Changing trends in BM weapon paths

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Miugre - Heavens Tear
Miugre - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,390 Arc User
edited February 2010 in Blademaster
So today I walk in here and see threads on axes, fists, and axe/fist combo paths. Yet I seem to remember fists being written off as "useless" or "not worth taking seriously" the first few months into the game. lol?

Yeah, I'm looking into fist/axe these days. Yesterday I obtained a Hefty Poleaxe of Giants for my 65 BM. Actually, this is a better timeline of my thoughts (self-satire added):

Lv1: Woo melee class!
Lv3: Yeah okay, swords look best on her. Can't see her using anything else, so swords ftw.
Lv20: Whoa, from a distance that BM looks like he's using a staff. No, wait, that's a spear. o_o ...huh. *picks up spears*
Lv30: Axes, axes, axes. If I wanted to use an axe, I'd play my damn barbarian. I'm sticking with sword/spear.
Lv40: Lawl @ using the standard BM skills while unarmed. Fists are funny lookin', but they'd be cool to use.
Lv55: Wait, fists have a channeling cancel skill? That backflip-kick? That just blows my mind, man. I've gotta pick up fists now, Annihilator of Souls is cheap.
Lv58: D: ...my main made a 2-socket AoS?? *gets two flawless garnets for it*
Lv60: *Equips AoS and TT60 Spear*
Lv61: *Equips Illusive Lunar Cutlass*
Lv62: Wow, I can't AoE for ***. So that's why people use axes. And when did fists get popular? Ehhhhh... fine I'll get one. I guess the only way to be unique now is to be omnitalented. *buys a random 3* Azure Sky Hammer*
Lv65: *Equips Hefty Poleaxe of Giants*

......so yeah. I figure why not be omni-talented? A Jack-of-All-Trades, if you will. Only problem is, she already has a certain amount of Vit already - I think 30-40, somewhere in there. I'm fine with her being a glass cannon (the only drawback being I'd need a very competent cleric), just as long as I can equip the latest weps and hold aggro. For now I'm just putting everything into Str and Dex, but I don't know if it'll be enough unless I buy a reset note and completely dump Vit...

For now, the double-flawless AoS is good enough for holding boss aggro; I've learned to just start with double-spark and Relentless Courage. I was tanking all three bosses in BH51 last night quite competently with this tactic (and would've held aggro perfectly if not for the squad's veno stubbornly ignoring my repeated pleas to not send in her shadou cub immediately, only to watch it take aggro and die).

Also, the fists are my go-to weapon on kill quests in the swamp, since everything starts out with a cast there.

At the moment, it's just the axe I'm not so competent with... but maybe that's just because half the monsters in 51 are ranged.

My only regret? That sword and spear just get kind of overshadowed by fist and axe, respectively. I like them... it's just that I don't find many situations where they're good to use (though I welcome anyone to contradict me on this... I'd actually be quite happy).



Anyway. I just thought I'd point out how we all seem to have been very, very silly arguing over the pros and cons of weapon paths. To me, unless you're going for a barb-style build (in which case, you'd probably end up as a pale comparison), the best option is to equip them all. I've played every class except Psychic so far, and the thing that sets the BM apart is their versatility and weapon variety. Why not have fun with that?

Discuss. :P
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Yes, I'm still a stubborn holdout in favor of the old game. Haters gonna hate. ;]

Other Active Characters:
LigerKing (Barb), Girasole (BM), Shamsheer (Sin), ArborSoul (Mystic).
Post edited by Miugre - Heavens Tear on
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Comments

  • Wyver - Harshlands
    Wyver - Harshlands Posts: 23 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    ive been a multi path BM since 50's of all weapons(i know) and its only recently that people wanna go multi cause of all the diffrent skills T.T and i agree the versatility of the BM is what makes it a good class in PVP and pve and sets it apart Spears when people run is funny b:chuckle sword main path for me though >.<
  • Starchief - Sanctuary
    Starchief - Sanctuary Posts: 606 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    multipath here :D. Changing weapons in mid skill is soo fun. I love it when i use that spinny move with axes (forget what its called, lol) and switch to my pole mid spinny skill it looks like im spinning with a pole :D. And fists are just raep in BHs boses go by so much quicker.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Divine_Death - Dreamweaver
    Divine_Death - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,491 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    Wyver - Harshlands wrote: »
    ive been a multi path BM since 50's of all weapons(i know) and its only recently that people wanna go multi cause of all the diffrent skills T.T and i agree the versatility of the BM is what makes it a good class in PVP and pve and sets it apart Spears when people run is funny b:chuckle sword main path for me though >.<

