I have a feeling Armageddon is a skill to avoid

Yulk - Heavens Tear · April 2010

I learned Emberstorm on my wiz, went to test it out. with a random barb and a cleric. The barb did not hold arggo well because he was in human form, I used it, and I killed myself lol. It does the most damage out of all my wizard's skill so far, but the cost of it was terrible and I am pretty sure I'll steal arggo and just die, I don't think Armageddon is a good skill after all. I think I'd rather use stomp of the beast king than that, I'd rather not gamble my HP for high damage even if it didn't cost spark or chi.

Baalbak - Dreamweaver · April 2010

well.. as with all skills (generally speaking) there is a right time and a wrong time to use Armageddon. Take slam for instance... good for aoe grinding on physical mobs: I like to sunder -> surf impact -> swell -> slam -> bestial onslaught -> mighty swing | repeat from swell . Or it can be good for squad support in FC/RB/Zhen etc. BUT... why would I go and slam around on cater mobs? I'd be pushing them into their cast only range, doing more harm to myself than them.

With higher levels (both of the skill and the barb) Armageddons damage grows larger, and can be extremely potent in certain scenarios... One hit a mage, cleric, etc... BUT.. try to use it while tanking and you certainly are cutting your chances of survival.

personally I'm gonna max sunder before leveling Armageddon past 1.

Yulk - Heavens Tear · April 2010

Baalbak - Dreamweaver wrote: »

well.. as with all skills (generally speaking) there is a right time and a wrong time to use Armageddon. Take slam for instance... good for aoe grinding on physical mobs: I like to sunder -> surf impact -> swell -> slam -> bestial onslaught -> mighty swing | repeat from swell . Or it can be good for squad support in FC/RB/Zhen etc. BUT... why would I go and slam around on cater mobs? I'd be pushing them into their cast only range, doing more harm to myself than them.

With higher levels (both of the skill and the barb) Armageddons damage grows larger, and can be extremely potent in certain scenarios... One hit a mage, cleric, etc... BUT.. try to use it while tanking and you certainly are cutting your chances of survival.

personally I'm gonna max sunder before leveling Armageddon past 1.

Yeah, about slam is definitely true, I would only risk myself using slam on casters. I am also planning on leveling sunder before Armageddon too

Rawrgh - Raging Tide · April 2010

At level 1 it's gonna suck.

It's not really meant for PvE. The only time I use it in PvE is sometimes in frost, when I invoke, roar, armageddon. With invoke up I'm not losing hp so by the time invoke wears off I'm back up to full HP as long as the cleric is doing his/her job.

Fuzzy_Wuzzy - Raging Tide · April 2010

Arma goes boom and has big fire show and looks epic.... b:dirty

need there be a better reason to get it? b:chuckle

Lycanthar - Sanctuary · April 2010

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I learned Emberstorm on my wiz, went to test it out. with a random barb and a cleric. The barb did not hold arggo well because he was in human form, I used it, and I killed myself lol. It does the most damage out of all my wizard's skill so far, but the cost of it was terrible and I am pretty sure I'll steal arggo and just die, I don't think Armageddon is a good skill after all. I think I'd rather use stomp of the beast king than that, I'd rather not gamble my HP for high damage even if it didn't cost spark or chi.

Is this post for real?

He claims the worst wiz skill is the best and the best barb skill is the worst?

Yulk, GTFO YOU FORUM FAILURE.b:angry

This guy is literally c0ckslapping the barbarian genepool everytime he posts something.

Maragon - Dreamweaver · April 2010

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I learned Emberstorm on my wiz, went to test it out. with a random barb and a cleric. The barb did not hold arggo well because he was in human form, I used it, and I killed myself lol. It does the most damage out of all my wizard's skill so far, but the cost of it was terrible and I am pretty sure I'll steal arggo and just die, I don't think Armageddon is a good skill after all. I think I'd rather use stomp of the beast king than that, I'd rather not gamble my HP for high damage even if it didn't cost spark or chi.

wait wait are you actually leveling a character again?

