5 aps sin or Rank 9?

pierrevr1
pierrevr1 Posts: 22 Arc User
edited May 2012 in Assassin
So anyone done the math - What will be the best in pvp and pve? A max -int sin or full Rank 9 sin? And what will be best for sage or demon sin?

Please ignore price since both are expensive.

Thanks
Post edited by pierrevr1 on
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Comments

  • BoatFoot - Lost City
    BoatFoot - Lost City Posts: 29 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    5.0 + rank 9

    /thread.
  • _Leif - Lost City
    _Leif - Lost City Posts: 369 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    BoatFoot - Lost City wrote: »
    5.0 + rank 9

    /thread.

    It's impossible for a full rank 9 sin to be 5.0

    /you're an idiot

    A 4.0 sin with rank 9 daggers is probably the best balance between interval and damage per hit (rank 9 daggers are the highest damage daggers period). Note you'd need every single piece of interval gear in the game in order to compensate for the fact that rank 9 has no interval bonus tho. You could drop down to 3.33 aps and get yourself some decent ornaments (cube neck + warsong belt) to bolster your pdef. Or you could even go full rank 9 and shard full + 2 DEF stones (total of 71 DEF level; 86 DEF level with anni box). It's more or less impossible for you to die at this point unless you're fighting someone that's stacked in attack level.

    Lot of choices for a lot of different styles
  • Tsubakey - Heavens Tear
    Tsubakey - Heavens Tear Posts: 473 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    with rank 9 close to 200 atk lvls is possible.
    [SIGPIC]http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=10046531006&dateline=1291585534[/SIGPIC]
  • Twsted - Raging Tide
    Twsted - Raging Tide Posts: 135 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    _Leif - Lost City wrote: »
    It's impossible for a full rank 9 sin to be 5.0

    /you're an idiot

    A 4.0 sin with rank 9 daggers is probably the best balance between interval and damage per hit (rank 9 daggers are the highest damage daggers period). Note you'd need every single piece of interval gear in the game in order to compensate for the fact that rank 9 has no interval bonus tho. You could drop down to 3.33 aps and get yourself some decent ornaments (cube neck + warsong belt) to bolster your pdef. Or you could even go full rank 9 and shard full + 2 DEF stones (total of 71 DEF level; 86 DEF level with anni box). It's more or less impossible for you to die at this point unless you're fighting someone that's stacked in attack level.

    Lot of choices for a lot of different styles

    with full rank 9 a sin has less phys def than a barb with TT99 lol soo its goin to get ***** by 5 aps sins
    is it jus me or does every thread turn into a flame thread at some point? wheres the love?? b:cry
    WTF is a gank? -_- its called pvp
  • Tsubakey - Heavens Tear
    Tsubakey - Heavens Tear Posts: 473 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Twsted - Raging Tide wrote: »
    with full rank 9 a sin has less phys def than a barb with TT99 lol soo its goin to get ***** by 5 aps sins


    why the **** would u compare the phys def of a light armored sin to a heavy armored BARB?
    [SIGPIC]http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=10046531006&dateline=1291585534[/SIGPIC]
  • Rice_hero - Lost City
    Rice_hero - Lost City Posts: 140 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Actually, in pvp... 5.0 sins are actually 3.33 sins unless they have the -.interval tome before rank 8 came cheap then they'll be 4.0 based because who the .... in their right mind would 3 spark in an open field of pvp & when 3.33 does the job just fine. Rank 9 Daggers alone would be a win win situation in both pve & pvp especially if you're doing group pvps. I love playing the sin class because of the versatility of being one of the fastest dps class & also become a deadly threat w/ crazy DPH crits/zerks. We have a skill that pretty much gaurantees all of our skills for the next 8 seconds to crit. including the almight genie skill "BRAMBLE RAGE". combine those crits w/ your strongest skills + Jones Blessings+ Chill of the deep + 30atk lvls from r9 daggers + God of frenzy (high chance to zerk) + extra 2.00 range for aoeing + frenzy (if you still have extra genie points) & interval is then.. considered pretty useless in pvp. In pve, I would prefer to have if possible a 2nd cast nv dagger w/ some frenzy/zerk affect w/ -.05 interval though. or... hmm.. I'd have to think about it xD. Your Interval gear's are bound anyways, might as will wear all r9 to pvp if you afford it & all or some interval for pve.


    I'll rephrase it to make it simpler... Would You like to 1-3 shot people a group of elite top geared people w/out them ever knowing you're there? or wait for them to spread & then kill them in 2-3second one at a time. Keep in mind people can still use Absolute domain or may have a charm that will tick.
  • _Leif - Lost City
    _Leif - Lost City Posts: 369 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    I trip spark in pvp all the time. It's honestly not as suicidal as you'd think provided that you're somewhat strategic about it (ie not sparking in the middle of a crowd). While properly geared sage sins can oneshot many many players, it's really the interval sins that can kill high HP barbs/BMs etc (without bramble rage).

