FAILURE OF LOGIC and all that is right. - Lost City

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  • MagicHamsta - Lost City
    MagicHamsta - Lost City Posts: 10,466 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    What humans probably need.
    x.x'
    darthpanda16: Firefox crashed on me. Aryannamage: I don't think I am a GM that would be new.
    Hawk:Do this. closing thread
    frankieraye: I'll see if we can replace the woman with a stick figure and the tiger fangs with marshmallows.//Issues like these need to get escalated quickly to minimize the damage.
    Kantorek: Yeah.. you should try it. It's awesome.
    Sihndra: Nope- not currently possible under any circumstances. Sorry.
    LokisDottir: I mean...not haunting the forums, nope nope..
    Konariraiden: You don't know what you are up against. You will lose.
    Waiting for...Hamster Packs!
    58% chance to get tokens
    41% chance to get an all class pet hamster....but they has already been freed by the magic hamster.
    1% chance to get ban hamstered with the message "Hamsters United!"
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Kupuntu - Sanctuary
    Kupuntu - Sanctuary Posts: 3,008 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Possible explanations:

    1) Quit for a year and forgot what HF does. Yeah fat chance.

    2) Quit for a long time and was sword/fist/spear/whatever without HF. Yeah...

    3) Troll.

    4) Fail player.

    If he actually quit for a year or so, I'd say it's no. 1. If not, then the third/fourth one.
    YouLoveRice - Lost City wrote: »
    HOW IS 3 > 40 and if anyone can give me a reasonable explanation for this, and could possible tell me why i was kicked for finaly stop using 3rd spark and doing what they wanted, then i will gladly bend over and run around being useless in frost rather then actually helping my squad.

    Okay that's rather weird; why kick someone out when they did what the squad wanted?
    100% F2P player. Started PW: March 2007, Quit PW: March 2011.
    pwcalc.com/e7016929e7b204ae "Pure axe" 8k HP multipath BM, last one of my kind.
  • Tatuaje - Lost City
    Tatuaje - Lost City Posts: 2,780 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Since we are on the topic of fail players.

    Was on my SIN this weekend running BH39. Had a good group other than a barb.

    Constantly, this fail Barb would run into large amounts of mobs and aggro all of them and never us any AOE aggro skills.

    Myself and another fairly well geared Sin would constantly save the cleric and party. Our Veno did well to help the group survive. At Hercule, the Barb rushes in on the boss and mobs and Cleric gets ganked from aggroing the blood suckers.

    Veno, Sin and myself were able to kill Herc nonetheless and then proceeded to gank the Barb.

    Funny part was the Barb asked for an invite back to squad for the next run. b:shocked

    Hope you all enjoyed my pointless mural of text. b:bye

    Moral of the story: Seeing many fails Barbs lately. And Veno's seem to be lacking the knowledge of pulling mobs properly.
    tatuaje: grinding mobs and zhenning ???
    frankieraye:All right, I admit it, it's a bit retro. lol.
  • Redmenace - Heavens Tear
    Redmenace - Heavens Tear Posts: 908 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    RedsRose - Lost City wrote: »
    He didn't....he played over a year ago...


    *sigh* Rice b:surrender

    That skill worked the same way a year ago.

    RedMenace

    \example of the usual LC Rage
    A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.
    Robert A. Heinlein
  • Oneji - Heavens Tear
    Oneji - Heavens Tear Posts: 310 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    You know your guys behavior just amazes me *sarcasm*.Could you guys just grow up and instead of ranting at a person who has been gone a long time about how stupid he is,(so he says)could you not just simply say "HF amplifies damage, and btw welcome backb:victory. Not trying to sound like your parents or something but it is really ridiculous how you guys are actingb:bye.
  • Skynyrd - Lost City
    Skynyrd - Lost City Posts: 45 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    I was gunna say somthing smartass but... +1
  • Nakhimov - Lost City
    Nakhimov - Lost City Posts: 1,829 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    People like you are the reason I quit this game.
    You are THE WORST.
    Bladestorm lets you spin around like a carnival ride and do damage. Not using it is almost like having a move called Confetti Rocket Power Leap and saving it for "emergencies"
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Nakhimov the Kingslayer of Kil'Jaeden's <Criminal Scum>
    wowprogress.com/guild/us/kil-jaeden/Criminal+Scum
  • Airyll - Dreamweaver
    Airyll - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,882 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Tatuaje - Lost City wrote: »
    Since we are on the topic of fail players.

