Question about LA.

First question I would have to ask, what Goal are you hoping to gain from the LA build.

NO dont go LA cause itll cost you a ton of coin to restat to AA at higher lvls , your aiming for high pdef for what reason ?? are you doing pvp at the moment, cause if your not than going LA is just a waste , your not tanker you just need to have enough hp at these lvls to make sure you survive 2 or 3 hits till tank takes agro back , pure AA at this lvl with nice enough shards can give out almost similar pdef not to mention that even a small 500 magic attack differnece ,which becomes alot when you reach end game , can be the difference between a charm tick or a one shot in pvp also pure AA willl ave more mp + heal more soo youl be spending lesser on pots

Dawnx_ - Harshlands wrote: »

More Physical defense.

And heres the PW Calc.

http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=43962809d185c6a2

You should really consider a VIT build cleric. Look for some good examples all through here on a vit build, and what play style fits them.

Dawnx_ - Harshlands wrote: »

I'd like an answer to my question though.

I also went LA to PK at later lvls so i don't want to be squishy.

@ Paramedic: My mag attack is around 4.3k to 4.4k. When i went from AA to LA i knew that to be effective i needed to keep my mag attack up or get it higher which i did.

Well from what I remember (not alot tho i'll have to admit -__-') something ~5k magic attack was considered good at 7x. So 4.3-4.4k I guess is below average.

I'd also suggest AA for now which makes it easier to rush levels. You dont want to be pking until you're 9x or 10x and you can decide to restat then if you think LA is still the way to go.

The only reason I have EVER heard someone say they want to be LA for is of course better PKing....because of the p-def circumstance mainly.

A good 100-150 vit build cleric, can virtually get as high IF not higher p-def return as a LA cleric. And become more stronger than an LA cleric in many ways. For one they will still retain their highest m-def potential through gear and mag-points. and will have room to build up p-def in sharding-and in gears, without it affecting HP gain, and losing ANY m-def.

Problem with LA build is you spend so many points into dex to achieve wearing the gear, but your skills are TO SLOW to achieve max benefit of having any crit effects from them often enough to feel it. So you more less have wasted points goin somewhere that wont benefit you near as often as it would in say VIT, as a passive benefit.

Dawnx_ - Harshlands wrote: »

@xxxdsmer if i went HA i wouldn't heal as well.

And will this build work? http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=92e76ad2ec630448

http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=451812660be7b231

That's something like what I had at 77. Can't be arsed to remember exact details of my gear, but it's pretty close. At 80, switch to first chrono adorn. At 90, switch to third attendance ring. Do not get TT70/TT80 armor because it's a waste of money and you don't need TT70/TT80 armor for TT90 green.

P.S. Before anyone QQs about the 54 str, it's the str needed for end-game robes and I'm a lazy ***** that just wanted to put it all in then so I didn't have to worry about it and could just add all five points into mag for the rest of my cleric life. Vit is also capped at 100.

Defense has diminishing returns, that's why in a pinch its usually better to add to vitality unless you'll be getting alot of defense. For instance, between your first and second build you went from ~1700 (35%dr) to 3550 (54%dr). You more than double your pdef but only gain 19% more damage reduction.

T put it another way, the first 1700 pdef gave you 35%dr and the next 1850 only gave you 19%. Diminished returns. And as you get higher later and later in the game it takes more and more defense per percent of damage reduction.

*Vitality has a multiplier effect on both pdef and mdef, as well as adds to hp.
*Adding to magic means you'll heal yourself for more when you are dieing, if you have the time. Less magic and more vit/dex means your heals will impact your hp bar less.
*If you are looking for a little extra defense, lean towards legendary gear over TT gear.
*Clerics come with their own pdef buff, so unlike other classes you will never be without it. For arcane veno's I recommend sharding 1:1 pdef and hp (around there.) For Clerics I'd say 1:3 pdef and hp.
*End game gear/weapons = higher numbers so your multipliers will have more effect.

To answer your inital question about damage at level 77. I am a pure build and I do around 1200 more dmg average then you with my average being near 5500. As for vita builds, I don't know. Then again, my squad probably notices my low hp more than they notice my strong heals. If a cleric had base magic 3 and all stat points in vitality I bet the squad wouldn't notice the weak heals but would be impressed with the clerics high hp...

I've always questioned LA build. People say, it for more physical defense, but LA clerics still die pretty damn fast.

Either, have less damage and take longer to kill, but stay alive a tiny bit.
Or, have more damage, kill faster with better healing, but die more rapidly.
They seem a bit even.

Only benefit I see out of it is maybe higher critical hit rate?

I can see LA as useful early on, and on a PVP server, but as you level up, LA has average pdef, average mdef. Arcane can achieve well more mdef, and as far as phys reduction % is concerned not too enormous of a difference. The reality is, all that bonus STR and bonus DEX won't make up for the constant damage a MAG build has and certainly will not even come remotely close to making up on heals. It's possible to be a LA cleric and do well but it is in fact gimping yourself as your attacks and heals are directly based off weapon and magic attribute.

LaLeLoo - Sanctuary wrote: »

Only benefit I see out of it is maybe higher critical hit rate?

20 Dex points equate to 1% more to your crit rate; therefore, hardly a justifiable advantage. As a caster, you can get a decent crit rate with good gear and zero statted dex and your damage output averages out better than a same level LA with the higher crit rate since your magic attack will be higher overall.

