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    • Battle LA Fox Veno

    Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2011 in Venomancer
    Hey all, i have been reading a lot of topics about LA/HA/AA veno and i'm wondering if its good to build a veno with la armor/rings/etc with -int, using a magic weapon and battle in fox form? Will i have good atk and p def?
    Post edited by nebixdd on

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    • Posts: 6,094 Arc User
      edited January 2011
      Your pdef and patk will be less than a same level HA/AA veno. Your crit will be higher, but not enough higher to make up the difference.
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    • Posts: 1,529 Arc User
      edited January 2011
      it is a perfectly valid build up until mid 90s but at that point you will want to make a decision on your endgame goals - full AA or HA/AA

      i am not playing Shulkie often these days but have been hybrid/LA for most of the game (most of my gear has +vit stats). Going HA too early in the game can be tough due to the need to find gear with +str or +mag stats make up the difference so you can equip armor and magic weapon of appropriate level (and keep up your magic attack/pet heal)
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    • Posts: 436 Arc User
      edited January 2011
      Imo it would be a nice end game setup,

      I think i posted this build somewhere before

      http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=e24a366c757a88ee with Claw


      http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=0e6e9bc5ae01ee8b same build with lvl 95 magic sword

      you will give up high damage for the ability to use 3 forms Caster, Mellee Fox and High aps DD
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    • Posts: 3,852 Arc User
      edited January 2011
      I made two endgame builds centered around similar gear (difference going from LA to HA being in green/red, green for higher values and red for lower) and in fox form magic attack is the same, but to emphasize physical attacks too):

      LA veno:
      http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=181e5d22e7ea6097
      HP: 7909
      Phys atk: 6399-7524
      Mag atk: 8117-10177
      Crit: 16%
      Phys def (red %): 12433 (76%)
      Mag def (red %): 7213 (64%)
      Accuracy: 3136
      Evasion: 1450
      Attack Rate: 2.22/sec

      HA veno:
      http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=054e2b8f25532898
      HP: 9170 [+1261]
      Phys atk: 6995-8251 [+596-727]
      Mag atk: 7857-9851 [-260-326]
      Crit: 13% [-3%]
      Phys def (red %): 21379 (84%) [+8946 (+8%)]
      Mag def (red %): 5876 (59%) [-1337 (-5%)]
      Accuracy: 1960 [-1176]
      Evasion: 891 [-559]
      Attack Rate: 1.82/sec [-0.4-0.5/sec]

      This really comes down to simply what you prefer, and any possible alts you have or will have to be able to share gear. If you have, or are going to make, an archer or sin or LA magic class to share gear with, go LA veno. If you have a BM or barb, or will have one, to share with, go HA, or if you want to share with another caster class with the option of HA/AA to switch to arcane, go HA/AA. However, just about every HA/AA veno I've met on HT, far more often than not, uses their heavy armor by default. It must be emphasized that both HA and LA can use arcane gear because the requirements of that armor are very similar to endgame magic weapons which are highly recommended regardless of choosing LA or HA.

      I already have an HA veno (her own account) and that LA build is what I will be experimenting with, using mostly sin/archer's gear. If I don't like it I always have the option of using my BM/barb's gear on the same account.

      The very distinguishable differences:

      - HA refines better, thus more HP (largest noticeable diff favoring HA)
      - Phys attack is slightly higher for HA builds because of more STR
      - Mag attack is slightly higher for LA builds because of more MAG
      - Phys def is moderately higher for HA builds because of more STR and HA armor
      - Mag def is moderately higher for LA builds and the lower phys def and higher mag def than HA
      - Accuracy, evasion, crit, and attack rate favor LA builds significantly
      - HA has the option to use Arcane, but loses a good portion of HP and phys def. LA builds also have this option with similar results.

      I did not include a fist, axe, or human form melee option because there's no possible build for a veno to effectively be an endgame fist (lots of str, lots of dex) + endgame magic weapon (lots of magic) user. To maximize a veno's potential they need both high phys and magic attack, so gimping magic attack makes a veno useless in any AOE instance or one that requires (or is highly preferred) ranged magic attacks over melee.