    Was on my SIN this weekend running BH39. Had a good group other than a barb.

    Constantly, this fail Barb would run into large amounts of mobs and aggro all of them and never us any AOE aggro skills.

    Myself and another fairly well geared Sin would constantly save the cleric and party. Our Veno did well to help the group survive. At Hercule, the Barb rushes in on the boss and mobs and Cleric gets ganked from aggroing the blood suckers.

    Veno, Sin and myself were able to kill Herc nonetheless and then proceeded to gank the Barb.

    Funny part was the Barb asked for an invite back to squad for the next run. b:shocked

    Hope you all enjoyed my pointless mural of text. b:bye

    Moral of the story: Seeing many fails Barbs lately. And Veno's seem to be lacking the knowledge of pulling mobs properly.

    All this is the sign of two fail players.

    1) A fail barb who doesn't aggro what he runs into.

    2) A fail cleric for healing the fail barb.

    I'd have let that cleric die for his own equal stupidity. Any smart cleric worth their salt will leave failure barbs like that to die because it will either encourage them to leave the squad, opening a free space for a not-fail barb, or it will actually teach the barb something. All without a single other death.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Tatuaje - Lost City
    Tatuaje - Lost City Posts: 2,780 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Airyll - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    2) A fail cleric for healing the fail barb.

    This I agree with but for the whole run I have to admit the Cleric did his best to keep everyone alive.

    But yes, the Cleric was fail for trying to do to much.

    I can admit my next run, we were Cleric hoarders. We had one pro Barb, 2 pro SINS, and 3 Clerics.

    Each DD had his own Clerical protector if need be. Really, the Barb had the highest level Cleric keeping him alive.

    The run went very well.

    I do have to say that mobs with TnT up their yingyang are the worst kind and BH39 is bad. Can't wait to get my SIN to 60 to get out of there.
    tatuaje: grinding mobs and zhenning ???
    frankieraye:All right, I admit it, it's a bit retro. lol.
  • Airyll - Dreamweaver
    Airyll - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,882 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Tatuaje - Lost City wrote: »
    This I agree with but for the whole run I have to admit the Cleric did his best to keep everyone alive.

    But yes, the Cleric was fail for trying to do to much.

    I can admit my next run, we were Cleric hoarders. We had one pro Barb, 2 pro SINS, and 3 Clerics.

    Each DD had his own Clerical protector if need be. Really, the Barb had the highest level Cleric keeping him alive.

    The run went very well.

    I do have to say that mobs with TnT up their yingyang are the worst kind and BH39 is bad. Can't wait to get my SIN to 60 to get out of there.

    To be honest, I'm surprised to hear that a run with that many clerics went well. More often than not, a run with multiple clerics tends to become worse then a run with, say, only one. This is because each cleric will assume the other cleric will, say, heal the barb, and so they themselves don't do their job as well as they should.

    Not that multiple cleric squads don't work out. As you've just said, they can. But I tend to find even though I feel safer with three clerics in a squad, I end up dying more.

    I will agree that BH39 is a nasty BH. I never enjoyed it on my veno and I'm grateful my archer was beyond 60 when BH was first introduced. I just hate 39 as an instance in general.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • VlLKASS - Sanctuary
    VlLKASS - Sanctuary Posts: 1,396 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Airyll - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    To be honest, I'm surprised to hear that a run with that many clerics went well. More often than not, a run with multiple clerics tends to become worse then a run with, say, only one. This is because each cleric will assume the other cleric will, say, heal the barb, and so they themselves don't do their job as well as they should.

    Not that multiple cleric squads don't work out. As you've just said, they can. But I tend to find even though I feel safer with three clerics in a squad, I end up dying more.