    If you use them for fun and looks with no mastery, sure. But splitting up your spirit for 4 masteries at 5X is a terrible idea.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    "Closing this for excess letter Q's" - hawk
  • Filet - Heavens Tear
    Filet - Heavens Tear Posts: 414 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    The reason so many more people use fists now is because before anni packs fists far far far less useful. No -interval cape, no scroll of tome, no easy way to get lunar claw.
  • Esque - Lost City
    Esque - Lost City Posts: 97 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    there was always a reason to use fists even before the annipacks. some of us fist users have been lucky enough to save enough money to get the light armour bracers of blood moon with -.10 interval in our 60's. you don't NEED the tome or the cape or the 95 gold lunar claws, just dedication.
    Allnighte - knn read pwdatabase laio, rank6 weap needs all of the badges la.
    rank8 laio just la needs laio rep la

    Naevo - o wait dis be pw-my-en? ding dong la
  • Filet - Heavens Tear
    Filet - Heavens Tear Posts: 414 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    Esque - Lost City wrote: »
    there was always a reason to use fists even before the annipacks. some of us fist users have been lucky enough to save enough money to get the light armour bracers of blood moon with -.10 interval in our 60's. you don't NEED the tome or the cape or the 95 gold lunar claws, just dedication.

    Replace dedication with money/luck. only -.1 interval doesn't help much, most people try to make their character stronger, and without the lunar cape, scroll of tome, and lunar/FF claw/fist, using fists as a weapon really isn't that effective.
  • MagicHamsta - Lost City
    MagicHamsta - Lost City Posts: 10,466 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    Filet - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    The reason so many more people use fists now is because before anni packs fists far far far less useful. No -interval cape, no scroll of tome, no easy way to get lunar claw.
    Esque - Lost City wrote: »
    there was always a reason to use fists even before the annipacks. some of us fist users have been lucky enough to save enough money to get the light armour bracers of blood moon with -.10 interval in our 60's. you don't NEED the tome or the cape or the 95 gold lunar claws, just dedication.

    LordKazahahahahhahahahana eated your faces with his punches
    D:
    (>.<)'
    b:shocked
    darthpanda16: Firefox crashed on me. Aryannamage: I don't think I am a GM that would be new.
    Hawk:Do this. closing thread
    frankieraye: I'll see if we can replace the woman with a stick figure and the tiger fangs with marshmallows.//Issues like these need to get escalated quickly to minimize the damage.
    Kantorek: Yeah.. you should try it. It's awesome.
    Sihndra: Nope- not currently possible under any circumstances. Sorry.
    LokisDottir: I mean...not haunting the forums, nope nope..
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    Waiting for...Hamster Packs!
    58% chance to get tokens
    41% chance to get an all class pet hamster....but they has already been freed by the magic hamster.
    1% chance to get ban hamstered with the message "Hamsters United!"
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • wtvdie
    wtvdie Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    spear all the way! cause:

    at lvl 1: spear is cheapest! woot!

    lvl 19: fb 19 spear woot!

    lvl 80 bramble weapon???? WOOT!!

    Now?: WTF 8 GBAs and 8 dust of stars to upgrade?? wtf why does this green weapon take over 20mil to make.. wtf?
  • Dreaded_Fate - Lost City
    Dreaded_Fate - Lost City Posts: 219 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    Fist/Axes.
    [EvilMarlon - Sanctuary] It would be nice to be a male veno i tryed a veno and my dad saw me and he thought i was **** it took me a whole month for him to even talk to me again. <-- LMAO b:chuckle
  • Wyver - Harshlands
    Wyver - Harshlands Posts: 23 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    Divine_Death - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    If you use them for fun and looks with no mastery, sure. But splitting up your spirit for 4 masteries at 5X is a terrible idea.

    i know was hard but im 80's and its all good now took awhile though ;D lol b:chuckle
  • Esque - Lost City
    Esque - Lost City Posts: 97 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    MagicHamsta - Lost City wrote: »
    LordKazahahahahhahahahana eated your faces with his punches
    D:
    (>.<)'
    b:shocked

    lol i've never been in a fight against him, only partied up. we've spoken a few times before.