      On both builds they have the option to switch to a few -chan gear (minimum wrists, rings, chest, helm, cape, and other possibilities depending on how rich you are).
    • Posts: 0 Arc User
      edited January 2011
      JanusZeal - Heavens Tear wrote: »
      I made two endgame builds centered around similar gear (difference going from LA to HA being in green/red, green for higher values and red for lower) and in fox form magic attack is the same, but to emphasize physical attacks too):

      LA veno:
      http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=181e5d22e7ea6097
      HP: 7909
      Phys atk: 6399-7524
      Mag atk: 8117-10177
      Crit: 16%
      Phys def (red %): 12433 (76%)
      Mag def (red %): 7213 (64%)
      Accuracy: 3136
      Evasion: 1450
      Attack Rate: 2.22/sec

      HA veno:
      http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=054e2b8f25532898
      HP: 9170 [+1261]
      Phys atk: 6995-8251 [+596-727]
      Mag atk: 7857-9851 [-260-326]
      Crit: 13% [-3%]
      Phys def (red %): 21379 (84%) [+8946 (+8%)]
      Mag def (red %): 5876 (59%) [-1337 (-5%)]
      Accuracy: 1960 [-1176]
      Evasion: 891 [-559]
      Attack Rate: 1.82/sec [-0.4-0.5/sec]

      This really comes down to simply what you prefer, and any possible alts you have or will have to be able to share gear. If you have, or are going to make, an archer or sin or LA magic class to share gear with, go LA veno. If you have a BM or barb, or will have one, to share with, go HA, or if you want to share with another caster class with the option of HA/AA to switch to arcane, go HA/AA. However, just about every HA/AA veno I've met on HT, far more often than not, uses their heavy armor by default. It must be emphasized that both HA and LA can use arcane gear because the requirements of that armor are very similar to endgame magic weapons which are highly recommended regardless of choosing LA or HA.

      I already have an HA veno (her own account) and that LA build is what I will be experimenting with, using mostly sin/archer's gear. If I don't like it I always have the option of using my BM/barb's gear on the same account.

      The very distinguishable differences:

      - HA refines better, thus more HP (largest noticeable diff favoring HA)
      - Phys attack is slightly higher for HA builds because of more STR
      - Mag attack is slightly higher for LA builds because of more MAG
      - Phys def is moderately higher for HA builds because of more STR and HA armor
      - Mag def is moderately higher for LA builds and the lower phys def and higher mag def than HA
      - Accuracy, evasion, crit, and attack rate favor LA builds significantly
      - HA has the option to use Arcane, but loses a good portion of HP and phys def. LA builds also have this option with similar results.

      I did not include a fist, axe, or human form melee option because there's no possible build for a veno to effectively be an endgame fist (lots of str, lots of dex) + endgame magic weapon (lots of magic) user. To maximize a veno's potential they need both high phys and magic attack, so gimping magic attack makes a veno useless in any AOE instance or one that requires (or is highly preferred) ranged magic attacks over melee.

      On both builds they have the option to switch to a few -chan gear (minimum wrists, rings, chest, helm, cape, and other possibilities depending on how rich you are).

      The difference between ha and la is pretty insignificant, u still have a good def as a la(76%) and u will have more crit, more dps so u might be able to kill fast and be still good for tank because u only have 8% less def and in my opinion that's nothing. After reading your post i think la is a way better. Well i might me wrong so I would like to see more opinions about this topic i made because i'm really confused =S
    • Posts: 3,852 Arc User
      edited January 2011
      nebixdd wrote: »
      The difference between ha and la is pretty insignificant, u still have a good def as a la(76%) and u will have more crit, more dps so u might be able to kill fast and be still good for tank because u only have 8% less def and in my opinion that's nothing. After reading your post i think la is a way better. Well i might me wrong so I would like to see more opinions about this topic i made because i'm really confused =S
      Mmhmm, there isn't that much difference. I suppose the "lazy" build if we generalize for a second could be LA. If you noticed in the Beamhoof Slicer I put one garnet and one sapphire. This is to reduce the workload of switching out weapons. As it is, a multi-faceted veno will be switching out rings, possibly ornaments and other gear. Probably a little easier for the lazy folk to need to switch around less. HA/AA is certainly the opposite of that. For instance, when my 100 veno was in her 90s doing BH I'd make sure she had her arcane set for Eden while having heavy set for Brim. LA set at that level would provide adequate physical and magical defenses. Little difference, in the end. I'm one who tries to avoid politically correct speech (i.e. "anyone can!" or "any build can work!") but you can't lose with either build. It's especially useful if you can save money by utilizing gear from/for alts so you don't have to farm the same stuff over and over for different armor types. This is what has kept me from getting really "outstanding" gear to this day.
    • Posts: 190 Arc User
      edited January 2011
      http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=92512f13dd41847e

      this is my character in pve gear as of right now, allows me to use my fists as well as my neon purgatory. demon spark for veno gives a big enough boost over bm spark w/ bm fist mastery... 75% more damage, that i keep agro off of 5.0 bm's with the same wep. any build u pick is viable if the player is smart enough to know how to properly use it and exploit its strengths, reduce its weaknesses.
      lvl101 LA/AA demon veno ftw, 15251 hp buffed, 13508 buffed pdef in human. able to use tt100 fists at 5 aps w/ genie. all from 2 years of work... WASTED
      [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
      was fun while it lasted

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