End game barb "check up" before restat
Sakubatou - Sanctuary
Posts: 4,001 Arc User
Hey guys, LF some pro barb advice.
First, here is my goal. My goal is support for pve, but rather than being a vit build and fail at holding aggro end game I was aiming for a str/dex dmg build. And I don't want to be used just for my buffs.
So. Here is my experience as a lvl 100 BM. I see a barb with 20k+ vit and groan because I know I'll rip aggro in a second and end up tanking while the cleric heals the barb. I see a barb with less the 13k hp and groan because even though I'm less likely to pull aggro the barb has low hp and may die easily, then I have to tank again. Of the two options I lean towards the DD build because there is almost no hope of the vit barb tanking and is there for little more than buffs. I am thinking hybrid build, despite hearing they're "fail because they don't excell at any one thing".
So, from that point of view I'm trying to create my barb. I will be able to transfer or make my tt99 and endgame gear. I also would like to use lvl 73 instastrike fists with -30 req on them for quick chi ups and maybe DD (not sure, but made a pwi calc build of them). I however, am not interested in tanking standing up in human form using fists. I just feel safer in tiger form.
I chose "doable" builds, btw. And as a Bm i'm used to weapon switching.
Here is a build with axes (I used Lunar Howling Hurricanes... I just like stuns, lol)
http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=cd8d2743276b417b
And a build with the fists I have,
http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=d03207c6c25f2b90
Can the pro barbs help me trouble shoot? Stat wise, does this look good? Not enough accuracy? Not enough hp? Or too much vit that would be better used towards dmg? Could I tank with my hp and dmg?
Thanks for your help, critiques, and comments. b:bye
First, here is my goal. My goal is support for pve, but rather than being a vit build and fail at holding aggro end game I was aiming for a str/dex dmg build. And I don't want to be used just for my buffs.
So. Here is my experience as a lvl 100 BM. I see a barb with 20k+ vit and groan because I know I'll rip aggro in a second and end up tanking while the cleric heals the barb. I see a barb with less the 13k hp and groan because even though I'm less likely to pull aggro the barb has low hp and may die easily, then I have to tank again. Of the two options I lean towards the DD build because there is almost no hope of the vit barb tanking and is there for little more than buffs. I am thinking hybrid build, despite hearing they're "fail because they don't excell at any one thing".
So, from that point of view I'm trying to create my barb. I will be able to transfer or make my tt99 and endgame gear. I also would like to use lvl 73 instastrike fists with -30 req on them for quick chi ups and maybe DD (not sure, but made a pwi calc build of them). I however, am not interested in tanking standing up in human form using fists. I just feel safer in tiger form.
I chose "doable" builds, btw. And as a Bm i'm used to weapon switching.
Here is a build with axes (I used Lunar Howling Hurricanes... I just like stuns, lol)
http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=cd8d2743276b417b
And a build with the fists I have,
http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=d03207c6c25f2b90
Can the pro barbs help me trouble shoot? Stat wise, does this look good? Not enough accuracy? Not enough hp? Or too much vit that would be better used towards dmg? Could I tank with my hp and dmg?
Thanks for your help, critiques, and comments. b:bye
Seven 100+ characters leveled the hard way. Free to play. Mystic, Psychic, and Wizard left to level. b:victory
Post edited by Sakubatou - Sanctuary on
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Comments
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no amount of str well let u keep aggro from 5 aps. if they have 5 aps then they are the tank. end of story.
im 84 and i have yet to lose aggro to a non interval dd with lvl 10 ream. demon ream will help even more.
unless a DD is TRYING to take aggro from you lvl 11 ream either sage or demon should be enough to keep aggro from non interval DD.Killing level 80's with a lvl 60 is a lot more fun than killing level 90's with a level 100.0 -
Depending on what type of in game/rl money you have I personally think this would be a decent build, moderate str and dex but still a well rounded tanking HP.
http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=98783a6fdde31d3f
As I'm sure you know though you'll ever hold 3.33-5.26 APS at least not 100% of the time.