    filet, you're right about replacing dedication with luck/money (more luck in my case), but then again, you can also say that much about the FF/LG weps, SoT, and lunar cape. also, i can't say i agree with you on fists being an effective weapon. although -.10 interval doesn't seem like much, it sure as hell is better than nothing at all. pre-90s, -.10 bracers and FF gold fists are the best one can get for quick attacks. couple said bracers with the belial fists, and thats when things begin to change a bit.


    talk to ShiHeiLong about that last sentence. i'm sure he'll be more than happy to elaborate on all the times i've caved his virtual face in.
    Allnighte - knn read pwdatabase laio, rank6 weap needs all of the badges la.
    rank8 laio just la needs laio rep la

    Naevo - o wait dis be pw-my-en? ding dong la
  • Filet - Heavens Tear
    Filet - Heavens Tear Posts: 414 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    Esque - Lost City wrote: »
    lol i've never been in a fight against him, only partied up. we've spoken a few times before.

    filet, you're right about replacing dedication with luck/money (more luck in my case), but then again, you can also say that much about the FF/LG weps, SoT, and lunar cape. also, i can't say i agree with you on fists being an effective weapon. although -.10 interval doesn't seem like much, it sure as hell is better than nothing at all. pre-90s, -.10 bracers and FF gold fists are the best one can get for quick attacks. couple said bracers with the belial fists, and thats when things begin to change a bit.


    talk to ShiHeiLong about that last sentence. i'm sure he'll be more than happy to elaborate on all the times i've caved his virtual face in.

    Yeah but with only -.1 interval from wrists fists weren't a very effective pvp weapon. FF fists were extremely uncommon before anni packs. Either way I'm not complaining that fists have been given such a big upgrade, bms definitely need it.
  • dekciw
    dekciw Posts: 954 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    It's mostly because people started to realize that axe just don't cut it anymore even with gx uber refined. Why? Everyone is hitting endgame and the most squishy class aren't so squishy anymore because they have high refined gear and stacked pdef shards-neck-belt and so on. Making your beloved g11 weapon damage miserable. Berserk or not, the dps on a single target with axe is horrible ( hello 3digit damage @ less than 1 hit/s when people have 8-10k+ hp). Then people started looking around for solutions and realized that fists/claws with as much -interval as possible had incredibly high DPS giving Warriors the possibility to kill people again.

    Sadly now, and It's something I'm trying to avoid, most warriors that do have good fists-claws now barely use their axes anymore, not totally filling their stunner role that they should play.
    ZzXVdr5.png
  • SeaStorm - Heavens Tear
    SeaStorm - Heavens Tear Posts: 315 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    AWE...you just need a BM that's good in using all weapons etc. BTW most won't use them cause they scare the **** out of the player, but the GX fists are fab, just light you up like a freaking candle stick...I'd wear a charm and have a cleric there...

    The BM I run with uses currently 9 different weapons along with the skills for each one...Thank god for the number/F keys. You time it right and stack all the right skills (BM/Veno)...I love watching that HP bar drop like a fly.

    Fists = massive amounts of chi build up = HF + sage amp followed by sword skills, then pole etc etc etc

    Either way he creates a massive amount of damage to the point that there's only 1 barb so far on the server (HT) that can hold aggro. Everyone else, he steals aggro off of. Not too bad for a 9X BM vs 9X - 10X Barbs.

    Only time he doesn't steal is when I'm tanking ? bosses with my herc.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • wtvdie
    wtvdie Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    why does he have 9? there are 4 weapon paths. assuming u have a few bramble weapons, and 1 of each weapon, u'd have made 7 tops? genie is better for pulling than a bow.
  • maocchi
    maocchi Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    Some people have both zerk and non zerk weapon sets. All my weapons with exception of pole are zerk, but I have both zerk fists (Peace) and non zerk fists (Gorenox) because zerk on fists kills you as much as it kills your enemy.
  • Kinohki - Lost City
    Kinohki - Lost City Posts: 66 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    Where axes and fist lack, swords / polearms pick up. The two excel in single target "spike" damage. Farstrike is one of the hardest hitting skills that doesn't use chi. 100% weapon dmg + 2.2k dmg at level 10 with a range of 15 meters. Double or triple spark and yeah..Good game arcane. That skill HURTS.(I've oneshot some wizzies and other arcanes just by dual sparking and critting..3-5k depending at lv 82.)

