Unicorn or Thundercrack?

Katozuma - Raging Tide
Katozuma - Raging Tide Posts: 61 Arc User
edited April 2010 in Archer
Lately I seen a lot archers using Unicorn and was wondering is it better than the Thundercrack, the one I see less often.
Post edited by Katozuma - Raging Tide on

Comments

  • Admante - Dreamweaver
    Admante - Dreamweaver Posts: 323 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Wind and Clouds is more win than either.
  • KageYingZi - Heavens Tear
    KageYingZi - Heavens Tear Posts: 823 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Wind and the clouds>Thundercrack>Unicorn.
    In fact unicorn with +3 cannot compare to wind and the clouds +3.The dmg range is similar with the adds but since Wind has a faster atk,it oudmgs the Unicorn
  • Haxxz - Harshlands
    Haxxz - Harshlands Posts: 45 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Admante - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Wind and Clouds is more win than either.

    This.

    I think the main reason is because of costs. Thundercrack is expensive to make and buy, Unicorn isn't so bad as it doesn't really require anything hard to get in terms of TT mats and can be bought cheaply from other players, Wind and Clouds is by far the cheapest (I myself have acquired a couple Wind and Cloud molds for under 20k from the AH) since the mold itself is generally really common.

    All of them around similar damage, guess it depends what you want.
  • Neodaystar - Sanctuary
    Neodaystar - Sanctuary Posts: 1,020 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Wind and clouds is the fastest easily obtainable range weapon there is - being a sling and having -0.1 attack interval. For early 70s, with this sling you can usually kill a mob before it can cast an attack on you as it dies. W&C does have a higher dps, very good for grinding/bosses, very highly recommended as it is affordable. However, if you do plan on doing alot of gamma, I recommend the cross bow as a 2nd weapon (barrage attack rate is not affected by attack intervals and the cross bow offers higher spike damage). If you would prefer a bow for some reason, there are ☆☆☆Crescent Moon Bow that will be a better option than Unicorn since it can also have better weapon bonuses and effects.


    ☆Thudercrack +5 - (TT90 Build / Blood Moon Build)
    Physical Atk.: 4225-7768 / 4205-7731
    Critical Hit: 25% / 25%
    Attack rate: 0.62 /sec / 0.67
    Avg DPS: 3717.83 / 3998.56

    ☆Unicorn +5 - (TT90 Build / Blood Moon Build)
    Physical Atk.: 4685-6747 / 4662-6715
    Critical Hit: 25% / 25%
    Attack rate: 0.67 /sec / 0.71
    Avg DPS: 3829.72 / 4038.835
    Extra: Nimble Proc

    ☆Wind and the Clouds +5 - (TT90 Build / Blood Moon Build)
    Physical Atk.: 4604-6364 / 4583-6334
    Critical Hit: 25% / 25%
    Attack rate: 0.77 /sec / 0.83
    Avg DPS: 4222.68 / 4530.555
  • XylolyX - Heavens Tear
    XylolyX - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,097 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    The only reason I made and used the Unicorn was to decompose it a few levels later.

    I still have my wind and clouds (and 33K of ammo!) and still use it in instances. I like the faster attack speed and I think overall dps is slightly higher than even my CH:Soulsmasher.
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  • Neodaystar - Sanctuary
    Neodaystar - Sanctuary Posts: 1,020 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    CH:S does have a higher dps than wind and clouds, but not by a lot. Considering the proc effects of CH:S, it should be better than W&C and have the potential to have even more dps.
    The reason you might feel that way is because the sling have a higher attack speed, and sometimes getting that one attack in to kill a mob before it attacks you can make a big difference.