Astoru - Heavens Tear · April 2010

Don't compare Arma to Emberstorm. Armageddon has tons more HP to work with because it is a barbs skill, and barbs can also use Sacrificial proc weapons.

Arma + Crit + Zerk proc = Everyone within range is DEAD

Theavenger - Sanctuary · April 2010

You have a feeling arma is a skill to avoid?
Well guess what...
"I gotta feeling....that tonight's gonna be a good night"

but in all seriousness, it IS a skill to avoid if you don't know when, how, or where to use it.

Other than that it is a killer skill that i will lvl to 10 on my barb.

VerenKaunis - Dreamweaver · April 2010

Isn't OP the person who thinks LA is better than HA on a BM? Taking that into account, why am I still surprised at this thread?

Qingzi - Harshlands · April 2010

Fuzzy_Wuzzy - Raging Tide wrote: »

Arma goes boom and has big fire show and looks epic.... b:dirty

need there be a better reason to get it? b:chuckle

Couldn't agree more. b:laugh

I test the clerics (sorry clerics) by using Arma every now and then, BH59, for instance.
Some clerics handle a sudden drop since they see Arma going off. But some stop healing and run away when they think I'm gonna die, then I get wiz healed b:shocked.
Besides, what does Arma being a bad skill (NOT!!!) having to do with Emberstorm, I know their effects are about the same, but Arma is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay better.
Stop aggroing on barbs and lvl one of your own

Yulk - Heavens Tear · April 2010

VerenKaunis - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Isn't OP the person who thinks LA is better than HA on a BM? Taking that into account, why am I still surprised at this thread?

oh, since when I said LA on a BM is better than HA on a BM? I like HA better than LA, learn to read b:shutup

I think outside the box, not inside. Besides, this is off topic no?

Anyways, I am pretty sure you crazy power hungry barbs killing yourselves with it, I prefer to use arma at the right timing. And Qingzi, I do have a barb xD. I rather spam invoke than Armageddon tyvm. I rather wear out my opponents than be DD, I got this char for melee DD :P so yeah, the second poster is right. I'd rather use it wisely than to act like a suicide bomber

Invoke > Arma in PVP and PVE GG

VerenKaunis - Dreamweaver · April 2010

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

oh, since when I said LA on a BM is better than HA on a BM? I like HA better than LA, learn to read b:shutup

Sorry, I seem to have gotten your 2 LA threads mixed up.

http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=623061
http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=681812

My point still stands.

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Besides, this is off topic no?

Not completely off-topic.

LA on a BM = fail
Saying armageddon is useless = fail

Other than that, yes, it's off-topic.

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Anyways, I am pretty sure you crazy power hungry barbs killing yourselves with it, I prefer to use arma at the right timing. And Qingzi, I do have a barb xD. I rather spam invoke than Armageddon tyvm. I rather wear out my opponents than be DD, I got this char for melee DD :P so yeah, the second poster is right. I'd rather use it wisely than to act like a suicide bomber

Anyone who doesn't fail at playing a barb would know when and when not to use arma. No **** you need the 'right timing' to use a skill that takes up half of your HP and MP as well as 2 sparks. It's not something a person just tosses around for ****s and giggles.

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Invoke > Arma in PVP and PVE GG

Arma has limited uses in PvE. I'll admit that and I'm sure that others will agree. Invoke on the other hand is a godsend when it comes to tanking a boss or when the cleric has his thumb up his **** while you've got 20 mobs trying to rip you to furry little pieces.

In PvP it changes; invoke delays problems, arma removes them. Arma is one of the hardest hitting skills in the game (the hardest hitting skill if the barb has lots of HP or it zerk+crits) and anyone who claims that a skill that reduces damage (no matter how nice that 90% is) is better for PvP should delete their barb.

Yulk - Heavens Tear · April 2010

VerenKaunis - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Anyone who doesn't fail at playing a barb would know when and when not to use arma. No **** you need the 'right timing' to use a skill that takes up half of your HP and MP as well as 2 sparks. It's not something a person just tosses around for ****s and giggles.

