Is attack rate irrelevant?
I found that I am using skills all the time and hardly use the base attack. As skills has its own Channel/Cast/Cooldown timing, it seems to mean that attack rate is irrelevant? So having faster attack rate as an assassin does not seems to give us an advantage. Is my observation correct? Or is there some flaw that I am not aware of?
Post edited by sydgamer on
0
Comments
-
Attack rate is irrelevant when purely using skills.I was early taught to work as well as play,
My life has been one long, happy holiday;
Full of work and full of play-
I dropped the worry on the way-
And God was good to me everyday.0 -
For sins early in levels we could use auto-attack to deal decent damage; but as we level up the bulk of our damage comes from our skills, and even later on, at 44, we have a skill that reduces our attack rate drastically but in return it increases our damage. When using this skill we'll basically need to use skill and only skills =P
So yeah, attack rate for us is/will be irrelevant.4x sin - Sacronox
3x psy- Aegento
5x wiz- Kimbley
3x ea - Mavado
Raging Tides-
3x cleric- Ishmael0 -
Honestly, I agree with you. Sin's got Chill of the Deep which reduces ur attack rate a 100% at lvl 10 so (obviously) it's too hard to kill someone(by normal hits) with ur attack rate reduced by a 100%. b:shockedb:bye[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0
-
personally i don't skill spam on bosses as you do decent dps just auto attacking and it doesn't suck up your mana0
-
I have to at least partially agree with Lusca here - I start out on bosses pretty much purely auto attacking, and bust out the skills later on after the tank has really good aggro and I know I'm not going to **** something off and die.0
-
TidalShrike - Harshlands wrote: »I have to at least partially agree with Lusca here - I start out on bosses pretty much purely auto attacking, and bust out the skills later on after the tank has really good aggro and I know I'm not going to **** something off and die.
when i'm with a decent tank i only use rib strike and raising dragon strike and just spam single spark since i'm pretty while sparked i do better dps auto attacking than i do with skills
but when i'm with a not-so-good tank then i don't spark or use skills other than rib strike every 30 seconds so that i don't pull aggro lol0 -
For starting assassins, attack speed really doesn't seem to matter since in early levels (up until about 35) you just spam skills constantly. (Slipstream, Puncture, Rib Strike)
However in later levels (50+) your attack speed can be a matter of survival while questing. I find it much easier to just keep Bloodpaint active as I auto-attack everything to death. My HP is constantly at full unlessI encounter a mob with incresed attack/m.attack/ sac assault.
I do believe though that in the higher level content (80+) Chill of the Deep will be our main source of damage. It may reduce our attack speed, but with our attack level so high, we'll be spamming skills for most of our damage.0 -
at very high lvl i agree chill of the deep will be our main source of DD. Im pretty you will all find a combo like
puncture wound>slipstream strike>rising dragon strike>tackling slash etc etc what you want to use skills during the bleed effect and refresh it as soon as possible.
Of course your purpose will be to use spark each time you need it.
However you cannot say now that at low lvl (i mean under lvl 70) chill of the deep is so good. Im sure almost all your skills are not maxed to their right lvl (maybe puncture wound and slipstream strike i hope). So for a moment auto attack stay better than chill of the deep but later yeah it will be overpowered by this skill
. 0 -
Stacked interval at 90+ > whatever you're going to be trying to do, more than likely. I rarely use skills while grinding or doing public quest. I kill mobs my level in like 8-9 seconds worth of melee. And mobs don't die to 3-4 skills like they used to... so skill spamming is kind of pointless. Would rather make use of the increased chance of weapon effect proc. I used to open with rib strike and stuff or other skills but eventually I got too lazy to even do that and it only saved me at most one hit.. but the slow casting time of skills made it not worth it.Sacronox - Harshlands wrote: »For sins early in levels we could use auto-attack to deal decent damage; but as we level up the bulk of our damage comes from our skills, and even later on, at 44, we have a skill that reduces our attack rate drastically but in return it increases our damage. When using this skill we'll basically need to use skill and only skills =P
So yeah, attack rate for us is/will be irrelevant.
For pvp skill spamming will probably be the best on anything but heavy armor probably, though. But for pve the only use a few skills;
- Self buffs: just useful in general obviously, Bloodpaint and Focused Mind are great
- Tackling: only for kiting mobs
- Knife Throw: luring mobs, making melee mobs come your way, etc. Great for luring mobs out of the water to prevent the glitch with halved damage @ swamps.
- Teleport + sprinting skills: getting around faster
Other than those I dont really use any skills seriously... maybe sleep but that's it. I spam skills on sac assault mobs since they die in 3 hits without getting a hit off but yeah... melee ftw.Wondering how much longer these **** packs are going to be around.0 -
Attack rate? Assassin? Irrelvant? o___O
We're one of the fastest hitting in the game, we can out DD blademasters (Non-fist ones) by a mile. In PvE I find spamming skills is a waste of mana, i'll pop on bleed then drop the mob in a couple seconds thanks to my very fast attack rate and frequent hits.
