Fist BM from level 1?

kitchikan
kitchikan Posts: 1 Arc User
edited December 2010 in Blademaster
Is that possible? Ive never played a BM and was wondering this.... I wanna use fist/claw (I think fist and claw are the same thing).


If anyone could give me your thoughts from using fist/claw from level 1... that would be great. Thanks =)

P.S.
(I have money for interval gear later).
Post edited by kitchikan on
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Comments

  • Okeano - Harshlands
    Okeano - Harshlands Posts: 4,943 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    My second BM was fists from the start. You don't need AoEs til later anyways so starting with fists actually save you pots.
  • kitchikan
    kitchikan Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Okeano - Harshlands wrote: »
    My second BM was fists from the start. You don't need AoEs til later anyways so starting with fists actually save you pots.

    And are fist and claw the same thing? Cause I see level 30 Legendary Claws.... could I use those AND fist with the 3str/2dex build?
  • MoonUsagi - Heavens Tear
    MoonUsagi - Heavens Tear Posts: 4,377 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    If just for non aoe grinding sword beat other BM weapons. Decent speed and decent damage.
    But since spirit and coins isn't easy to gather people chose to using axe and pole arm. (for aoe purpose later)
    Weapon duration is reduced each time you attack, so fist claw maybe not really a good choice.

    Before interval times (before there lots of interval) most BM just use fist claw for the disable and use other weapon for grinding.
    So i think it better to use fist only after getting decent amount of interval gear or just to DPS in instances.

    but if you really want to use fist claw go ahead, it ok
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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  • kitchikan
    kitchikan Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    MoonUsagi - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    If just for non aoe grinding sword beat other BM weapons. Decent speed and decent damage.
    But since spirit and coins isn't easy to gather people chose to using axe and pole arm. (for aoe purpose later)
    Weapon duration is reduced each time you attack, so fist claw maybe not really a good choice.

    Before interval times (before there lots of interval) most BM just use fist claw for the disable and use other weapon for grinding.
    So i think it better to use fist only after getting decent amount of interval gear or just to DPS in instances.

    but if you really want to use fist claw go ahead, it ok

    Na... I wanna use Fist/claw from level 1-110. I wanna see If I can do it =)
  • Ajani - Harshlands
    Ajani - Harshlands Posts: 1,170 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    :Ob:laugh
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  • _DarkSeph_ - Sanctuary
    _DarkSeph_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,294 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    You CAN do it without much trouble, but you'd be nerfing yourself.

    From level 1-30 axes ARE the superior weapon. Even for 1v1 grinding. You get supply stash hammers at lv5 and lv20. At level 30 axes will still be superior unless you can splash out the 1m+ on Sting Of Thorns. Fists don't actually start to really shine until Annihilator of souls at lv60, then it starts getting a lot better from there.

    However, fist DPS is pretty similar so it's not a huge deal.

    Still, don't just stick to pure fist. Pure-axe BM's are often looked down on most, but imo there is nothing worse than a BM who chooses to purely use fists. The axe is an amazing weapon, so try to make good use of it too, squads will be a great deal more thankful for it.
  • kitchikan
    kitchikan Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    _DarkSeph_ - Sanctuary wrote: »
    You CAN do it without much trouble, but you'd be nerfing yourself.

    From level 1-30 axes ARE the superior weapon. Even for 1v1 grinding. You get supply stash hammers at lv5 and lv20. At level 30 axes will still be superior unless you can splash out the 1m+ on Sting Of Thorns. Fists don't actually start to really shine until Annihilator of souls at lv60, then it starts getting a lot better from there.

    However, fist DPS is pretty similar so it's not a huge deal.

    Still, don't just stick to pure fist. Pure-axe BM's are often looked down on most, but imo there is nothing worse than a BM who chooses to purely use fists. The axe is an amazing weapon, so try to make good use of it too, squads will be a great deal more thankful for it.

    Im not gonna go axe just because someone wants me to o.O.