    I will agree that BH39 is a nasty BH. I never enjoyed it on my veno and I'm grateful my archer was beyond 60 when BH was first introduced. I just hate 39 as an instance in general.

    b:chuckle I always loved BH39 on Arch & BM.
    On Arch I'm way in the bk, while the mob blows in the tanks face :D
    On Bm I got to practise Tiger Leap/Leap Bk to avoid dmg when mobs exploded, was fun.
    Not that multiple cleric squads don't work out. As you've just said, they can. But I tend to find even though I feel safer with three clerics in a squad, I end up dying more.

    Lol same experience...
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Jhalil - Heavens Tear
    Jhalil - Heavens Tear Posts: 865 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Can this be stickied?
    And also have the words/terms "hyper stones" and "fast leveling" and "hypers" automatically be linked to this topic?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Still trying to move your cursor, eh?
  • Deora - Lost City
    Deora - Lost City Posts: 1,086 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    I will go in his defense here because I do know that he did play around a year ago and did quit... my old main was even in the same faction as him, and anyone that played LC around that time knew who he was so yeah more then likely he forgot what the skill did...
  • Solandri - Heavens Tear
    Solandri - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,843 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Let me play devil's advocate and point out that due to poor translation, if all you do is read the skill description, it isn't at all obvious that the Heaven's Flame does a damage amp. "Leap onto the opponent using your mana to summon a blazing fire dragon dealing base physical damage plus 100% of weapon damage plus 4135.7. Damages all enemies within 12 meters of the target and causes them to suffer 100% of that damage over 6 seconds."

    To see that it amplifies all damage, you have to bring up the skill tree and read the description there. Since most people rarely do that, and since you don't see other people's damage, it'd be very easy to miss the damage amp effect if you weren't told about it.

    OP should've asked his group why they wanted him to use HF instead of being stubborn and refusing to use it despite their pleas. But I hardly consider not knowing about the amp effect to be fail. I suspect the vast majority of players didn't know it until they're told about it or read about it on the forums.
  • Olba - Sanctuary
    Olba - Sanctuary Posts: 1,776 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Well, going to point this out:
    Heaven's Flame wrote:
    Damages all enemies
    within 12 meters of the target and causes them to suffer 100% of that
    damage over 6 seconds    .
    Subsea Strike wrote:
    Increases all damage taken by the target by 30.0% for 8 seconds.
    Amplify Damage wrote:
    While in fox form, curse the target and make it take 20% more damage for 20.0 seconds.

    Seriously, the way it's written, Heaven's Flame does sound like it has a DoT instead of an amp. Even more so compared to Subsea Strike and Amplify Damage.

    So yeah, unless someone has told you, you're rather unlikely to know HF's effect. After all, if you're gonna take more than 8 seconds to kill something, it's bound to be a boss. And in those, you'd be more likely to want to spark. Unless, of course, you figured that 2 sparks is far too high a price for what looks like a crappy DoT.
    If you disregard what I say because of who I am or because of the contents of what I said, you are a fool.

    Everyone wants to be different, but when you're different you wish you were normal.
  • Tatuaje - Lost City
    Tatuaje - Lost City Posts: 2,780 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Airyll - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Not that multiple cleric squads don't work out. As you've just said, they can. But I tend to find even though I feel safer with three clerics in a squad, I end up dying more.

    The reason why this worked out was we did the one thing every squad should do previous to all runs. Discuss strategy. Once everyone knew their roles and secondary if something went wrong, the triple BH run went incredibly smooth. b:victory
    tatuaje: grinding mobs and zhenning ???
    frankieraye:All right, I admit it, it's a bit retro. lol.
  • Noob - Raging Tide
    Noob - Raging Tide Posts: 771 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    oh my...thats like asking a cleric to pureheart instead of ironheart...
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • RedsRose - Lost City
    RedsRose - Lost City Posts: 12,354 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Noob - Raging Tide wrote: »
    oh my...thats like asking a cleric to pureheart instead of ironheart...

    b:shockedb:infuriatedb:cry

    Nightmares...b:sad
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    RoidAbuse is awesome, only he would sell his sperm for gear!!