Don't completly forget your attack rate, in my opinion it's one of the main things that makes us so deadly. o.o.Reikara - 94 HA/AA Veno - Heaven's Tear - Retired
Limeball -84 Assassin - Heaven's Tear - Retired
Reikarah - 99 Seeker - Sanctuary - Retired
Why do I stick around? I draw pwi fanart.0 -
Kristoph - Lost City wrote: »Stacked interval at 90+ > whatever you're going to be trying to do, more than likely. I rarely use skills while grinding or doing public quest. I kill mobs my level in like 8-9 seconds worth of melee. And mobs don't die to 3-4 skills like they used to... so skill spamming is kind of pointless. Would rather make use of the increased chance of weapon effect proc. I used to open with rib strike and stuff or other skills but eventually I got too lazy to even do that and it only saved me at most one hit.. but the slow casting time of skills made it not worth it.
For pvp skill spamming will probably be the best on anything but heavy armor probably, though. But for pve the only use a few skills;
- Self buffs: just useful in general obviously, Bloodpaint and Focused Mind are great
- Tackling: only for kiting mobs
- Knife Throw: luring mobs, making melee mobs come your way, etc. Great for luring mobs out of the water to prevent the glitch with halved damage @ swamps.
- Teleport + sprinting skills: getting around faster
Other than those I dont really use any skills seriously... maybe sleep but that's it. I spam skills on sac assault mobs since they die in 3 hits without getting a hit off but yeah... melee ftw.
i agree, the skill spamming with 30 +att lv is nice when u make few nice crit (ofc with crit buff), with skill spamin against LA and Arcane gear its kind'a better because u have more chance for forcing target in his positin,with normal attack maybe they tping or casting something what break ur attack.
mainly pve not spark burst+buff on u and few times a skill?
i think this is why dev team maked the attack speed reduce,att lv increase skill, for skill spamming,but in pve if u dont have sht weapon then in 1vs1 u dont really forced to spamming skills,no?
correct me if i said bullsh!t 0 -
your attack speed becomes your primary damage source at higher levels, its far from irrelevant.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
advice to fledgling archers:
Going sage is like drunken sex, at first she may look good, but when you wake up the next morning; you'll look at her and go WHAT HAVE I DONE.0 -
WaffleChan - Sanctuary wrote: »your attack speed becomes your primary damage source at higher levels, its far from irrelevant.
I'm glad we have such high leveled and experienced assassins to tell us what's what at high levels....4x sin - Sacronox
3x psy- Aegento
5x wiz- Kimbley
3x ea - Mavado
Raging Tides-
3x cleric- Ishmael0 -
its called being experienced as an archer/fist BM who are totally reliant on attack speed. with the average attack, but ridiculous attack speed of fists/daggers, stacking interval gear would yield huge damage increases. could you imagine attacking more than twice a second?Sacronox - Harshlands wrote: »I'm glad we have such high leveled and experienced assassins to tell us what's what at high levels....0 -
lol funniest thing i ever heard. of course its IMPORtant for us. i use for killing only spark tackling slash and normal attack(duo fast chi recovery i spam sparks like hell) if u get to higher lvls ur crit chance will increase of course and withf aster attack rates u will get mroe dmg in 5 sec with normal attack than with skills in those same 5 sec. not to mention bloodpaint which is best when hitting fast and hard(crit). tried this on an archer. at lvl 105 i rarely use skills(sharptooth most of the time) the rest does the crit and the attack rate. so yeah sin have to be fast to survive0
-
none exist, liar.at lvl 1050 -
For a while I was using deep chill and killing things with 3 or 4 skills, and I still can, but now I just use my amp dam aoe and melee things to death. saves soo much mp
On bosses I will spam skills and then melee when out of mp for a bit then pop a pot and do to town some more. I haven't pulled aggro more than once or twice from the barb, but they weren't in tiger form so it might have been more to do with them not holding aggro.
I guess it all depends on the situation/mobs you are killing. I wouldn't suggest skill spaming on shrunchkin wizzies because literally all they do is manaburn you and kite.
On the other hand if you are fighting a def+/assault mob you might want to debuff and/skill spam.
The real issue is that when you are going to skill spam, do you want to use deep chill and be stuck with it for 10min just to kill a few mobs?