    The only real problem for an interval sin is when your opponent absolute domains/expels right as you start your attack. Robe classes in particular will mash AD/expel the second they see you on their damage log. Obviously the easiest way to counter this is to oneshot them, which is very doable for pre-99/non-event geared robes/light armor classes.

    As soon as you start attacking mages with +10 event ornaments and nirvana robes, however, it becomes much more difficult. Yes, the oneshot is still possible (especially with God of Frenzy proc and genie buffs), but really you're just placing it in the hands of % procs. If you don't crit or proc frenzy, you're going to get sealed/slept/stunned/destroyed before you can channel your next attack.

    So, if you can't kill them in one shot, you have to settle for stabbing them as many times as possible before they pop immunity. Easiest thing to do is position yourself as far as possible from them within range of shadow jump, buff up, triple spark, restealth, inner harmony, shadow jump, normal attacks + tangling mire + occult ice. From personal experience, it takes 2-3 second for a competent pvper to pop immune after I start attacking (there seems to be a second delay from when you activate to when it takes effect). With 5 aps, you can easily get in 10-20 attacks before they are able to respond. If you can't kill a robe/LA class in 10-20 attacks with tangling mire activated, you are NOT going to be able to kill them 1 on 1.

    Even if you don't have enough space to triple spark safely, you can simply double spark, activate relentless courage, and continue in the same manner.
  • Rice_hero - Lost City
    Rice_hero - Lost City Posts: 140 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    ^ yea, what Leif said... I love my demon shadow jumpb:dirty, 35m range, can possibly even spark from safe zone and WTH! instant teleport to target in certain places such as Silver Pool. I like 3 sparking a lot in pvp too and just to scare people but if you're gonna use it, at least know what you're gonna do. Shadow jump is one of the most unique & most useful skills to use but honestly all these sins... even 10x sins i squad with never use it.... since i'm on the topic, Nv Run bosses/ If you're doing chests at the end... walk, walk, teleports to npc, while everyone holy paths to other side of the room

    b:laugh
  • QuickClaw - Lost City
    QuickClaw - Lost City Posts: 130 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    _Leif - Lost City wrote: »
    I trip spark in pvp all the time. It's honestly not as suicidal as you'd think provided that you're somewhat strategic about it (ie not sparking in the middle of a crowd). While properly geared sage sins can oneshot many many players, it's really the interval sins that can kill high HP barbs/BMs etc (without bramble rage).

    The only real problem for an interval sin is when your opponent absolute domains/expels right as you start your attack. Robe classes in particular will mash AD/expel the second they see you on their damage log. Obviously the easiest way to counter this is to oneshot them, which is very doable for pre-99/non-event geared robes/light armor classes.

    As soon as you start attacking mages with +10 event ornaments and nirvana robes, however, it becomes much more difficult. Yes, the oneshot is still possible (especially with God of Frenzy proc and genie buffs), but really you're just placing it in the hands of % procs. If you don't crit or proc frenzy, you're going to get sealed/slept/stunned/destroyed before you can channel your next attack.

    So, if you can't kill them in one shot, you have to settle for stabbing them as many times as possible before they pop immunity. Easiest thing to do is position yourself as far as possible from them within range of shadow jump, buff up, triple spark, restealth, inner harmony, shadow jump, normal attacks + tangling mire + occult ice. From personal experience, it takes 2-3 second for a competent pvper to pop immune after I start attacking (there seems to be a second delay from when you activate to when it takes effect). With 5 aps, you can easily get in 10-20 attacks before they are able to respond. If you can't kill a robe/LA class in 10-20 attacks with tangling mire activated, you are NOT going to be able to kill them 1 on 1.

    Even if you don't have enough space to triple spark safely, you can simply double spark, activate relentless courage, and continue in the same manner.

    You sir, are a terrible sin. please stop talking.
    Frankieraye:
    I'm not too worried about susa really. r9 does not exist in the real world
  • _Leif - Lost City
    _Leif - Lost City Posts: 369 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    QuickClaw - Lost City wrote: »
    You sir, are a terrible sin. please stop talking.

