Assassins broke TW?
ShadowX - Raging Tide
Posts: 32 Arc User
How do you reasonably stop an invisibile cata-pulling assassin when they're in the air somewhere?
-ground aoes don't reach
-towers have random targetting so crystal/building could be dead by then
-only dreamweaver port gives awareness pots (only 1 guild has access)
EDIT:
Please read more carefully before you post
(if you did, just scroll down and ignore the rest of the post).
1. You can fly in tw while pulling a catapult.
2. Its up to the member of the guild that dreamweaver port to decide whether to give out awareness pots.
Quick test with bm roar and wizzy zhen:
3. Aoe's do not reach more than 2 elevation up (somewhere closer to 1 elevation).
Ex: An aoe that is at 21 elevation will NOT hit you at 23 elevation.
Be specific about which aoe you are talking about when you say aoe the catapult.
If you know an aoe that reaches *up* far, test it out first.
-ground aoes don't reach
-towers have random targetting so crystal/building could be dead by then
-only dreamweaver port gives awareness pots (only 1 guild has access)
EDIT:
Please read more carefully before you post
(if you did, just scroll down and ignore the rest of the post).
1. You can fly in tw while pulling a catapult.
2. Its up to the member of the guild that dreamweaver port to decide whether to give out awareness pots.
Quick test with bm roar and wizzy zhen:
3. Aoe's do not reach more than 2 elevation up (somewhere closer to 1 elevation).
Ex: An aoe that is at 21 elevation will NOT hit you at 23 elevation.
Be specific about which aoe you are talking about when you say aoe the catapult.
If you know an aoe that reaches *up* far, test it out first.
Post edited by ShadowX - Raging Tide on
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Comments
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honestly... your first post and you make is a qq about sin post. either you ahve too much time on your hand or are just that dense.1. If I kill you; do something about it yourself, don't go complaining to my wife.
2. If you have less kill counts then me, don't expect me to take pk advice from you.
3. If you are hiding behind an alt, don't expect me to acknowledge your existence.
Tokichiro - Heavy Armor Fish / Kiyoshi - Dual Blade Elf0 -
ShadowX - Raging Tide wrote: »How do you reasonably stop an invisibile cata-pulling assassin when they're in the air somewhere?
-ground aoes don't reach AoE the Catapult.
-towers have random targetting so crystal/building could be dead by then You AoE the catapult and the Sin is pretty much dead without a cleric healing him\her.
-only dreamweaver port gives awareness pots (only 1 guild has access)If i remember correctly, City of Raging Tides gives Awareness Potions.
Assassins don't exactly break TW because its only invisibility that kills people. Normally, Assassins don't just jump in out the middle of nowhere try to kill people in big groups, they pick off the people not in groups like Clerics and such. They're not exactly easy to counter but think about it- would you rather face a BM or an Assassin the heat of battle?0 -
Lol wait wut? Cata pulling sins?
WTS barrage and db.
Thats if, by some weird twist of fate they make it to the crystal.b:dirty0 -
ShadowX - Raging Tide wrote: »How do you reasonably stop an invisibile cata-pulling assassin when they're in the air somewhere?
-ground aoes don't reach
-towers have random targetting so crystal/building could be dead by then
-only dreamweaver port gives awareness pots (only 1 guild has access)
Im gonna take a wild guess here lol
You have never been to a real TW.
You have never played a sin.
You cant pull cata flying, any aoe skill on the cata will knock the sin out of stealth >.<
In TW the tank pulling cata is normally chainstunned + aoed by like 10 ppl and can only move further ahead the last bit with 79 skills and anti stun pots + genies + spam heals + invoke etc which is why you need someone with at last 20k hp to make it inside base. A sin wouldn't even get past A/B/C5 before he died.0 -
Gasoline - Lost City wrote: »Im gonna take a wild guess here lol
You have never been to a real TW.
You have never played a sin.
You cant pull cata flying, any aoe skill on the cata will knock the sin out of stealth >.<
In TW the tank pulling cata is normally chainstunned + aoed by like 10 ppl and can only move further ahead the last bit with 79 skills and anti stun pots + genies + spam heals + invoke etc which is why you need someone with at last 20k hp to make it inside base. A sin wouldn't even get past A/B/C5 before he died.