Basically you've got a nice event build. Just try and bump your refines and get GXs (as posted in the calc link)It's a game and I'm proud to be a stupid fail demon barb!
My EPIC Fail Demon Barb has 40k/48k HP and my stat points are as follows:
VIT 552 STR 310 DEX 60! b:surrender0 -
At lvl 84 people dont soak 10k USD in to a their char and have +10-12 event gear and 5.26 aps either, just wait you'll find a nice crowd of people you wont want to play with unless you plan on doing the same.Furries - Dreamweaver wrote: »no amount of str well let u keep aggro from 5 aps. if they have 5 aps then they are the tank. end of story.
im 84 and i have yet to lose aggro to a non interval dd with lvl 10 ream. demon ream will help even more.
unless a DD is TRYING to take aggro from you lvl 11 ream either sage or demon should be enough to keep aggro from non interval DD.It's a game and I'm proud to be a stupid fail demon barb!
My EPIC Fail Demon Barb has 40k/48k HP and my stat points are as follows:
VIT 552 STR 310 DEX 60! b:surrender0 -
The latter build, sharded with vit stones.
b:bye
Edit: Also, refine the hell out of your armors and shard +1 Atk/+2 Def. Pick your poison.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Just my $0.02 but if they want 15min runs with their uber 5APS gears, then let them tank. With all that CSing already done, surely they dont mind a bit more for their charms. b:shutup
I still look for a good old fashioned group with people who havent spent a few 100$ for getting their stuff together and are willing to spend and hour or so doing a instance.
After all its the hanging around together part thats the fun part for me.
Sorry for the rant! Now that thats out of my system: The OP:
Unless the devs suddenly decide to boost the aggro meter on fleshream (yeah, right, like thats ever going to happen) no amount of pure damage is going to keep aggro for long off the 5APS tank. Try it with your BM, theres no difference in the dmg/str for BMs and barbs IIRC. So if you still wanna tank you gotta go get high APS too. b:byeWhen the going gets tough; Get a tank!
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Nocturne mature HT guild - we invite people, not levels.
pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=7608420 -
Axelire - Heavens Tear wrote: »The latter build, sharded with vit stones.
b:bye
Edit: Also, refine the hell out of your armors and shard +1 Atk/+2 Def. Pick your poison.
+1
i also with the statements about 5aps steals. It's going to happen, but if he/she can't survive full aggro, with decently shared aggro and a competent cleric, neither of you should be ticking too much.0 -
Best Barb DD build ever-
http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=c828bf5fe83d9056
More seriously though, a barb won't do enough damage to hold aggro against 5 aps BM's/Sins. Since you can't hold aggro without going 5 aps, which you don't want to do, I'm assuming you'll just want to DD. Since you don't want to go with a claw build, I suggest SteelStar's build. Since you'll only be DDing though, you could take off all the extra vit+dex and put it into strength. Maybe change both rings to frost. So basically, something like-
http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=62d9878de34d0786
Wouldn't recommend going off my build though, I'm not too good at making them, and I'm not sure whether going pure strength is really a good idea or not....[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Thank you Forsakenx for the picture. b:thanks0 -
Just build a tank like it's supposed to. There's still stuff like delta and tw. If you want to farm, then stick with your bm.0
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Hazardus - Heavens Tear wrote: »Just my $0.02 but if they want 15min runs with their uber 5APS gears, then let them tank. With all that CSing already done, surely they dont mind a bit more for their charms. b:shutup
Let 'em tank, I agree.I still look for a good old fashioned group with people who havent spent a few 100$ for getting their stuff together and are willing to spend and hour or so doing a instance.
After all its the hanging around together part thats the fun part for me.
You said it! Any time you wanna squad with my barb or archer, you got it!Sorry for the rant! Now that thats out of my system: The OP:
Unless the devs suddenly decide to boost the aggro meter on fleshream (yeah, right, like thats ever going to happen) no amount of pure damage is going to keep aggro for long off the 5APS tank. Try it with your BM, theres no difference in the dmg/str for BMs and barbs IIRC. So if you still wanna tank you gotta go get high APS too. b:bye
Truth.
