Venos and TT?

Venos are LOVED in TT. Two major skills to have max'd asap when you start doing TT are amp then purge (purge is needed starting with Ape in 2-2). Venos are the tank for 3-1 all bosses. Barbs can do it but you'll see that venos tend to be the prefered tank for that TT. I never have a problem getting in a TT squad.

Only issue I see is people tend to forget what to do when the veno and barb trade tanking duties depending on the type of boss. Some say that veno's should be put with the barb (aka tank) in the drop distribution...some say that venos don't have as much repairs etc so they should remain in DD even though they tanked. It's something to find out from the start...personally if they're willing to slot me in the tank position for 3-1 if I tank in any other TT I want tank slot as well.

As for when to start soloing and depends on your build and herc. The reason I say this is I ran a few TTs with a LA veno that was about 5 or so lvls over me (I was under 2-? lvl at the time - ie hadn't received any quests etc). She was tanking the first boss in 2-whatever (the lion one). Apparently she wasn't able to keep up the heals to keep her herc alive. Her herc died and mine ended up getting aggro. I had 3 squad members in shock that I was able to solo heal my herc and finish the 3/4 hp left on the boss.

SeaStorm - Heavens Tear wrote: »

purge is needed starting with Ape in 2-2

Thank you! Thank you thank you THANK YOU!

I have asked time and again why the heck I've been levelling up purge, when nothing seems to need it. Thank you for at last telling me what I can usefully use it on!


On the main topic - well, kinda.
Veno's get last pick with the DDs in TT most of the time. Even though we can tank most of it (and thus take the heal role too) AND because of no [?] damage reduction our pets consistently outdamage everyone else.

Then there's amp damage, spark passing... veno's are valuable in TT. Very valuable.

Liked? No so much.

Edit:
Solo mode you can do as soon as you meet the level requirement. The bosses are greatly weaker in solo mode.
But it's not really cost effective - you'll usually only just collect enough mats to pay for the ultimate substances you need.
I'd not bother with it unless you find yourself needing 'just one more...' of some mat to make an item.

kenlee wrote: »

that purge is still kinda useless if there is only one veno in squad. that ape in 2-2/2-3 buff itself like every 15 seconds while my purge has 30 sec cooldown

true, and sometimes he ends up buffing the second after you've purged him. But if you time it just right, you can completely purge him everytime.

ExtraTwisted - Dreamweaver wrote: »

What? Purge is also great in pvp.

Blue. So don't care.

I started solo'ing TT1-1 at lvl 63 with a glacial walker. It was during the 2x event and was really worth it. The last two times that I did it, the lord of percussion did not drop a drum. So I came out with only an edge each time. Itpays for the sub, but not a ton of profit.

I'm curious about when I can tank sqaud mode TT1-1. That drops some serious loot. Im saving for a herc right now..... Kind of waiting for zen sale and battle pet pack sales :-). Then life will be easier.

You'll have a hard time doing much of squad mode with a golem, I don't think I'd try until the 73 heal, and then I'd probably want to skip drummer, soul (obviously) and maybe even the serpent.
Dimmy... is actually pretty easy to tank. But luring it into place with a low-golem sounds like a recipe for disaster. Maybe using the teleport-through trick.

Serpent will be doable with enough channel - the only real difficulty is that the snakes attacks really quite quickly once its health is low.

Drummer I'd suggest skipping due to the aoe if nothing else.

ExtraTwisted - Dreamweaver wrote: »

So, you never have any intentions of fighting anyone ever? That sounds pretty dull. b:surrender

Pretty much. I've got plenty of first person shooters for competitive play.

I'm a Veno too,At low lv(no herc) I did some solo mode TT run to got some money and equp upgrat TT mats, so is hard to say is worth or not. When U lv up and getting rich. U can get Herc and batter equp, even U can get some high lv usefull skills ( like S-Degeneration, AMP...). those r much helpfull for ur later TT run(squad mode). U can think about this to killing a boss U first use s-Degeneration to cut off 20% Boss HP then add AMP..., so kill boss even world boss(lol not solo) even faster. That's y veno easy to find squad in TT run. For our squad running TT2-3(whol run), just need 28-45 mins.I 'm sure some squad can run even faster.

