Fist venos...benefits?

Nothing aside from lulz.

There was a thread a while back, which worked out that fox-form veno, due to melee mastery, could be very nearly as effective as a BM, using fists.
Add the pet on top for added damage and you might just be tipping the scales.

Of course - on the downside, you lack the BMs skillset - no wonderful stuns, no aggro management etc. And since oyu've tricked the game into letting you be a fist-fox, you can't even use your veno skills (no pet heal!)

So it's a somewhat silly build, at best.

Here's a fox fist build with stats set for a level 95 magic weapon and barely enough str and dex to wield the Lunar claw. Has to be light armor to get the stats to work.
5315-6010 damage
5662.5 average damage
3.33 atk/sec w/ full interval gear
18856 DPS average
Generates 13.32 chi/sec
Can Sage spark every 25.5 sec
Sage spark yields 42584 DPS
Overall DPS is (42584*15+18856*7.5)/25.5 = 30595.6

Here's a heavy magic sword fox with the exact same number of stat points. Using the Lunar magic sword with same refine and shards as Deicide above.
7143-8260 damage
7701.5 average damage
2 atk/sec w/ full interval gear
15403 DPS average
Generates 8 chi/sec
Can Sage spark every 40.5 sec
Sage spark yields 31120 DPS
Overall DPS is (31120*15+15403*22.5)/40.5 = 20083.3

BUT, with the magic sword you can Amp. Sage Amp gives you 20 sec of 30% extra damage, which if you have no channeling items works out to (1.3*20 + 1*10)/31.5 = 1.143 = 14.3% extra damage on average. 20083.3*1.143 = 22952.3 DPS. Demon Amp will do slightly more.

So far, the fist fox does about 33% more DPS than the heavy magic sword fox. In my case, I have Sage Soul Degen, so that's like an instant (1/.8) = 25% boost to my DPS. So the fist fox build would have only a 1.33/1.25 = 6.4% damage advantage over a heavy magic sword build using Sage Soul Degen and Amp.

In theory, Ironwood should decrease this gap further. But then you have to figure mob defense, time spent out of fox form, and spell damage, which makes it much more complicated. And the Amp calc ignores the boost to pet DPS. Suffice it to say, I don't think giving up your skills and heavy armor to wield a fist weapon is worth the less than 6.4% extra damage.

True you could remove the mag from the fist fox and dump it into str. But at that point, why play a veno? Just make a BM. You don't need to break the claws every time you login, you get lots of skills you can use, and you can hit 5 atk/sec with Demon spark and stay perma-sparked.

Vitenka - Dreamweaver wrote: »

There was a thread a while back, which worked out that fox-form veno, due to melee mastery, could be very nearly as effective as a BM, using fists.
Add the pet on top for added damage and you might just be tipping the scales.

Of course - on the downside, you lack the BMs skillset - no wonderful stuns, no aggro management etc. And since oyu've tricked the game into letting you be a fist-fox, you can't even use your veno skills (no pet heal!)

So it's a somewhat silly build, at best.

not even close
having a big number multiplied with 3.33 or 5 is a big difference
besides that, sins w/o fists outperform both bm or fox

all melee weapons (except bows) benefit from melee mastery but switching to fox is a requeriment. if a veno is to choose a fist bm build to stay full time as fox (it's only possible to switch to fox when the weapon cracks and it takes a while to do that) she won't be able to heal pet or use skills as they're only avaiable with magic weapons. it's possible to summon/unsummon pets and use their skills though. the advantage of that is to have the highest DPS in game even with lower attack rate than, very high accuracy and physical resistance. must be very good to tank bosses and to PK melee classes but being unable to use skills is a terrible disadvantage.

I'd much rather get a not so rare OHT magic sword (or maybe nirvana?) with 2 or 3 -requeriment adds so magic can be neglected.

King_Solomon - Heavens Tear wrote: »

the advantage of that is to have the highest DPS in game even with lower attack rate than, very high accuracy and physical resistance.

i had squad with fists bm with interval and they kill bosses very fast. i had squads with sins and they destroy bosses. ive seen for example fc bosses going down so fast, my amplify didnt even disappeared before bosses died. yea, bosses that died in seconds. your place there is to debuff bosses, trying to be a half DD that others can be with the same gear as yours is a waste of time, not to mention that you cant debuff either.