As for the build: My stats: 232 vit, 294str and 71dex (16K HP with adds.) I do decent damage, rarely miss and can't hold aggro from any 4.0-5.0aps classes at all. So build however you wish, unless you sink some serious money into your barb, after lvl90 you won't tank much for any higher levels.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Lvl10XBarb
Lvl10XArcher
lvl10XAssassin0 -
Just my 2 cents worth....PW is meant for team work that is why there was a role each character is too play. Let the tank TANK!!! end of story. A vit. barb is build to take the damage; if you are taking aggro from the tank then your not working as a team. When a BM for example with low HP takes aggro its a big mana dump for the healer which can get costly to the healer. As for myself if I am in a squad and the DD continuously takes aggro I do one of 3 options (because I only run with one specific healer most of the time) 1. The healer and myself will just leave cause we hate lack of team work which is prime example when the DD steals aggro constantly. 2. We'll let ya have aggro and watch the epic fail to ya LOL (healer will not waste money or mana dump to none team player) 3. Myself and the healer will just drop and leave due to idiots that do not know their role in a squad. 4. (ok 4 not 3 LOL) If I made the squad you would be dropped from the squad after repeated steal of aggro since the DD's job is to DD! not tank LOL.
Sure there is those cases that maybe a magic user may need to tank or even a BM, but in most cases the tank TANKS!!!. Its about team work and knowing your role in a squad.
Oh I have yet through my time playing PW as a full Vit barb had aggro stolen from me unless it was intentional loss from me or a new player that hyper-stoned their way to 90+ who knows nothing about team work.0 -
At endgame especially, if another class consistently out aggro the barb AND is able to tank, then they should be let to tank.
IMO, team work is about doing what is best for the team, and in general the goal is for a fast kill. I've played a cleric, and honestly, I'd rather spam heal a DD that is able to hold aggro and tank so that we can have all the other DDs go full throttle and kill whatever it is fast.
Only a selfish, egotistical barb would continue to spam flesh ream to start an aggro war and thereby making it harder for the cleric, or insist on tanking, so the DDs have to nerf their damage, thereby wasting everyone's time.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
i do agree too..
if DD can tank it with healer's heal.. Let them have it
I am more then glad to stand up .. and DD instead.
Save me the repair cost and time too.
But that is of cuz everyone understand there is a switch of role.
Trust me.. there will be times where it will fail.. and you have to go tiger and grab aggro quickly or see a full party wipe.Build Aiming for : pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=99d12b053ed06fe9
Retired : pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=a798089d5502e95b
17k hp since level 92.. now @ 13k Hp on 1000 -
agreed to pritty much everything that has been said. I'm a sage build (I know groan some more) but I hold my aggro without to much nerfing from my party.
That being said, it's hard for any barb, of any build (minus 5 aps themselves) to deal with a 5 aps party. You're not going to hold aggro to that for very long. No tank I know, really has a huge problem standing up and dding, we love it...it's a change from the monotony of fleshremeing and our 200k+ repair bills.
However, what usually gets under a barbs skin is when the bm/archer/sin becomes an *** about it. ESPECIALLY if they die, and proceed to blame the cleric (when there had been an understanding of change of roles) or, in worst cases the barb for not changing back and saving them in time. (that's just super annoying)
in short and sweet terms: we're barbs, we adapt and we know that our traditional tanking methods are going out of style, that being said alot of us don't see the need in totally rechanging our builds, especially when we do just fine in most parties. we also don't mind dding, unless you're planning to try and make us feel inferior to your "super" build (I always say, i'm perfectly fine in a situation of who's "tankier" i'm more than willing to drop my pants and compair who's bigger)
Lost City Sage barb and Retired Coven Marshal.0 -
NO i would go back 2 form 2 get back agro from say 5 aps player if tehy died i would let party die but try save the cleric.