Ms_HopToIt - Sanctuary wrote: »

Any good veno is always welcome in a TT squad. Veno + pets(not always hercs)= Best boss DD. I did solo mode TT 1-1 1-2 till i got my herc and i can currently solo (or tank) 1-1, 1-2, 1-3, 2-1, 2-2, and 3-1. I got my herc at lvl 75, and started tanking most of the TTs at lvl 79

o: When you said 1-3, 2-1, 2-2, and 3-1, are you talking about squad mode? If so, how are you tanking soul banisher in 1-3, ape in 2-2, and wurlord in 2-1/2-2? O: My herc gets pwned in there.

One thing is costs, but second is how big role you play in squad. Why would anyone agree to get less when they did most of job? With veno-herc tank everyone have pretty much the same costs. Only exception is if boss have aoe where cleric has to use BB. But even that can be cut if cleric uses Concentration orb. Best way to solve problem with splitting is to split it all equally.

As for barbs hating hercs venos... Barbs' feelings against herc-veno is similar to venos' feelings to Zeal genie with pulling skill. For a long time veno put his pride into pulling skills, but then Zeal came and started to do the same. Now some venos hates them, some loves and uses them. Barbs used to be the main tanks, they put pride into it till a brainless-yellow-fat-boy came and started to do almost the same. So some barbs saw them as opportunity to save money, some saw them as threat.
So now you can see cases where barb pulls and veno catches/tanks the boss.

"pretty much the same costs" was meant that if veno is tanking then barbs and clerics costs gets lowered to other DD costs. To put it simply: If veno tanks, then [barb costs]=[bm costs]; [cleric costs]=[wizard costs].

Btw, there are other costs not only repairs. I mostly spend more on mp items than on repairs.

Herc isn't here from the very beginning. Fix me if I am wrong, but if I remember correctly, then first few months there was no herc in pwi. It came with the first expansion. At that period venomancer was only puller/debuffer/DD and barbs where the main tanks of game. After this expansion the main bashing of venos started.

Ms_HopToIt - Sanctuary wrote: »

Yes Im talking about squad mode. I am however excluding drum and soul banisher in 1-2 and 1-3, and Im excluding wurlord in 2-1 and 2-2, and cosmo in 2-2. I tanked all the bosses in 3-1 at lvl 79, although i did need extra healing boost with the snake looking boss. Also, -12% chan ortaments help, too. I could also tank soulripper in 2-3 before i got lvl 9 heal. And i haven't tried yet, but Im sure i could tank astral walker in 2-3 now.

By about your mid-80s, 1-2 drummer is soloable with herc. The only way you can fail is if you get very, very unlucky and he fires off a max damage magic attack and max damage melee attack, AND your heal does not land in between.

1-3 drummer is problematic even in your 90s. He's mostly soloable, but the chances of the double near-max attack killing your herc are higher. However, both of them are super-easy if you can interrupt the magic attack. Once he start's AOEing, your spam heals should be enough (assuming you have a way to survive the AOE). If you don't interrupt him though, look out. I've seen him nuke my level 92 herc for 3.5k.

Soul Banisher is a beast. 1-3 still gives me problems at 92 w/ heavy armor. He's like drummer, except his AOE damage seems to go up as the fight goes on. A high damage AOE followed by near-max attack can still kill my herc. I've done it with just myself healing, but it was very, very close many times. I prefer to have another veno help heal, but there aren't many other heavy venos who can just stand in his AOE. Even LA venos frequently die to his AOE.

Wurlord probably can't be soloed, but IMHO he's an overrated boss. As long as you have interrupts and sufficient healing (usually 2 venos for a herc, though by 90 you can do 2-1 with just one veno healing), he goes down easily. His low hp means you don't need genies with particularly high energy regen to interrupt him through the fight. Just two people with interrupt genies should be able to keep him from casting for the 60-120 sec it takes to kill him (if your genies don't have good regen, you'll need to bring along extra DDs to shorten the fight).

Also, if you have a cleric, a decent vit/arcane veno should be tank him from range. We've done 2-1 wurlord with a 90 wiz with just 2600 hp tanking (2 clerics, 1 using BB). And I've ended up tanking half a fight against him - I pulled, main veno goofed and herc died. I hadn't finished summoning my herc and didn't want the cleric to die so I started nuking like mad to get aggro. The cleric kept me alive long enough for the main veno to revive pet, summon, send it in, and for it to regain aggro. I think I was around 88, 6k mdef, and 3.5k hp. Haven't tried 2-3 wurlord yet.