Arma has limited uses in PvE. I'll admit that and I'm sure that others will agree. Invoke on the other hand is a godsend when it comes to tanking a boss or when the cleric has his thumb up his **** while you've got 20 mobs trying to rip you to furry little pieces.

In PvP it changes; invoke delays problems, arma removes them. Arma is one of the hardest hitting skills in the game (the hardest hitting skill if the barb has lots of HP or it zerk+crits) and anyone who claims that a skill that reduces damage (no matter how nice that 90% is) is better for PvP should delete their barb.

A barb using arma on another barb is suicidal and your going to lose more HP, on a veno, you might one shot yourself. MISSING arma which is most likely going to happen in PVP for barbs no? They need a great boost of accuracy. Especially against archers and sins. In PVP, is no different, I seen a barb done well against a BM with demon spark and fists USING invoke and he endured it well by absorbing the fast attack speed from that BM. Apparently you should tell him to delete his barb too? b:laugh And YES, this is today, and oh yeah, I got a friend that ALWAYS use invoke in PVP and he owns you tuna fesh nicely

DaCage - Sanctuary · April 2010

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

A barb using arma on another barb is suicidal and your going to lose more HP, on a veno, you might one shot yourself. MISSING arma which is most likely going to happen in PVP for barbs no? They need a great boost of accuracy. Especially against archers and sins. In PVP, is no different, I seen a barb done well against a BM with demon spark and fists USING invoke and he endured it well by absorbing the fast attack speed from that BM. Apparently you should tell him to delete his barb too? b:laugh And YES, this is today, and oh yeah, I got a friend that ALWAYS use invoke in PVP and he owns you tuna fesh nicely

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

oh, since when I said LA on a BM is better than HA on a BM? I like HA better than LA, learn to read b:shutup

I think outside the box, not inside. Besides, this is off topic no?

Anyways, I am pretty sure you crazy power hungry barbs killing yourselves with it, I prefer to use arma at the right timing. And Qingzi, I do have a barb xD. I rather spam invoke than Armageddon tyvm. I rather wear out my opponents than be DD, I got this char for melee DD :P so yeah, the second poster is right. I'd rather use it wisely than to act like a suicide bomber

Invoke > Arma in PVP and PVE GG

Wait a minute. You're saying that you'd rather be hit for a long time and have a high repair and charm cost then too kill your opponmeant?

Do you realize what the meaning of PVP is? It's not just surviving it's also KILLING.

GTFO of forums pls

VerenKaunis - Dreamweaver · April 2010

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

A barb using arma on another barb is suicidal and your going to lose more HP, on a veno, you might one shot yourself.

1) Barbs shouldn't be fighting other barbs.

2) I've seen a barb one shot another barb with arma (along with everyone else who happened to be around him).

3) Bramble hood doesn't work in PvP.

I take it that you're idea of PvP is limited to duels? Yeah, duels are technically under the PvP label but charms don't work in duels. In world PvP you need spike damage (or insane DPS) to get past charms. Arma does very nice spike damage.

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

MISSING arma which is most likely going to happen in PVP for barbs no? They need a great boost of accuracy.

Misty forest rings. Bloodbath. Accuracy pots. Heard of them?

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

In PVP, is no different, I seen a barb done well against a BM with demon spark and fists USING invoke and he endured it well by absorbing the fast attack speed from that BM.

OK, so this barb you're talking about endured a single BM's DPS. I'll repeat myself; invoke delays problems, arma removes them. The point of PKing is to kill players.

It's nice and all if someone can stand around taking hits for 20 seconds but unless he can kill everyone that's attacking him in those 20 seconds then it's pointless.

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I got a friend that ALWAYS use invoke in PVP and he owns you tuna fesh nicely

Good for your friend. He plays a class made to tank physical damage and can beat a squishy melee class that does only physical damage.

