Omg, Demon Sandstorm..feel no different

2

Comments

  • Mumintroll - Heavens Tear
    Mumintroll - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,393 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    prof wrote: »
    then show me the math, because I don't believe this exceptional boost in damage everybody is praising. I'd prefer the crit after I see what she hits next to me

    I did this math. I just copy and paste it.
    I'm going sage. why?
    1. Demon barrier gives you 150% def. But from circa 8000def you don't gain very much damage reduction so I think it not worth. And 8000 def you can make with sage 120% barrier quite easily too.
    2. 5% from masteries is much more, than additional 1200 damage from SS. This will be true, when you will have weapon refined to +7 or more. More attack damage, more sage damage gain.

    Example Weapon. Neon purgatory refined +7 has a max. damage 6900. Now daemon SS has. 300% damage + 6560 earth damage = 27260 (same as sage) now + 1200(demon) =28 460 damage demon.

    Now Sage: SS 6900 + 300% + 6560 = 27260 + 5% =
    28 623 damage. So Sage damage is more about 163 in comparing demon damage.

    Now you have refined same weapon to +12. So demon damage will be 40580 +1200=41780
    Sage damage will be 40580 + 5% = 42609. So sage damage is now 829 more than demon damage.

    Now just hypothetically. With rank 8 weapon refined +12. Has demon maximum damage 51 827. Maximum sage damage is now 53158. So sage damage is 1331 bigger than demon damage.


    Also this difference will grow with more basic damage you will have. 1200 demon damage will never change, BUT 5% of sage damage will grow always. Also This 5 % is for EVERY spell.
    Also I didn't mention another aspect like chi and ultimates.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • CrazyLazy - Dreamweaver
    CrazyLazy - Dreamweaver Posts: 14 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    He dont need to be 89 just go onto site and it gives u list of what each skill does at sage and demon b:cute and no offence why would any1 go demon? Ye there spark looks good ye distance shrink is useful 30 meter range. But come on sage is only and best way for Wizard 50 chi from holy pyro ye only 20% chance but come on it works every 1-3 shots with it. Half chi awesome the more chi you save and build faster u can open some woop ****.
    Everytime i Post it is my opinion and my view. I do not claim they are perfect its your choice what you do im just stating my opinion from experience. b:pleased
  • FireWizardEX - Dreamweaver
    FireWizardEX - Dreamweaver Posts: 463 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    CeliaZ - Sanctuary wrote: »
    lolz, like you discovered it already b:chuckle Are you the only wizard that can use sage and demon books at 77 already?

    u should already know im specially b:chuckle
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Nakhimov - Lost City
    Nakhimov - Lost City Posts: 1,829 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    CrazyLazy - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    He dont need to be 89 just go onto site and it gives u list of what each skill does at sage and demon b:cute and no offence why would any1 go demon? Ye there spark looks good ye distance shrink is useful 30 meter range. But come on sage is only and best way for Wizard 50 chi from holy pyro ye only 20% chance but come on it works every 1-3 shots with it. Half chi awesome the more chi you save and build faster u can open some woop ****.

    Many of the skill descriptions on ecatomb are wrong. As well, it's hard to tell what's good and what's not unless you've actually used it.

    And people go demon because of a higher perceived damage output, even with lower refines.

    @FireWizardEX: if your sig is any indication, I'm tempted to believe you sleep with a list of sage skills under your pillow b:surrender
    Bladestorm lets you spin around like a carnival ride and do damage. Not using it is almost like having a move called Confetti Rocket Power Leap and saving it for "emergencies"
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Nakhimov the Kingslayer of Kil'Jaeden's <Criminal Scum>
    wowprogress.com/guild/us/kil-jaeden/Criminal+Scum
  • Mizuoni - Dreamweaver
    Mizuoni - Dreamweaver Posts: 3,533 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    CeliaZ - Sanctuary wrote: »
    lolz, like you discovered it already b:chuckle Are you the only wizard that can use sage and demon books at 77 already?