    I play the game how I enjoy playing and Im 18 atm and still enjoying fist/claw.... so yeah. Pure is fine. If parties dont want me... Ill find another. HF is the only axe skill that will make a difference... thats not a party changer.
  • _DarkSeph_ - Sanctuary
    _DarkSeph_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,294 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    At the very least go with lv1 HF and lv1 aoe's for FCC, trust me you'll be grateful for it. :P

    Guess I understand where you're coming from though, game is meant to be played for fun after all, not doing what everyone else tells you. Good luck with it.
  • Joshcja - Sanctuary
    Joshcja - Sanctuary Posts: 3,502 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    went fist from lvl 1 never regreted it

    axes suck for 1v1 grinding even at low levels

    stat for fist/axe build and just use fists till you need aoe's (will happen at about 6x/7x)
    Gifs are hard to make work here
  • Serinregis - Lost City
    Serinregis - Lost City Posts: 166 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    kitchikan wrote: »
    Im not gonna go axe just because someone wants me to o.O.

    I play the game how I enjoy playing and Im 18 atm and still enjoying fist/claw.... so yeah. Pure is fine. If parties dont want me... Ill find another. HF is the only axe skill that will make a difference... thats not a party changer.

    you don't understand, heaven's flame IS a party changer, without it your party will deal less damage overall than with it (duh) and will thus complete difficult instances with more difficulty than necessary.

    Trust me when I say, if you do not at least have axes available for HF, you will build up a bad rep and will NOT be able to get into parties.

    I (on my cleric) once ran Frost with a sword bm, our tank pulled the first wave of mobs and the sword bm stayed sword and pulled out an thoroughly underwhelming aoe cycle that forced him to use single target skills more often than not. Our tank asked him "no axes?" he said no, and then 3 people left the party .__.

    Axes are HANDS DOWN the BEST AoE weapon there is (you can even argue that it and maybe pole are the only aoe weapons) and will definitely be needed for an easy time running higher leveled instances.

    Of course you always have the choice of grinding your way to 100, but prepare to sink more time into this game than you want to to do that.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    b:dirtyb:dirtyb:dirty
  • Sakubatou - Sanctuary
    Sakubatou - Sanctuary Posts: 4,001 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Joshcja - Sanctuary wrote: »
    went fist from lvl 1 never regreted it

    axes suck for 1v1 grinding even at low levels

    stat for fist/axe build and just use fists till you need aoe's (will happen at about 6x/7x)

    ^This^ Joshcja and I tend to agree on alot of things.

    The only benefit of axes have over fist at lower levels is they come as quest rewards and are in your stash.

    Nothing like being a low level with almost no defense, hp or mp pool, and watching yourself attack .83 times a second while mobs annihilate you. Not alot of low levels have the def/hp to aoe grind, axes main benefit. Even though fist dps only slightly edges out axe dps before interval you will often kill a mob in less hits because you're chipping away at the hp, not taking chunks. With fists your dps is often best skill-less, so you'll save on mp pots, too, and with getting sparks so quickly you'll be able to spark more (more hp and dps) and use diamond sutra more often to heal yourself. The only fist skill worth having past level 1 until late in the game is cyclone heal (DBB for channel canceling later too).

    To maximize damage with fist you'll still want 3 str and 2 dex. Even if you plan to only use fist, having 3 other weapons in your arsenal will become valuable and something you enjoy as it adds more dimensions than auto attacking. Basically, a bm with only 1 or 2 weapons is like a barb with only human skills, a cleric with no seals or attacks, a psychic with only white marrow, a veno with no pet,...

    I could always use my other weapons but axes weren't needed till 70+, sword and pole 80+. Currently I use fist 90% of the time, axe7%, pole 2%, and sword 1%.
    Seven 100+ characters leveled the hard way. Free to play. Mystic, Psychic, and Wizard left to level. b:victory
  • kitchikan
    kitchikan Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Serinregis - Lost City wrote: »
    you don't understand, heaven's flame IS a party changer, without it your party will deal less damage overall than with it (duh) and will thus complete difficult instances with more difficulty than necessary.