2-2 Cosmo is easy if you have two venos who can alternate purges. He does a lot of damage though, so coordinating heals while doing this can be tricky (if the veno is not purging that round, she should be healing. A trio of us did it in our low-mid 80s with a 65 veno helping heal. A veno with demon purge should be able to keep him purged alone.

3-1 bosses are all easy. Just be sure you kill enough regular mobs before starting Coredash. The kill quest says you only need 10 kills to nerf him, but a recent patch seems to have changed that to 13 or 15 without updating the message. Without sufficient kills, his physical AOE range becomes huge and it's impossible to heal from outside the AOE. Also, bring along a lot of DD. I've soloed it 83? 84?, but it took over 45 min per boss, which is a waste of time for an average of 1-2 drops. You'll need more DD anyway to get past the timed boss (need to kill to access the hand boss) so bring some friends, and mow through the bosses in 10-12 min.

The timed boss used to give us problems because we listened to what other people told us to do against him. It took many levels but I think we finally have it figured out. Everyone has to run in at the same time. At the start of the fight, he gives you something like 100 chi and a free spark buff which seems equivalent to about a 1 or 2 spark eruption. It lasts for 1 minute so you do NOT want to spark during this time. After it wears off, then you start using your own sparks. His defense gets higher as the fight goes on so it's important to toss as much as you can on him early into the fight. Amp, Sharpened Tooth Arrow/Soul Degen, pdef and mdef debuffs, extreme poison, rainbow, etc. Keep them applied as much as you can in the first minute. We've gotten our kill time for him down to 62 sec with 3 venos and 1 cleric, 66 sec with 3 venos.

The hardest part of 3-1 is actually breaking into the room just before the ribbon boss. You can't summon your pet without getting into aggro range of the mobs in the room. So you have to tank some hits to get your herc out. I'm heavy so I just go in with Bramble Hood, summon, run out, switch to arcane, and heal. An arcane should be able to do it by going in with Feral, summon, Hood, run out, and heal. The big blademan in that room also drops the rare Annal 2, needed to finish a level 90 quest.

2-* Soulripper is easy. The only thing you have to watch out for is if he gets lucky with a nuke, and even that will barely take half a herc's hp off. Our standard MO was to have the high level herc tank, but have the lowest level veno heal the herc, thus freeing up the high level veno to deal DD. You can't do this on most of the other bosses because the low level heal can't keep up with the damage. But Soulripper just doesn't do as much damage as the other bosses.

2-* Astralwalker is pretty straightforward too. He does a lot of damage with each swing, but swings really, really slowly. The problem is the adds. At certain lower levels, you simply can't heal your herc with both an add and Astral attacking it. There are strategies around this if you're soloing, but I prefer just bringing along friends to deal with the adds, since they also shorten the fight considerably. The adds come at 90%, 60%, and 30% hp btw.

Wow, this got a lot longer than I was planning on.

An alternate strat vs astral is to summon herc (make it stand there, buff it but do not buff it with reflect, thats crucial) near the base of a chain and then climb the chain.

Get up as high as your pet heal allows and wait for astral to come close to your herc then make herc attack it.

Simply spam heal through the whole fight; the adds will agro you due to pet heal but will never be able to reach you so they just rush around without really doing much (apart from an occasional swipe at herc, but without reflect they don't stick to him). Even a low veno should be able to take astral this way.

Astral is also a ranged mob, so reflect has no effect on him. He hits much harder at range too - you find this out very quickly if he agros you and you jump down; expect huge damage before you touch the ground.

As for steelation; simply hood at room entrance, summon herc+full buffs and jump down. Spam heal from below. Tab to switch mobs.

Solandri - Heavens Tear wrote: »

By about your mid-80s, 1-2 drummer is soloable with herc. The only way you can fail is if you get very, very unlucky and he fires off a max damage magic attack and max damage melee attack, AND your heal does not land in between.

1-3 drummer is problematic even in your 90s. He's mostly soloable, but the chances of the double near-max attack killing your herc are higher. However, both of them are super-easy if you can interrupt the magic attack. Once he start's AOEing, your spam heals should be enough (assuming you have a way to survive the AOE). If you don't interrupt him though, look out. I've seen him nuke my level 92 herc for 3.5k.

Soul Banisher is a beast. 1-3 still gives me problems at 92 w/ heavy armor. He's like drummer, except his AOE damage seems to go up as the fight goes on. A high damage AOE followed by near-max attack can still kill my herc. I've done it with just myself healing, but it was very, very close many times. I prefer to have another veno help heal, but there aren't many other heavy venos who can just stand in his AOE. Even LA venos frequently die to his AOE.

