Skills for Eldergoth Sharpshooter

Sallix - Sanctuary
Sallix - Sanctuary Posts: 5 Arc User
edited September 2009 in Venomancer
I have an Eldergoth Sharpshooter for pulling/luring duties and thinking about using him as a debuffing pet when i'm not tanking bosses.

I'd keep his lvl 5 "Bash" he comes with (only level 64 so can't max pet skills yet) and add "Howl" and "Pierce" which would mean one skill slot left after i remove "Roar".

This is where i'm looking for suggestions/opinions, currently looking at one of these four skills:-

Threaten - Less damage to the barb tanking can only be a good thing.
Shrill - To try and help out with cancelling boss AOE's.
Slow - This one I'm thinking of using when luring when i'm on my own, more time to get Herc summoned and rebuffed.
Tough - For running through multiple mobs on a lure or pulling a boss.

I'm open to opinions on other skills as well but don't just name a skill please give a reason to why it would be better then the ones I've named, so what do you guys think would be the best fourth skill?
Post edited by Sallix - Sanctuary on

Comments

  • Alphae - Lost City
    Alphae - Lost City Posts: 1,512 Arc User
    edited August 2009
    I'd say Tough and Threaten are the most viable skills there.

    Shriek is hard to time correctly, if you lag at all you really can't use it effectively, and it has a long cooldown (? going from memory, I could be totally wrong).

    Slow afaik works only on normal mobs and while that's what you're luring a lot of the time, it's too short of a slow (IMO) to make much of a difference... easier to use hood (bosses/elite mobs) or fox form (regular mobs)


    As to which one I'd get, I'd say it depends on what you think you'll do more: luring or debuffing.

    I'd say luring is a one time thing, boss fights are long and bosses need to be debuffed over and over again. This is why I would go for Threaten.
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  • Brael - Dreamweaver
    Brael - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,430 Arc User
    edited August 2009
    I would use something other than the sharpshooter, it's built to be an excellent lure/tank already and you're spreading the skills pretty thin to be putting it on any job like that.

    I would say slow and tough on the eldergoth, and then threaten/howl/shriek on something else for a real debuff pet.
  • tweakz
    tweakz Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2009
    The Eldergoth's survivability is partly because of it's range and being able to avoid short range AoE's. For a Debuff pet ideally I think you'd want something with great hp & phys,mag def like an Armored Bear. There are plenty of skills that aren't range dependent to use on ranged pets. 2 I'm using are Claw and Protect. For just luring, you might want Tough along with at least one aggro skill for leveling.
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  • Sallix - Sanctuary
    Sallix - Sanctuary Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited August 2009
    I'm not a huge fan of levelling pets, so the fewer i can have is an advantage to me, that's why i was thinking of turning the Eldergoth into a dual role pet luring/debuffing.

    The armoured bear is out of me level range so not a viable option yet, as are claw and protect since I don't have the cash lying around to buy them.

    If I was to get another pet for only debuffing, what would be a good choice keeping in mind my level (64) and not really wanting to spend an arm and a leg on a pet and then the money on buying the scolls?

    Also that would mean Eldergoth (only for luring now unles there is another role it can play) then would have Bash, Tough, Slow (maybe) and one other skill, are they're any skills that can be used at range that increase damage?
  • Vitenka - Dreamweaver
    Vitenka - Dreamweaver Posts: 4,125 Arc User
    edited August 2009
    Yeah, using any of its skills during the 'lure' part of its job negates its range advantage. Which is a shame, because I am a big believer in slow. (It's no stun, but it makes the difference between getting hit and not getting hit, on fast mobs)

    But then, using it just to lure, it gets no use out of its skills. So I guess you do have all four slots to play with.

    It's reasonably fast, so to be honest, I'd keep the roar for "Oh heck, the cleric is getting eaten by a wanderer" situations.
    For pure damage, howl is a very nice debuff. Pierce I'm'a'dunno. Sometimes it's good (debuff whilst healing) other times, you want to use ironwood anyway. Maybe replace it, or roar, with an elemental bash? Toxic-mist and lightning are both nice (toxic because it draws extra aggro on the earth mobs YOU are drawing aggro on, lightning because it hurts the ones that resist you the most)
  • tweakz
    tweakz Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2009
    Slow doesn't work on bosses and would be better applied on a debuff lure pet for magic mobs (I use Threaten for phys). The Sharpshooter's range allows you to back up a bit as it is after you send it because it's not going the whole distance to the target (so slow isn't as needed and would negate that benefit).
    For pure damage, howl is a very nice debuff.

    Yes, it made my Eldergoth a great grind pet but I eventually trashed it for non range dependent skills. There are wolves with similar growth charts that come with howl that you could use to try it.
    Pierce I'm'a'dunno.

    At level 89 (if sage) you'll get an Ironwood Scarab that works better, and Barbarians have one that's better yet that you don't want to be overwriting.
    If I was to get another pet for only debuffing, what would be a good choice keeping in mind my level (64) and not really wanting to spend an arm and a leg on a pet and then the money on buying the scolls?