Personally I'd run if a barb used invoke, then come back once it wears off to kill him. Unless he had chi pots or that nifty genie skill then he'll be out 2 sparks and my skills would either be finished or almost finished their cooldown.

WnbTank - Archosaur · April 2010

IJS, that ppl who don`t run from barb using invoke are either noobs or idiots as they dun recognice the skill or they dun care, which way it is, doesn`t really matter. Now when we can`t use invoke(well we can if we don`t think), we`re left with plan to kill other person and for that arma is neat. Haven`t really PvPd but I`d guess tick charm->Stun->Arma-> Thunder storm(Genie skill) should kill even most HAs pretty neatly, unless TS have been nerfed bad since I last played ~6months back, was kinda OP back then. But it`s safe to say, that invoke in PvP = fail barb as speed reduction = easy to kite--> 20s & you are, w/o sparks, just where you started. I can see invoke used if your ganked and need to escape, though speed reduction, again, pretty much ****s you unless you are close to safe zone if your not, arma again could be nice bet to kill some of em.

Ps. Thinking "outside the box" doesn`t equal plain stupidity

.

Nevaglar - Sanctuary · April 2010

VerenKaunis - Dreamweaver wrote: »

1) The point of PKing is to kill players

Some noob in my faction thinks PK stands for Player kindness...i'm starting to think it might be one of Yulk's altsb:thanks

Yulk - Heavens Tear · April 2010

VerenKaunis - Dreamweaver wrote: »

1) Barbs shouldn't be fighting other barbs.

More like using arma against other barbs

2) I've seen a barb one shot another barb with arma (along with everyone else who happened to be around him).

I seen on screenie from a certain barb from damage log, if a barb don't invoke against arma was either unlucky that he didn't have 2 sparks yet or just dumb not to do that

3) Bramble hood doesn't work in PvP.

I only seen 1 veno use bramble hood overall and that was in TT1-2

I take it that you're idea of PvP is limited to duels? Yeah, duels are technically under the PvP label but charms don't work in duels. In world PvP you need spike damage (or insane DPS) to get past charms. Arma does very nice spike damage.

Arma does nice spike damage, but the cost of it is far too much and gambling for HP is rather dumb. Once again, Arma is not hard to detect, it was kind of a slow cast.

Misty forest rings. Bloodbath. Accuracy pots. Heard of them?

You think I haven't heard of bloodbath? I have it at LVL6 on my barb. Misty forest rings are helpful too. Accuracy pots? Effectiveness powers < tranquilizing orb which makes armageddon even more risky. Using powders in PVP is a waste especially for barbs. You forgot to state beastial onslaught to decrease evasion. Oh yeah, and venoes got befudding mist too to decrease chances. Oh yeah, don't forget about sparking too

OK, so this barb you're talking about endured a single BM's DPS. I'll repeat myself; invoke delays problems, arma removes them. The point of PKing is to kill players.

Yeah, point of PKing, arma can kill, but if I was going to PK as this char at 59 and above, I'd use tranquilizing orb or spark as soon as the barb channels his arma. Beastial onslaught is a much more reliable DD skill than arma anyways, I'd save my chi and spark to deflect him, not stand there and get hit by it

It's nice and all if someone can stand around taking hits for 20 seconds but unless he can kill everyone that's attacking him in those 20 seconds then it's pointless.

Killing unsuspecting players is easy, its like a BM chain stunning people. Arma have nice spike damage, maybe the most. Once again, Immunity to ALL attacks and yes, even arma

Good for your friend. He plays a class made to tank physical damage and can beat a squishy melee class that does only physical damage.

He was fighting all, he knows how to PVP very well. I dueled him at same LVL with my own PVE barb and lost, because he used a skill to make me take more damage than him. HA < elemental attacks.

Personally I'd run if a barb used invoke, then come back once it wears off to kill him. Unless he had chi pots or that nifty genie skill then he'll be out 2 sparks and my skills would either be finished or almost finished their cooldown.

