Reflect or bloodhunger?

Brionni - Harshlands
Brionni - Harshlands Posts: 20 Arc User
edited November 2010 in Venomancer
My wanderer got protect, strong and claw, but what final skill is worth choosing, reflect or bloodhunger when it comes to bosses? Maybe bloodhunger gives a bit more survivability? Then I can sacrifice additional damage from reflect.
Post edited by Brionni - Harshlands on

Comments

  • MANray_ - Sanctuary
    MANray_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,311 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    First of all, congratulations on your Wanderer, it truly must be a unique and very powerful pet. My advice to you would be to simply skill Bash and save the other rare skills for a different pet.

    The reason for this is it would simply be the best way to take advantage of your pet's high dps+claw. Protect and Strong already make it a very ressilient pet and Bloodhunger's relatively long cooldown and one shot use would make it inefficient for both attack and defense. Reflect would mean no aggro/attack skill on your pet which comes down to being much more of a disadvantage even if reflect would allow for better crowd control. Already you have made great choices and produced a pet that's both ressilient and a superb DD. Sometimes less is more.
  • SashaGray - Heavens Tear
    SashaGray - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,765 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    bloodhunger is really only even somewhat useful as a PVP skill, and then only with a pet with a lot of HP, it wont give you any help in PVE because the cooldown is too long to be reliable, and the damage dealt isn't any more effective than a regular hit on a mob.

    for PVP it can be effective, but i cant see putting it on anything besides a nix, and putting it in the last skill slot and not getting fleshream, i wouldnt do it, since fleshream is so much cheaper depending on actual HP of the pet will usually do more damage. i have played with it on other servers and the effects of bloodhunger can be pretty devestating in a 1v1 battle, much more so than fleshream. the skill description may be a little off, but since it is pretty much used, it probably escaped the minor localization changes

    also the damage dealt is immediate, while fleshream is over time, so there is no purify/genie spell for it unlike flesh ream, and is also so rare, that nobody will know what it is when they get hit by it in pvp.

    since you've already dumped a bunch of coin into your DW i imagine your gonna keep it, either reflect or bash would be fine in the last slot, since DW especially w/ claw will do more damage than a herc, bash might be superfluous for especially if your tanking [?] bosses with it, and reflect will open up aoe possibilities. for 2nd and 3rd OHT map grinding especially, reflect will be much better for you than bash, for open maps and non-[?] mobs its kind of a toss-up.

    whenever someone replaces a skill to put bless on their herc, they either discard bash or protect (i would go with discarding bash, protect is extremely important for TT bosses) they never discard reflect.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Brionni - Harshlands
    Brionni - Harshlands Posts: 20 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    MANray_:ty
    the effects of bloodhunger can be pretty devestating in a 1v1 battle, much more so than fleshream.
    Now I know how to equip my skatefishb:victory claw+bloodhunger must work nice,
    ty for repliesb:thanks
  • MANray_ - Sanctuary
    MANray_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,311 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    @SashaGray

    I had no idea Bloodhunger was used for PvP, it's always good to learn something new...

    There's something i may be missing here however. According to Ecatomb a lvl 100 Nix gets 3446 HP. Add 30% from Blessing (1033) and you get 4479. Let's say you've got the Nix down to 1 hp for a best case scenario, that's 4478/2 for Bloodhunger, 2239 damage, which hardly seems devastating compared to Ream (that's a base 4096 +30% from Claw, 5324.8, times two, 10649) even if you only get 1 tick in (3549). IMO Bloodhunger appears to be situational, but i may be missing something here since you make it clear descriptions may be incorrect.

    As for Reflect, it will only contribute to damage when tanking, which even if the Wanderer can handle because of Protect and Strong is not it's ideal role. The stat it comes closer to the herc in is Phys def and this is still a difference of 681 at lvl 100. Given the much lower hp (a difference of 1406) the Wanderer is not only far from the tanking prowess of a herc but even that of a similarly skilled GW. Don't get me wrong, i think making the pet a near tank through adding Protect and Strong is brilliant, but turning into a pet fully devoted to this role seems wasteful. Given it would become much as a herc with blessing for aggro this would make it almost exclusively a soloing pet (there's a reason Claw is rarely recommended for hercs). Yes, it will handle crowds, but not nearly to the same extent as herc, and will be missing a further 9.5% damage increase Bash would have provided which i fail to see how you would consider superfluous. That is a 14.5% advantage in damage output when compared to a multi-elemental Wanderer (3 Bashes).

    To me it comes to making the Wanderer both the best dps available to practical purposes AND remarkably ressilient vs. turning it into a tank that would be much weaker than a similarly skilled Shaodu Cub despite it's dps advantage. Yes, this is only my opinion.

    Edit; @Brionni YW, whatever you decide i have no doubt you'll have some of the most awesome pets in this version of the game.
  • Brionni - Harshlands
    Brionni - Harshlands Posts: 20 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Right, I did not intend to make a herc out of poor DWb:laugh And I know my big bear would profit more of legendary skills than the wanderer. DW is still a mediocre tank even if stronged and protected, its just my whim to enhance him in that way, eventually I rolled veno only to have him by my side and I enjoy him so much that I will not ditch him even for all hercs in the worldb:laugh
  • MANray_ - Sanctuary
    MANray_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,311 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    A quick question to those experienced in using Bloodhunger. Ecatomb lists Bloodthirst as a requisite, does Bloodhunger replace Bloodthirst as an upgrade or does it use a second skill slot?
  • SashaGray - Heavens Tear
    SashaGray - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,765 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    i think there is something wrong in the description, i did a bit of testing with another player and bloodhunger would occasionally grab up around 15k HP off the other player, though they where running around with between 30k and 40k hp.

    im pretty sure it did take 2 pet slots to learn, 1 for bloodthirst 3 and a second slot for blood hunger, in which case you would have to drop pounce =( , learn blood hunger, forget bloodthirst, and relearn pounce.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • MANray_ - Sanctuary
    MANray_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,311 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    There really is something wrong with the description if Bloodhunger can hit for 15k, although i'm guessing other "servers" to mean a certain kind we cannot discuss in this forums and which may not be properly coded... It would be really interesting to find out.

    Anyway, this would make it a moot point as far as the OP's pet is concerned, not just for his decission of trying the skill on a Skatefish, but because it would require the Wanderer to loose a legendary skill.

    Now, the description in Ecatomb (i'm inclined to think originally from PW-MY, although names for skills are localized for PWI and i've never heard of pet skills working differently in that version) makes it perfectly clear is half of a pet's missing hp.

    Thanks for the info SashaGray.
  • sleepcat
    sleepcat Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    i think there is something wrong in the description, i did a bit of testing with another player and bloodhunger would occasionally grab up around 15k HP off the other player, though they where running around with between 30k and 40k hp.

    This has caught my attention. I would be interested in helping gather data to further study this skill. :p
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Aniella - Harshlands
    Aniella - Harshlands Posts: 729 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    bloodhuger is a skiils, that u need another "skill" 2 learn and t takes 2 spots, not worth it, if i was u i had just learn it bleed,
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    QQ If i did Crazy stone at 3x AND not 6x, i had been lvl 105 now!
    Didnt know about Bh/CrazyStone before lvl 6x LOL