3 Fist questions

lol hey :P its me raven *chuckle* anyways the guy above covered most of it i just wanted to say hi and add on, i was lucky enough to find a 3* HA lv 64 intervaled guant for 400k and im keeping that untill TT90 gold *-* rofl i love the thing, but LA is a great alternative seeing as more intervals of those are around. deamon is a must as far as i hear, if u ever get rich enough to hit 5 times a second u can keep a constant demon spark which is devastating.

side note... i had no clue deamon HF was given another 3 secs

and imo the lv 59 fist skill isn't that great, i didn't get it, cause its effect isn't great and its not flashy ._. (sry i love the axe and sword 2 sparks xDD) besides if u can do that, i would just spark instead. if u can't kill them without that extra fire dmg u shouldn't be fighting them

CruiseWolf - Heavens Tear wrote: »

well you can cast the fist ulti without using 2sparks, just cast skill and immediately before its finished switch to axes to cancell skill, then u will have the fire damage and both ur sparks still.

I use it and switch to axes then do HF and back to fists. i hit way more harder than i do without it.

Lol what is this cyclone heel glitch you are talking about Devoted?

Curious as well what this glitch would be. At this point i do Cyclone heel -> 2 spark to do massive damage output in sparked time, since at level 9 it's duration is 12 secs, and cooldown of 15.

omg now you are making me curious ><

I just can't seem to think of a combo to make cyclone heel glitch, because i don't see any benefits of it interrupting but still have the speed boost.

I mean using cyclone heel and then switching to axes wouldn't be the glitch would it? if that's the case i've been using it since i got cyclone heel :P

I don't use the two spark fist ulti / two spark axe ulti alot because i feel cyclone heel -> two spark will do more DPS then casting that many skills in the cyclone heel attack speed increase.

maybe i should try out the two spark fist ulti -> glitch axes -> cyclone heel -> two sparks -> switch to fists in spark -> dps

Kokki - Harshlands wrote: »

I can imagine doing the glitch for the two spark skills like HF and DBB, but the cast and channel time on cyclone heel is probably shorter then glitching it. I mean switching over to axes just when heel starts and then switching back to effectively DD again = one mistake and you waste 2 seconds.

If i attack once with my axes after the heel cast i lost just over 1.2 seconds on top of the interrrupt time and lag on servers. full time of C. heel is 1.6 i believe? ( i'm at work can't check exact channel and cast time )

So how usefull is it to glitch it?

Main thing for glitching is making the most of it, everything should lead to something else.

For instance, basic BM level is just having a weapon. Higher version would be after-cast canceling. Higher still is using weapon swaps with all that. Then there is adding cancel casting on top of it all, and you'll see how fun that is with some of the skills.

Cancel casting only works on self buff skills, our debuff skills don't get applied until after damage comes; whereas buffs are applied during the channel phase. This is the whole trick for cancel casting. Unfortunately, this means you must do the cancel during the time of the channel of the skill. And as an idea, I had to reorder my bar just to successfully cancel cast the .2 sec channeling time of demon GS. You have under .2 seconds to swap weapon, which is a real pain in the **** until you start getting that one down. DBB is much easier with its .6 sec channel.

So, you know you will be changing weapon to get a cancel cast to go off, which means you start chaining them. My method is cancel cast DBB, swap to spear and cancel aftercast direct to Roar of the Pride for the stun. Leaves them no real time to react to any animation, as roar is channeling in a fraction of a second after they first see movement. Since I have spear now equipped, I will then cancel cast Demon GS (hopefully will be what I get tomorrow from pages of fate) for the 50% chance of auto-crit. Cancel cast will be swapping to axes, and I either stop and time it to hit DB for stun lock, or add in demon Tiger Maw depending how well the earlier part went.

Off of that I will either cancel aftercast the first skill used and have 7.5 secs of stun from demon DB. Here I will need to actually have demon GS to time the buff to see if I should do another demon GS cancel cast before or after HF. With Cloud Eruption could even do HF followed up by actual demon GS for debuff and damage added on, before swapping over to claws to finish them off.

So if you really want to go high skill end game killing, you can see how BM in just a small snapshot has a whole lot of skill and knowledge needed to pull off some ridiculous combos that leave Gardener BMs deserving of the disrespect being tossed about on them; even if there aren't many disrespecting them, yet.

For an idea though, on mobs under HF and GS effect, with demon DBB buff on me, I was dealing X5 damage with crits. Which is a damn sight better than even demon sparks damage buff, it just requires high end -int gear in order to raise attacks up to a similar level in order to have the same APS. On heavy targets, the fire damage buff will have even more effect, and a high end poison pot could also be used to stack the elemental damage against the player. Another good aspect of it, is by auto-attacking with claws you will be gaining 25 chi per second, and a good 3 or 4 secs at least before they drop out of normal stun lock and your damage chain winds down. From there you can really take it in any direction you want, and if no actual GS was used only 330 chi was used total, leaving you free to keep going thanks to attack chi gain.

EDIT:

Main points:

Aftercast cancel is done with 2 skills on same weapon back to back, counting attack button as a skill if needed.

Cancel cast is done with a skill that buffs you, and you are able to weapon swap before channel time is done. Also this needs to be done before the channel bar even shows up, so you're doing it off an invisible timer basically.