    I guess all those essence i kill are just worse than me b:surrender
  • Regenbogen - Lost City
    Regenbogen - Lost City Posts: 1,559 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    try using rank9 dagger with chill of the deep,dot sharding in armor and jones bless...b:cry
    i am waiting for you my little flagcarriers b:kiss
  • Olbaze - Sanctuary
    Olbaze - Sanctuary Posts: 4,242 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Regenbogen - Lost City wrote: »
    try using rank9 dagger with chill of the deep,dot sharding in armor and jones bless...b:cry

    Something tells me that the DoTs in armor wouldn't serve much purpose at that point. I'd rather use Primevals for vita.
    I am Olba. Not Ol, not Baze nor Blaze. And even less would I go by Olblaze. Please, take a second to read a person's username.
    If you see b:cute be sure to take a second, calm look at anything I said.
  • Regenbogen - Lost City
    Regenbogen - Lost City Posts: 1,559 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Olbaze - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Something tells me that the DoTs in armor wouldn't serve much purpose at that point. I'd rather use Primevals for vita.

    the purpose is +24aktlv b:surrender
    i am waiting for you my little flagcarriers b:kiss
  • Olbaze - Sanctuary
    Olbaze - Sanctuary Posts: 4,242 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Regenbogen - Lost City wrote: »
    the purpose is +24aktlv b:surrender

    Yeah and you already have 90 Attack Levels, at least.

    Since Attack Level > Defense Level at this point obviously, the damage multiplier is just 1+(A-D)%.

    Now:
    1* Enemy has 0 Defense Levels:
    [1+(114-0)%]/[1+(90-0)%]
    =(1+1.14)/1.9
    =2.14/1.9
    =~1.13

    2* Enemy has 58 Defense Levels (24x JoSD, Daily Defense Blessing, event belt + neck)
    [1+(114-58)%]/[1+(90-58)%]
    =(1+0.56)/(1+0.32)
    =1.56/1.32
    =~1.18

    So basically, you're sacrificing 240 Vitality (3,120 life + defenses) for 13-18% more damage against most people.

    Considering the kind of damage you'd already do with the R9 dagger, the extra 13-18% is only meaningful against people with similar gear. And with R9, the damage is so huge that 1v1 is a contest of who hits first, not who hits for the most. However, the extra life and defenses just might save you, whereas the extra damage will be insignificant.

    My point: The effectiveness of additional Attack Levels decreases when the difference between your Attack Levels and the enemy's Defense Levels increases. That is, Attack Levels suffer from diminishing returns.
    I am Olba. Not Ol, not Baze nor Blaze. And even less would I go by Olblaze. Please, take a second to read a person's username.
    If you see b:cute be sure to take a second, calm look at anything I said.
  • johhnyboi1232
    johhnyboi1232 Posts: 3 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    _Leif - Lost City wrote: »
    It's impossible for a full rank 9 sin to be 5.0

    /you're an idiot

    A 4.0 sin with rank 9 daggers is probably the best balance between interval and damage per hit (rank 9 daggers are the highest damage daggers period). Note you'd need every single piece of interval gear in the game in order to compensate for the fact that rank 9 has no interval bonus tho. You could drop down to 3.33 aps and get yourself some decent ornaments (cube neck + warsong belt) to bolster your pdef. Or you could even go full rank 9 and shard full + 2 DEF stones (total of 71 DEF level; 86 DEF level with anni box). It's more or less impossible for you to die at this point unless you're fighting someone that's stacked in attack level.

    Lot of choices for a lot of different styles
    did he say full r9? no now ****
  • ImNotFiveAps - Dreamweaver
    ImNotFiveAps - Dreamweaver Posts: 458 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    johhnyboi1232 wrote: »
    did he say full r9? no now ****

    Threads over a year old... you sdfu and stop necroing threads >_>
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Olbaze - Sanctuary
    Olbaze - Sanctuary Posts: 4,242 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    johhnyboi1232 wrote: »
    did he say full r9? no now ****

    It's impossible for any sin using Rank 9 dagger to be 5 aps, so his point is still valid.
    I am Olba. Not Ol, not Baze nor Blaze. And even less would I go by Olblaze. Please, take a second to read a person's username.
    If you see b:cute be sure to take a second, calm look at anything I said.
  • fabrizionaidu
    fabrizionaidu Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2012
    loooooooool this threads to old
  • CritCat - Archosaur
    CritCat - Archosaur Posts: 608 Arc User
    edited May 2012
    lol, didn't realize it's a necro.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Current Sin Build:
    pwcalc.com/b6540a34278d977d
    Current Wizard Build:
    pwcalc.com/068f7e40791a3be6
  • _Skai_ - Raging Tide
    _Skai_ - Raging Tide Posts: 3,407 Arc User
    edited May 2012
    At least he realized at some point, unlike most other necros.
    [SIGPIC]Octavia is best pony[/SIGPIC]
    Vicious's Brony. Brohoof!
    youtube.com/user/SkaiPW - Assassin PvE/PvP Videos!
  • SpazzMcAps - Harshlands
    SpazzMcAps - Harshlands Posts: 2,561 Arc User
    edited May 2012
    _Skai_ - Raging Tide wrote: »
    At least he realized at some point, unlike most other necros.