Ouch. And you call yourself a level 100? I've pulled a catapult while invis while flying. The only hard part is to dodge all the aoes, you'll usually be knocked out of invis and nuked.. You could try surviving for a little with focused mind and deaden nerves but yeah.. not really going to helpYou can't see me b:avoid.0 -
Accel - Raging Tide wrote: »Ouch. And you call yourself a level 100? I've pulled a catapult while invis while flying. The only hard part is to dodge all the aoes, you'll usually be knocked out of invis and nuked.. You could try surviving for a little with focused mind and deaden nerves but yeah.. not really going to help
I never puller a cata being a veno but doing it flying and getting inside base seems impossible. Specially since you cant move very fast, cant rush in tiger and keeping in right range on ground while you're flying above w/o loosing it must be rather inconvenient b:shocked0 -
Gasoline - Lost City wrote: »I never puller a cata being a veno but doing it flying and getting inside base seems impossible. Specially since you cant move very fast, cant rush in tiger and keeping in right range on ground while you're flying above w/o loosing it must be rather inconvenient b:shocked
Yeah, losing the cat is definitely inconvenient but its still possible to pull wihle flying ;DYou can't see me b:avoid.0 -
The things i don't know are:
1. high up you can fly above a stationary catapult.
-However, there is a glitch where you can fly over the walls while pulling a catapult, and it'll follow through the wall, so you can fly fairly high and still have the catapult.
2. whether the catapult being attacked counts towards the sin being attacked.
3. whether barrage reaches up in the air.
-I know for sure wiz zhen and stun don't reach that far up since I've flown over them but haven't tried going through a barrage to know.
1. Aoes do not reach that far up, its more of a circle than a ball effect.
2. I'm assuming the assassin forces stealth/shadow escapes once the catapult is positioned, or just picks up the catapult after the barb dies.
3. I already mentioned awareness pots, only 1 guild has access to it unless the guild member sells them.
When you pull a catapult it goes from green to yellow to red, and the color change happens fairly slowly so its not that hard to know how far you can move before you need to stop.0 -
Ninnuam - Sanctuary wrote: »Lol wait wut? Cata pulling sins?
WTS barrage and db.
Thats if, by some weird twist of fate they make it to the crystal.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXHGLuj8tlQ0 -
Magical_Orgy - Lost City wrote: »
b:shocked
Have you tested out staying afloat above the catapult and away from towers? (or with ppl distracting towers).0 -
b:laugh omfg that is so freaking funny.
You can go up to the height of the second tree limbs before the cata decides to fall off contact. A cat will stay with you for about 35 meters which is pretty much the range of a sage archer or a pet.
Barrage has the listed amount of range but can reach to the max height from the bottom of the screen you see those arrows flying unless you are at the tippy top of them you are getting hit with them. And the Wizard zhens have a much further reach then their animation shows.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
That's only around us though.
Wizzy zhen has a big radius like a circle but doesn't reach very far up, same with bm roar.
I thought the archer barrage that reaches so high up was always just an animation and doesn't really go that far either. b:surrender0 -
No Zhens extend a outside of the obvious animation and yah most 3/4 of the time you see those arrows around you they are going to hit you or try to. I don't know how far up a wizard zhen goes I will have to test that because it has never become an issue. BM roar has a very limited range in both directions but it extends as far up as it does out trust me I have fought enough BMs to know that one.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0
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I've flown over bm stun clouds in that little passage at the base walls.
The stun/zhen can still reach if you're in jumping range but it's not anything like a ball.
