Magic Attack; What am I doing wrong?

DeathBanana - Heavens Tear · April 2010

The agreed Magic Attack formula is

[URL="http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=214921"]( 1 + ( MAG / 100 ) ) * ( LVL + EQP )
EQP = sum of all +matk in your gear (usually weapon + rings)[/URL]

So, I ran these numbers through

( 1 (given) + 356/100 (mag) ) * ( 82 (level) + 80 (ring A) + 51 (ring

+ 28 (ring B add) + 710 (lowest weapon attack) + 25 (flawless sapphire) + 63 (weapon add) = 4737.84

This is all fine and dandy, as my lowest base magic attack is 4738 unbuffed. However, once I buff myself:

70% (level 10 Spirit's Gift) of 1039 (my equipment bonuses) = 744.8
4738 (my lowest base magic attack unbuffed) + 745 = 5483

This is not all fine and dandy, as my lowest base magic attack is 5455 buffed. I tried putting some different numbers:

70% (level 10 Spirit's Gift) of 798 (all of my weapon bonuses) = 558.6
4738 (my lowest base magic attack unbuffed) + 559 = 5297

I did a few more trivial experiments until realizing that 5455-4738 = 717

Take a look at my equipment bonuses. Is there anything that, put together, can equal 717? Is the formula off slightly? Should I spend more time playing the game than working out formulas?

EDIT: Huzzah, I'm not crazy. Bought a G3 wand off of the blacksmith (QQ, 3k). Here's the formula for that.

( 1 (given) + 346/100 (mag) ) * ( 82 (level) + 80 (ring A) + 51 (ring

+ 28 (ring B add) + 77 (lowest weapon attack) ) = 1418.28

Perfect, my lowest base magic attack is 1418 unbuffed.
My lowest base magic attack is 1638. 1638 (lowest base magic attack buffed) - 1418 (lowest base magic attack unbuffed) = 220, a number impossible to make with my given equipment. Either I'm blind or something's wrong.

Paramedic - Dreamweaver · April 2010

this topic hurt my eyes b:faint

DeathBanana - Heavens Tear · April 2010

Test: To see if I can predict how much a Great Cyclone would hurt (a lot of) Kitties

The Great Cyclone Formula (level 10): 1.2 (metal mastery) * ( 1241 (base magic attack, weaponless) + 80 (ring A) + 51 (ring

+ 28 (ring B add) + 1372.6 (constant) ) = 3327.12

The Mob Defense Formula: 100 (given) * 15 (the kitty's metal defence) / ( 15 (the kitty's metal defence) + 40 (given) * 82 (my level) ) = 0.45523520485584218512898330804249% reduction

3372.12 (base damage for Great Cyclone) - 0.45523...% (percent damage reduction) = 3311.97377...

The Field Test: 3408 (as opposed to the estimated 3312)

The Final Result: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v443/Mmmarshmallow/Gaffs/normal_headdesk.jpg

Side note: No animals were harmed in the testing process. *cough*

Qlngfu - Archosaur · April 2010

take i to the archer forum, they are good with numbers b:nosebleed

_cupid_ - Harshlands · April 2010

0.o where did u even get the numbers from head hurts now.

Maragon - Dreamweaver · April 2010

for one thing 1039 * .7 =/= 744.8 but 727.3 so the formula is only 10 off from the actual instead of 28.

will edit if I come up with anything else.

EDIT1: does your weapon give you 10 mag points or is there a typo there. at the top you have 356 mag points and when u equip the npc one you have 346. no arguing just checking your work cuz I'd really like to have this formula figured out too.

EDIT2: when running damage tests you may want to do it without a weapon so that there is no variation in atk stat. just for the sake of being easy on the numbers

EDIT3: In staring at the page I think and looking at the descriptions I think the error is in the way that level is calculated into the formula (I dont think the level is added directly into the atk stat with weapons numbers and therefore would not be part of the buffed number. However it works as is in the unbuffed number and 0.7*82 taken off the buffed stat is too much. But I still think there error is in there)

EDIT4: Also I get 1641 as the theoretical buffed stat given those numbers

EDIT5: I noticed something interesting that should give us another number to work with. It would appear that with the G3 wand you are giving the stats based on the char sheet as opposed to calculations. As i said in my 4th edit the theoretical stat is 3 higher at 1641. Here's the number of interest. 1641 and 5465 are both .183% higher than 1638 and 5455 respectively. there is some minor fluctuation after the 4 decimal but that is within rounding error. So at this point (would be nice to have some more people post some number to test this) it would seem that using the formula we could just divide by 1.00183 untill we figure out where that deviation is.