sure if we lose our tank job and OK fine we need then 2 become a dd then the said 5aps MUST have bigg enough balls 2 admit he cant tank the boss THEN and only then would i save the party from wipe excepth from the cleric.
why should we ho back 2 tiger and save the party when the 5aps is the one at foult trying a boss he cant tank.
somehow we must get our pride as barb back lol.
still waiting for this 2 happen and i hope the expension will do this say increase damage
like when ur in ur 6x u think a bm can tank general ferng at 60 or krimson at those lv tehy couldent.
bosses need 2 start hitting much harder then i bet we get our job back who aggre with MEb:victory0 -
I just wanted to mention that you cannot use barb skills with fist/claw weapons. Thus, you cannot turn into tiger with them armed. You cannot change gear once in tiger form. I'm not sure if anyone else mentioned this. If barbs could do that, we would all be awesome claw tiger tanks.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0
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Barbs are a fail class. Their skills can't hold aggro in PVE and they cannot do enough damage in PVP to compete. It's a horrible design by PWI. The *only* way to make a good barb is to make it 5aps. Anything else sucks.
Barbs are becoming scarce in PWI anyway. Most other classes can tank just fine with some good armor and / or refinements.0 -
crunchycat wrote: »Barbs are a fail class. Their skills can't hold aggro in PVE and they cannot do enough damage in PVP to compete. It's a horrible design by PWI. The *only* way to make a good barb is to make it 5aps. Anything else sucks.
Barbs are becoming scarce in PWI anyway. Most other classes can tank just fine with some good armor and / or refinements.
Wait wait wait wait, Why if barbs are so scarce do i constantly have 3 Barbs in my BH squad? jeeze we must really be rare if we can do that,
No its not that barbs have all of a sudden become worse, Its that Every other class Has an ability to get High APS and still use their skills, BM's can get 5 APS with fist and still use skills, Sins can get 5 APS with daggers, and still use skills.
Incase you hadn't noticed already, PWI are slowly Year by Year replacing all the original classes, What is it that happened with the T'borns came out, Thats right Sins replaced the archers, and psys Replaced the Wiz, The Seeker will replace the BM's, and the Mystic may very well Replace the Veno, So next year, well we can all look forward to the replacing of the Barb and Cleric, and YAY! no more need for you to complane about Us not being able to hold agro. Hell the Mytic and Seeker might even replace both the Barb, BM, Veno And Cleric.
Barbs are made to Hold Aggro Against non APS builds, and they do that job extreamly well, its not Our Fault that PWE had to bring out -int gear. IF you build a BM the same way we build our barbs, Im pretty sure you'd have trouble keeping agro From high APS players as well. [/end rant]
Im a Barb as you can see, you can also see how long I've been a Barb for, Ive made plenty of mistakes with my Barb, And im not letting any one stop me from being a barb, I dont mind standing up and DDing, I rather enjoy the look of my human form skills, its a change from being in tiger 24/7 in ever instance, plus, all those wonderful AoE's i have in Human form are great. Let a Barb be a Barb.0 -
i think crunchycat is one of those 5 aps chars that power leveled and think that their credit card buys skill too... I think this thread has strayed pretty far from the original post... It either needs to get closed, or get back on topic..[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Leader of Sangnati (Latin for Blood Born/Nation)
We can be your best friend... Or your worst enemy...
Which would you prefer?
b:sin
100 Sage/Vit/Tank Barb
101 Demon/Fist/5.0 BM
Yes, 5.0 really is OP. Yet, I still got it... b:chuckle0 -
crunchycat wrote: »Barbs are a fail class. Their skills can't hold aggro in PVE and they cannot do enough damage in PVP to compete. It's a horrible design by PWI. The *only* way to make a good barb is to make it 5aps. Anything else sucks.
