facts behind fists bms pvp claims

to start off, duels aren't pvp. it is a pre-arranged fight for fun, with both parties aware the presence of their opponents and be as ready as they can get themselves to. Duels also have a series of rules and agreements, which are well known for all.

Also, duels do not include a range of components which play vital roles in the real pvp. such components include: pots, CHARMS and so on.

there's no denial that fisties are good at duels due to their fast attack speed and high dex, making other people missing them a lot, HOWEVER, that is NOT how you win in a real open pvp. fast attack can't kill off your opponent because it doesn't give you high enough damage to take away the hp during charms ticks. on the other hand, the way to take down your foe is spike damage, which fisties don't have.

as for fisties high dex which gives them an edge in duels, those dex is nothing when the opponent pops an accuracy pot. an axe user with not that high dex can even hit a pure dex archer and not miss all that much with the pot, let alone fisties.

all in all, fists are good in DUELS but not PVP

Wolfgore - Heavens Tear wrote: »

ACTUALLY...fists are very nice in pvp IF you are good enough to play multi-weapon style.
Consider Axe - Fists for starters.
Keep in mind that fists pay off in VERY HIGH refines (+8-9 considered ok)

Its better to ask a high lvl Fist user though, to get the whole picture b:victory

And remember ppl...the class is called BLADE MASTER not AXE MASTER b:laugh

oh ok
so then all blademasters should use swords/blades
not axes, poles, or fists.
got it.

emoretrospective wrote: »

is the fact that fist bms suck at pvp based on anything? cuz im a axe bm and ive had duels with quite a few fist bms and theyre almost as frustratin to fight as archers. i miss over half my hits and ive lost many times so what is the fact that fist bms suck at pvp based on?

you and me both buddy haha,

WRONG! Fist BM's KILL MAGIC USERS. they can cancel magic from mages and can increase attack rate. I am in fact a fist BM, and Duels are a SAFE PvP. i win in both duels and PK, because i'm too quick. Our Dex is amazing on people, and we have the best accuracy, evasion, and crit rate, in fact. Whoever disses the Fist BM about sucking in PvP can go face all the highest BM's in Dreamweaver, for many use fists.

Filet - Heavens Tear wrote: »

how are duels just a safe pvp? NO CHARMS. you're a 73 bm, not high level enough to have other people use misty's against you. mages suck before 90. It's one thing when high level fist bms who've been through actual legit pvp situations give their opinion which i respect, but the opinion of someone who thinks duels are just a "safe" pvp isn't worth much

ok first, do you even use fist? second, do u fight against fist? third, do you enjoy replying against me? lol. and i have had ppl use Misty's against me, but i escaped. always. and charms are not only PvP, its used in pretty much anything. Duels are called safe and fair because it "proves" who's better without the use of beneficial items.

Hathian - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I believe/hope/think he was trying to say that the class is BladeMaster - not really specifying any specific weapon to use, as in, it's not specific to axes.

I could be wrong, and he could just be ignorant, but alas, no way to know.

You r not wrong, thats what i was trying to say...buh...
95% are playing with axes just because they see other BMs playing with axes. Most of them are afraid to try other weps just for fear that they'll be called n00bs, fails etc...All i am trying to say is DONT BE AFRAID TO EXPERIMENT! End game BM is supposed to be MULTI weapon user!

And that was my 2 cents b:bye

emoretrospective wrote: »

is the fact that fist bms suck at pvp based on anything? cuz im a axe bm and ive had duels with quite a few fist bms and theyre almost as frustratin to fight as archers. i miss over half my hits and ive lost many times so what is the fact that fist bms suck at pvp based on?