__Goddess__ - Heavens Tear · April 2010

ummmm.... gets calculator and starts counting on her fingers.....

b:sad

LTraveller - Dreamweaver · April 2010

I tried to figure that out too, unsuccessfully. It seems that base matk formula is correct; what I couldn't figure out is exactly how does the game calculate "weapon damage". Seems that it's not a sum of all matk in weapon, rings and shards, but something more complex.
http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=661422

Delia - Harshlands · April 2010

Warning: I haven't read your posts as carefully as I'd like to because I have to leave in a minute.

The game (I've heard) includes level as a source of weapon magic attack, I believe, so weapon magic attack = (your level + ring1 m.attack + ring2 m.attack + weapon m.attack (including refinement) + shards m.attack + any other (one necklace and belt give some)

Hope that maybe that helps.

Nieka - Harshlands · April 2010

soooo many numbers just be like me and accept what you have and move on

my mag attack buffed is 8500-10700 by the way b:victory

LTraveller - Dreamweaver · April 2010

Delia - Harshlands wrote: »

Warning: I haven't read your posts as carefully as I'd like to because I have to leave in a minute.

The game (I've heard) includes level as a source of weapon magic attack, I believe, so weapon magic attack = (your level + ring1 m.attack + ring2 m.attack + weapon m.attack (including refinement) + shards m.attack + any other (one necklace and belt give some)

Hope that maybe that helps.

Yes, I heard that too, but... see post #9 in the thread I linked to. Maybe it's level multiplied by certain coeff, idk.

Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 · April 2010

DeathBanana - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Test: To see if I can predict how much a Great Cyclone would hurt (a lot of) Kitties

The Great Cyclone Formula (level 10): 1.2 (metal mastery) * ( 1241 (base magic attack, weaponless) + 80 (ring A) + 51 (ring + 28 (ring B add) + 1372.6 (constant) ) = 3327.12

The Mob Defense Formula: 100 (given) * 15 (the kitty's metal defence) / ( 15 (the kitty's metal defence) + 40 (given) * 82 (my level) ) = 0.45523520485584218512898330804249% reduction

3372.12 (base damage for Great Cyclone) - 0.45523...% (percent damage reduction) = 3311.97377...

The Field Test: 3408 (as opposed to the estimated 3312)

The Final Result: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v443/Mmmarshmallow/Gaffs/normal_headdesk.jpg

Side note: No animals were harmed in the testing process. *cough*

You should include your level as part of the weapon attack bonus for cyclone

1.2 * (1241 + 100%*(82 + 80 + 51 + 28) + 1372.6) * (1 - (15 / ((40 * 82) + 15))) = 3409.92583
This is close to your observed 3408 (99.94% accurate)

There is probably some subtle rounding somewhere. I'll take a look at your buffed values since I havent had much experience with magic buffs.

CASE 1:
(1 + (356 / 100)) * (82 + 80 + 51 + 28 + 710 + 25 + 63) = 4737.84 (Observed 4738)
(1 + (356 / 100) + .7) * (82 + 80 + 51 + 28 + 710 + 25 + 63) = 5465.14 (Observed 5455)

CASE 2:
(1 + 346/100) * (82 + 80 + 51 + 28 + 77) = 1418.28 (Observed 1418)
(1 + (346 / 100) + 0.7) * (82 + 80 + 51 + 28 + 77) = 1640.88 (Observed 1641)

It all looks exact except for a 0.2% error in case 1 buffed. All together the formulas appear at least 99.8% accurate.

EDIT: Ohh while you are at it can you repeat a great cyclone with extreme poison?
I've wondered how magic mastery combines with poison... is it (1+.2+.2) = 1.4 or (1.2)*(1.2) = 1.44

Maragon - Dreamweaver · April 2010

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

You should include your level as part of the weapon attack bonus for cyclone

1.2 * (1241 + 100%*(82 + 80 + 51 + 28) + 1372.6) * (1 - (15 / ((40 * 82) + 15))) = 3409.92583
This is close to your observed 3408 (99.94% accurate)

There is probably some subtle rounding somewhere. I'll take a look at your buffed values since I havent had much experience with magic buffs.

CASE 1:
(1 + (356 / 100)) * (82 + 80 + 51 + 28 + 710 + 25 + 63) = 4737.84 (Observed 4738)
(1 + (356 / 100) + .7) * (82 + 80 + 51 + 28 + 710 + 25 + 63) = 5465.14 (Observed 5455)

CASE 2:
(1 + 346/100) * (82 + 80 + 51 + 28 + 77) = 1418.28 (Observed 1418)
(1 + (346 / 100) + 0.7) * (82 + 80 + 51 + 28 + 77) = 1640.88 (Observed 1641)

It all looks exact except for a 0.2% error in case 1 buffed. All together the formulas appear at least 99.8% accurate.