Barbs are becoming scarce in PWI anyway. Most other classes can tank just fine with some good armor and / or refinements.
i would say thats not quite true.. b:laugh
barbs are good in pk. and yes, this game went bit wrong direction when they changed example lunar cave. the old "allmost impossible" lunar was fun and challenging. barb was rlly needed to be meatwall there and squadwork had to work.
today u can go solo the cave.. wheres the meaning of it now?
dd's can tank, barb for dd... all went messy.
ill give my vote to get back in old pwi.
but anyways... im hp build Demon barb and can keep aggro quite good with djinn's waltz axes with zerk, and 18k hp in tgr form now. (crappy gears) demon crit bonuses and no lower dmg in tgr form helps a lot keeping aggro aslike doing nice dmg in pk.0 -
Dagnatic - Sanctuary wrote: »Wait wait wait wait, Why if barbs are so scarce do i constantly have 3 Barbs in my BH squad? jeeze we must really be rare if we can do that,
Couldn't say; however, those are 3 barbs that aren't tanking. What I can say is that I see many barb-less squads form for everything and if you walk out into any PVP zone, there are usually no barbs around (although a surprising amount of assassins are usually present). Additionally, I am in 8 different factions on alts and the number of barbs are very low compared to all other classes.Dagnatic - Sanctuary wrote: »No its not that barbs have all of a sudden become worse, Its that Every other class Has an ability to get High APS and still use their skills, BM's can get 5 APS with fist and still use skills, Sins can get 5 APS with daggers, and still use skills.
Who said barbs got worse? They simply always sucked.Dagnatic - Sanctuary wrote: »Incase you hadn't noticed already, PWI are slowly Year by Year replacing all the original classes, What is it that happened with the T'borns came out, Thats right Sins replaced the archers, and psys Replaced the Wiz, The Seeker will replace the BM's, and the Mystic may very well Replace the Veno, So next year, well we can all look forward to the replacing of the Barb and Cleric, and YAY! no more need for you to complane about Us not being able to hold agro. Hell the Mytic and Seeker might even replace both the Barb, BM, Veno And Cleric.
I am not sure how you qualify replacement; however, what I see is that virtually everyone and their sister are creating assassins because of the PVP and PVE advantages they have over all other classes.Dagnatic - Sanctuary wrote: »Barbs are made to Hold Aggro Against non APS builds, and they do that job extreamly well, its not Our Fault that PWE had to bring out -int gear. IF you build a BM the same way we build our barbs, Im pretty sure you'd have trouble keeping agro From high APS players as well. [/end rant]
This is not true. I have a wizard that I guarantee you cannot hold aggro from. Additionally, the more mature the server you have the more APS builds you are going to find. With my present APS barb build, it is extremely difficult to steal aggro from me.Dagnatic - Sanctuary wrote: »Im a Barb as you can see, you can also see how long I've been a Barb for, Ive made plenty of mistakes with my Barb, And im not letting any one stop me from being a barb, I dont mind standing up and DDing, I rather enjoy the look of my human form skills, its a change from being in tiger 24/7 in ever instance, plus, all those wonderful AoE's i have in Human form are great. Let a Barb be a Barb.
A barb was my first class and its the one I give the most attention to; however, by comparison from playing all the other classes I can very confidently say that it was a poorly designed class.0 -
TankedBeast - Lost City wrote: »i think crunchycat is one of those 5 aps chars that power leveled and think that their credit card buys skill too... I think this thread has strayed pretty far from the original post... It either needs to get closed, or get back on topic..
I've noticed that people who use the phrase "I think" tend to do very little of just that.0 -
KomamuraSaji - Heavens Tear wrote: »barbs are good in pk...
I have yet to see evidence of that ;3.KomamuraSaji - Heavens Tear wrote: »... and yes, this game went bit wrong direction when they changed example lunar cave. the old "allmost impossible" lunar was fun and challenging. barb was rlly needed to be meatwall there and squadwork had to work. today u can go solo the cave.. wheres the meaning of it now? dd's can tank, barb for dd... all went messy.