As a fist/hybrid BM, and through my experience id say fist do not suck in pvp(duels, pk, tw) Fists "CAN" out do other Bm class, "IF" :

1. The player is skilled, is an avid gamer and knows what he is doing
2. The player playing the fist knows his own strs and weaknesses
3. Builds his fist stats correctly
4. Uses the right equips
5. Sportsmanship


First of all fist is not axe, is not not a sword, not a pole and not an archer meaning, fist does not do the role of an axe, of a sword, of pole neither an archer so fists has:

1. Its own unique way of being played(has similarities to other Bm class, of cors fist is a BM after all)
2. Its own role in pve= different role in grinding-grinds best 1v1,boss fighting- Best dpser coz of faster atk rate, and chi accumulation for spark, and support- use casting interrupt skills.
3. Its own role in pvp= duels=keep ur enemy stationary and kill them as fast as u can(meaning get ur dmg high, and speed faster)
Pk= "never"
3.1 head in to a "massive pk fest" if u know u have no one to back u up(well of cors if its 1v1 pk, apply the same rule as in duel),
3.2 if u know u will attract attention,
3.3 if u know ur enemy will kite u towards danger.(dont worry melees wont... usually lol),
3.4 if u know they are in groups and is clustered together.
Must always:
3.1 know when to spark, to stun and to use speed buffs( such as wait when charm ticks or surpise melees when urs ticks surely when dat happens they will be eager to kill u lol)
3.2 target the same enemy the stunner in ur group is atking(if u go in with a squad)
3.3 run when someone dragons, or stuns, or when u are taking heavy dmg or being ganged up(well this is the basic tactics for pking)
TW=
Never
3.1 race to battle first
3.2 face another BM head on(coz what he stuns they attack)
3.3 Follow kiter
Must/should(for pk and TW)
3.1support the axes(make use of their dragon and stun, support the stunners(coz they are the ones to keep ur enemy stationary)
3.2 Act as a second stun,
3.3 Act as Dpser to a Catapult puller,(IF there are no/few enemies are around it)
3.4 kill unwary lone robes, lone LAs ,Lone Melees.
3.5 kite whenever ur being ganged up, or u cant kill ur enemy

Those are some usage of a fist in pve/pvp that i have done, not everytime i get to follow it well no one is perfect, i mess up, i die alot so does anybody in pk/tw. All should know, fist will not replace axe bms, sword bms neither pole bms im just pointing out that fist is useful and does not suck neither pvp nor pve and that all BM paths were made equally not by Dmg,hp,speed,or skills but all have strs and weakness that vary depending on situations, one could be stronger than the other so on so forth and that all have different purpose and usage in every aspects of the game .

Arron - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I agree. for all those who think you CANT EVADE MAGIC, face all the BM's in Dreamweaver and choke on your language.



i agree again, people think other Weapon Users are noobs because you use a different wep. i experimented from axe at 60, now im a Pole Fist Hybrid. in dreamweaver, everyone is even, no matter what weapon. Many of the highest are either fist mains or fist hybrids. UNIQUENESS FTW!!!

Magic never misses. If you're all hybrids then you're all the same there goes your uniqueness oops. Seriously you always talk about how other weapon path bms are arrogant, but all I see you doing is going around shouting how since you're a fist bm from dreamweaver you're super special and unique and you own everybody else. Your stupid ego is just as big as the ego of an ignorant axe bm that believes that fists suck.

Maximus you are absolutely right. Charms are strategy, not a PURE PVP ITEM. and i always get the first attack in on mages, and they miss me often... somehow...

and Filet, you are wrong. i cannot beat BM's higher than me, but thats why Fists ignore them. and you should really shut up before you get outta control. lol

kthxbai

Mothergoose - Sanctuary wrote: »

Oh yeah, nvm that, I suck. I was used to bramble array, wasn't thinking about the other robe classes, lol.b:thanks

robe+low hp+bramble+high dmg vs melee with high hp+high dmg+stun = who wins? robes? U should know, the reason why bramble was given to robes so it would not make bramble the ultimate skill to fight melees(specially fist) since robes have low hp, meaning even if u return dmg to a melee, a bm(a melee class) can still 1,2,or 3.... ok 4 hit kill u, and that would only be like a few dmg return to us, u would say the dmg return is enough to kill us with ur mag attacks, keep mind bms have stun, genies have stun, meaning in those stun time a melee can kill a robe without taking in so much dmg from bramble, imagine barbs having a bramble skill of its own? what would dat mean to fist bms? thats ouch in my vocabulary... (that is why in pk squads i bring in a veno to cleanse them off their buffs)

Filet - Heavens Tear wrote: »

arron you're an idiot. I never said charms were a pure pvp item, I said that they were the main difference between duels and pk. Charms make spike damage a requirement, whereas in dueling all that is needed is good dps. Magic attacks don't miss, how is anybody supposed to believe what you say when you think that you evade magic attacks because you have good evasion? And stop comparing to mages, they're the easiest class to beat below 90 and then 90+ they start owning.