Lol running, now that is very cowardly b:laugh . Kiting, ok, but running? ROFL LOL. So you just stand there when a barb use arma but run when he use invoke? ROFL. This points that invoke is better than arma overall and its better to use sunder instead, besides, even demon sunder have 100% chance to crit for a few seconds which can kill squishes really easy w/o arma no?

Fuzzy_Wuzzy - Raging Tide · April 2010

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

This points that invoke is better than arma overall

b:shutup

To try and state conclusively that one skill is simply better than another is useless and you obviously need to spend more time working with your barb and trying to actually understand why and when each skill is required. They all work better than others in different circumstances.

.. the fact Yulk keeps replying shows he either a far more epic troll than Fuzzy realized or his head is thicker than a New York phone book...

either way, no point in replying further and trying to continue to beat a dead horse with a point the rest of us seem to agree on. b:bye

VerenKaunis - Dreamweaver · April 2010

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

More like using arma against other barbs
Barb VS Barb is like banging 2 rocks against each other. One of them will eventually crack but unless you hit them together really hard then it'll take a while.

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I seen on screenie from a certain barb from damage log, if a barb don't invoke against arma was either unlucky that he didn't have 2 sparks yet or just dumb not to do that
Because obviously you're an expert on PvP, right? **** happens in PK. People will blame their loss on not having sparks, not having a charm, missing an attack, lag, and whatever else they can think of. Fact is, they died. End of story.

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I only seen 1 veno use bramble hood overall and that was in TT1-2
And that refutes my claim that bramble doesn't reflect in world PvP...how?

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Arma does nice spike damage, but the cost of it is far too much and gambling for HP is rather dumb. Once again, Arma is not hard to detect, it was kind of a slow cast.
Barbs use arma, people die to arma. If it could be avoided consistently then no one would die to it and thus no one would use it. The cost is high but the payoff is, likewise, high.

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Killing unsuspecting players is easy, its like a BM chain stunning people. Arma have nice spike damage, maybe the most. Once again, Immunity to ALL attacks and yes, even arma
Yes, killing unsuspecting players is easy. And obviously the only times arma is used is when a red named barb sneaks up behind some player who can't see him coming.

/sarcasm

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

He was fighting all, he knows how to PVP very well. I dueled him at same LVL with my own PVE barb and lost, because he used a skill to make me take more damage than him. HA < elemental attacks.
Yeah, magic damage is HA's weakness. You're point?

My point was that sins don't have a single skill which does magic damage. Sins are melee. Sins use light armor. Sins are squishy.

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Lol running, now that is very cowardly b:laugh . Kiting, ok, but running? ROFL LOL. So you just stand there when a barb use arma but run when he use invoke? ROFL. This points that invoke is better than arma overall and its better to use sunder instead, besides, even demon sunder have 100% chance to crit for a few seconds which can kill squishes really easy w/o arma no?

Apparently you can't read. See the part where I said I'd come back after invoke wears off. If he had used arma then I would've been dead.

Yulk - Heavens Tear · April 2010

I can't read? b:bye I thought you say what was bolded

VerenKaunis - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Personally I'd run if a barb used invoke, then come back once it wears off to kill him. Unless he had chi pots or that nifty genie skill then he'll be out 2 sparks and my skills would either be finished or almost finished their cooldown.

Second, a lot of people dunno how to play their toons right, end of story. I have some faults too, but learn to be quick. If your quick in PVP, your definitely good. PKing doesn't require skill because it doesn't take skill to just jump someone that doesn't notice WTH he / she is aware of, that does not prove why armageddon is useful. It does have it's uses, even wizard's emberstorm. But in most circumstances, BOTH of them is useless.

Fuzzy_Wuzzy - Raging Tide · April 2010

VerenKaunis - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Personally I'd run if a barb used invoke, then come back once it wears off

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Lol running, now that is very cowardly b:laugh . Kiting, ok

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I can't read? b:bye I thought you say what was bolded

did you even read what you quoted.... or stop and realize what you yourself posted in reply?

