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More pet choice questions

hyenagod420hyenagod420 Posts: 5 Arc User
edited September 2010 in Venomancer
Hi all, I'm back with a few more questions, and I'd appreciate all of your helpful insight into the class and pets again if possible.

I slaved away all day yesterday and made almost 1mil from farming mats around archosaur and selling them to peoples shops (took me HOURS, but feel it was worth it so I can afford a decent pet. So here's my questions (thanks to your advice i decided not to get the cute kitty)

1) Should I keep my dark wanderer until lvl 60 and get a Kowlin? (I noticed his dps is great but his defense is starting to lag at lvl 25+, if he gets 3 mobs on him he is essentially dead before i can aggro transfer)

2) Should I forget getting a kowlin and buy the lvl 20 bear and then the lvl 80 bear?

3) Should I be just like every other cut and paste veno and use a magmite or walker and slave away hoping I can one day afford a herc?
Post edited by hyenagod420 on

Comments

  • Yindra - SanctuaryYindra - Sanctuary Posts: 784 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    There's a generally a reason for the copy&paste pet selection.

    However, whether a Magmite/Walker is "worth" it can be debated. It doesn't tank bosses, so labeling it as a "tank"-pet is somewhat stupid. As such, going for higher damage might be a good thing, IF it actually speeds up things.

    On the other hand, if things get out of hand and aggro piles up on the pet, having a "tank" pet might come in handy. Of course, I never pulled 2 or 3 monsters on my pet at lvl 25 --- back then, I didn't even know I could do that, so I avoided it. Nowadays I'm not so much on the avoiding side since I know my Magmite can handle a couple monsters.

    Also, just yesterday I did one of the Hallucinatory Trench (FB79) quests. Monsters at the beginning of that dungeon are all ranged, and more often than not it ended up like a ping-pong game: monster shoots fireball, my pet HP goes down to 33% (just a guess, looks like a nice number), I cast Heal, Magmite HP goes back to 100%, monster casts fireball, pet HP goes to 33%, I cast Heal, pet HP goes back to 100% and so on. That might be one of the situations where the actual question is "how much HP/magic resist would your dps pet have". Or a better question, who would be stupid enough to solo stuff like that? FBxx isn't actually solo terrain, and in 79 I'll never get past the early monsters.

    On the world map, however, I usually wish the Magmite would deal more damage faster. In many cases, his HPs are not an issue at all.

    I could still add a couple of "bash" levels, though --- but then, I could do that with a dps pet too.
    Slow progress, game is getting way too grindy :-( Quests I still hope to be able to do some day: FB39, General Feng
  • VenoProwl - Raging TideVenoProwl - Raging Tide Posts: 185 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    For me my Glacial (even @ 4 levels below me) still does decent damage...

    Just whenever I start on the mob, I let the pet hit 2 or 3 times, then ironwood, pet hit 1 or twice then I should be fine from then just spamming venomous.

    A heck load of non-herc venos have a glacial for a reason =)

    Before I launch into a speech, let me point out that sometimes you can sell the herbs you collected @ double or more the price you're selling them to catshops. Just collect them, and go into catshop mode/ go afk/ go read a book/ go play starcraft.

    ========================

    1) Try to get hay>fruit>fungus and then keep both lol.

    If this was really the 'perfect world', I'll have:

    My mount
    my sawfly
    my glacial (for emergency sacrifice in BHs and AoE grinding)
    my dark wanderer (for dps)
    Ninetailed fox (will put debuffs on this one, will look cute AND useful for bosses)

    But alas...I'm poor. I'm also one that don't really care about looks. I'll follow the general sawfly/glacial build. My reasoning? It allows me to be more productive in BHs, (where I get most of my exp) Gamma, Delta (when I get to it).

    More productive = more money gained, then once I have enough then I can meddle about with looks and niceties.

    2) I was told that the lvl 80 bear was good, but...I looked at the stats, and a glacial walker has better damage. Although the bear has much better magic resist (and not too bad pdef). But...if I'm against a magic boss, I doubt either pet will survive. And normal mobs (for quests)...I'd rather have the higher damage output to kill the mob faster while I spam heal :)
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    AriAdiemus - Archosaur:
    "Clerics heal health, they still can't heal stupid."

    So true. b:surrender

    8x Veno, 6x Cleric
  • MANray_ - SanctuaryMANray_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,311 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    I would actually recommend that you stick to your Wanderer for good, it's actually a somewhat ressilient pet and a Kowlin will be much more fragile and actually deal less damage. It's also not as cookie cutter as you might think, i very rarely ever see Wanderers at my level range. If you want to improve it's ressilience i would recommend skilling Threaten and leveling up Tough so that you'll have options in dealing with scenarios involving multiples. Swap out Pierce, already you should have added an aggro skill such as Bash.