I noticed that zhen's reach further out, but again, the aoe effect has acted more like a thick piece of pie than a ball in my experience.0 -
erm,........ a sin gets knokked out invis as soon as he gets damage OR a debuff,,,, >_> he cant pul a cata ,, u can just dol a tangling mire on the cata and poof their u see the sin ._____. and sins in TW are useless,,, they are more of an 1 v 1 class. in a good TW aoe is spread everywhere no way a sin can bypass thad all.0
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Actually i don't think sin will broke tw at all. b:laugh
But they needed if a faction in TW want to be safe from the attacking faction assassin.
http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=612482
Here a thread of me asking how sin survive in Tw. b:victory
For me sin needed in TW to see another sin coming. b:thanks
(because using special pots seem to be a bit pricey & you don't know when you going to die)[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Sorry i speak engrish b:chuckle
Nickname doesn't have anything to do with sailor but related to a folklore
Use search, it was your best friends to avoid many suffering in internet...0 -
Skippy - Dreamweaver wrote: »erm,........ a sin gets knokked out invis as soon as he gets damage OR a debuff,,,, >_> he cant pul a cata ,, u can just dol a tangling mire on the cata and poof their u see the sin ._____. and sins in TW are useless,,, they are more of an 1 v 1 class. in a good TW aoe is spread everywhere no way a sin can bypass thad all.
Read more carefully please:
1. If you look at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXHGLuj8tlQ
you can see you can run far enough from the catapult to avoid the aoe.
-this is different from your experience as a catapuller because most bms will go up to stun *you*, not a catapult that is at a decent distance from you.
2. If this works then there doesn't need to be a huge escort near the catapuller (hence no aoe target), just people off to the sides distract the towers.
3. Try testing your aoes in PK to see how far UP they reach.0 -
ShadowX - Raging Tide wrote: »Read more carefully please:
1. If you look at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXHGLuj8tlQ
you can see you can run far enough from the catapult to avoid the aoe.
-this is different from your experience as a catapuller because most bms will go up to stun *you*, not a catapult that is at a decent distance from you.
2. If this works then there doesn't need to be a huge escort near the catapuller (hence no aoe target), just people off to the sides distract the towers.
3. Try testing your aoes in PK to see how far UP they reach.
That video does not show how a real TW works, thats not a full TW 80/80 its just a bunch of clueless people running around hunting a sin lmao. She could not even get the cata to attack the crystal since that would have forced her to stay in one place and than they could have knocked her out of stealth. So really it wont win you any TWs. You actually need to attack the crystal for that. Normally, in a real TW she would have problems to get the cata inside base since the entrance would be stun locked by billions of BMs and the cata would have been spotted by scouts as soon as it left base b:surrender.
Alltho its a rather pro way of confusing the enemies. I can see many benefits of having a sin running around with a cata making the opposite faction hunting it like morons, will get some pressure of your own base when its being attacked.0 -
I guess all I am asking about is if there is an aoe that can reach an assassin up in the *air* above the catapult. b:surrender
I'm not saying the sin will be there on the ground like a normal barb puller does in TW.
She didn't position herself above the catapult in the vid either, something that's part of what I'm asking about.
(probably pointless anyways since she's the only target for the towers and one hit would get her killed by everyone chasing the catapult)
There are ways to do tw to avoid the other details.
Even in a full 80 v 80, the bms still need a target, so once the sin out of base only a higher lvl sin, awareness pot, or a tower would knock the sin out of stealth.
-It is possible to fly over the stun clouds, only barbs pullers don't do this because they are the target anyways.
-The assassin have an anti-stun skill they can use with a tranq orb or domain to pull through the stun clouds, then force back into stealth once they're through.
-Could always have a barb move with the assassin to make people think, for a while, that the barb is pulling while the assassin flies through.
What the assassin attacks doesn't effect the catapult, and the assassin doesn't have to attack the crystal to for the catapult to do it.
-Towers could be a problem but as long as there are people around to aggro the towers the sin won't get hit.
PS: I am a complete oracle noob because I am level 84.
I never played CB and spent the gold to buy mats and up my manufacturing skills up to lv2.
I never did lunar, delta, old frost.
I never got bored.
I never quit for months when anniv packs came out.
I never TW'd.
I have always posted on the pwi forums.
...I feel like I lost my virginity or something. b:sad0 -
Anyone can pull a cata against a **** guild (not just a sin)... the attackers (in the vid) didn't even build all the towers. I been carrying awareness pots before any sin even reach the level of stealth (aleast to me). And you don't think I'll use the pots now that sins can actaully be stealth... especially if i see a random cata running around.
- So what... you just fly over a stun cloud... and now your behind enemy lines. Unless your team mates can back you up... you might as well be useless.