    Trust me when I say, if you do not at least have axes available for HF, you will build up a bad rep and will NOT be able to get into parties.

    I (on my cleric) once ran Frost with a sword bm, our tank pulled the first wave of mobs and the sword bm stayed sword and pulled out an thoroughly underwhelming aoe cycle that forced him to use single target skills more often than not. Our tank asked him "no axes?" he said no, and then 3 people left the party .__.

    Axes are HANDS DOWN the BEST AoE weapon there is (you can even argue that it and maybe pole are the only aoe weapons) and will definitely be needed for an easy time running higher leveled instances.

    Of course you always have the choice of grinding your way to 100, but prepare to sink more time into this game than you want to to do that.


    I thought HF only affected YOUR dmg... thats what someone told me....

    And can I wear any kind of axes and cast HF then switch back to fist? Or do I have to stay with axe for the skill to keep going?
  • Aelo - Harshlands
    Aelo - Harshlands Posts: 75 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    HF amplifies the damage that the target takes. That means that the damage of all persons who attack the amped target will be increased over the duration of the amp.

    You can cast HF once you have an axe, poleaxe, hammer or polehammer equipped.

    Once HF has been cast, you can switch to any other weapon e.g. fist and continue to attack the target. For the duration of the amp, the damage of your attacks to the target will be increased.
  • Michael_Dark - Lost City
    Michael_Dark - Lost City Posts: 9,091 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    HF is the only 100% Amplify Damage effect in the game. Demon Dragons is the most broken skill in the game. Learn it. Love it. Live it.

    Triple Spark > Cloud Eruption > Dragons > switch to fists = fooking epic raep.
    I post in forums. This one and others. That's why I post.
  • kaktusovsok
    kaktusovsok Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Okay,I want to be Fistmaster, but if i add 3str 2dex where the vit goes?
  • Kyrael - Dreamweaver
    Kyrael - Dreamweaver Posts: 140 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    kaktusovsok wrote: »
    Okay,I want to be Fistmaster, but if i add 3str 2dex where the vit goes?

    Nowhere. b:shutup
  • ArchSaber - Sanctuary
    ArchSaber - Sanctuary Posts: 1,440 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Michael_Dark - Lost City wrote: »
    HF is the only 100% Amplify Damage effect in the game. Demon Dragons is the most broken skill in the game. Learn it. Love it. Live it.

    Triple Spark > Cloud Eruption > Dragons > switch to fists = fooking epic raep.

    I do that combo with my fail vanities and Brigand died in 30 secs. But of course I died right before boss die, barbs are so useless.

    You also forgot to add demon DBB to that combo.

    Frenzied Rage proc's description says it doubles physical attack. Isn't that 100%?
    AP classes are a real butt pounding...
  • Taiako - Dreamweaver
    Taiako - Dreamweaver Posts: 48 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Newbie fist BM here.

    I've been fist since level 7. My build currently is 3 str, 4 dex, and 3 vit every 2 levels. I've been wearing light armor since level 12. Planning to use ranked gear from 30 on, since I won't be able to use normal heavy armor my level.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • mrkbbjj
    mrkbbjj Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    _DarkSeph_ - Sanctuary wrote: »
    You CAN do it without much trouble, but you'd be nerfing yourself.

    From level 1-30 axes ARE the superior weapon. Even for 1v1 grinding. You get supply stash hammers at lv5 and lv20. At level 30 axes will still be superior unless you can splash out the 1m+ on Sting Of Thorns. Fists don't actually start to really shine until Annihilator of souls at lv60, then it starts getting a lot better from there.

    However, fist DPS is pretty similar so it's not a huge deal.

    Still, don't just stick to pure fist. Pure-axe BM's are often looked down on most, but imo there is nothing worse than a BM who chooses to purely use fists. The axe is an amazing weapon, so try to make good use of it too, squads will be a great deal more thankful for it.

