Eruption Fist vs Extreme Poison

StormHydra - Sanctuary
StormHydra - Sanctuary Posts: 2,221 Arc User
edited September 2009 in Wizard
Ive read the two descriptions on the skills and eruption fist seems to be alot better.

At lvl 1 eruption fist reduces elemental resistance by 30% and lasts for 4.5sec. Extreme poison increases damage by 20% for only 1.5sec.
Did the new patch nerf extreme poison? or is there something else ive missed.
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Post edited by StormHydra - Sanctuary on

Comments

  • Xegeth - Dreamweaver
    Xegeth - Dreamweaver Posts: 389 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    A reduce of 30% is not the same as 20% more damage. Just try it out, your damage will most likely be a lot better with extreme poison.
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  • Pel - Lost City
    Pel - Lost City Posts: 52 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    The only time I could forsee Eruption fist helping your damage very much is against Robe users, and against them, we're probably trying to use a Blade Tempest, so its not that effective. It comes down to the fact that our magic damage is really high, versus your opponet's magic defense whether human or mob, isn't going to be high enough for that 30% to take enough off to really help.
  • Adroit - Lost City
    Adroit - Lost City Posts: 4,628 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    if u ever get undine (79 skill lower enemy resists 60%) u'll realize that -30% resists doesnt compare to a 20% amp. with -60% resists.. it gives u roughly an extra 30% dmg on heavies.. and robes are even less. Being that rebsists suffer from diminishing returns, you may cut their resists by 60% and only reduce their actual reduction by 10-15%. The amp is just aded damage, so if u were to do 100dmg, then add a 20% amp, you'd do 120 damage. On top of all that, i dont think undine and eruption fist stack.. so u'd be better off with just undine. And the duration will get longer as you level the genie skills and add attributes, so that rly shouldnt make much of a difference
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  • Kristoph - Lost City
    Kristoph - Lost City Posts: 2,016 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Extreme Poison lasts 6 seconds at max. Not 1.5 seconds. And 1 second extra for every 10 dex, so it's easy to get to 10 seconds.
    Wondering how much longer these **** packs are going to be around.
  • Mizuoni - Dreamweaver
    Mizuoni - Dreamweaver Posts: 3,533 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Eruption fist and undine strike stack. Undine is more effective on robes.
    Sins are Scissors. Psychics are Rocks.
    Archers, Venos, Barbs, Wizards, BMs, Mystics, Seekers are Paper.
    ...and Clerics are Mushrooms.
    Paper beats Rock. Scissors beats Paper. Scissors also happens to beat Rock...until Rock gets 50k+ soulforce at which point Rock becomes an unstoppable killing machine that beats Paper... and would beat Scissors but it can't find Scissors, because Scissors are invisible.
    So Scissors beat Paper and avoids Rock, and that is called BALANCE. -cheze
  • Adroit - Lost City
    Adroit - Lost City Posts: 4,628 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Mizuoni - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Undine is more effective on robes.

    no.
    10char
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  • Mizuoni - Dreamweaver
    Mizuoni - Dreamweaver Posts: 3,533 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Lets say a HA has 500 mag res and an AA has 5000 mag res. 60% of 500 is 300 and 60% of 5000 is 3000. the HA would have 200 mag res and the AA would have 2000. A loss of 3000 is more effective than 300. with undine i can 2 shot robes with 5k HP or less without crits. Its not much of a difference on HA
    Sins are Scissors. Psychics are Rocks.
    Archers, Venos, Barbs, Wizards, BMs, Mystics, Seekers are Paper.
    ...and Clerics are Mushrooms.
    Paper beats Rock. Scissors beats Paper. Scissors also happens to beat Rock...until Rock gets 50k+ soulforce at which point Rock becomes an unstoppable killing machine that beats Paper... and would beat Scissors but it can't find Scissors, because Scissors are invisible.
    So Scissors beat Paper and avoids Rock, and that is called BALANCE. -cheze
  • Adroit - Lost City
    Adroit - Lost City Posts: 4,628 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Mizuoni - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Lets say a HA has 500 mag res and an AA has 5000 mag res. 60% of 500 is 300 and 60% of 5000 is 3000. the HA would have 200 mag res and the AA would have 2000. A loss of 3000 is more effective than 300. with undine i can 2 shot robes with 5k HP or less without crits. Its not much of a difference on HA

    when i get home ill get some #'s for u. But u need to realize that it is calculated different than ur saying, and u need to look at % reduced, not the value of mres u have
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  • Kristoph - Lost City
    Kristoph - Lost City Posts: 2,016 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Mizuoni - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Undine is more effective on robes.
    Undine is the same on everyone, roughly. From 2k to 800 would increase your damage by the same % as from 6k to 2.4k.
    Wondering how much longer these **** packs are going to be around.
  • tyrtallow
    tyrtallow Posts: 592 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Undine is the same on everyone, roughly. From 2k to 800 would increase your damage by the same % as from 6k to 2.4k.

    Mdef is diminishing returns, so that wouldn't be right. Still, I've never been able to try it properly (except when I had a level 1 genie and I tried it on Magic Resistant-types. not much effect tho)
    Theoretically, given diminishing returns and mdef vs actual magic reduction values Eruption Fist would probably be better than extreme poison only if you manage to combine it with some other skill that decreases mdef by a lot (like Undine). Not worth going through all that trouble to reduce low mdef, probably viable against people with high mdef (if you don't want to use blade tempest for some reason). Even then, it would require proper setup and timing. Not really sure how this will be in practice.

    With Extreme poison high magic reduction should soak up your extra magic damage, but then there's always blade tempest. (and you can always try to avoid magic resistant mobs).

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