- Anti-imbolization isn't anti damage. What do you think people will be doing when your use your all so powerful maze step. One BIDs is enough to end your cata pulling career.
- What do a barb next to a cata attract? AOEs. And guess what happens with aoes when a sin is standing next to the barb?
- Yes, the sin doesn't have to attack crystal for the cata to attack. But the sin have to STAY STILL. And guess what happens to the cata when the puller stay still... IT WALKS RIGHT UP TO YOU AND CUDDLES. I am sure you can guess what happens next.
Aleast try to get in a tw or two before posting stupid theories that would not work with the current game mechanics.1. If I kill you; do something about it yourself, don't go complaining to my wife.
2. If you have less kill counts then me, don't expect me to take pk advice from you.
3. If you are hiding behind an alt, don't expect me to acknowledge your existence.
Tokichiro - Heavy Armor Fish / Kiyoshi - Dual Blade Elf0 -
Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »Anyone can pull a cata against a **** guild (not just a sin)... the attackers (in the vid) didn't even build all the towers. I been carrying awareness pots before any sin even reach the level of stealth (aleast to me). And you don't think I'll use the pots now that sins can actaully be stealth... especially if i see a random cata running around.
- So what... you just fly over a stun cloud... and now your behind enemy lines. Unless your team mates can back you up... you might as well be useless.
- Anti-imbolization isn't anti damage. What do you think people will be doing when your use your all so powerful maze step. One BIDs is enough to end your cata pulling career.
- What do a barb next to a cata attract? AOEs. And guess what happens with aoes when a sin is standing next to the barb?
- Yes, the sin doesn't have to attack crystal for the cata to attack. But the sin have to STAY STILL. And guess what happens to the cata when the puller stay still... IT WALKS RIGHT UP TO YOU AND CUDDLES. I am sure you can guess what happens next.
Aleast try to get in a tw or two before posting stupid theories that would not work with the current game mechanics.
Only way to get awareness pots atm is from Dreamweaver so only those guild members have the access and the power to distribute it.
-The "line" doesn't stop at the bm stun cloud; not everyone is grouped on the ground right next to the bms.
-I said anti-immobilization *+ tranq orb or domain*
-I'm not suggesting the sin be right next to the barb, just move together.
-The catapult does not fly.0 -
ShadowX - Raging Tide wrote: »Only way to get awareness pots atm is from Dreamweaver so only those guild members have the access and the power to distribute it.
-The "line" doesn't stop at the bm stun cloud; not everyone is grouped on the ground right next to the bms.
-I said anti-immobilization *+ tranq orb or domain*
-I'm not suggesting the sin be right next to the barb, just move together.
-The catapult does not fly.
really... cause i can get them from raging tide... get your info correct... or aleast have the correct name.
- while its true that the bm stun line isn't the absolute line for the 2 sides. but being behind enemy line stun line is almost guarantee instand death... especially for a la. this is not rambo where you can actually kill the entire enemy base by sneaking behind enemy lines.
- for god's sake... if you want to pull **** out of no where aleast use the best pots. maze step + ironguard is much better combo then whatever your proposing. even then its not going to be enough to live against a half assed opponinent.
- so what... by next to each other you mean 12 meters... cause that the range of aoes. so wtf do you think is going to happen when there is a barb and 12m away there is a cata running by itself.
- no **** cata doesn't fly. but it needs to stop to attack. and if it stops you bet your **** that half of the enemy guild will be nuking it. and your going to assume not 1 out of those 40 people that nuking the cata will pop a pot?
i have NO problem acquiring pots when my guild doesn't own the production land. and now that my guild can make all the speciality pots... i have NO problem making it for others... even if its a random guy. well for randoms... you better be paying me a tp fee to the land and pay a tip.1. If I kill you; do something about it yourself, don't go complaining to my wife.