    FireWizardEX stunned me with demon sr then 1 shot me with sage bt. he iz leet x.x
    Sins are Scissors. Psychics are Rocks.
    Archers, Venos, Barbs, Wizards, BMs, Mystics, Seekers are Paper.
    ...and Clerics are Mushrooms.
    Paper beats Rock. Scissors beats Paper. Scissors also happens to beat Rock...until Rock gets 50k+ soulforce at which point Rock becomes an unstoppable killing machine that beats Paper... and would beat Scissors but it can't find Scissors, because Scissors are invisible.
    So Scissors beat Paper and avoids Rock, and that is called BALANCE. -cheze
  • FireWizardEX - Dreamweaver
    FireWizardEX - Dreamweaver Posts: 463 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Nakhimov - Lost City wrote: »
    Many of the skill descriptions on ecatomb are wrong. As well, it's hard to tell what's good and what's not unless you've actually used it.

    And people go demon because of a higher perceived damage output, even with lower refines.

    @FireWizardEX: if your sig is any indication, I'm tempted to believe you sleep with a list of sage skills under your pillow b:surrender

    u are awesome....b:laugh
    Mizuoni - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    FireWizardEX stunned me with demon sr then 1 shot me with sage bt. he iz leet x.x

    b:cute
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Mumintroll - Heavens Tear
    Mumintroll - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,393 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Nakhimov - Lost City wrote: »
    Many of the skill descriptions on ecatomb are wrong. As well, it's hard to tell what's good and what's not unless you've actually used it.

    And people go demon because of a higher perceived damage output, even with lower refines.

    @FireWizardEX: if your sig is any indication, I'm tempted to believe you sleep with a list of sage skills under your pillow b:surrender
    I don't understand why people telling, that demon has bigger damage output. I gave you prove, that is NOT true. But you will still telling your "truth". Give me prove, that demon has bigger damage output.
    Demon has lower channeling time on some spells, but this difference is sooooo low. Only 3spark is -25% channeling for FEW seconds. On another side 5% more on masteries do A LOT of difference in damage output and by the time is even bigger and bigger.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • MagicHamsta - Lost City
    MagicHamsta - Lost City Posts: 10,466 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Nakhimov - Lost City wrote: »
    @FireWizardEX: if your sig is any indication, I'm tempted to believe you sleep with a list of sage skills under your pillow b:surrender

    O.o' lol I wonder if FireWizardEx sleeptalks about sage skills while he sleeps.

    FireWizardEX: "zzz 20% to gain chi zzz on pyrogram
    zzz SS decrease accuracy by 50% zzz
    5% damage increase zzz~"

    xD

    me am surprised a thread on a single skill has gone on for 4 pages. o.o'
    darthpanda16: Firefox crashed on me. Aryannamage: I don't think I am a GM that would be new.
    Hawk:Do this. closing thread
    frankieraye: I'll see if we can replace the woman with a stick figure and the tiger fangs with marshmallows.//Issues like these need to get escalated quickly to minimize the damage.
    Kantorek: Yeah.. you should try it. It's awesome.
    Sihndra: Nope- not currently possible under any circumstances. Sorry.
    LokisDottir: I mean...not haunting the forums, nope nope..
    Konariraiden: You don't know what you are up against. You will lose.
    Waiting for...Hamster Packs!
    58% chance to get tokens
    41% chance to get an all class pet hamster....but they has already been freed by the magic hamster.
    1% chance to get ban hamstered with the message "Hamsters United!"
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • CrazyLazy - Dreamweaver
    CrazyLazy - Dreamweaver Posts: 14 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Nakhimov - Lost City wrote: »
    Many of the skill descriptions on ecatomb are wrong. As well, it's hard to tell what's good and what's not unless you've actually used it.

    And people go demon because of a higher perceived damage output, even with lower refines.

    @FireWizardEX: if your sig is any indication, I'm tempted to believe you sleep with a list of sage skills under your pillow b:surrender

    true some our wrong but basic ones such as pyrogram stone rain gush distance shrink and sandstorm are all correct. And there the ones u spam in pvp mostly. And they become even better once u get holy/demon version of them
    Everytime i Post it is my opinion and my view. I do not claim they are perfect its your choice what you do im just stating my opinion from experience. b:pleased
  • CeliaZ - Sanctuary
    CeliaZ - Sanctuary Posts: 901 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Mumintroll - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    I don't understand why people telling, that demon has bigger damage output. I gave you prove, that is NOT true. But you will still telling your "truth". Give me prove, that demon has bigger damage output.
    Demon has lower channeling time on some spells, but this difference is sooooo low. Only 3spark is -25% channeling for FEW seconds. On another side 5% more on masteries do A LOT of difference in damage output and by the time is even bigger and bigger.