Can you please define what kiting is if not running/leading the other around until spark wears off... or invoke... or any other skill and then moving in for the kill?
b:shutupb:bye

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Second, a lot of people dunno how to play their toons right, end of story.

Trying to argue that one of the most damaging skills the barb has is useless.... you are obviously a prime candidate to win a trophy as one of these people...

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

PKing doesn't require skill because it doesn't take skill to just jump someone that doesn't notice WTH he / she is aware of, that does not prove why armageddon is useful. It does have it's uses, even wizard's emberstorm. But in most circumstances, BOTH of them is useless.

...Not even sure why me quote the rest of that.... maybe because Fuzzy not sure if he should facepalm at it or fall of his chair laughing....

Rawrgh - Raging Tide · April 2010

Fought an archer yesterday for 5 minutes. He'd stun me, metal attacks, aim low, metal attacks. When freeze wore off I'd run up to him (soon I'll have anti-stun : ), just another 300k spirit) and then spam attacks. Since he had a charm I'd hit him, tick his charm, hit him maybe one or two more times, and then he would run off (had my TT genie equiped so I couldn't use holy path or occult ice) and we would repeat the process. Eventually I got close and used armageddon. The result? Easy one shot.

If you don't want to use armageddon then don't, no one is forcing you to. It seems to me that you're convinced it's useless and rather than make this thread to get advice from people who actually HAVE the skill, you're trying to convince us a skill that you DONT EVEN HAVE YET, is useless.

VerenKaunis - Dreamweaver · April 2010

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I can't read? b:bye I thought you say what was bolded

VerenKaunis - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Personally I'd run if a barb used invoke, then come back once it wears off to kill him. Unless he had chi pots or that nifty genie skill then he'll be out 2 sparks and my skills would either be finished or almost finished their cooldown.

VerenKaunis - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Apparently you can't read. See the part where I said I'd come back after invoke wears off. If he had used arma then I would've been dead.

You can't read. b:bye

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Second, a lot of people dunno how to play their toons right, end of story. I have some faults too, but learn to be quick. If your quick in PVP, your definitely good. PKing doesn't require skill because it doesn't take skill to just jump someone that doesn't notice WTH he / she is aware of, that does not prove why armageddon is useful. It does have it's uses, even wizard's emberstorm. But in most circumstances, BOTH of them is useless.

Because obviously the only time anyone ever PKs is when the other person doesn't know a PKer is coming, right?

/sarcasm

Fail moar. b:bye

Also, emberstorm is always useless. It's damage, like arma, is based on the amount of HP the caster has. Guess which class has the least HP and which class has the most.

Redmenace - Heavens Tear · April 2010

Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I learned Emberstorm on my wiz, went to test it out. with a random barb and a cleric. The barb did not hold arggo well because he was in human form, I used it, and I killed myself lol. It does the most damage out of all my wizard's skill so far, but the cost of it was terrible and I am pretty sure I'll steal arggo and just die, I don't think Armageddon is a good skill after all. I think I'd rather use stomp of the beast king than that, I'd rather not gamble my HP for high damage even if it didn't cost spark or chi.

Then Don't Use It.

Better yet, don't use it, and don't whine to us about it.

RedMenace

\None of us are telling you how to BM
\\so Stop telling us all how to Barb, ****
\\\Whatever you do, don't get Armageddon

Brigid - Harshlands · April 2010

If you read some Yulk's other threads, you'd realize just how fail he is and ignore him entirely. This is the guy that, among other things, advocates LA for Blademasters, and talks about endgame PvP from his vast experience playing a 5x character and a handful of 4x alts.

Devils_Heir - Heavens Tear · April 2010

my barb isnt all that high, but i understand from experience that halving your hp for a sht load of power is well worth it, when used right. I would much rather kill a bm or something in a couple of seconds with armageddon than sitting there for 5 minutes taking hits and just clicking their charm, and having a horribly nasty repair bill to deal with

I have a feeling Armageddon is a skill to avoid

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