One thing that can also help is if you're standing still and not attacking, you can do a cancel cast by hitting both hotkeys at the same time, which makes your DBB roar GS combo that much easier because roar automatically stops your character.

Granrey - Sanctuary wrote: »

One of the things that I've been interested in doing is combining fissure and DBB, since fissure reduce enemies fire resistance and DBB adds fire damage on your attacks. but never tried to invest on DBB without knowing if it would work.

My question is, based on this glitch what would be the best way to do it (adding HF too)?

Regarding the glitch when you cancell cast the first skill, do you lose the two sparks on the first skill?

Personally never tried this with Fissure but I don't think there is no need for that.

Beside in pk when u r using fist, using Fissure would take too long to do next combo and by the time ranged class would jsut flied away

well the best way to do this glitch is following combo, I use this all the time (not in pwi...)

and works great..

for BM, heavy veno, and Barb

Roar - Cyclone - DDB - Wait 0.5sec - drake - HF - attk wif fist

for Squishy class like archer, cleric and mage

Roar - Cyclone - hit with first for 2sec - drake - HF - attk wif fist

I don't see much point in using DDB agsint squishies since they r gna die anyway...

well sometimes Mage hav uber high p-def and quite hard to kill, in that case i use DDB + Glacier spike, if the crit buff works really great.

another way is using cyclone + glacier spike, it kills enemy real quick, sometimes even BMs

u could use alternative combo against barb cuz of their high p-def + hp in tiger form.

well personally since barb is also ranged class

i hit them wif fist until just b4 their charm tick and follow the combo,

or doing HF b4 drake works fine too (hits more while stun wears off)

and remember if u have demon HF its 9 sec.

hope this helps =P

I've been practicing the skill over the weekend the way recomended here and yes it works great (pve wise, I have not tried in PVP).

So far, I've been able two use HF,DBB(glitched) and then MS plus cyclone heel.

I got to admit, I did not expect to learn more BM tricks at 90+ lol.

thanks for sharing guys.

WTF, why am I finding out about this just now? O.o BM forum you have failed me QQ. Thank god for something useful on here out of all the BS of "Hey, how's my build with warsoul fists?" or same old weapons arguments.

I noticed there's no cooldown if you cancel, wonder if this works on Sin skills...

Edit: Damn, doesn't work on Sin skills.

Telarith - Sanctuary wrote: »

Because there isn't much use for cancel casting until demonized GS mostly. While DBB can be used, it really isn't that needed except against HA targets. And the area glitching will be most needed is on high healthed, difficult to kill targets. Which is why the combo I made earlier would come into effect: you simply can't kill them 1 on 1 any other way.

Every other instance you're not really going to be using it. You'll be comboing off of another player's debuffs in group based, stunning to save team/lock others down, or other assists for other players. But that just has too many different ways it will go, that listing each one is not possible. Similarly getting the jump on someone won't need it either, should be normal killing for the most part.

I think michael believed we go through that combo every time, from a post he made in general, but that is just extreme end showing what can be done. If someone can't figure out how to break it down and take pieces they need for specific class type targeting, then they can't make use of any advice either way.

GS is the main one to practice, and is definitely the hardest. That is quick aside from weapon swap, but using a non-weapon specific skill with aftercast cancel negates the downside from using it. RotP is obviously a good choice to go with, as it starts your stun chain. And swapping weapon on 1st skill takes away the disadvantage of weapon swapping as well. DBB has limited need, though it is fun to mess with, and good for if you're looking to take on a CS barb for gigglies.

Glitching cyclone has limited uses as well, due to wasted time. It must be followed by a second skill, or you end up losing over-all damage mostly from the slower attack speed of 2nd weapon before you can switch back. It's why I've always liked wind shield over it instead.

So in the end, going all out is only needed against CS barbs, otherwise takes pieces out of posted one from earlier. Or just get demon GS, and abuse that one; it's the one with the greatest effect for us anyways.

heel glitch and DBB are rather nice for mid game tanking since swaping to a single blade to cancle with only -.1 costs you almost no DPS for a semi permanent -.05

and DBB is nice to drop right before 2 spark since you can actualyl use the spark as an aftercast cancle or in a spark DBB cyclone HF combo as a DD

not really needed pre 99 but the above tricks and others are (redundancey here i come) great till you actualyl get stacked - int of -.2 or more

cyclone heel level 10 gives me infinite -int and permanent DG when out of CD.

Every 30 secs i pop DG + cyclone heel, and people ask me how the heck i can DG that much.

If anything can be said shadowless kick is nice for the cancel.

Try this combo DBB(cancel by switching to axes) -> HF -> (switch to fists ) cyclone heel

Parties will LOVE YOU!

also when you stack a little more -int ( around 90 ) you can do this and alternate a DBB -> Demon spark -> cyclone heel before your CD of HF is over to put out a massive DPS out on single targets as well as group amping with HF.

Granrey - Sanctuary wrote: »

I usually thank god for things more important than playing a fantasy game but I would thank you if you share some of your 3 year knowledge that you have not seen here.b:thanks

You sure don't know what a saying is . I'm not even religious... I'd tell you what I learned or you can learn it yourself. I choose option two. Have fun.


As for canceling cyclone heel I'm not sure wtf you people are doing but I can cast the skill and be attacking with fist within 0.5 seconds of clicking the skill. Meh.