    You know that 1 your prove is not 100% bug-free, and 2 that the things you present as facts really are just opinions. Read this:

    Demon has lower channeling time on some spells, and this difference is sooooo big. 3spark is -25% channeling for 15 seconds. On another side 5% more on masteries do A LOT less difference in damage output and by the time is won't become that much higher.

    This is not my opinion, its just to show you that what you say are just non-argumented opinions and no facts at all.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Mumintroll - Heavens Tear
    Mumintroll - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,393 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    CeliaZ - Sanctuary wrote: »
    You know that 1 your prove is not 100% bug-free, and 2 that the things you present as facts really are just opinions. Read this:

    Demon has lower channeling time on some spells, and this difference is sooooo big. 3spark is -25% channeling for 15 seconds. On another side 5% more on masteries do A LOT less difference in damage output and by the time is won't become that much higher.

    This is not my opinion, its just to show you that what you say are just non-argumented opinions and no facts at all.

    Give me the math. I gave you math. So math is not opinion it is the fact. And also fact is, that sage has more damage output than demon. Especially with end-game gear.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Mizuoni - Dreamweaver
    Mizuoni - Dreamweaver Posts: 3,533 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    CeliaZ - Sanctuary wrote: »
    You know that 1 your prove is not 100% bug-free, and 2 that the things you present as facts really are just opinions. Read this:

    Demon has lower channeling time on some spells, and this difference is sooooo big. 3spark is -25% channeling for 15 seconds. On another side 5% more on masteries do A LOT less difference in damage output and by the time is won't become that much higher.

    This is not my opinion, its just to show you that what you say are just non-argumented opinions and no facts at all.

    [verbal irony] i feel so loved ;-; [/verbal irony]
    Sins are Scissors. Psychics are Rocks.
    Archers, Venos, Barbs, Wizards, BMs, Mystics, Seekers are Paper.
    ...and Clerics are Mushrooms.
    Paper beats Rock. Scissors beats Paper. Scissors also happens to beat Rock...until Rock gets 50k+ soulforce at which point Rock becomes an unstoppable killing machine that beats Paper... and would beat Scissors but it can't find Scissors, because Scissors are invisible.
    So Scissors beat Paper and avoids Rock, and that is called BALANCE. -cheze
  • MagicHamsta - Lost City
    MagicHamsta - Lost City Posts: 10,466 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    b:shocked
    oh noes me sense a mathematics duel!!
    (>.<)
    everyone duck for cover least you be hit by a stray variable!
    DX
    darthpanda16: Firefox crashed on me. Aryannamage: I don't think I am a GM that would be new.
    Hawk:Do this. closing thread
    frankieraye: I'll see if we can replace the woman with a stick figure and the tiger fangs with marshmallows.//Issues like these need to get escalated quickly to minimize the damage.
    Kantorek: Yeah.. you should try it. It's awesome.
    Sihndra: Nope- not currently possible under any circumstances. Sorry.
    LokisDottir: I mean...not haunting the forums, nope nope..
    Konariraiden: You don't know what you are up against. You will lose.
    Waiting for...Hamster Packs!
    58% chance to get tokens
    41% chance to get an all class pet hamster....but they has already been freed by the magic hamster.
    1% chance to get ban hamstered with the message "Hamsters United!"
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • CeliaZ - Sanctuary
    CeliaZ - Sanctuary Posts: 901 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Mumintroll - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    I did this math. I just copy and paste it.
    I'm going sage. why?
    1. Demon barrier gives you 150% def. But from circa 8000def you don't gain very much damage reduction so I think it not worth. And 8000 def you can make with sage 120% barrier quite easily too. Opinion. 'I think it not worth' 'You can make with sage 120% quite easily too' prove?
    2. 5% from masteries is much more, than additional 1200 damage from SS. This will be true, when you will have weapon refined to +7 or more. More attack damage, more sage damage gain.

    Example Weapon. Neon purgatory refined +7 has a max. damage 6900. Now daemon SS has. 300% damage + 6560 earth damage = 27260 (same as sage) now + 1200(demon) =28 460 damage demon.

    Now Sage: SS 6900 + 300% + 6560 = 27260 + 5% =
    28 623 damage. So Sage damage is more about 163 in comparing demon damage.

    Now you have refined same weapon to +12. So demon damage will be 40580 +1200=41780
    Sage damage will be 40580 + 5% = 42609. So sage damage is now 829 more than demon damage.