    How are you not female 0.0
  • _Skai_ - Raging Tide
    _Skai_ - Raging Tide Posts: 3,407 Arc User
    edited May 2012
    SpazzMcAps - Harshlands wrote: »
    How are you not female 0.0

    I never been o.O. I stated many times already that I'm male playing a female toon.

    Does the title Brony not give you some idea? XD Bro + pony.
    [SIGPIC]Octavia is best pony[/SIGPIC]
    Vicious's Brony. Brohoof!
    youtube.com/user/SkaiPW - Assassin PvE/PvP Videos!
  • SpazzMcAps - Harshlands
    SpazzMcAps - Harshlands Posts: 2,561 Arc User
    edited May 2012
    _Skai_ - Raging Tide wrote: »
    I never been o.O. I stated many times already that I'm male playing a female toon.

    Does the title Brony not give you some idea? XD Bro + pony.

    I actually never saw that, ah well there goes my fantasy of marrying someone rich
  • Geshwur - Raging Tide
    Geshwur - Raging Tide Posts: 570 Arc User
    edited May 2012
    _Skai_ - Raging Tide wrote: »
    I never been o.O. I stated many times already that I'm male playing a female toon.

    Does the title Brony not give you some idea? XD Bro + pony.

    Since the point of this thread is moot now anyway... Can you explain wtf is wrong with that pink pony? >.> Seriously.
    Current Gears
    pwcalc.com/90f636550cbd5beb
  • _Skai_ - Raging Tide
    _Skai_ - Raging Tide Posts: 3,407 Arc User
    edited May 2012
    Geshwur - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Since the point of this thread is moot now anyway... Can you explain wtf is wrong with that pink pony? >.> Seriously.

    Nothing is wrong with the ponies. I just love the show lol. Nothing wrong with expressing it.
    [SIGPIC]Octavia is best pony[/SIGPIC]
    Vicious's Brony. Brohoof!
    youtube.com/user/SkaiPW - Assassin PvE/PvP Videos!
  • Geshwur - Raging Tide
    Geshwur - Raging Tide Posts: 570 Arc User
    edited May 2012
    _Skai_ - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Nothing is wrong with the ponies. I just love the show lol. Nothing wrong with expressing it.

    I still think something is wrong with that pink one. x.x
    Current Gears
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  • SpazzMcAps - Harshlands
    SpazzMcAps - Harshlands Posts: 2,561 Arc User
    edited May 2012
    _Skai_ - Raging Tide wrote: »
    I never been o.O. I stated many times already that I'm male playing a female toon.

    Does the title Brony not give you some idea? XD Bro + pony.
    well someone on hl keeps saying its gender neutral

    Geshwur - Raging Tide wrote: »
    I still think something is wrong with that pink one. x.x

    i agree there is nothing wrong with liking the show. i am proving you right
    so i serached for "My little Pony friendhsip is magic pink pony" on google images i came up with this
  • Phoenix_Eye - Heavens Tear
    Phoenix_Eye - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,681 Arc User
    edited May 2012
    i remember those ponies since i was 4 , weird happy childhood. I guess i like them even now (18 in 6 days.)
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    <--- MALE Veno ..... Moved to G W 2 or maybe not completely , don't know ...... PW addiction
    {That TT xbow chain is one that describes someone's bowel movements after having too much spicy food. A loud **** (Thundercrack), then a burning sensation (Flash Fire), followed by an explosion of multi-colored poo-confetti (Blinding Radiance). Excellent...} By Quilue
  • Geshwur - Raging Tide
    Geshwur - Raging Tide Posts: 570 Arc User
    edited May 2012
    SpazzMcAps - Harshlands wrote: »
    well someone on hl keeps saying its gender neutral




    i agree there is nothing wrong with liking the show. i am proving you right
    so i serached for "My little Pony friendhsip is magic pink pony" on google images i came up with this

    Never said anything was wrong with the show... Lol xD Just that the pink one wasn't all there. xD Which... IDR the episode number, but one of them proved me right.. The one when she had the party and everyone declined the invitation cause they were planning a party for her, so she had the party with inanimate objects and went crazy and yeah... x.x

    I think this actually sums it up quite well
    Current Gears
    pwcalc.com/90f636550cbd5beb
  • Geshwur - Raging Tide
    Geshwur - Raging Tide Posts: 570 Arc User
    edited May 2012
    Phoenix_Eye - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    i remember those ponies since i was 4 , weird happy childhood. I guess i like them even now (18 in 6 days.)

    I'm a 20 year old male. xD

    Me when people say it's only for little girls.
    Current Gears
    pwcalc.com/90f636550cbd5beb
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