8 fish out there that have much higher dps than us bms ( let's not even talk about r9 ones ) it makes one wonder if it's really worth it for bms that haven't reached 5 aps and/or high refines on their end-game fists/claws to even work towards getting those gears. Not even pure farming bm build with full DoTs,5 aps and tt100 +12 fists will get too close to a r8 or g15 nirv +12's 4-5 aps sins's dmg ( again don't even bother mentioning r9 daggs,the dps is just too high to even think about comparing it to anything else).

Also,seeing that every1 and their mother has r8 and some have r9 out there and that axes(if good ones like g15 nirvanas) were always superior to fists in TW/mass pvp is there still any reason to truly invest in high refines on your fists/claws instead of just being a debuff monkey with a few demon sparks in between and let the fish do the DD'ing? Let's not forget r9 axes which I find to be much scarier in pvp than high refined fists even,even in small scale. So if you have enough sins on your f/l or in faction to go on runs with,I really don't see a reason to even go past 3.33 or 4 aps if you're still gearing up for aps that is.

With all this being said,I wonder if we'll see more axes from bms in pvp and less fists from now on. As for pve,back to bell/hf/gs monkeys ? ( which I don't find a problem with when you make the same profits as them and can still perform nicely in pvp while focusing on your axes).

This is at least,what I'd do if I'd still care about this game(I do have lots of sins in my server/faction/friend list though) but I'm too inactive/unmotivated/think the game is dead/hate it to even farm much after the rank sale came & just playing every once in a while till FW's out b:surrender

Anyway,I'd like to hear your opinions about this

Okeano - Harshlands · January 2011

Your logic is so flawed on so many levels I don't even...

Just because Sins can get higher DPS than you, you shouldn't get a good DPS? Sins already out DPS BMs before R8 sales so I don't see how that will affect anything. Just because your neighbor/friends have good cars that you can never afford, you should just stick to bike? Just because a Sin can solo a TT in 30 minutes, you don't want to be able to do it in 40? Barbs have higher HP than BM, why bother refining your armor?

PvP wise, have fun killing BM and Barb with axes. There's no way in hell I can kill any decent 100 BM or Barb with my G15 axes +10, unless I go all out and demon spark + occult, which puts me completely vulnerable to any other attacks afterward. Axes is a very important part of BM and too many new BMs these days ignore it. But it doesn't mean that fists are not needed in PvP. Even with end-game axes like mine, fists are still better for things like Sins and Archers in 1v1. If one of my 2 skills with axes missed in the duration of a stun, that's 50% of my attacks wasted. Sure, if I get a lucky zerk crit I'll one hit them, but it's risky. But with fists, if a few of my hits miss, I'm still hitting them 3/4 times a second and landing much more damage while in the precious time of them under stun.

PvE wise, you are not always going to have Sins farming with/for you. The most profitable farming is solo. Fists BM is better debuffer than axes only BM. With fists and interval, you put in good damage between HF and can also spark + HF with chi from genie. You'll always have chi for HF when it cools down. Axes BM can HF, what, once every minute?

paulnujen · January 2011

lawyered.............

Okeano - Harshlands · January 2011

paulnujen wrote: »

lawyered.............

o.o??

TheMagicPimp - Raging Tide · January 2011

Hold your horses,I never said give up on fists completely,even if not used for pvp the accuracy would still be required for fighting some classes like archers & sins and naturally to get chi so you can HF more + prolly spark.

I still see it as a decent choice now if you got enough sin friends that you can get into instances with and don't forget that not every1 enjoys soloing instances,it's a mmo after all(well used to be,game's pretty dead as a mmo :P ). Also don't forget that not every1 pks and might focus on TW to get their share of pvp where axes > fists more even more than before now and where a bm shouldn't really be trying to fist another HA do death. And cough...I think skill spam with g15 nirv or r9 axes > fists with a sin's rib strike on.

Obviously,the better option is still to aim for aps gears 1st,farm farm farm then get better axes & whatever else you need as well but I think this is more of an option now for bms out there that don't try/care to be "perfect" ,just saying.

TheDan - Sanctuary · January 2011

You should still refine your weapon so you can still solo farm for cash when your sin friends aren't online so you can be somewhat self reliant.

Kupuntu - Sanctuary · January 2011

If you don't want to get aps gears, then why the hell would your friends take you to Nirvana or TT?...

Back when I had my -int stuff, I don't think any of my high aps friends would have had me on their regular farming party setup if I didn't have that stuff.

Okeano - Harshlands · January 2011

TheMagicPimp - Raging Tide wrote: »

I still see it as a decent choice now if you got enough sin friends that you can get into instances with and don't forget that not every1 enjoys soloing instances,it's a mmo after all(well used to be,game's pretty dead as a mmo :P ). Also don't forget that not every1 pks and might focus on TW to get their share of pvp where axes > fists more even more than before now and where a bm shouldn't really be trying to fist another HA do death. And cough...I think skill spam with g15 nirv or r9 axes > fists with a sin's rib strike on.

If I'm going to make a farming party with my Sin, who would I chose. A fists BM with TT100 +10 that can put in good damage between HF or someone with fists of Heroism?

Obviously axes should be used in TW 99% of the time, but having high interval still helps you to build up chi back fast between pushes. And yes I use axes when I get ribbed, but you'll be surprised how many Sins don't bother to rib a BM with fists.