    Now just hypothetically. With rank 8 weapon refined +12. Has demon maximum damage 51 827. Maximum sage damage is now 53158. So sage damage is 1331 bigger than demon damage.


    Also this difference will grow with more basic damage you will have. 1200 demon damage will never change, BUT 5% of sage damage will grow always. Also This 5 % is for EVERY spell.
    Also I didn't mention another aspect like chi and ultimates.

    You must use demon masteries too and calculate the 1 % double damage. 1/100 of all those demon numbers will be doubled, so the damage % will grow for demon. Difference between sage and demon is lower.
    Mumintroll - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Give me the math. I gave you math. So math is not opinion it is the fact. And also fact is, that sage has more damage output than demon. Especially with end-game gear.

    Check above.
    Mizuoni - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    [verbal irony] i feel so loved ;-; [/verbal irony]

    I dont really know what you mean with thisb:surrender
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Mumintroll - Heavens Tear
    Mumintroll - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,393 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    CeliaZ - Sanctuary wrote: »
    You must use demon masteries too and calculate the 1 % double damage. 1/100 of all those demon numbers will be doubled, so the damage % will grow for demon. Difference between sage and demon is lower.



    Check above.



    I dont really know what you mean with thisb:surrender

    You are right. Somewhere I did math with 1% critical of demon masteries, but unfortunately I cannot find it. Yep the difference is lower. But still is significant. Because If you have more damage around just 800 per hit with SS. 99hits x 800 damage =79200 damage. After 99hits you will gain 79200 more damage with comparable of critical(demon). Critical is 2x damage which is still less than 79200 gained damage.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • MD - Harshlands
    MD - Harshlands Posts: 577 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    .....8x mages are talking here

    Yet I have 18 demon skill books in my bankb:chuckle
  • CeliaZ - Sanctuary
    CeliaZ - Sanctuary Posts: 901 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    MD - Harshlands wrote: »
    .....8x mages are talking here

    Yet I have 18 demon skill books in my bankb:chuckle

    I never gave my opinion about demon/sage in this thread, I only showed Mumin how I believe her calculations were incorrect.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Mumintroll - Heavens Tear
    Mumintroll - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,393 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    MD - Harshlands wrote: »
    .....8x mages are talking here

    Yet I have 18 demon skill books in my bankb:chuckle

    I have 10 sage skill books ready in bank also.b:laugh
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Amour - Lost City
    Amour - Lost City Posts: 1,825 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    MD - Harshlands wrote: »
    .....8x mages are talking here

    Yet I have 18 demon skill books in my bankb:chuckle

    I used to think you were alright, but then I found out you were JeffreyS.
    8x mages > you
    "Amour is better suited to rainbow text, because he is a classy lady." - Nakhimov
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • MagicHamsta - Lost City
    MagicHamsta - Lost City Posts: 10,466 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Amour - Lost City wrote: »
    I used to think you were alright, but then I found out you were JeffreyS.
    8x mages > you

    O.o
    whos JeffreyS?
    darthpanda16: Firefox crashed on me. Aryannamage: I don't think I am a GM that would be new.
    Hawk:Do this. closing thread
    frankieraye: I'll see if we can replace the woman with a stick figure and the tiger fangs with marshmallows.//Issues like these need to get escalated quickly to minimize the damage.
    Kantorek: Yeah.. you should try it. It's awesome.
    Sihndra: Nope- not currently possible under any circumstances. Sorry.
    LokisDottir: I mean...not haunting the forums, nope nope..
    Konariraiden: You don't know what you are up against. You will lose.
    Waiting for...Hamster Packs!
    58% chance to get tokens
    41% chance to get an all class pet hamster....but they has already been freed by the magic hamster.
    1% chance to get ban hamstered with the message "Hamsters United!"
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Nakhimov - Lost City
    Nakhimov - Lost City Posts: 1,829 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    In a single word, LOLTERRIBLE.