Just leave the convincing to 90+ like EricaPn or people who actually use some evidence and bring logical arguments like Alkaiza. Go hang out with the level 2's that think that magic attack is affected by evasion, at least they have an excuse.

Alright, it didnt seem like it came out like that and im sorry. but level 2's? wtf!? lol. but somehow i avoid it. i dunno. every wizard on me uses pitfall and ****. maybe i avoid the effects... sorry if i have been a pain

emoretrospective wrote: »

is the fact that fist bms suck at pvp based on anything? cuz im a axe bm and ive had duels with quite a few fist bms and theyre almost as frustratin to fight as archers. i miss over half my hits and ive lost many times so what is the fact that fist bms suck at pvp based on?

I believe that these claims are valid and based on general findings, but the problem in this discussion is evidence. So far the only thing fist BMs have shown this forum is how bad they are at supporting their arguments; I have read a lot of words--not videos, or screencaps--from people saying that fist users can do well in pvp.

What I'm looking for is evidence showing that fist users CAN pvp (not duel) effectively, not evidence proving that they cannot. Showing that fist users cannot pvp is pointless in my opinion, but I think showing that they can pvp as effectively as other weapons in the same situations is valuable. So far fist users have shown that they can talk a lot and not actually compare weapons.

Walls of text only convince other people to ignore you. b:bye

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver wrote: »

i think i need to post that screenie of me 2 shotting him in a duel

LMFAO!!! DONT U DARE!!! xD but that was like ages ago before i became poles xD

Voices - Lost City wrote: »

I believe that these claims are valid and based on general findings, but the problem in this discussion is evidence. So far the only thing fist BMs have shown this forum is how bad they are at supporting their arguments; I have read a lot of words--not videos, or screencaps--from people saying that fist users can do well in pvp.

Yes their findings and experience are considered valid, and i myself put them into consideration, but still even those who are pros and high lvls still has the chance of making a mistake such as saying the claims that fists "sucks" or is "useless" that is why i joined this argument(in general not only this thread) to challenge their findings, and show me with their experience and facts on how they came up with the conclusion that fist is useless or weak im not saying i know better, but still i do know some, and if our opinions and facts differ that is when we challenge to see if the claims that fist is useless is true or not . So far all this forums can really give is words , videos are rare(but there are some) and screen caps can be edited to make it look like fist or any other weapon class is being useful or better. SO far im trying to post facts based on my experience as fister and as a hybrid on how a fist interacts in all aspects of the game and so far all ive heard is dat im a noob, a low lvl and has no right to make an opinion and challenge the high lvls.

Voices - Lost City wrote: »

What I'm looking for is evidence showing that fist users CAN pvp (not duel) effectively, not evidence proving that they cannot. Showing that fist users cannot pvp is pointless in my opinion, but I think showing that they can pvp as effectively as other weapons in the same situations is valuable. So far fist users have shown that they can talk a lot and not actually compare weapons.

Ive posted one way of fists being useful (not better than any one) in pve and pvp and i think Showing fist users are useless in pvp, is not pointless in my opinion, for this is the start of this argument, if they say fist is useless, they should show facts and evidence based on their experience and i would challenge them so we would find out if they really do know anything about fist and find out if their claims is true besides by them saying fist is useless gives us fist opportunities to prove them wrong and show them how fist can be made useful by answering their claims.

Comparing who is better wont prove who is useful and who is not, i believe usefulness of every BM weapon vary depending on situations. Like i said in my post, in PvE an axe would be more useful in against group and clusters of mobs, while fist can be better Dpser when it comes to bosses. ANd so on so forth.

Voices - Lost City wrote: »

Walls of text only convince other people to ignore you. b:bye

This forum is like a cage where we are locked in so How do dogs show they are tough? they bark a lot ...

Arron - Dreamweaver wrote: »

LMFAO!!! DONT U DARE!!! xD but that was like ages ago before i became poles xD

i need to post that snapshot of me two shotting him as a pole BM

you remember? in Dreamweaver Port