2. If you have less kill counts then me, don't expect me to take pk advice from you.
3. If you are hiding behind an alt, don't expect me to acknowledge your existence.
Tokichiro - Heavy Armor Fish / Kiyoshi - Dual Blade Elf0 -
Psychic aqua cannon is a spherical aoe. You can try using that if you're worried about a flying sin.0
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A barb moving along side the cat would do absolutely nothing. Ever pulled a cat? There is this tiny little red or blue orb that stands over you head. They wouldn't waste AoEs on someone who is obviously not the cat puller instead they would send a force to find the phantom puller of the cat and stun lock the barb and get to him in a minute.
A simple thing when he is in your base like I dunno Barrage? on top of the cat would make sure when he has to holy path back to the other side of the base he dies. Its only good as a minor distraction it is not a viable strategy. Once they enemy wises up they will ignore it until it gets near the base. So no assassins just don't have the stamina to do this. Its a parlor trick at best.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Ninnuam - Sanctuary wrote: »Lol wait wut? Cata pulling sins?
WTS barrage and db.
Thats if, by some weird twist of fate they make it to the crystal.
A pair of 9x's in my guild both tried that, they couldnt damage the sin while he/she was invisible (glitch?)0 -
Barrage does not reach either.
Most of the arrows are just animation but do not reach that high either.
Please test out the aoe and how high it reaches before saying it will hit.
Kyoshi, get your head out of your **** and actually read before trying to flamebait. Then maybe you would have noticed stuff I already mentioned. You post like an illiterate wannabe troll.0 -
ShadowX - Raging Tide wrote: »Barrage does not reach either.
Most of the arrows are just animation but do not reach that high either.
Please test out the aoe and how high it reaches before saying it will hit.
Kyoshi, get your head out of your **** and actually read before trying to flamebait. Then maybe you would have noticed stuff I already mentioned. You post like an illiterate wannabe troll.
just how many tws have you been in? cause all you post is pure assumptions... the use of second rate pots... and a **** video of a sin pulling a cata against a under-powered guild. do you honestly expect that to even remotely work in a real tw? by all means if you can convince any sin to pull a cata against me... cause then i could actually add killing a cata puller to my list of tw accomplishments.1. If I kill you; do something about it yourself, don't go complaining to my wife.
2. If you have less kill counts then me, don't expect me to take pk advice from you.
3. If you are hiding behind an alt, don't expect me to acknowledge your existence.
Tokichiro - Heavy Armor Fish / Kiyoshi - Dual Blade Elf0 -
Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »just how many tws have you been in? cause all you post is pure assumptions... the use of second rate pots... and a **** video of a sin pulling a cata against a under-powered guild. do you honestly expect that to even remotely work in a real tw? by all means if you can convince any sin to pull a cata against me... cause then i could actually add killing a cata puller to my list of tw accomplishments.
Lolz i kinda have to agree. Cant use that video as some sort of proof it does NOT show a real competitive TW. Its like on of those non factor guilds with lowbies, if they faced a real faction in TW they would even loose if a full int wizard pulled the cata.
On Lost City they actually tried having a 99+ sin pull cata in a real TW as in 80v80 TW with mostly 100+ people. Lets just say the sin dropped. He got knocked out of stealth from high ranged aoe. Its really a huge cluster of people in real TWs as we all know, specially around and inside base when 1 guild is pushing. Even if no one is targeting you, you will always get stunned or hit from someones aoe at one point when you try to get inside base.
Also doesn't the cata roll up next to you once you stop running? Than the sin can never attack the Chrystal since it would mean a 100% death, just run around with it...
It can still be used successfully as some sort of distraction move and take some pressure of the real catas i guess.0 -
Accel - Raging Tide wrote: »Ouch. And you call yourself a level 100? I've pulled a catapult while invis while flying. The only hard part is to dodge all the aoes, you'll usually be knocked out of invis and nuked.. You could try surviving for a little with focused mind and deaden nerves but yeah.. not really going to help
Guess what, chucklehead?
AOE *anything* = you drop out of stealth.
If the barrage doesnt kill you, the 'nix will.
Drop and re-roll.
RedMenace
\what group of dunderheads gave you a cat, and let you fly with it?
\\we can see the 'cat, genius
\\\it's a good guess that you're in front of itA human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.
Robert A. Heinlein0 -
well the AOE has to to hit before it pulls them out of stealth...and im pretty good at staying away from everything that can be AOEed. so.......yeah0
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