    Swords are great for spike damage as well due to myriad sword stance being the absolute stronges dual spark in the game. 210% weapon damage + 5000? Yeah..Good game. That skill hits like an oncoming semi and if paired right, is a death sentence to a player who knows how to use it. Each weapon has their uses. A BM is wholly supposed to use all 4 weapons and be an absolute avatar of destruction, it just boils down to the fact that all those skills take up SO much spirit it's ridiculous. They're easily the most spirit intensive class there is. Even skipping the useless skills (vacuous palm, mage bane etc..) you get to the point to where skills take so much coin and spirit it's ridiculous. Someone using all 4 weapons with all 4 masteries and paths maxed...Yeah, that BM would be a truly, truly frightening sight..Especially if they knew how to use that power.

    BM's are more than stuns..It's just that most of the population doesn't show anything past that point..It's sad really.
  • SeaStorm - Heavens Tear
    SeaStorm - Heavens Tear Posts: 315 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    wtvdie wrote: »
    why does he have 9? there are 4 weapon paths. assuming u have a few bramble weapons, and 1 of each weapon, u'd have made 7 tops? genie is better for pulling than a bow.
    maocchi wrote: »
    Some people have both zerk and non zerk weapon sets. All my weapons with exception of pole are zerk, but I have both zerk fists (Peace) and non zerk fists (Gorenox) because zerk on fists kills you as much as it kills your enemy.

    Yes, as maocchi says part of it is the zerk...in my friend's case the GX 90 fists...he doesn't use them without a cleric and a charm, due to the HP damage. Weapon wise he carries: Pole, GX fist, Fist (non-zerk), Axes, Single Sword, GX Single Sword, Double Sword, Hammers, and Bow. I think there might bit a couple more he doesn't have equiped atm too. BTW bow is extremely useful on runner poison mobs like in FB89 Eden.

    Different weapons have different status affects...if you know how to use them to your advantage...

    Oh and Kinohki's comment, "Someone using all 4 weapons with all 4 masteries and paths maxed...Yeah, that BM would be a truly, truly frightening sight..Especially if they knew how to use that power."

    he's got all the masteries of course some of the sage/demon are harder to get but they're all lvl 10 or sage/demon...and knows he how to use them...why else would he be able to out damage out tank 99% of the barbs he's teamed up with.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • dekciw
    dekciw Posts: 954 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    SeaStorm - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Yes, as maocchi says part of it is the zerk...in my friend's case the GX 90 fists...he doesn't use them without a cleric and a charm, due to the HP damage. Weapon wise he carries: Pole, GX fist, Fist (non-zerk), Axes, Single Sword, GX Single Sword, Double Sword, Hammers, and Bow. I think there might bit a couple more he doesn't have equiped atm too. BTW bow is extremely useful on runner poison mobs like in FB89 Eden.

    You don't know what GX is... or do you b:shutup

    GX = gang xie and it's the name of the hh90 gold axes made with Belial's gold mat(Ancient devil soul)

    There is no such thing as GX sword or fists.. I'm guessing you the hh90 gold sword with berserk and the hh90 gold fist with berserk.
    ZzXVdr5.png
  • Divine_Death - Dreamweaver
    Divine_Death - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,491 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    dekciw wrote: »
    You don't know what GX is... or do you b:shutup

    GX = gang xie and it's the name of the hh90 gold axes made with Belial's gold mat(Ancient devil soul)

    There is no such thing as GX sword or fists.. I'm guessing you the hh90 gold sword with berserk and the hh90 gold fist with berserk.