    Lunar Lupin - Howl Level 5 start level 49. - Never had one, but would if I had to do over. My guess is that it would make an excellent grinding pet.
    Also that would mean Eldergoth (only for luring now unles there is another role it can play) then would have Bash, Tough, Slow (maybe) and one other skill, are they're any skills that can be used at range that increase damage?

    Some people don't bother to level the ranged pets for luring because they're so often not hit. The Eldergoth Ranged imho makes the best boss tanker in liu of a Hercules and in some cases is better for that because of it's ability to avoid all melee. They make decent grind pets so I have no problem keeping mine leveled.
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  • Vitenka - Dreamweaver
    Vitenka - Dreamweaver Posts: 4,125 Arc User
    edited August 2009
    tweakz wrote: »
    Slow doesn't work on bosses and would be better applied on a debuff lure pet for magic mobs (I use Threaten for phys). The Sharpshooter's range allows you to back up a bit as it is after you send it because it's not going the whole distance to the target (so slow isn't as needed and would negate that benefit).

    So when am I ever luring bosses? Slow is great for 'increased speed' (and just naturally fast) monsters. Not as good as pounce, but much more likely to land.

    I agree that a ranged pet is a bad choice to put slow on, though.
    tweakz wrote: »
    Yes, it made my Eldergoth a great grind pet but I eventually trashed it for non range dependent skills. There are wolves with similar growth charts that come with howl that you could use to try it.

    Mmm, yes. Wolves with howl are nice. Such as the lunar you mention. Pretty crappy grinding pet, though. Just not tough enough.
    tweakz wrote: »
    Some people don't bother to level the ranged pets for luring because they're so often not hit. The Eldergoth Ranged imho makes the best boss tanker in liu of a Hercules and in some cases is better for that because of it's ability to avoid all melee. They make decent grind pets so I have no problem keeping mine leveled.

    Must say it's a PAIN to level up my eldergoth, it's lagging behind quite a lot. It does hit hard though. That's a nice advantage when grinding it, over other lure pets.

    Is there a ranged pet with better mdef?
  • Solandri - Heavens Tear
    Solandri - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,843 Arc User
    edited August 2009
    Sallix - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Threaten - Less damage to the barb tanking can only be a good thing.
    I should point out that barbs already get a skill which does just this (Frighten). At level 10 it's 30% lower physical attack, lasts 10 sec with a 15 sec cooldown, and it's AOE. Pet Threaten 5 is 36% lower physical attack, lasts 15 sec with a 30 sec cooldown, single target. You kinda have to figure the barb is in the best position to know when/if he needs the damage reduction, and can thus fire it when he needs it. A veno using it on a debuff pet will always be guessing if it's ever needed.

    I need to talk with some high level barbs about this, but unless they have some reason to hate to use Frighten, I'm probably gonna drop Threaten for Roar on my debuff pet. If you use barb Frighten, then the only utility of Threaten is that you can apply it when luring a big bad boss so the first hit the barb takes is reduced. But if that's all you're gonna use it for, then you might as well just put it on a special pet that you only use to lure big bad bosses. There's no reason for it to take up a skill slot on a debuff pet which hangs around the entire duration of the fight.
  • Vitenka - Dreamweaver
    Vitenka - Dreamweaver Posts: 4,125 Arc User
    edited August 2009
    If you don't want to have to level up the sharpshooter and use it as just a luring pet, then "Tough"? Throw that on, then lure.

    It shouldn't be taking any damage anyway, but tough should cut down on the deaths from mistakes (or particularly-awake monsters with a large attack radius)

    Then just... forget about levelling it?
  • QTKyuubi - Sanctuary
    QTKyuubi - Sanctuary Posts: 230 Arc User
    edited September 2009
    Solandri - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    I should point out that barbs already get a skill which does just this (Frighten). At level 10 it's 30% lower physical attack, lasts 10 sec with a 15 sec cooldown, and it's AOE. Pet Threaten 5 is 36% lower physical attack, lasts 15 sec with a 30 sec cooldown, single target. You kinda have to figure the barb is in the best position to know when/if he needs the damage reduction, and can thus fire it when he needs it. A veno using it on a debuff pet will always be guessing if it's ever needed.

    I need to talk with some high level barbs about this, but unless they have some reason to hate to use Frighten, I'm probably gonna drop Threaten for Roar on my debuff pet. If you use barb Frighten, then the only utility of Threaten is that you can apply it when luring a big bad boss so the first hit the barb takes is reduced. But if that's all you're gonna use it for, then you might as well just put it on a special pet that you only use to lure big bad bosses. There's no reason for it to take up a skill slot on a debuff pet which hangs around the entire duration of the fight.

    Definately keep roar, way too handy for saving the squishies. My lvl 1 Roar can pull aggro of lvl 90 squishes if required, though only temporrary to give them time to heal run which ever.

    Threaten though not approriate for assisting barbs could be usefull assisting other tankers, pet or person, that don't have an attack debuff, Not sure i would but on eldergoth b:question but if it's your debuff pet I'd say every bit helps, Howl is also good if you are in a magic crowd, even just for grinding for obvious reasons.
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