EDIT: Ohh while you are at it can you repeat a great cyclone with extreme poison?
I've wondered how magic mastery combines with poison... is it (1+.2+.2) = 1.4 or (1.2)*(1.2) = 1.44

Check out his first post again. Case 2 he has a buffed atk in his character screen is 1638 the 1641 is the atk by the formula so that in both case 1 and case 2 the buffed mag atk is high by .183%. I find it interesting that they are both high by the same percent.

Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 · April 2010

Maragon - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Check out his first post again. Case 2 he has a buffed atk in his character screen is 1638 the 1641 is the atk by the formula so that in both case 1 and case 2 the buffed mag atk is high by .183%. I find it interesting that they are both high by the same percent.

Ohh yeah you're right.. still the formulas are 99.8% correct

That suggests that they are missing some small correction..

The .7 appears to be causing problems. I think the 70% bonus from spirit's gift is really giving only 69%, that makes the numbers work out exactly.

(1 + (356 / 100) + .69) * (82 + 80 + 51 + 28 + 710 + 25 + 63) = 5454.75 (Observed 5455)
(1 + (346 / 100) + .69) * (82 + 80 + 51 + 28 + 77) = 1637.7 (Observed 1638)

I hope you guys don't miss that missing 1% weapon attack.

Maragon - Dreamweaver · April 2010

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

Ohh yeah you're right.. still the formulas are 99.8% correct That suggests that they are missing some small correction..

The .7 appears to be causing problems. I think the 70% bonus from spirit's gift is really giving only 69%, that makes the numbers work out exactly.

(1 + (356 / 100) + .69) * (82 + 80 + 51 + 28 + 710 + 25 + 63) = 5454.75 (Observed 5455)
(1 + (346 / 100) + .69) * (82 + 80 + 51 + 28 + 77) = 1637.7 (Observed 1638)

I hope you guys don't miss that missing 1% weapon attack.

But what consequence does this have on lower levels of the buff? are all the levels going to be 1% off? Could we get some lower levels to post their total equipment attack, number of magic points, mag attack buff level and what level their toon is? b:thanks

Also Asterelle you would know better then I would, has this formula been proven for masteries in other classes and for barbs strength of the titans?.....I has lotsa altsb:surrender

Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 · April 2010

Maragon - Dreamweaver wrote: »

But what consequence does this have on lower levels of the buff? are all the levels going to be 1% off? Could we get some lower levels to post their total equipment attack, number of magic points, mag attack buff level and what level their toon is? b:thanks

Also Asterelle you would know better then I would, has this formula been proven for masteries in other classes and for barbs strength of the titans?.....I has lotsa altsb:surrender

It's always correct for unbuffed base, masteries, and sparks. Dont remember off the top of my head if barb buff is exact.

I wouldn't stress so much over 1% missing weapon attack.

Maragon - Dreamweaver · April 2010

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

It's always correct for unbuffed base, masteries, and sparks. Dont remember off the top of my head if barb buff is exact.

I wouldn't stress so much over 1% missing weapon attack.

lol no I was just curious. missing 10 atk outa 5k+ isnt a big deal I'm a math nerd ......shoulda been an archerb:chuckle

Deceptistar - Sanctuary · April 2010

my sig stands correct b:nosebleed

Suchiiru - Heavens Tear · April 2010

Maragon - Dreamweaver wrote: »

But what consequence does this have on lower levels of the buff? are all the levels going to be 1% off? Could we get some lower levels to post their total equipment attack, number of magic points, mag attack buff level and what level their toon is? b:thanks

Level 29 Cleric, just got level one of Spirit's Gift. (and in no means in anything close to good gear. lol)

( 1 + ( 135 (magic) / 100 )) * ( 29 + 17 (ring A) + 11 (ring A add) + 19 (ring b) + 173 (lowest weapon atk) + 18 (two +9 atk sapphires)) = 627, correct to lowest magattk on character sheet

Spirit's Gift (Level 1) buffs 25%

25% of 267 (my +magatk on gear) = 66.75

66.75 + 627 = 693.75, round up to the 694 that's on the character sheet when buffed.

Looks like at least level one is accurate.b:victory

Angel_Wolf - Lost City · April 2010

oh gosh, math follows me everywhere now, doesn't it?

<

is an engineering student......

Myerling - Sanctuary · April 2010

Maragon - Dreamweaver wrote: »

But what consequence does this have on lower levels of the buff? are all the levels going to be 1% off? Could we get some lower levels to post their total equipment attack, number of magic points, mag attack buff level and what level their toon is? b:thanks

Also Asterelle you would know better then I would, has this formula been proven for masteries in other classes and for barbs strength of the titans?.....I has lotsa altsb:surrender

i think for physical classes it is primary stat/ 150, but masteries and buffs are added the same way

Magic Attack; What am I doing wrong?

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