Wurlord probably can't be soloed, but IMHO he's an overrated boss. As long as you have interrupts and sufficient healing (usually 2 venos for a herc, though by 90 you can do 2-1 with just one veno healing), he goes down easily. His low hp means you don't need genies with particularly high energy regen to interrupt him through the fight. Just two people with interrupt genies should be able to keep him from casting for the 60-120 sec it takes to kill him (if your genies don't have good regen, you'll need to bring along extra DDs to shorten the fight).

Also, if you have a cleric, a decent vit/arcane veno should be tank him from range. We've done 2-1 wurlord with a 90 wiz with just 2600 hp tanking (2 clerics, 1 using BB). And I've ended up tanking half a fight against him - I pulled, main veno goofed and herc died. I hadn't finished summoning my herc and didn't want the cleric to die so I started nuking like mad to get aggro. The cleric kept me alive long enough for the main veno to revive pet, summon, send it in, and for it to regain aggro. I think I was around 88, 6k mdef, and 3.5k hp. Haven't tried 2-3 wurlord yet.

2-2 Cosmo is easy if you have two venos who can alternate purges. He does a lot of damage though, so coordinating heals while doing this can be tricky (if the veno is not purging that round, she should be healing. A trio of us did it in our low-mid 80s with a 65 veno helping heal. A veno with demon purge should be able to keep him purged alone.

3-1 bosses are all easy. Just be sure you kill enough regular mobs before starting Coredash. The kill quest says you only need 10 kills to nerf him, but a recent patch seems to have changed that to 13 or 15 without updating the message. Without sufficient kills, his physical AOE range becomes huge and it's impossible to heal from outside the AOE. Also, bring along a lot of DD. I've soloed it 83? 84?, but it took over 45 min per boss, which is a waste of time for an average of 1-2 drops. You'll need more DD anyway to get past the timed boss (need to kill to access the hand boss) so bring some friends, and mow through the bosses in 10-12 min.

The timed boss used to give us problems because we listened to what other people told us to do against him. It took many levels but I think we finally have it figured out. Everyone has to run in at the same time. At the start of the fight, he gives you something like 100 chi and a free spark buff which seems equivalent to about a 1 or 2 spark eruption. It lasts for 1 minute so you do NOT want to spark during this time. After it wears off, then you start using your own sparks. His defense gets higher as the fight goes on so it's important to toss as much as you can on him early into the fight. Amp, Sharpened Tooth Arrow/Soul Degen, pdef and mdef debuffs, extreme poison, rainbow, etc. Keep them applied as much as you can in the first minute. We've gotten our kill time for him down to 62 sec with 3 venos and 1 cleric, 66 sec with 3 venos.

The hardest part of 3-1 is actually breaking into the room just before the ribbon boss. You can't summon your pet without getting into aggro range of the mobs in the room. So you have to tank some hits to get your herc out. I'm heavy so I just go in with Bramble Hood, summon, run out, switch to arcane, and heal. An arcane should be able to do it by going in with Feral, summon, Hood, run out, and heal. The big blademan in that room also drops the rare Annal 2, needed to finish a level 90 quest.

2-* Soulripper is easy. The only thing you have to watch out for is if he gets lucky with a nuke, and even that will barely take half a herc's hp off. Our standard MO was to have the high level herc tank, but have the lowest level veno heal the herc, thus freeing up the high level veno to deal DD. You can't do this on most of the other bosses because the low level heal can't keep up with the damage. But Soulripper just doesn't do as much damage as the other bosses.

2-* Astralwalker is pretty straightforward too. He does a lot of damage with each swing, but swings really, really slowly. The problem is the adds. At certain lower levels, you simply can't heal your herc with both an add and Astral attacking it. There are strategies around this if you're soloing, but I prefer just bringing along friends to deal with the adds, since they also shorten the fight considerably. The adds come at 90%, 60%, and 30% hp btw.

Wow, this got a lot longer than I was planning on.

Wow, Wall-O-text.

Anyways, I haven't tried drum or sb since i got my last pet heal

probably could handle it if the heals are timed right.

I am however worried about if ill still be able to tank all these bosses when i hit lvl 90, with no chan gear, going HA, im not gonna be able to mix it up really till im like lvl 93 or 95
meaning at lvl 90 i wont be able to chance ortaments in HA. however if i get the cape by 90, then this probably wont pose a problem.