    Also his sig makes me die a little inside every time I see it.
    Bladestorm lets you spin around like a carnival ride and do damage. Not using it is almost like having a move called Confetti Rocket Power Leap and saving it for "emergencies"
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Nakhimov the Kingslayer of Kil'Jaeden's <Criminal Scum>
    wowprogress.com/guild/us/kil-jaeden/Criminal+Scum
  • MD - Harshlands
    MD - Harshlands Posts: 577 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Amour - Lost City wrote: »
    I used to think you were alright, but then I found out you were JeffreyS.
    8x mages > you

    yet you might as well transfer your mage into HL and fight me, so I can see how good you are...lol

    a lvl100 mage with fail gears act like something big? what?=p

    JeffreyS was a joke lol, compare to Yoshiki/Shizoko/and bunch of other Cash shop EA back in the days~

    PS. few of ppl from Spectral told me on vent you are no where close to LLama and Elyane lol...
  • MD - Harshlands
    MD - Harshlands Posts: 577 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Amour ROFLROFL

    "FoX" more, Rule34 leader? Fail more....lol
  • Amour - Lost City
    Amour - Lost City Posts: 1,825 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Cool, I can't drop hundred into this game on a whim. Yet I'm still one of the best mages on the server, I wonder how that works.

    Wtf does "FoX" more mean? and whats a Rule34? I don't get it...
    "Amour is better suited to rainbow text, because he is a classy lady." - Nakhimov
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • MD - Harshlands
    MD - Harshlands Posts: 577 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Amour - Lost City wrote: »
    Cool, I can't drop hundred into this game on a whim. Yet I'm still one of the best mages on the server, I wonder how that works.

    Wtf does "FoX" more mean? and whats a Rule34? I don't get it...

    that was your character in HL dumb azz, keep on trying~

    one of the best mage?....hmm where? not even close....just because you keep on using lvl99 skills? My friend told me you took "2" months from 99 to 100?b:shocked

    The only reason you hit hard, lvl100 mage,lvl99 skills duh lol.....but like I said, you are no where close to one of the best. You act so big and randomly flame me just becuz I didnt CS on my EA like other EA did? lol

    PS. I heard my cv wand+9 rock ur HH99><
  • Nakhimov - Lost City
    Nakhimov - Lost City Posts: 1,829 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    MD - Harshlands wrote: »
    that was your character in HL dumb azz, keep on trying~

    one of the best mage?....hmm where? not even close....just because you keep on using lvl99 skills? My friend told me you took "2" months from 99 to 100?b:shocked

    The only reason you hit hard, lvl100 mage,lvl99 skills duh lol.....but like I said, you are no where close to one of the best. You act so big and randomly flame me just becuz I didnt CS on my EA like other EA did? lol

    PS. I heard my cv wand+9 rock ur HH99><

    Actually it was a little closer to a week and a half.

    PS. I heard cashshopping like a little rich kid doesn't rock anything.
    Bladestorm lets you spin around like a carnival ride and do damage. Not using it is almost like having a move called Confetti Rocket Power Leap and saving it for "emergencies"
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Nakhimov the Kingslayer of Kil'Jaeden's <Criminal Scum>
    wowprogress.com/guild/us/kil-jaeden/Criminal+Scum
  • MD - Harshlands
    MD - Harshlands Posts: 577 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Nakhimov - Lost City wrote: »
    Actually it was a little closer to a week and a half.

    PS. I heard cashshopping like a little rich kid doesn't rock anything.

    yet I heard im too op in HL, and you? hmm get 1shot more by GX+12 or CV bow+12.....or "rank 8+12?"~ your full buff defense not even higher than my self buff defense lol....
  • Nakhimov - Lost City
    Nakhimov - Lost City Posts: 1,829 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    MD - Harshlands wrote: »
    yet I heard im too op in HL, and you? hmm get 1shot more by GX+12 or CV bow+12.....or "rank 8+12?"~ your full buff defense not even higher than my self buff defense lol....

    I have a girlfriend and a job. b:cute

    I'm too OP irl.
    Bladestorm lets you spin around like a carnival ride and do damage. Not using it is almost like having a move called Confetti Rocket Power Leap and saving it for "emergencies"
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Nakhimov the Kingslayer of Kil'Jaeden's <Criminal Scum>
    wowprogress.com/guild/us/kil-jaeden/Criminal+Scum
  • MD - Harshlands
    MD - Harshlands Posts: 577 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Nakhimov - Lost City wrote: »
    I have a girlfriend and a job. b:cute

    I'm too OP irl.

    gf, hmm how old? like 12?.....

    job? how much you get every month? like $500?....fail more and try harder
  • Mumintroll - Heavens Tear
    Mumintroll - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,393 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Shut up kids. I'm 34 old have wife and children.b:laughb:laughb:laugh
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

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