    If you want a tanking pet then the Walker is likely your best choice, it's mag res won't be as good when compared to the bears, but sightly better hp and phys res will make up for it and it's high damage will come as an advantage. Do get the bears if you fancy them however, but i recommend them as back up to your Wanderer, not as substitute.

    Whether or not to eventually get an herc is a difficult decission and i won't try to sway you either way even though personally i have a well known position on this. What i recommend is for you to try and look through relevant threads, weight the available information and decide for yourself. This is very much a playstyle choice, although it will also impact your capabilities and what squads you'll be invited into. Fortunately, you have plenty of time to make up your mind (and can always change it) so you can put this on the back burner until you have learned more about the game's dynamics.
  • Desdi - SanctuaryDesdi - Sanctuary Posts: 8,680 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    1) Should I keep my dark wanderer until lvl 60 and get a Kowlin? (I noticed his dps is great but his defense is starting to lag at lvl 25+, if he gets 3 mobs on him he is essentially dead before i can aggro transfer)

    You should keep the Dark Wanderer. Changing it for a Kowlin is a bad move. The Dark Wanderer has much better defences, DPS and attack than the Kowlin.

    The Kowlin was designed as the "best luring pet" (it's the fastest land pet available and has an attack animation that helps you have a good timing with stowing the pet). Originally, all pets were going to be melee (correct me if I'm mistaken) but they missed out a couple of pets such as the Cactopods and the Marskman so now the Kowlin is at competition with the ranged pets and in some situations the ranged pets will be able to pull more effectively. I chose the Kowlin for luring because I wanted it.
    Apart from that, the Kowlin comes with a really nice set of skills. Bash, Flesh Ream (aggro/good attack skills) and Howl, Pierce (Magic and Physical Defence decrease). Those skills make the Kowlin a very nice support/debuff pet. I use it for debuffs/support and in low level FBs/BHs because if something goes wrong (eg. a Wizard aggros a mob) the Kowlin will reach and steal aggro/kill the mob faster.

    The Dark Wanderer has great DPS and attack (very very useful when a squad kills a boss) and also has better defences (which means that it will be able to survive AOEs in the future). When grinding and/or doing quests the mobs will die faster with the Dark Wanderer -> finish quest faster/make money faster. When killing a boss it will cause the boss's death faster (it especially shines in TT where the pets' damage is not reduced so it will be very useful). You should definitely keep it and not substitute it with a Kowlin.
    Like MANray_ suggested, level up Tough, add a debuff (preferably Howl) and level it up and of course add a Bash (aggro skill).

    Last note, the Dark Wanderer, being a DPS pet, will not become obsolete when/if you tame a "tank" pet or buy the Hercules. Keep in mind that there are different pets with different stats and abilities for different situations.

    2) Should I forget getting a kowlin and buy the lvl 20 bear and then the lvl 80 bear?


    3) Should I be just like every other cut and paste veno and use a magmite or walker and slave away hoping I can one day afford a herc?

    If money is an issue for you now you should forget about them all and go for the free pets.
    -There are low levels Cactopods (lvl8+) or the Eldergoth Marskman (lvl 42?) that will make excellent luring pets. You will have to level them up of course.
    -Either get the Glacial Walker or the Crystalline Mamgite (preferably the walker) which, as it has been mentioned already, has better defences than the Shaodu Cub or the Armoured Bear as well as better DPS/attack (which will result in keeping aggro more effectively).
    -Stick with your Dark Wanderer for DPS/debuff untill the end.

    When the game was released, the rare pets such as Kowlin, Cub, Bear etc. were a luxury and they are still considered a luxury (although prices have dropped). You shouldn't buy them if you can't afford them (imagine it like you have a car and you're thinking of whether to buy a new expensive one or not, since your car (free pet) can do the same job as the new expensive one (rare pet), what would you do?).

    My honest opinion for you would be that you get the free pets for now. As you level up, getting money will be easier for you so you will eventually be able to afford the rare pets you want.The cub and the bear are inferior to the walker in terms of stats. If you want the best tank pet (excluding the Herc) stick with the Walker. If you love the design of the cub and feel the small size is more convenient get the cub.
    Keep the money you have for now. You will need them for your skills which are important too.

    You shouldn't slave yourself and grind like there's now tomorrow. Remember that it's a game and you should enjoy and have fun. Also, do not worry about the Hercules for now. It's only demanded at level 80/90+ (whether it is a real need or not it's a different subject). By the time you are 80/90 you'll already have enough experience to decide for pets, skills, armours, everything.