    ☆Crimson Horn: Soulsmasher +5 - (TT90 Build / Blood Moon Build)
    Physical Atk.: 4797-7813 / 4774-7775
    Critical Hit: 25% / 25%
    Attack rate: 0.69 /sec / 0.74
    Avg DPS: 4350.45 / 4643.13
    Extra: Gloom Proc
  • Elenacostel - Heavens Tear
    Elenacostel - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,822 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Neodaystar - Sanctuary wrote: »
    If you would prefer a bow for some reason, there are ☆☆☆Crescent Moon Bow that will be a better option than Unicorn since it can also have better weapon bonuses and effects.

    For the most part, Sir Neodaystar's post was correct. This statement, however, is sort of wrong. It is actually very hard to find a ☆☆☆Crescent Moon Bow that can match Unicorn.

    One time, I found a ☆☆☆Crescent Moon Bow with -Interval, +Dex, and +Physical Attack. I bought it as an impulse buy, and when I tried it out on pwcalc, it actually dealt *slightly* more DPS than Unicorn, even considering the -Interval.

    In order to find a ☆☆☆Crescent Moon Bow better than Unicorn, you actually need some really, really good bonuses on it. That's also ignoring the fact that Unicorn refines higher.

    Standalone, the Unicorn is actually a nice bow. It only has a poor reputation because it is compared to Wind and the Clouds, which just happens to be awesome for DPS, and Thundercrack has a higher DPH. Furthermore, Thundercrack is needed for decomposition if you plan on obtaining Blinding Radiance.

    So the practical answer to your question is that you can use any of the three weapons, though each has advantages depending on the reason:

    Wind and the Cloud: Fastest Ranged Weapon. Highest DPS. Good for grinding and bosses. Cheap.
    Thundercrack: Highest DPH. Good for Barrage. Decomposes for Blinding Radiance Path. Not a slingshot.
    Unicorn: Good balance of DPS and DPH. Cheap. Not a slingshot.

    Unicorn also decomposes for Crimson Horn: Soulsmasher, but I recommend you do not get that weapon, as Vast Land is superior in many ways.
  • Neodaystar - Sanctuary
    Neodaystar - Sanctuary Posts: 1,020 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Elenacostel - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    For the most part, Sir Neodaystar's post was correct. This statement, however, is sort of wrong. It is actually very hard to find a ☆☆☆Crescent Moon Bow that can match Unicorn.

    One time, I found a ☆☆☆Crescent Moon Bow with -Interval, +Dex, and +Physical Attack. I bought it as an impulse buy, and when I tried it out on pwcalc, it actually dealt *slightly* more DPS than Unicorn, even considering the -Interval.

    In order to find a ☆☆☆Crescent Moon Bow better than Unicorn, you actually need some really, really good bonuses on it. That's also ignoring the fact that Unicorn refines higher.

    Wow! Finding one with -0.1 interval is perhaps the best find you can get on that CMB. Both bow are actually grade 9, so they will refine for the same amount. Comparing the attack values of both bows (along with Uni's +72 bonus), Uni is 116 higher in min attack value, and Uni has 152 higher in max attack value. I had kept an eye in the AH often a while back for 3star weaps to decompose when mirages were being sold for around 18k (a few months ago). You can easily find extra bonuses on the ☆☆☆CMB (2-3 add ons) with Physical Attack +46~72, Maximum Physical Attack +78~123, +Dex 6~9, or even +1~3 crits. A combination of those 2 addons can place CMB on level or even be better than Unicorn in dps without really a need for the -0.1 interval bonus. The chance of finding a good one might depend on servers too. Because of fcc, I've seen more bms and sins using mid-level bows such as these two. Everytime I had check the AH for CMB, I usually did find one to my liking and wished that I had it inplace of the Uni back then. They are about the same price too.

    Click on the links to PWI database for more info on other addons for the CMB if anyone is is interested.