    "Toughest monster? ..... RedsRose b:surrender" - Kantorek
    Where is my 1 v 1 Kan? b:mischievous
  • Tudordan - Dreamweaver
    Tudordan - Dreamweaver Posts: 123 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Go play WoW and stop infesting our general forums with useless vomit and silenced screams,OPb:bye
    I hate idiots,but I'm forced to stay near them!
  • Typhyse - Sanctuary
    Typhyse - Sanctuary Posts: 3,469 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Tatuaje - Lost City wrote: »
    The reason why this worked out was we did the one thing every squad should do previous to all runs. Discuss strategy. Once everyone knew their roles and secondary if something went wrong, the triple BH run went incredibly smooth. b:victory

    Strategy can greatly outdo brute force.
    My wife is 63 and I help her with her BHs. The other day we were in a squad with 2 other sins and 2 clerics. Needless to say, as all the others were in the 6x range, I was the tank. Mobs were fine, Fush was easy, Rank needed a little strategy, but Drake was as bish. After an almost full party wipe out (me and one of the sins SEd in time), we tried again, this time I aggroed Drake from behind out of stealth so his AoE wouldn't one-shot the clerics. Done.
    So yeah, not tooting my own horn here for being a tank; just saying how a little strategy can make even the most unorthodox of squads kick some major ****.

    Edit: sorry for continuing the off-topic conversation.
    Demon_Troll: "takes on the appearance of an innocent archer but turns into a mindless idiot once you hear him speak"
    ~Spazz~
  • kalx
    kalx Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Watch me get flamed for this, or they will give me a reply think their being smart but while flaming me.
    Oneji - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    You know your guys behavior just amazes me *sarcasm*.Could you guys just grow up and instead of ranting at a person who has been gone a long time about how stupid he is,(so he says)could you not just simply say "HF amplifies damage, and btw welcome backb:victory. Not trying to sound like your parents or something but it is really ridiculous how you guys are actingb:bye.
    Olba - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Well, going to point this out:







    Seriously, the way it's written, Heaven's Flame does sound like it has a DoT instead of an amp. Even more so compared to Subsea Strike and Amplify Damage.

    So yeah, unless someone has told you, you're rather unlikely to know HF's effect. After all, if you're gonna take more than 8 seconds to kill something, it's bound to be a boss. And in those, you'd be more likely to want to spark. Unless, of course, you figured that 2 sparks is far too high a price for what looks like a crappy DoT.

    ^
    l
    l
    +1 These.

    Seriously people stop commenting on the thread, the guy didn't know what HF done, acknowledge and advice him ffs. This community need to sort themselves out. Regardless how long he played the game if he is a noob or whatever, you can never stop learning and people's arrogance that their knowledge is better astounds me.
  • Borsuc - Raging Tide
    Borsuc - Raging Tide Posts: 1,526 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    MagicHamsta - Lost City wrote: »
    (>.<)
    Which be why me stopped using DB for the most part in Frost runs.
    xD

    DB be deadly.....to the wizzy.
    D:
    omg use Expel you noob. b:chuckle

    You really wanna get a wipe when barb happens to die if he lags on invoke? Cause you're asking for it relying on barb keeping aggro. (impossible)
    Magic_Seeker - Sanctuary wrote: »
    But for the sake of discussion , when a BM uses HF I, (The actual DD of your party ) hit crits of up to 150k , now thats much better than regular 25k hits isn't it?
    That's total nonsense. 25k doesn't become 150k with HF. I believe 25k*2 = 50k not 150k. 6 times the damage output is not what HF does.
  • KuiXing - Harshlands
    KuiXing - Harshlands Posts: 1,084 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    and this is why ppl dont like oracles and hypers..... -facepalm-
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    I have the best mom ever, she brought me drugs and fruit juice - Reavღ
    Challenge accepted I'm going to go blow up the sun - FanFon
    Those crabs are like the Energizer Bunny, they just keep going and going and going... - Wildsblade
  • Okeano - Harshlands
    Okeano - Harshlands Posts: 4,943 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Oh great, this dumb thread got dumped to BM's section.

