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Nova or Scarab?

Hell_rayzer - Heavens TearHell_rayzer - Heavens Tear Posts: 141 Arc User
edited September 2010 in Venomancer
I dont have the money to lvl both but which one is the better skill to have? Im in a pve server.
Post edited by Hell_rayzer - Heavens Tear on

Comments

  • Dyskrasia - Heavens TearDyskrasia - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,161 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Probably scarab first (er... I'm assuming you're referring to lucky lol), since it's more practical to use when killing mobs.
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  • Hell_rayzer - Heavens TearHell_rayzer - Heavens Tear Posts: 141 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    yea lucky scarab
  • Zoe - Heavens Tear Zoe - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,814 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    If you run frost/rebirth, then nova is a must have. For everything else, lucky is better.

    Myself, I'd grind until I had the coins to level both.
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  • Hell_rayzer - Heavens TearHell_rayzer - Heavens Tear Posts: 141 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    k ill try lucky at lvl 5 see how i like it and then decide
  • LloydAsplund - SanctuaryLloydAsplund - Sanctuary Posts: 3,899 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Both are must haves imo. Depends on what you want to do. Use your imagination, if you do frost a lot, which is better?
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  • MANray_ - SanctuaryMANray_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,311 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    I would consider Lucky a priority over Nova, especially at mid levels. The reason for this is it simply is the best caster attack after Venomous and Ironwood, and while perhaps you may not want to use it much for grinding (if you really want to keep your mp consumption down for whatever reason) it is the best hit you can get in for PvE after the two basics. It outdamages both Noxious and Blazing for practical purposes as it lacks a DoT component. For PvP it simply is a must as your only caster stun (or at least until Demon Frost) which can on ocassion even come in handy for PvE despite its very small duration.

    Nova is very specialized and requires two sparks. In my opinion is only worth using against 4 or more mobs and even then you may want to use Noxious over it. The reason is even a somewhat mediocre squad should kill things fast enough the chi cost is not really worth it (better to spark the BM for HF). Now, RB is something most venos don't get to see a lot of, at least until higher levels. If you're doing RB runs you should really have both Lucky and Noxious maxed, although herc will be the primary qualification to get in on squads.
  • Phoenix_Eye - Heavens TearPhoenix_Eye - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,681 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    LvL lucky first , it's ur 1 of ur few immobilation skills (even pathetic duration) , but it's nice to stun a mob and let ur pet catch it . Especially the sage version is damn cool (1+ stun sec)

    Nova lvl 1 will do for a lot of lvls , then give it 4-5 lvls for FF and RB , ull probably use it mostly for the stun-freeze-petrification (w/e b:laugh) effect , usually to save some1s butt , better use ur sparks for big nukes with lucky or ironwood imo.

    if u have money and spirit , go for both
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  • Brael - DreamweaverBrael - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,430 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Are they both level 1 now? My advice to a lower level would actually be to level neither. There's better uses for spirit. However, seeing as how you're level 88 I have to assume each skill is somewhat leveled already.

    To me Lucky didn't really get good until I had the sage version, the reason is because the value of a stun increases significantly, the longer the duration is. Cooldowns and melee swing timers still count down while stunned, because of this, a lower level lucky that only stuns for say half a second or even 1 second, can quite conceivably provide zero benefit while giving you a lot of aggro, and costing a good chunk of mana.

    Nova on the other hand has limited use. I've actually found that rebirth and fc squads lately have preferred me NOT using it because of the bug where a sealed mob randomly runs off. I can think of more than a handful of times where using nova has actually done more harm than good as a result. Additionally, being an AE the places where you can really use it are a little more limited. Damage wise you're better off using a double spark (and especially triple when you hit 89).

    If you're looking for an AE to level, you might want to look at Noxious first. Honestly, I think you're better off maxing befuddling mist (or consume spirit if you want a slightly better skill combo that costs significantly more) and leech before thinking about lucky or nova.

    If the only choices really are between lucky and nova I would say nova if you do rebirth/fc moderately. Otherwise do lucky, lucky if nothing else is great to fire off during sparks, amps, and so on when solo or a solid nuke inbetween noxious when you have a barbarian to hide behind.
  • sleepcatsleepcat Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Lucky Scarab is actually pretty nice for those "oh ****" moments so you can stun them cast hood, then foxform and run away or something in instances. At least that's what I do. I also use it as a starter skill in most combos. But in normal situations, spamming Venomous is more mana-efficient. I think Lucky Scarab is the 2nd most damaging single target spell after Ironwood excluding the DoTs? If that counts for anything.

    Nova is really mostly for those zhen moments or if you need a quick aoe freeze. You probably won't want to do this outside of zhen moments because you simply can't handle all that aggro on you most of the time. At least that's what I do.
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  • GalenNn - Lost CityGalenNn - Lost City Posts: 51 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    I dont really know what niva does can someone tell me?
    I know its a little off topic but i didnt want to start a thread about it.
    Thx in advance!!
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  • Alphae - Lost CityAlphae - Lost City Posts: 1,512 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    I would agree that Lucky Scarab has more all-purpose use. However, Parasitic Nova is an AWESOME skill and as soon as you have the coin, both should really be level 10.

    Nova, I never use while grinding, I save my spark for mana regen (3 spark) and for "oopsie, I need hood" moments. However, nova is invaluable in Frost, and I can't generate spark fast enough to use it as much as I'd like as well as pass spark to tank, cleric, and occasionally the BM (I don't bother with spark potions, I just don't use nova as much as I'd like).

