FF for a BM

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d3athwsh
d3athwsh Posts: 1 Arc User
edited May 2010 in Dungeons & Tactics
OK I've never done FF before but I have lvl 85 axe BM. I've read through various FF guides but I was wondering if theres anything I should know as BM that would be required of me to do in a FF run or any particular role a BM may have in there. Any info info would be appreciated, thnx!
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  • LifeHunting - Heavens Tear
    LifeHunting - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,023 Arc User
    edited April 2010
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    BM Roll in FF:


    AoE all mobs to death while barb holds the arggo off you :D


    Oh, just as an incaser (for like if barb lost arggo to you because you switched to fist), have a HP charm on your guy.
  • Brigid - Harshlands
    Brigid - Harshlands Posts: 1,332 Arc User
    edited April 2010
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    That's incorrect, at least until you get up into the 90s. Please acquire some actual FC experience before giving advice about it.

    BM's primary role is not to be a half-assed DD. BM's role is support. Specifically, to Roar of the Pride (stun) all mobs, then Heaven's Flame so that the real DDs do their job faster. Good squads can finish off the pulls before the stun wears off.

    At higher levels, BMs can also be the primary puller, but they tend to have more trouble with the pulls that include magic mobs, and there's less margin for error.

    A squad with multiple BMs also can work quite well at higher levels, but again that's something you try once you're familiar with the instance and know what you're doing.
  • Korg - Lost City
    Korg - Lost City Posts: 130 Arc User
    edited April 2010
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    Stand by the clerics blue zhen wait for the pull to reach you
    then stun>Dragons>Aoe.
    Your roll during the zhenning process is usually to save the squishy classes by stunning the group and amping damage to kill the group of mobs faster.
    Otherwise the archer, mage and sometimes even the cleric might grab mobs and die.

    Some squads also rely on the bms to handle the bishop groups because of there aoe freeze (usually freezing other classes before they get to her)
    Just use Will of the Bodhisatva to immunize youself from freeze run to the center of the group and Stun so the other classes can move in safely and kill it.

    ^^


    Happy Frosting!



    Edit: I was ninjad
  • LifeHunting - Heavens Tear
    LifeHunting - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,023 Arc User
    edited April 2010
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    Brigid: Done FF before, that is all i had to do :)


    So, please don't be rude when i say what i know from the FF's i've done (based on what only i had to do).
  • Kristoph - Lost City
    Kristoph - Lost City Posts: 2,016 Arc User
    edited April 2010
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    LifeHunting - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Brigid: Done FF before, that is all i had to do :)


    So, please don't be rude when i say what i know from the FF's i've done (based on what only i had to do).
    Just because that's all you did doesn't mean other BMs should be useless as well. Fact that you failed to mention Roar/HF is quite a big deal.
    Wondering how much longer these **** packs are going to be around.
  • d3athwsh
    d3athwsh Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited April 2010
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    Thnx alot all! b:pleased
  • LifeHunting - Heavens Tear
    LifeHunting - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,023 Arc User
    edited May 2010
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    Kristoph - Lost City wrote: »
    Just because that's all you did doesn't mean other BMs should be useless as well. Fact that you failed to mention Roar/HF is quite a big deal.

    Me not Axe BM. Me Sword/Fist BM (with pole for slight luring potential)

    And i didn't need roar since the herc was ok with handling arggo for most the mobs and me was charmed.
  • Astoru - Heavens Tear
    Astoru - Heavens Tear Posts: 822 Arc User
    edited May 2010
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    LifeHunting - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Me not Axe BM. Me Sword/Fist BM (with pole for slight luring potential)

    And i didn't need roar since the herc was ok with handling arggo for most the mobs and me was charmed.
    Sword+fist bm = Useless in FF. HF is a big deal.

    Just saying.

    By the way, does Herc have an AoE stun? No? Then your point is moot.
    ●Wizard (Male) - Fasditious and pretentious, carries the arrogance of intellectual superiority. Feels the need to remind everyone of his world-ending power, but grows a little manic and unhinged when he finally is allowed to unleash it. "Ahh-hahahahaha!! NOW YOU ALL BURN!!!!"
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • FoXyLadyRoss - Lost City
    FoXyLadyRoss - Lost City Posts: 15 Arc User
    edited May 2010
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    keep party buffed
    stand by BB/ mage dragon breath and aoe stun when mobs come in

    if its a really good pull, aoe stun, dragon, then aoe till they die
    there is not a single pull in there that lives through a full cycle of aoe stun, dragon, aoes skills, while mage is also doing dragon breath and archer doing its rain skill

    so that is about it

    easy as pie
  • FatherTed - Dreamweaver
    FatherTed - Dreamweaver Posts: 3,723 Arc User
    edited May 2010
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    Stun mobs barb brings back before they aggro cleric.

    Dragon.

    Stun bishops.

    Spend the rest of your time kicking ****!