Twilight Temple 3-3 is very challenging now. Try the last boss with a barb tanking and see how far it gets you. [sarcasm] Why not go and tank Nirvana? I am sure barbs are popular because they can hold aggro in there. [/sarcasm].KomamuraSaji - Heavens Tear wrote: »but anyways... im hp build Demon barb and can keep aggro quite good with djinn's waltz axes with zerk, and 18k hp in tgr form now. (crappy gears) demon crit bonuses and no lower dmg in tgr form helps a lot keeping aggro aslike doing nice dmg in pk.
That might work if your squad is fundamentally weak on DD output; however, on my server at least I am frequently in +6-+12 geared squads with TT 99, NV, Rank 8, and /or Rank 9 weapons. Your build wouldn't steal aggro let alone hold it. 0 -
Yah, my question has been answered and this thread has gottten of track and somewhat necroed.
As for what I decided? The BM I share my gear with has gotten decent gear now and its made an big difference. As I've tanked almost every situation end game now I've found that not much more than 12k hp is needed if you substitute skill for the missing hp. I currently only have about 12.8k hp and can do any instance without a charm or the need to pot, although genie heal is sometimes useful. So, I plan on boosting that to 15-16k with gear and that should be more than I need for anything. I will go with the fist build but keep high DD axes on me to start out FRing and to Tigerform~>Roar~>reset aggro~>,FR,FR,FR~>humanform~>DD when I need to.
And as much as I want to weigh in on the off topic discussion I'll just end with this...
/End Thread pls.Seven 100+ characters leveled the hard way. Free to play. Mystic, Psychic, and Wizard left to level. b:victory0 -
b:pleased havent been in too many 5aps squads cause i quit before they began flooding the game withing the first few months of sins hypering they're way to 100+ but I've never had problems holding aggro in any squad where i was the tank its too easy to spam ream/roar and any other skills we have that are meant for holding aggro
Go look for the old vids of back when Cq and spec used to steal and reset world bosses on each other all the time till whoever was able to get the boss in the nearest legal sz was only one to get aggro from the main tank was another barb that would have to drop in and ream the bosses several times along with roar then run the bosses outta sz to try to wipe the DDer's that stumbled outta sz after the boss.
I got 15k hp and 5k base phys damage without buffs HH 90 greens with nothing better than flawless stones with a sage build Heck ive been able to hit up to 100k with sage trip spark and amp/mire on bosses in fbs in tiger form without attack lvl charms.
When i start seeing sins and bms tanking the harder world bosses like the one near snowy village then i'll think making my barb was worthless.b:bye0 -
Jenovadeath - Lost City wrote: »When i start seeing sins and bms tanking the harder world bosses like the one near snowy village then i'll think making my barb was worthless.b:bye
You wont tank carebear anytime soon, lol. I remember our last meeting, it was warm summer night, I felt breeze on my furr, making it all messy. He was too scared to fight me at once, killing the cute foxes around me, I mean foxes, everybody else were safe, lol. Fight was getting intense and I got 1shot on my lvl 90 barb for 16.3k as he had dropped my BB cleric, kitty`s wifey you mind =(. He wouldnt be that hard w/o random aggro, sure last few millions of hp he is hitting like a truck, but BB would be enough to him only **** charm, when you got another one healing =/. Oh well, sage claw BMs might do better job having that 25% dmg reduction on them at all times and I think I`ve seen even archers tank harpy, lol. We got our uses but we really arent some gods gift to mankind, like some seem to think.Trolling Sid since So Hot
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u guys may not be good with advices, but ur good at pretending to be pros b:shutup0
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^+1 , xD0
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Hi All,
I am thinking about my Equip for the late levels, 90+ and I want to know what you think about the military rank equipment. For me ut seems to look like a good alternative to all the recommended armor, or am I wrong?
Thanks in advance for your reply.
Dreenan0 -
um.. wow.. necro?
i mean bumping a thread such as a guide, something that you want to be seen again, or something that has been written that you don't want to copy and paste into a new post.. but seriously;
this isn't any of those. and therefore; is considered a necro.
please create a new threadKilling level 80's with a lvl 60 is a lot more fun than killing level 90's with a level 100.0 -
Closed for necro.
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