    I'm curious to know why a pure Axe-BM is looked down apon? I only use axe build right now and not sure why it would be bad? I understand all skills are AOE's,but /shrug.
  • ArchSaber - Sanctuary
    ArchSaber - Sanctuary Posts: 1,440 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    mrkbbjj wrote: »
    I'm curious to know why a pure Axe-BM is looked down apon? I only use axe build right now and not sure why it would be bad? I understand all skills are AOE's,but /shrug.

    Axe destroys mp, fail accuracy, fist is twice the damage from 1-30.
    AP classes are a real butt pounding...
  • Amurora - Heavens Tear
    Amurora - Heavens Tear Posts: 111 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Sorry. Somehow my "Post new Topic" Ended up a Reply.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • No_peas - Heavens Tear
    No_peas - Heavens Tear Posts: 34 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Cool thread.

    ive just started my Fist BM, been fist from level...(whatever level you can wear fists).
    Am stated as heavy armour too. Was wondering if this is right, or should i be using light armour so i can put points into Vit?
    Cos at the mo, i have 23 vit, and the rest HAS to go into strength and dex so that i can wear the correct level fists and armour.
    Was thinking since i cant stat Vit, then should i be sharding with citrines in armour? Or should i stick to pdef?

    Last question, when can i start wearing -int gear?

    Thanx
  • Sakubatou - Sanctuary
    Sakubatou - Sanctuary Posts: 4,001 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    No_peas - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Cool thread.

    ive just started my Fist BM, been fist from level...(whatever level you can wear fists).
    Am stated as heavy armour too. Was wondering if this is right, or should i be using light armour so i can put points into Vit?
    Cos at the mo, i have 23 vit, and the rest HAS to go into strength and dex so that i can wear the correct level fists and armour.
    Was thinking since i cant stat Vit, then should i be sharding with citrines in armour? Or should i stick to pdef?

    Last question, when can i start wearing -int gear?

    Thanx

    This really should get its own thread, rather than hijacking someone elses:

    but since its along the same lines I'll answer it. HA is what you should wear since you are going to tank. Only acceptions are the dq bracers at level 60, and then some of the tt90/tt99 LA gear if you so chose.

    To be able to wear axes you need 3 strength per level and 2.5 strength per level for HA. To wear fist you need 2 dex per level. This leaves no extra stats to add to vit unless you manage your gear to consistently have the strength and dex add-ons you need, which for most people is way too much work. The other option is add to vit and just don't plan on wearing on level weapons/armor. You'll be fine with base vit, or 23 vit since you already have added it. Make up for this with hp sharded armors, and if you have the coin get +1-2 refines on early gear.

    And the first interval armor I believe isn't till level 60 (DQ bracers, running 15 mil+ in sanctuary). Most -int gear is at least level 90+. Search function for lists.
    ArchSaber - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Axe destroys mp, fail accuracy, fist is twice the damage from 1-30.

    Umm... source? They are actually relatively equal damage until -int is added, not counting misses. Swords actually out dd fist 1-30 when auto attacking.
    Seven 100+ characters leveled the hard way. Free to play. Mystic, Psychic, and Wizard left to level. b:victory
  • Darth_Puggy - Archosaur
    Darth_Puggy - Archosaur Posts: 176 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    As you can clearly see here, the BM community is just all over the place. Which makes sense, I suppose, considering the vast variety of possibilities they have available. Some said pure axe are fail, others say swords are fail, others say pure fist = fail, I haven't seen anyone poo-poo polearms yet. For a change.
    I have heard some axe skills are very important in a few endgame instances.
    Maybe the faster attack rate makes fists a good survival strategy for lower levels? Some said yes, some said no.
    Whatever you do, I'd recommend stat 3str/2dex so you can wear Heavy Armor. Because if you're going to wear LA on a BM, go roll an Assassin.
    That's just my opinion.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Darth_Puggy - Archosaur
    Darth_Puggy - Archosaur Posts: 176 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Oops, accidental double post.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • _DarkSeph_ - Sanctuary
    _DarkSeph_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,294 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    ArchSaber - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Axe destroys mp, fail accuracy, fist is twice the damage from 1-30.