    Remember that you can change pets anytime. I've changed a lot of pets with my first Venomancer as I was discovering the game. I suggested the free pets because you can easily obtain them so if you end up changing them your money won't be wasted (unless you have the patience to try and tame the rare pets yourself).


    [SIGPIC]http://i.imgur.com/MtwcqjL.png[/SIGPIC]
    ★ Venomancer videos - tinyurl.com/k6ppkw4 ★ Desdi - Demon ♪ Wyvelin - Sage ★
  • hyenagod420hyenagod420 Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Thanks desdi and manray for such insightful posts / answers to my questions.

    I guess I will be sticking with my dark wanderer, and will grab a ranged pet as my lurer for future bosses and such (plus it will make killing range and magic mobs who run easier)

    So skill wise, I should unlearn pierce, skill up tough and roar, and add bash? what should the 4th skill for the pet be then?
  • WaffleChan - SanctuaryWaffleChan - Sanctuary Posts: 2,897 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    However, whether a Magmite/Walker is "worth" it can be debated. It doesn't tank bosses, so labeling it as a "tank"-pet is somewhat stupid. As such, going for higher damage might be a good thing, IF it actually speeds up things.
    i dont know what crack you're smoking, but its fully capable of tanking some simple bosses. for example, ive had a magmite tank khewy, quillhog, stygian etc. requires a decent mag stat to overcome the damage, but theyre capable of pulling the feats off. ive seen armored bears do this as well; and they have even less def.
    Also, just yesterday I did one of the Hallucinatory Trench (FB79) quests. Monsters at the beginning of that dungeon are all ranged, and more often than not it ended up like a ping-pong game: monster shoots fireball, my pet HP goes down to 33% (just a guess, looks like a nice number), I cast Heal, Magmite HP goes back to 100%, monster casts fireball, pet HP goes to 33%, I cast Heal, pet HP goes back to 100% and so on. That might be one of the situations where the actual question is "how much HP/magic resist would your dps pet have". Or a better question, who would be stupid enough to solo stuff like that? FBxx isn't actually solo terrain, and in 79 I'll never get past the early monsters.
    this on the other hand is an accurate anecdote. i would assume itd be safer to carry a more balanced pet in 79 such as froggie.
    FBxx isn't actually solo terrain
    no veno should be soloing FBs unless theyre wielding a herc :P.
    1) Should I keep my dark wanderer until lvl 60 and get a Kowlin? (I noticed his dps is great but his defense is starting to lag at lvl 25+, if he gets 3 mobs on him he is essentially dead before i can aggro transfer)
    keep a dark wanderer as damage dealing pet, it comes armed as one of the most powerful DDs in the game. kowlin is fairly useless: subpar defenses, average attack, its only saving grace is its speed... which dark wanderer has too.

    2) Should I forget getting a kowlin and buy the lvl 20 bear and then the lvl 80 bear?

    3) Should I be just like every other cut and paste veno and use a magmite or walker and slave away hoping I can one day afford a herc?
    there is a reason why most venos use these golems, they have the premier balance of softness and strength... er wait this isnt a paper towel brand... uh yeah. they are the most well rounded pets in terms of attack, defense, and hp making them quite user friendly. i would suggest skipping the 20 bear, and going for the 80 if you do head down this route. the 80 bear has far better stats by 90.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    advice to fledgling archers:
    Going sage is like drunken sex, at first she may look good, but when you wake up the next morning; you'll look at her and go WHAT HAVE I DONE.
  • MANray_ - SanctuaryMANray_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,311 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Thanks desdi and manray for such insightful posts / answers to my questions.

    I guess I will be sticking with my dark wanderer, and will grab a ranged pet as my lurer for future bosses and such (plus it will make killing range and magic mobs who run easier)

    So skill wise, I should unlearn pierce, skill up tough and roar, and add bash? what should the 4th skill for the pet be then?

    You're welcome. b:cute

    Your first priority should be an Aggro skill, Bash being the likely better choice, although you do have the option of the so called "elemental bashes", skills like Icicle or Fireball which deal elemental damage, or Flesh Ream which can come in handy if you are on a PvP server. Skilling up Tough would help with your pet being somewhat fragile although you may notice more of a diference swaping out Pierce for Threaten since lvl 1 Tough is usually pretty good in itself.
  • Desdi - SanctuaryDesdi - Sanctuary Posts: 8,680 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    I'm glad I could help!