    Unicorn
    Grade 9
    Attack Speed 0.67
    Physical attack 580-1076
    Physical Attack +72
    Accuracy +178 (****)
    Nimble: Has a chance to increase accuracy (****)

    ☆☆☆Crescent Moon Bow
    Grade 9
    Attack Speed 0.67
    Physical attack 536-996
  • Elenacostel - Heavens Tear
    Elenacostel - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,822 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    I think this is the bow I found:

    ☆☆☆Crescent Moon Bow - http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=1478189c1d893535
    Physical Atk.: 4414-6337
    Critical Hit: 25%
    Attack rate: 0.77 /sec
    Avg DPH: 5375.5
    Avg DPS: 4139.135

    ☆Unicorn +5 - http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=74a24c2146aab2f6
    Physical Atk.: 4662-6715
    Critical Hit: 25%
    Attack rate: 0.71 /sec
    Avg DPH: 5688.500
    Avg DPS: 4038.835

    As you can see, the difference isn't that much better. You need some really impressive stats on CMB to match Unicorn. Considering how cheap Unicorn is, you may as well go with that.
  • Rawrgh - Raging Tide
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide Posts: 6,790 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Unicorn also decomposes for Crimson Horn: Soulsmasher, but I recommend you do not get that weapon, as Vast Land is superior in many ways.

    Superior in many ways, including cost, which, from what I've seen, will put it out of the range of most 8x archers.
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  • Elenacostel - Heavens Tear
    Elenacostel - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,822 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Superior in many ways, including cost, which, from what I've seen, will put it out of the range of most 8x archers.

    Are you saying Vast Land is too expensive? I think that may be a server thing, since Raging Tide is new (I am assuming you are speaking with regards to that server). In that case, I shall trust your judgment with regards to that.
  • Lyzzern - Lost City
    Lyzzern - Lost City Posts: 193 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    "The Penetrator"... "Unicorn"... "ThunderCRACK"... Lol I think Archers are very perv b:shocked
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  • Olba - Sanctuary
    Olba - Sanctuary Posts: 1,776 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Lyzzern - Lost City wrote: »
    "The Penetrator"... "Unicorn"... "ThunderCRACK"... Lol I think Archers are very perv b:shocked

    If you read more into it, there's also Heaven Shatterer, Flowing Stardust, Underworld Breaker, Flashing Glory, Stellar Vibration and Punishing Thunder.
    If you disregard what I say because of who I am or because of the contents of what I said, you are a fool.

    Everyone wants to be different, but when you're different you wish you were normal.
  • truekossy
    truekossy Posts: 7,021 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Lyzzern - Lost City wrote: »
    "The Penetrator"... "Unicorn"... "ThunderCRACK"... Lol I think Archers are very perv b:shocked

    Considering the origin of stormrage eagleon.... actually, considering the fact that Quilue is an archer, that kinda goes without saying.
  • WaffleChan - Sanctuary
    WaffleChan - Sanctuary Posts: 2,897 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    id use wind and the clowns, but keep thundercrack for a soul edge. it eventually becomes blinding radiance, and i love mine >_>;.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    advice to fledgling archers:
    Going sage is like drunken sex, at first she may look good, but when you wake up the next morning; you'll look at her and go WHAT HAVE I DONE.
  • Olba - Sanctuary
    Olba - Sanctuary Posts: 1,776 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    WaffleChan - Sanctuary wrote: »
    id use wind and the clowns, but keep thundercrack for a soul edge. it eventually becomes blinding radiance, and i love mine >_>;.

    ... I skipped one of them loops and bought me a Flash Fire. And my damn BR turned 1 socket b:cry
    If you disregard what I say because of who I am or because of the contents of what I said, you are a fool.

    Everyone wants to be different, but when you're different you wish you were normal.
  • AinaMizuako - Sanctuary
    AinaMizuako - Sanctuary Posts: 1,041 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    truekossy wrote: »
    Considering the origin of stormrage eagleon.... actually, considering the fact that Quilue is an archer, that kinda goes without saying.

    Don't act innocent. I know you named some of those bows yourself. D:<
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    oh look, i'm inactive again.

    b> leviciti b:cry
  • truekossy
    truekossy Posts: 7,021 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Pffft. That was 99.99998% you and your active imagination. b:shocked

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