    As long as we are being technical, it was Berserker instead of Berserk ;).
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    "Closing this for excess letter Q's" - hawk
  • nate1019
    nate1019 Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    hey my perfectworld ant working can you get the perfectworld to work for me
  • Pervs - Lost City
    Pervs - Lost City Posts: 256 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    http://zoome.jp/gattun/diary/64/

    Japenese or Chinese server, PvP Tournament (where you get the helmet). Watch and learn.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Joshcja - Sanctuary
    Joshcja - Sanctuary Posts: 3,502 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    i want arena to open so bad now >.<
    Gifs are hard to make work here
  • Michael - Harshlands
    Michael - Harshlands Posts: 348 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    The arena is open, has been for weeks now thursday at TW time for your server.
  • Devoted - Lost City
    Devoted - Lost City Posts: 3,634 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=3568221&postcount=67

    < One of the few people preaching fist endgame pre AP.
  • Filet - Heavens Tear
    Filet - Heavens Tear Posts: 414 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    Devoted - Lost City wrote: »
    http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=3568221&postcount=67

    < One of the few people preaching fist endgame pre AP.

    Really funny how an archer knows our class the best XD
  • Pervs - Lost City
    Pervs - Lost City Posts: 256 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    Naw pretty sure 90% of the people that roll WRs are ****. Thats why we get topics like "Light Armor Fister (don't tell me im wrong)" and "Best place to grind at 40s????". You have people like Kurzon, Taykiem, and cbastor that fail as WRs (no offense cb ;]) and re-roll archer which in fact suck even more.

    WRs imo are the second hardest class to play besides EP since you need timing and a bit of luck to excel at it. Too bad all the WRs that CS in Lost City are doing it wrong. Not one 5.0 =/
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Devoted - Lost City
    Devoted - Lost City Posts: 3,634 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    I think the few warriors who know what they are doing are far too poor to reach their goal. To be good at a warrior you NEED a good source of income to fund the almost mandatory GX and lunar claws/hh100. Not to mention you also should want the cv spear. That's three weapons to refine. Axe doesn't need a high refine due to its limited use for tw/drake bash/aoes but your claws do need a decent refine to be able to do enough against mages. Spear isn't that important either but it's still another weapon to refine. Not to mention gear, you need at least 2 pieces of hh99 which is easy but if you are 272str and 200+ dex you are gonna need some beyond average refines to make up for your low hp. To stay with the competition you also want: lunar cape, event helm and boots and maybe a cv neck in the long run... even a love up and down tomb. Don't forget the cv ring so you can hit stuff, two isn't necessary with your high dex but a netherbeast ring is great... hell skills... hard because you get terrible blade skills that the npc won't even buy.. pdef and magic sutra are manditory, not to mention cyclone heel (cheap) and 3 masteries.. hell drake bash, lions roar, dragon.. warrior is probably the most expensive class endgame.

    As you can see people DO know how to play warrior but the good ones won't appear till this gear becomes very common. The ones with the money have +12 GX and 642 vit. They are terrible, if they had any skill people would never question a warrior.

    I think lordkazahana has the closest build to a good warrior but he isn't anything special, if anyone like warmachine had that gear it would be gg.
  • Daizengar - Sanctuary
    Daizengar - Sanctuary Posts: 142 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    This is the current me: http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=1b841bcbd0888777 (Stats on some items are inaccurate)

    Other weapons I have are:
    +6 Deicide, 2 G9 Garnets
    +4 GX, 1 G9 Garnet
    +3 Firelotus, 1 G8 Garnet & 1 G8 Amber
    Unicorn b:shocked

    I also have a 2nd Misty ring that I switch with Heavenly Lord when needed.

    All skills(except useless ones) are at least Lv10.

    Started as a Pure Polearm BM up until 7x when I added the other 3 weapons to my build. Best choice I ever made.

    All of my Lunar and Event gear I've only been able to get 1-2 items every time Anni packs returned, and that's by farming stuffs for coins and borrowing money from faction mates and friends. I go into heavy debt every single time just for that new item that brings me closer to the ultimate goal.

    Yet, I'm still missing lots of things like, Aura of the Golden Bell, Lunar rings and Love: Up and Down.

    And I still have yet to start collecting Twilight materials for my TT99 2HA/LA set and Monarch spear b:cry

    Even so, so far it's been very rewarding. Slowly but sure, I will acquire everything b:laugh
  • Draeyos - Lost City
    Draeyos - Lost City Posts: 20 Arc User
    edited January 2010
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    Not to be negative, but from the looks of it trying to make a good BM seems costly and too much dam work for a game. Honestly if it take all that to be considered decent/good, Idk if i even wanna lv my BM anymore.

    Although I could be misunderstanding what you guys are saying and willing to give up too easy.

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