TheMagicPimp - Raging Tide · January 2011

Kupuntu - Sanctuary wrote: »

If you don't want to get aps gears, then why the hell would your friends take you to Nirvana or TT?...

Because when a boss already goes down in 30-50seconds(HF-able ones ofc) friends or even faction would rather have some1 they know in squad rather than a random player just for the sake of killing a boss 15 seconds faster. b:chuckle

TheDan - Sanctuary wrote: »

You should still refine your weapon so you can still solo farm for cash when your sin friends aren't online so you can be somewhat self reliant.

Assuming that one's actively playing & would log on at different times than those friends :P

Okeano - Harshlands wrote: »

If I'm going to make a farming party with my Sin, who would I chose. A fists BM with TT100 +10 that can put in good damage between HF or someone with fists of Heroism?

I agree with you but with a reliable group of people things can change.

Anyway this was just an idea of how to build up your TW bm directly,skipping on some of the farming gear if you aren't really interested in the game enough to actively play it & farm enough to make use of your investment in aps gears.

Kupuntu - Sanctuary · January 2011

TheMagicPimp - Raging Tide wrote: »

Because when a boss already goes down in 30-50seconds(HF-able ones ofc) friends or even faction would rather have some1 they know in squad rather than a random player just for the sake of killing a boss 15 seconds faster. b:chuckle

I personally had no problems letting a pure axe or low aps BM in a squad with me unless their gears weren't on par with mine. When you got 3.33 aps sparked and +7 claws, I wouldn't take a BM with full TT90 with me...

Most people aren't like me though.

TheMagicPimp - Raging Tide · January 2011

Kupuntu - Sanctuary wrote: »

I personally had no problems letting a pure axe or low aps BM in a squad with me unless their gears weren't on par with mine. When you got 3.33 aps sparked and +7 claws, I wouldn't take a BM with full TT90 with me...

Most people aren't like me though.

Well yea obviously,I know I did some nirvanas with a wiz in squad with me several times.Not seeking "the perfect nirv squad" or anything,especially not in such a broken game. There are still several ppl that are already OP geared & are known to take their faction wiziez & psys to nirvana,even if those casters would just be leecing off 'em. In return they don't have any problems with TW sign ups or anything because every1 in the faction is happy.

Ofc it's not profitable to do so & it obviously doesn't happen that often,but really now...too much thinking about profit alone...ppl take this down-the-hill-game too seriously,ijs.b:beatup

Joshcja - Sanctuary · January 2011

both bm's and sins cap out at 11k-12k phys attack with g 15 claws and daggers (full str/dex builds)

the main edges sins have are GoF daggers and powerdash CC, however bm's get +20 attack level DBB cancle for more DPH and GS for an average 15% crit... sins out DD us by about 30% pre rank 9

and bm's can tank far more damage thanks ro higher phys def mag def and hp

i'd say 5 aps on a bm is still worth it

Rawrgh - Raging Tide · January 2011

Go for it, 5.0 aps is sexy b:victory

There are still several ppl that are already OP geared & are known to take their faction wiziez & psys to nirvana,even if those casters would just be leecing off 'em. In return they don't have any problems with TW sign ups or anything because every1 in the faction is happy

Vicious has discovered our secret b:shocked

Michael_Dark - Lost City · January 2011

Okeano - Harshlands wrote: »

Obviously axes should be used in TW 99% of the time

Disagree.

Red sprint + bolt > HF. Especially now with so much high refined G15 and R9 weapons.

With bolt I literally have two stuns. Of course they aren't stunned with bolt, but they are unable to move. That's so much more effective for advancing DD squads... so their targets don't have a chance to retreat. At least, I've found comparing how well axes vs fists work in TW being in a stun squad.

The only time you would use axes are for fissure and HF. HF is only necessary for maybe the top squad you're opposing. I've found that bolt really annoys everyone, I get focused, which leaves the advancing DD parties mostly untargeted for a few seconds and gives them time to push in and attack.

If I go in and stun + HF, people panic... immune pot, or if they're using anti-stun, they retreat until it wears off... half the time you call a target you're going to amp, they don't even get targeted and you've wasted two sparks.

And I've done quite a few TWs as pure vit + axe build and fist build. Both have their merits, but I find that bolt + roar can immobilize and stun such a great number of people in one rush... One time I bolted I counted 12 people in my damage log.... I also watched most of them die right after I did because most of them focused me and our DD party came in and swept them away.

But that's just the way I play. And judging by what my enemies and friends in the opposing faction tell me, I do my job well.

rangerchad · February 2011

As for combating very impressive geared sin on my BM, i use Bolt of tyreseus ( cuz of its interval cut and it helps seal them in case i dont have the chi for stun lock) after they hell spark then jump back, then smack, then stun lock them till hell spark is gone and because of stun lock they cant run, i always use my GX vs sin because u need to kill them before they disapear on ya lol with GX and my 25% crit, zerk critting takes down sin rather quickly. when i use my interval to fight sin its a matter of accuracy which i dont have yet lol so i stick with axes vs interval sin (given i have the chi for it lol)

Okeano - Harshlands · February 2011

Michael_Dark - Lost City wrote: »

Disagree.

Red sprint + bolt > HF. Especially now with so much high refined G15 and R9 weapons.

Bolt is one move. How is that more than 1% of the time? You don't need fists out rest of the time.

Although I do find it annoying that HF has become more and more of a waste, since every time someone sees it they domain. I'm starting to consider using GS in its place.

Still worth working on aps gears?

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