I know some like to log out and in to get rid of it, but that is so annoying. I wish bloodpaint was 10 min. It would make killing water mobs in tideform less of a hassle with rebuffing :PI Aim To Misbehave0 -
lenn i didn't say it was on PWI. i played an archer on a private server. i know what i'm talking bout.....to be honest i played every class except veno on a private serverXD.....jsut didn't take time to learn bout them except archers.......thats why i know0
-
private sservers are illegal, and idiotic.BIackTyphoon - Heavens Tear wrote: »lenn i didn't say it was on PWI. i played an archer on a private server. i know what i'm talking bout.....to be honest i played every class except veno on a private serverXD.....jsut didn't take time to learn bout them except archers.......thats why i know0 -
first of all i know that by now and its not idiotic. stop talking bout things u don'T know. helped me a lot to get exp on the game and on the classes. if u don't like it ...well don't but stop talking ****0
-
only an idiot would play something illegal, no offense.BIackTyphoon - Heavens Tear wrote: »first of all i know that by now and its not idiotic. stop talking bout things u don'T know. helped me a lot to get exp on the game and on the classes. if u don't like it ...well don't but stop talking ****
why play a pserv of a FREE game lol...? i can understand a p2p, but free, come on.0 -
fast lv uping = less experience with ur class.0
-
umm u do realize that this game is only free as long as u pay in CS. as soon as players stop doin so u won't get **** from the game. and why i played ? not because i'm an idiot but because of the rates. i got to lvl 105 in one day and had the other time learning bout my class. now i can play here with my accumulated exp. i saved time baiscally and one mroe reason. not everyone has now social life so to safe time i did play. got that? i didn't have to wait for month to find out which build is the best and what skills to use(and don't refer to the guides. i have my own playstyle and i tend to find out for myself what build to use and which skills to skill)0
-
im sorry but getting to 105 does NOT teach you how to play your class. in a place with a bunch of max leveled idiots and +12 fake and warsoul gear, you arent learning a damn thing.BIackTyphoon - Heavens Tear wrote: »umm u do realize that this game is only free as long as u pay in CS. as soon as players stop doin so u won't get **** from the game. and why i played ? not because i'm an idiot but because of the rates. i got to lvl 105 in one day and had the other time learning bout my class. now i can play here with my accumulated exp. i saved time baiscally and one mroe reason. not everyone has now social life so to safe time i did play. got that? i didn't have to wait for month to find out which build is the best and what skills to use(and don't refer to the guides. i have my own playstyle and i tend to find out for myself what build to use and which skills to skill)
note those private servers run the same way. the instant some one stops 'donating' to the dumb asses who run the things, theyre gone, and theyre all just scams.
if you have a 'social' life, play casually, work on your character every so often, theres no need to justify doing something illegal. your arguments are null and void.0 -
The less conservative you are, the faster you kill. The faster your MP burns away, the more HP you save as an Assassin. Of course, I never have issues with MP as an Assassin due to the fact that I used to play the extremely MP heavy Cleric. While normal attacks can be considered a staple, it doesn't change the fact that a good 3/4th of Assassin Skills are fast and that they can go into endless skill loops. Unlike Archers, Assassin's strongest skills take only a blink to channel.
Overall, it's all on taste. Me, I'm a skill spammer because I know it's heavy offense, heavy defense, and it's the only way to start understanding the Assassin's incredible heavy hitters at the very end.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
im sorry but getting to 105 does NOT teach you how to play your class. in a place with a bunch of max leveled idiots and +12 fake and warsoul gear, you arent learning a damn thing.
u don't get warsould gear...keep dreaming. and u Do learn bout ru class since u can fokus on skills and survivalnote those private servers run the same way. the instant some one stops 'donating' to the dumb asses who run the things, theyre gone, and theyre all just scams.
didn't say it was free. that was not the argument. just said that PWI is not "free"if you have a 'social' life, play casually, work on your character every so often, theres no need to justify doing something illegal. your arguments are null and void.
i didn't justify it. i just said i didn't want to waste time. and besides i don't want to argue. i got my exp out of playing there. its not idiotic but helpful and i don't play there anymore otherwise i wouldn't be here. and furthermore we are off topic. sry Lenn don't wanna argue. jstu so u know i don't think its good to play a private server but i do think it helps. so now on topic.
i think that rate will be most important when u get ur demon spark. very very usefull against bosses while having bloodpaint. tho in lower lvls i belive skills will have to be used quite often. dunno bout lvl 50s or 60s but i guess after lvl 60 u will have a good crit % so u will be jsut fine with bloodpaint and normal attack0 -
if you dont wanna argue, stop posting. your garbage is derailing this thread.BIackTyphoon - Heavens Tear wrote: »u don't get warsould gear...keep dreaming. and u Do learn bout ru class since u can fokus on skills and survival
didn't say it was free. that was not the argument. just said that PWI is not "free"
i didn't justify it. i just said i didn't want to waste time. and besides i don't want to argue. i got my exp out of playing there. its not idiotic but helpful and i don't play there anymore otherwise i wouldn't be here. and furthermore we are off topic. sry Lenn don't wanna argue. jstu so u know i don't think its good to play a private server but i do think it helps. so now on topic.
i think that rate will be most important when u get ur demon spark. very very usefull against bosses while having bloodpaint. tho in lower lvls i belive skills will have to be used quite often. dunno bout lvl 50s or 60s but i guess after lvl 60 u will have a good crit % so u will be jsut fine with bloodpaint and normal attack0 -
if you dont wanna argue, stop posting. your garbage is derailing this thread.