    That's it off the top of my head.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Thanks for the sig Ophida :3
  • Lylfo - Dreamweaver
    Lylfo - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,166 Arc User
    edited May 2010
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    The usual stun, HF.

    Get alpha male if you are pulling so as to not let the cleric die first. Bm also has the freeze immunity buff making them perfect for bishops.

    Bring a bow for heads and harpies. Bm can do the hands at the big room too by using their "poke" or bring a bow.

    If you are a fist BM(preferably with int gears and is tanking/a good barb to hold aggro), double/triple spark DD and if you are not(worried about repair cost, death, cant deal alot of damage), hf more to help your squad.(If you are neither axe or fist bm....I dont have any useful advice for you)

    Also, help to cancel channeling skills(if you are a fist BM) at bosses like the sleep(the one with the claw before the big room) or the bubble boss.

    Recommended genie skills would be cloud eruption, bramble rage, alpha male,holy path(if you are pulling)
    Thanks Chillum for the nice Sig.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Infliction - Raging Tide
    Infliction - Raging Tide Posts: 59 Arc User
    edited May 2010
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    Brigid - Harshlands wrote: »
    That's incorrect, at least until you get up into the 90s. Please acquire some actual FC experience before giving advice about it.

    BM's primary role is not to be a half-assed DD. BM's role is support. Specifically, to Roar of the Pride (stun) all mobs, then Heaven's Flame so that the real DDs do their job faster. Good squads can finish off the pulls before the stun wears off.

    At higher levels, BMs can also be the primary puller, but they tend to have more trouble with the pulls that include magic mobs, and there's less margin for error.

    A squad with multiple BMs also can work quite well at higher levels, but again that's something you try once you're familiar with the instance and know what you're doing.

    The real DD's being what? In every FC I've ever done, for 1, A bm in a big pull is the best DD, because when every single mob in the group is attacking 1 person, that means that the person has aggro. A fist/axe bm with GX and some nice fist is the best DD on bosses, and in big groups, can also be the best DD.
  • Lylfo - Dreamweaver
    Lylfo - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,166 Arc User
    edited May 2010
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    BM with axes are good for aoe DD. But wizards and archers are better aoe DD cuz their skills hit at a much faster interval. In 9/10 squads I've been to, the wizards and archers are the ones who seem to steal aggro. If that is not enough, go make a 5 BM and 1 cleric FC since Bms are puller/DD/tank (which is very possible btw).
    Thanks Chillum for the nice Sig.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Brigid - Harshlands
    Brigid - Harshlands Posts: 1,332 Arc User
    edited May 2010
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    Infliction - Raging Tide wrote: »
    The real DD's being what? In every FC I've ever done, for 1, A bm in a big pull is the best DD, because when every single mob in the group is attacking 1 person, that means that the person has aggro. A fist/axe bm with GX and some nice fist is the best DD on bosses, and in big groups, can also be the best DD.
    Note that I was talking about an 8x squad. In fact, I specifically said "until you get into the 90s" at the very beginning of my post.

    Also, in my FC squads, it's almost never been the BM with aggro on any pull where I use Barrage. When you see more than half of the pull all running away from the barb/BM, and towards the archer, that's a pretty clear sign who has the aggro, no?

    Regarding 90+, I won't deny that a fist/axe BM can be a better DD on bosses. I mean hell, at least half of the time I can do better damage as a fist archer than by shooting. That's despite the fact that I'm pure DEX.

    Anyways, numbers:
    L8 barrage: base physical damage plus 180% of weapon damage plus 4109.8, every 3 seconds. Base for 8x archers is at least 4-6k or so, 180% of weapon is around 1.5-2k. So, call it 10-13k or so every 3 seconds. That's not even counting the 20% or more crit chance that the archer will have.

    L10 Dragon's Breath: base magic damage plus 4458.2 every 3 seconds. Base for 8x wizards is at least 4-6k, so 8-10k or so every 3 seconds.

    L80 BM will have maybe 3-5k or so base physical, 600-1.2k weapon damage.
    L10 Highland Cleave: Base physical damage plus 100% of weapon damage plus 2118.2. That's 6-8k, in 2.4 seconds.
    L10 Fissure: Base physical damage plus 2442.7. That's 5.5-7.5k, in 1.7 seconds.
    L10 Drake Sweep: Base physical damage plus 2036.8. That's another 5-7k, in 1.2 seconds.

    Thus, in 6 seconds, you have the Archer doing 20-26k, Wizard doing 16-20k, and the BM doing 16.5-22.5k. But wait, you say. The BM is doing just as much damage! But remember, Heaven's Flame increases the entire squad's damage by 90% (for level 8) or more. Unless for some reason there's only one DD, the squad's damage output is increased far more by using HF than by using their other AOEs.

    tl;dr: BMs can do almost as much damage, sure. But if they do, then the squad as a whole is NOT doing as much damage, and is taking far more damage as well. Heaven's Flame increases the squad's damage output by at least 2 DD's worth, whereas trying to play DD increases the squad's damage output by 1 DD's worth.

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