    For the Dark Wanderer I'd go with Tough, Bash, Howl and Threaten (or Pierce if you choose to go HA build or become Demon where Ironwood won't debuff 100% of the time).
    Roar is a good option too especially for saving a cleric or a wizard when they stole aggro but personally I put that on my tank pet before acquiring a Hercules. In the situations where you'll be asked to tank the rest of the squad won't always be aware that they have to slow down their DPS and lower their damage output. In that case you'll need something that can grab aggro back immediately.

    All that however comes with experience. At first I didn't have Roar on my Cub but after helping in a lot of FBs/BHs and having DDs steal aggro from my pet (and often die) and I realised that it's necessary. Besides, I would often steal aggro myself when being careless with my damage output. So for now go with Tough, Bash, Howl and Bash on your tank pet and see how it goes.
    You won't be put into tight situations (such as needing to save the cleric from a mob) until about lvl 60 when the BH becomes a bit more complicated and you are also able to do TT.
    [SIGPIC]http://i.imgur.com/MtwcqjL.png[/SIGPIC]
    ★ Venomancer videos - tinyurl.com/k6ppkw4 ★ Desdi - Demon ♪ Wyvelin - Sage ★
  • Mahabharatha - ArchosaurMahabharatha - Archosaur Posts: 6 Arc User
    edited September 2010

    i would suggest skipping the 20 bear, and going for the 80 if you do head down this route. the 80 bear has far better stats by 90.

    Ummmm, not really, no. It is a bit faster, but the attack is lower and the defences are only by 24 points higher on the lvl 80 bear; the shaodu has higher dodge and accuracy ( not an essential, but it is useful). I do prefer my shaodu, self tamed, as it has useful skills and you can use it early on in the game...plus it's cute :D !
  • Brael - DreamweaverBrael - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,430 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Dodge and accuracy are near worthless stats, the difference between tier 1 and tier 7 dodge on a test of 10,000 swings was 2%, which was within the margin of error. Accuracy takes another hit because the debuff from ironwood (or pierce, or the same debuff that other classes have) also drops the targets evasion to 0, causing you or your pet to never miss with it on.

    The bear has a hp growth of 7 compared to the cubs 6, 6 physical/magic def vs the cubs 5, and equal attack. The other four stats make no difference. Granted the bear does have a level 80 tame vs the cubs level 20 tame, which is the equivalent of 6 levels worth of stats, but at level 89 the bear takes the lead as the stronger tank. The only area where the cub wins out over the bear is in damage output by about 7%.
  • Desdi - SanctuaryDesdi - Sanctuary Posts: 8,680 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    I believe it's pointless to change your Cub or a Bear at lvl 80. Their differences are small and few.
    Except, of course, if you want the Armored Bear because you like it.
    [SIGPIC]http://i.imgur.com/MtwcqjL.png[/SIGPIC]
    ★ Venomancer videos - tinyurl.com/k6ppkw4 ★ Desdi - Demon ♪ Wyvelin - Sage ★
  • Ms_HopToIt - SanctuaryMs_HopToIt - Sanctuary Posts: 914 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    The difference isnt that much, but I would say it's worth it to switch if you didnt bother lvling up your cub's skills, like tough is lvl 1 on cub. and the bear's tough is lvl 5. If you never bothered to lvl up a skill like that, then I would say switching is worth it.
    >.<
  • dawnamdawnam Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Hello,everyone.I been wondering for months now where in what time to taime the rare pets.I live in Ohio State,so I don't know the correct timing for taiming the rare pets.In it;s dificult to find the cordaniances.I'd like to taime some of the rare pets to sale in use aswell.Can someone one who knows the answers to my question send me info to my message box plz in thanks for all who answers.
  • Desdi - SanctuaryDesdi - Sanctuary Posts: 8,680 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    dawnam wrote: »
    Hello,everyone.I been wondering for months now where in what time to taime the rare pets.I live in Ohio State,so I don't know the correct timing for taiming the rare pets.In it;s dificult to find the cordaniances.I'd like to taime some of the rare pets to sale in use aswell.Can someone one who knows the answers to my question send me info to my message box plz in thanks for all who answers.

    It's off topic but here's my advice:
    Check the Auction House for every rare pet. Check the remaining hour or each egg for ecah rare pet. Usually Venomancers put in the AH the rare pet eggs shortly after they've tamed them so if for example the majority of the eggs say "23 hours left" it means that the rare pet was tamed about 1 hour ago. If it says "12 hours left" it should be close to spawning etc. Try to check the AH for a couple of days to figure out the possible spawn time. Once you have it go to the spawn and see what happens.
    [SIGPIC]http://i.imgur.com/MtwcqjL.png[/SIGPIC]
    ★ Venomancer videos - tinyurl.com/k6ppkw4 ★ Desdi - Demon ♪ Wyvelin - Sage ★
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