    Classic ^^ You've probably read a few high level peoples guides, worshiped their opinions hoping it would make you like them and glued a pair of fists to your BM. Have you even used an axe besides occasional frost AOE's?

    Up to level 30, axe/hammer is closer to twice the damage of fists (not literally, but you get the idea). You get very decent stash hammers at 5 and 20, while the average fist user is stuck with 1 star NPC unless they waste time manufacturing a weapon they out-level in a day. At lv30 you get access to Sting Of Thorns and things even out.

    The loss of accuracy doesn't affect you much until 50, and stops again at 77.

    Axes don't destroy MP. As a past-pure axe use I never actually bought a pot in my life. Auto attack will kill most mobs in pretty much the same time until 60+. Axe users spamming skills on 1v1 mobs are nubs.

    Yes fists are amazing and yes pure-axe is a restricted and foolish path to choose, but a good BM should at least know the full potential of every weapon they use. =/
  • vilppa
    vilppa Posts: 6 Arc User
    edited December 2010
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    peaceb:kissb:byeb:cuteb:victory
  • Kientei - Heavens Tear
    Kientei - Heavens Tear Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Nice opinions DarkSeph, though I think its kinda funny everyone has talked about every weapon except polearms. Guess not many think much of them anymore. They are sort of in the middle of swords and axes in strength, stat requirements, and skills, generally speaking.

    I was a pure axe user up to around 40 until I stopped playing for awhile. Thinking of starting over after **** up on my stats. I already know how important axe skills are down the road. The fists DPS is a nice thing, and I also like swords...no mean comments please ^^.

    I'm thinking of using some merch swords with early levels while using those stash hammers when I get them, probably moving into fists as I keep leveling. Lot's of great comments here but my question is, what about skills? Should I get level 1 fist skills and then pour all my SP into axe skills? Maybe a couple skills to put in more than others? It's frustrating being a BM sometimes. Axe skills for the future, fist mastery for better attacking, can't forget the awesome defense and healing buffs that the BM gets too. I'm at a loss...I think I'm drowning...XD
  • XxZavxX - Raging Tide
    XxZavxX - Raging Tide Posts: 603 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    I actually have used both fists/axes from get go on my 2nd BM. I like fists when I am being lazy and just spark constantly. But if I am hypering of course I'll go axes...

    Dmg wise, eh, leveling is so fast and I manufactured my ****.. that I think fists did more damage, but axes were more helpful.
  • XxZavxX - Raging Tide
    XxZavxX - Raging Tide Posts: 603 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Kientei - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Nice opinions DarkSeph, though I think its kinda funny everyone has talked about every weapon except polearms. Guess not many think much of them anymore. They are sort of in the middle of swords and axes in strength, stat requirements, and skills, generally speaking.

    I was a pure axe user up to around 40 until I stopped playing for awhile. Thinking of starting over after **** up on my stats. I already know how important axe skills are down the road. The fists DPS is a nice thing, and I also like swords...no mean comments please ^^.

    I'm thinking of using some merch swords with early levels while using those stash hammers when I get them, probably moving into fists as I keep leveling. Lot's of great comments here but my question is, what about skills? Should I get level 1 fist skills and then pour all my SP into axe skills? Maybe a couple skills to put in more than others? It's frustrating being a BM sometimes. Axe skills for the future, fist mastery for better attacking, can't forget the awesome defense and healing buffs that the BM gets too. I'm at a loss...I think I'm drowning...XD
    What I have done with skills since I use both fists and axes is that I have pumped both weapon masteries..

    Maxed Highland Cleave, raised the other AOEs a bit..

    And when I go fist I just spark constantly, so I haven't really bothered with those skill much.


    my BM is 52 right now..

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