    Lucky has great use grinding, it's a good damage nuke and of course it stuns, though the stun is so short it's not good for much else other than to stun in order to get hood up, or to jump on your flyer if you need to get out of a bad situation. I like to use it mostly as a spark builder as well as a finishing nuke (one thing I think venos overlook is KNOWING the relative amount of damage their spells will do under various circumstances, but it is a very useful skill).

    EDIT: @ above:

    Parasitic nova is a 2-spark area-of-effect (AOE) skill that does considerable damage, and has a 66% chance to basically stun each mob that it hits. It also has a wider effect area than does the veno's other AOE, Noxious Gas.
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  • Mayfly - DreamweaverMayfly - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,094 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    It also has a wider effect area than does the veno's other AOE, Noxious Gas.

    <Ahem> Other AOEs. There are two foxform AOEs, Befuddling Mist (very short range and directional) and Malefic Crush (shorter range than Noxious, longer than Befuddling.) There is also the foxform Myriad Rainbow, which is an AOE debuff, and I think either the sage or demon version of Purge is AOE, but neither do direct damage.
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  • Andromaka - Heavens TearAndromaka - Heavens Tear Posts: 925 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    sleepcat wrote: »
    Nova is really mostly for those zhen moments or if you need a quick aoe freeze. You probably won't want to do this outside of zhen moments because you simply can't handle all that aggro on you most of the time. At least that's what I do.
    Love aoe-ing dream inspectors in OHT with nova b:chuckle

    TBH i lvled nova around lvl 95 when i started to do rb, before that i didnt really need it much (1 year ago when FF was just impossible). So unless you need to run rb or FF you can lvl nova later, but for those 2 instances Nova is a must. For grinding lucky scarab is awesome as everyone else said, but if i were to choose, id lvl both to a decent lvl rather than max only 1 of them.
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  • SeaStorm - Heavens TearSeaStorm - Heavens Tear Posts: 315 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    @at Mayfly...sage purge is the AOE version. Demon version is not AOE.
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  • Mayfly - DreamweaverMayfly - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,094 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    I thought it was sage, but didn't want to steer anyone wrong and didn't trust my memory that much.
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  • Solandri - Heavens TearSolandri - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,843 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Lucky is your best "free" DPS spell (only Ironwood is better but costs chi). I would try to max it. The downsides are its high mana cost and cooldown timer. The stun is also useful for interrupting certain annoying caster mobs even at level 1. It takes some practice to learn the timing for when mobs will cast. But once you've figured it out and can interrupt, a mob starting to cast is basically 4-5 seconds your pet can go without taking any damage. At higher levels it's also good for stopping a mob if you pull aggro from your pet. Lucky - Fox - Stunning - move away will usually freeze it in place long enough for the pet to get aggro back.

    Nova is a waste of two sparks. Does terrible DPS, terrible damage per mana (compared to other skills double-sparked, including noxious in AOE situations). I can think of only two reasons to use it. If you need the seal effect (which sadly is only 67% likely to succeed). And if you're AOEing and have no shortage of chi (e.g. Rebirth) and are waiting for the cooldown on Noxious. Ok, three reasons - the graphical effect is pretty cool. Outside of Rebirth, the only recurring uses I've found for Nova are against bishops in FC, and to kill most of the guards in BH29 Qingzi's room in one shot.
  • Mayfly - DreamweaverMayfly - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,094 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Nova is also useful in the Mice Bashing room in the cube if you find/gather a group of tombstones, or on level 32 Sabertail Scorpid King and his 6 level 30 Venomous Talontail followers in the north-east end of Scorpion Valley if you're leveling up pets (low level pets only on the scorpion group) though Noxious Gas does nearly as good a job.
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  • Alphae - Lost CityAlphae - Lost City Posts: 1,512 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    <Ahem> Other AOEs. There are two foxform AOEs, Befuddling Mist (very short range and directional) and Malefic Crush (shorter range than Noxious, longer than Befuddling.) There is also the foxform Myriad Rainbow, which is an AOE debuff, and I think either the sage or demon version of Purge is AOE, but neither do direct damage.

    Whoops, should have specified that it's the wider ranged of the human AOEs.

    Sage Purge is AOE but it's about a 5 meter range. Very useful in TW for one. Basically I didn't mention the fox AOEs as well because they do have quite limited range. I mostly use Myriad Rainbow fox, and I'm demon so I have demon Purge (lower cooldown, I might mention, is also very nice). I don't have any other demon fox skills, so I don't even think I actually have Malefic Crush as I haven't had a reason to level a mana burn yet =P
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  • Mayfly - DreamweaverMayfly - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,094 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Malefic crush does damage as well as mana burn... since I don't PVP, the damage part is the only part that concerns me. Crush vigor, on the other hand, I haven't even bothered to learn on my HA/AA veno.
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  • Alphae - Lost CityAlphae - Lost City Posts: 1,512 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Malefic crush does damage as well as mana burn... since I don't PVP, the damage part is the only part that concerns me. Crush vigor, on the other hand, I haven't even bothered to learn on my HA/AA veno.

    It does damage if you hit the target :c which I don't a good percentage of the time :C crush vigor is a nice skill if you get the demon version, which gives 50% to gain a spark.
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