So says an inexperienced level 24 tideborn to someone who has provided useful information. You're derailing the thread with your soapbox more than Typhoon is.
As for damage, if you're still skill-spamming 5x and 6x, you're wasting MP. The fact that I can keep Advanced Spark up 90% of the time on my Sin means that my Sin does far more damage than my Fist BM ever did in 6x. It helps that I have -0.05 interval LA wristguards, but even without those skill spamming is utterly pointless outside of PVP.
Considering Daggers can be crafted with -0.05 interval, it should be possible to hit 3-4 times per second with high level gear, easily. Daggers also have slightly higher base damage than fists, so you may see Sins Demon Sparking barbs to kill them just like Fist BMs do (with a lil' Bramble Rage tossed in for good measure).
Save skill spam and the Attack Level buff for PVP. It was tailor made for it.0 -
he didnt post a drop of helpful information. nor am i just a 'level 24 inexperienced tideborn,' idiot. its a glitched forum display.Phoenix - Dreamweaver wrote: »So says an inexperienced level 24 tideborn to someone who has provided useful information. You're derailing the thread with your soapbox more than Typhoon is.
As for damage, if you're still skill-spamming 5x and 6x, you're wasting MP. The fact that I can keep Advanced Spark up 90% of the time on my Sin means that my Sin does far more damage than my Fist BM ever did in 6x. It helps that I have -0.05 interval LA wristguards, but even without those skill spamming is utterly pointless outside of PVP.
Considering Daggers can be crafted with -0.05 interval, it should be possible to hit 3-4 times per second with high level gear, easily. Daggers also have slightly higher base damage than fists, so you may see Sins Demon Sparking barbs to kill them just like Fist BMs do (with a lil' Bramble Rage tossed in for good measure).
Save skill spam and the Attack Level buff for PVP. It was tailor made for it.
anyways, the way stacking interval goes would be most helpful on an an assassin when youve acculmulated quite a bit of it.
lets say they have lunar cape, love up and down, and a 99 LA attack speed bonus. (a .25 interval boost)
we take daggers' basic attack speed of 1.25/s and convert it to seconds per attack:
1/ 1.25 = .8
next we subtract the interval, and convert it back.
1 / (.8 -.25 = ~1.82 atk/s
say demon spark adds 25%, convert it back to seconds per attack
and use the formula (seconds / attack) * (1 - % boost)
(.55) * (1 . -25) = ~0.4125
or .41, which isnt a valid .05 fixed interval so it would be bumped to .40
1 / .4 = 2.5 atk/s
as you can see, attacking 2 and a 1/2 times per second is going to yield way more damage output that a simple spamming of skills. really, before you go pointing fingers of whos inexperienced, dont judge a book by its cover.0 -
The only issue there is that the player will need to be level 99 with interval gear then in order to reach two and a half attacks a second. And with the addition of Demon or Sage, it can also easily be assumed that the skills also reached Demon/Sage quality. Thus, until the damage for the demon/sage skills are figured out, we cannot presume normal attacks being more efficient.
We are also very certain that Demon/Sage has some wild effects on skills, for all we know they can shoot Chill of the Deep's Attack levels to 50, negate the attack rate debuff, or many other possibilities. So, until Sage and Demon skills have been realized, we cannot presume that normal attacks with interval gear will yield better results.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0
![http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v125/phoenix_blade/sig.jpg[/SIGPIC]](http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v125/phoenix_blade/sig.jpg[/SIGPIC]){kind=link}
Categories
- All Categories
- 182K PWI
- 699 Official Announcements
- 2 Rules of Conduct
- 264 Cabbage Patch Notes
- 61.1K General Discussion
- 1.5K Quality Corner
- 11.1K Suggestion Box
- 77.4K Archosaur City
- 3.5K Cash Shop Huddle
- 14.3K Server Symposium
- 18.1K Dungeons & Tactics
- 2K The Crafting Nook
- 4.9K Guild Banter
- 6.6K The Trading Post
- 28K Class Discussion
- 1.9K Arigora Colosseum
- 78 TW & Cross Server Battles
- 337 Nation Wars
- 8.2K Off-Topic Discussion
- 3.7K The Fanatics Forum
- 207 Screenshots and Videos
- 22.8K Support Desk