Dawnx_ - Harshlands wrote: »

I'd like an answer to my question though.

I also went LA to PK at later lvls so i don't want to be squishy.

@ Paramedic: My mag attack is around 4.3k to 4.4k. When i went from AA to LA i knew that to be effective i needed to keep my mag attack up or get it higher which i did.

a few people here are bent on making you go vit or pure. I'll try not to be biased on any build. and as for 4.4k matk at 77 that's perfectly fine for LA. pretty decent actually. pwcalc don't wanna pull up for me atm so i can't check the builds that came before and actual stats ect.



LA (your build of choice): you get more pdef then your average pure or vit cleric and that's a given. but your mdef drops (averaged out by your mdef you take more but in pvp it's not a difining factor with how many phys DD's their are in comparison to casters, even most casters will opt to smack you with physical if they are able to aka: BT and plume/razor). LA and vit build have around the same dmg. LA's pdef is a great boost tbh but it becomes less aparent at 80-90+ if you use pdef ornametns on vit/pure. a LA cleric will either use 2 pdef (makes you far higher then vit/pure in pdef) or 1 pdef 1 mag (the difference isn't as large on either defence front and your dmg is less then pure and hp most likely lower then vit).

VIT: higher hp then your average cleric by normally 1k (even vit clerics i know tend to stop around 100 vit). cleric in pvp/pk should aim for around 5k hp. if you can get that in LA or pure then kudo's don't worry much about vit (personal preference). and your pdef is normally same as pure and dmg less. so dmg for some extra hp your choice

pure: most clerics pick this path in favor of the higher dmg vs being a little squishier. my 83 cleric was LA up untill 80 restated to pure at 80 so i can share a few of the actual differences from experience (just not post 90 lol). pure my dmg in pve definitely went up a good chunk that's for certain and my pdef actually went up but I'll explain that here in a moment (kinda did in the LA section but not into details). lower pdef, lower hp, higher dmg

comparison and genral pvp/pk for cleric. heres the thing if you go vit/LA yes you'll take more hits and do less damage but think about this real fast. you gain for example 2k matk at 80ish from LA to pure using a +3 2 immac yaksa (pdef wep). 2k matk in pk is 500. 500 dmg after you add in resistances is more or less 250 (50% reduction) reason it's 250 is since that's either physical or magical depending on the respective skill and armor ect. so is 250 dmg more worth the added 500-1k+ hp or higher pdef is up to you. now as for the reason my matk difference isn't high. my helm is TT80, wep is crit wep yaksa, and +3 belt and amulet of earth so my gear screams give me pdef lol (figuratively speaking of course). if you plan to refine/shard your armor well to hit 5k+ hp then LA is better then vit in my humble opinion (granted that 5k is for like 90-100+'s 3-4k for 80-early 90's should work). if you can refine your weapon nicely to help offset the loss of dmg then either vit or LA are perfectly fine. on the other hand if you can get good refiens on pdef ammy/belt your pdef won't be lacking, dmg will be higher, mdef will be higher, hp can be higher (refine/sharding) so pure is also good. LA gives more hp per refine then arcane so if your planning on going for high refines LA will give you more hp in the long run then the arcane counterparts. your dmg will go down agreed but refining weapon nicely should make it more then doable.

all in all it depends on what you can afford and your personal style. if you like to take more hits magical and physical then vit is good to have. if you like to take mostly physical beating (happens a lot in pvp/pk) then LA with pdef ornament and belt (and a mdef belt/ammy in inventory for the case of psy/wizzy but that may get to expencive late game) then LA is optimal. if you want to hit harder but be generally squishier then go pure. their are downsides and upsides to each of the 3 primary builds all of which good sharding/refines can offset. LA takes so so refine/shard and good wep refine/shard. pure takes good armor refine/shard (really good) and a decent wep to keep up with well refined vit/LA's in a pk setting with 1/4 dmg. while vit has to normally shard their armor for pdef or more hp and as with pure they tend to use pdef ornaments to offset their physical weakness. pick which you like the best as your style and play it whether or not others criticize you about it. the richer you are the more pure shines over the others and that's just a fact of how it goes (high refines on pdef ornaments + diminishing returns eventually out pdef's LA if you build/play it right and the 1k hp from 100 vit vs 2-3k matk when you already got 5k+ hp isn't as usefull ect.) if you can't afford fairly good gear then i'd suggest vit/LA depending on whether you want to shard hp or pdef in your armor (pdef ammy/belt on LA is just crazy lol). just be sure to take in account the 1/4 pvp rule effects dmg but it doesn't decrease your hp or defences.


ps: sry for the seriously unorganized wall of text lol It's 12:18 and i'm tired with work in the morning. hope this helped with some semi biased opinions.

Kairu_ - Sanctuary wrote: »

a few people here are bent on making you go vit or pure. I'll try not to be biased on any build...

sry m8, ur not unbiased - u show lack of knowledge about subject and just repeat wrong assumptions which circulate on forums for long time.


unless really high refines, LA gives you similar (bit worse or bit better) survivability against physical damage; and much more worse survivability against magic damage

if u think that overall survivability of LA and vit AA somehow evens out then you are wrong.


one good thing about LA, is that your healing will be more efficient since p.def is high and hp low. But when u take into acount, how much overall defense you gonna lose - you will want to think again before you switch to LA.


do some research and actually compare builds, before you post wall of text

Why not just make this:

http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=50376f33fa57b1fb

b:dirty