    Let's assume he knew the effect of HF tho. I use and don't use HF on bosses depends on the squad. If the squad is mostly casters who wants to triple spark and hit a high crit or 2 to feel good about themselves then no, it'd be better damage in the long run for me to keep triple sparking. I used HF with casters back at lower APS but don't anymore unless it's Psy. With a squad of more than 1 interval Sin, I time my HF with their sparks.
  • Joshcja - Sanctuary
    Joshcja - Sanctuary Posts: 3,502 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    please move this thread out of our fourums and chance the OP's class to wizzie

    we dont want him here and he needs a reason to Q.Q

    (its a vit axe bm Okeano pretty shure its 3 sparked damage is ****)
    Gifs are hard to make work here
  • Typhyse - Sanctuary
    Typhyse - Sanctuary Posts: 3,469 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    I don't understand why he was kicked in the first place. It's not like he was an ASSassin teleing around, grabbing aggro, then SEing to let the squad get caught unprepared. (believe me, I've done that before and it's not a pretty sightb:shocked)
    Demon_Troll: "takes on the appearance of an innocent archer but turns into a mindless idiot once you hear him speak"
    ~Spazz~
  • Telarith - Sanctuary
    Telarith - Sanctuary Posts: 1,417 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Oneji - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    You know your guys behavior just amazes me *sarcasm*.Could you guys just grow up and instead of ranting at a person who has been gone a long time about how stupid he is,(so he says)could you not just simply say "HF amplifies damage, and btw welcome backb:victory. Not trying to sound like your parents or something but it is really ridiculous how you guys are actingb:bye.

    It really shouldn't, one thing these forums are very good at is reality checks. Read the thread of this topic, and then reread the original posting. THAT is why everyone is responding the way they are. If he had come in generally curious, and trying to find out who was at fault, it would have been generally helpful posts that informed. Maybe a little ribbing. But then again, someone like that would have listened or asked the group in the first place, so moot point.

    Their post was arrogant, and unfortunately ignorant which just compounded the issue. Arrogance by itself might be excused in moderation, when there is something to back it up. He showcased the worst kind of behavior people run into from whoracles, and is getting it shoved back in his face while informing him. So they are at least above his level, in that while acting the same they are at least providing useful information.

    Thing is, BMs knew how the skill worked within a month of server start, through word of mouth and faction chat. And with the proliferation of dumb VIT axers back then, not knowing how HF works would take some real effort. The only time trip spark was used over HF, was in solo AoE grinding for the greater over-all damage soloing, and immunity time allowing charm to recharge. But that was solo only, in groups HF did more damage. And if he played back then, he would have had the skill on his skillbar. So even with some serious amnesia, he should at least have wondered why it was there.

    There's always the possibility that he got confused, and was basing it off of old threads debating the merits of trip spark over HF from soloing, and used that to base his "logic" from. But that would be even worse, as it means he would/is a mindless drone who doesn't think and just copies what he sees/hears without having any idea why.

    Back then FBs were done alot, and done often. He would have known from there, the question becomes is it the same person who was playing a year ago, or someone else. Either way, can we just merge this with the Lyndura's BM guide and be done with seeing it in our forum section?
    Fist are the worst at PvP AND PvE, if you disagree, as I said, take it to PM's or make your own guide. Go here if you want to debate about it. - Lyndura

    Get a High lvl Fist warrior use it, Restat to axes. GG - complexx

    :NOTE: These signatures are to forever immortalize, how stupid people can be.
  • Michael_Dark - Lost City
    Michael_Dark - Lost City Posts: 9,091 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Borsuc - Raging Tide wrote: »
    That's total nonsense. 25k doesn't become 150k with HF. I believe 25k*2 = 50k not 150k. 6 times the damage output is not what HF does.

    If he's a an axe BM it would work as: normal x zerk x crit x amped with HF.

    b:bye
    I post in forums. This one and others. That's why I post.
  • Kondo - Lost City
    Kondo - Lost City Posts: 6 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    dude u r kinda a fail bm,just because u don't even know what the skills do and u consider urself smart,even I(archer) could use a bm better than u do,so stop being so proud of urself and listen to other players.

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