Dex build Axe BM
Saffon - Dreamweaver
Posts: 20 Arc User
Reading other posts and this just hit me...
If I build my BM with 5 str 5 dex per 2 level, I can probably use an Axe a few levels below me right?
With that kind of Dex, my hit rate would be same as most sword BMs. Even though my hit speed is still slow because of the Axe, but I miss less.
My dodge rate would be similar.
My damage will be lower since I am not using Axe my level, but I miss less and crit more.
Does that sound like a viable option?
If I build my BM with 5 str 5 dex per 2 level, I can probably use an Axe a few levels below me right?
With that kind of Dex, my hit rate would be same as most sword BMs. Even though my hit speed is still slow because of the Axe, but I miss less.
My dodge rate would be similar.
My damage will be lower since I am not using Axe my level, but I miss less and crit more.
Does that sound like a viable option?
Post edited by Saffon - Dreamweaver on
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Comments
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what without any vit? hmm anyone knows how much hp we get per lev? and per vit point?0
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Thank you.
That answered my question.
Really.
I think BM get 15 per vit point, but Axe BMs need vit to tank. AoE with no vit is suicidal.
Thanks for the help. b:laughb:laughb:laugh0 -
This build would probably give you the best crit at endgame making you very powerful but the problem is you probably cant make end game because the low hp will kill you later and 5 str per 2 lvls is 1 stat too low but man think about all the crit you will have b:pleased0
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My build has been 6str/4dex (with 5dex at 91 cause TT90 legendary axes are end game for me) And hp is rarely an issue for me. It'd be nice for TW, but I do fine with 3 base vit.
And BM's get 30 hp per lvl and 15 per vit. refining and sharding gear will give you a significant amount of hp as well.0 -
Saffon - Dreamweaver wrote: »Reading other posts and this just hit me...
If I build my BM with 5 str 5 dex per 2 level, I can probably use an Axe a few levels below me right?
With that kind of Dex, my hit rate would be same as most sword BMs. Even though my hit speed is still slow because of the Axe, but I miss less.
My dodge rate would be similar.
My damage will be lower since I am not using Axe my level, but I miss less and crit more.
Does that sound like a viable option?
I'm actually doing that for now. I have the TT70 fists and TT70 sword but TT60 axes.
The dps form sword and fists are higher than axes under this situation.
However, Ihave fists mastery on level 10 and the other two on level 9.0 -
I am not sure why you would not do a 6/4 build and carry the latest axes. Your gimping yourself unless your main weapon is something other than axes.
with a 6/4 your stating yourself to use any of the weapon paths, your evasion and crits are going to be strong, and you truly can master all the weapons available to a BM.
But!! if your planning on pole or sword to be your main weapon of choice and just want the axes for aoes later on....that build is fine. I am a firm believer in a little VIT along the way, but that is your call, if you find a way to manage sutra,pots,maybe a charm to keep yourself alive, then that works too.
And BM's get a base 30hp per level and 15hp per VIT attribute point...I believe someone asked that, instead of actually answering the OP's questionDon't let my level confuse you. I've done this before.
Leader-Vandals-Heavens Tear0 -
2 words. Get GS :P. GS > TT90KhaosShadow - Sanctuary wrote: »My build has been 6str/4dex (with 5dex at 91 cause TT90 legendary axes are end game for me) And hp is rarely an issue for me. It'd be nice for TW, but I do fine with 3 base vit.
And BM's get 30 hp per lvl and 15 per vit. refining and sharding gear will give you a significant amount of hp as well.
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I capped my vit at 30 (LOL!?!?), and have str for axes of my level, with the rest dex. I've only got 4k HP though, which is extremely low for my level. I do fine in AoE/PvP for the most part, but TW I am sort of gimped.
The accuracy and especially dodge is nice, but the more dex you have, the better you are versus physical classes, and worse versus magic classes (since they dso so much dmg, you need HP to even live long enough to hit them)0 -
KhaosShadow - Sanctuary wrote: »My build has been 6str/4dex (with 5dex at 91 cause TT90 legendary axes are end game for me) And hp is rarely an issue for me. It'd be nice for TW, but I do fine with 3 base vit.
And BM's get 30 hp per lvl and 15 per vit. refining and sharding gear will give you a significant amount of hp as well.
Well this build will probably be a good thing to follow after you cap your vit which is around 60 or 80 depending if you want to be more of a tank0 -
ummm, what are GS? there are so many short hands for this game that full words are rarely used and keeping everything separate gets rather confusing.
And I did follow my build after capping my vit, at 3 =P.
Vit is highly overrated for most aspects of this game. I've never had an issue in pve. Things I can't tank a barb is needed for and a BM with high vit still doesn't have the hp to tank them. I'm not on a pk server and don't have to worry about randomly getting pk'ed so I dont need vit for that reason. And in TW's I have enough hp to live threw quite a bit. by the time they manage to kill me and vit BM would probably live 2-3 seconds longer making no significant difference at all.
Personally I think people should just build there character how they want. If you don't play to your playstyle you're gonna get bored and quit probably.0 -
KhaosShadow - Sanctuary wrote: »ummm, what are GS? there are so many short hands for this game that full words are rarely used and keeping everything separate gets rather confusing.
And I did follow my build after capping my vit, at 3 =P.
Vit is highly overrated for most aspects of this game. I've never had an issue in pve. Things I can't tank a barb is needed for and a BM with high vit still doesn't have the hp to tank them. I'm not on a pk server and don't have to worry about randomly getting pk'ed so I dont need vit for that reason. And in TW's I have enough hp to live threw quite a bit. by the time they manage to kill me and vit BM would probably live 2-3 seconds longer making no significant difference at all.
Personally I think people should just build there character how they want. If you don't play to your playstyle you're gonna get bored and quit probably.
The only problem I have with vit on 3 is that elite mobs can one shoot me if I make mistakes and magic classes can too as I have low magic defence too.
I have vit on 3 too. When I fight magic mobs, I block all their attacks prior me killing them. The issue is if I fight an elite magic mob and I failed blocking those attacks.
However, with magic mobs at my level, my charm saves me even when I failed to block all the mag attacs, the only issue is if they gang on me.
Vit on 3 gives me a lot of flexibility statwise for dex and str. I noticed, I can have all the latest BM weapons any time if I chosse to. Since, I will have enough dex or str for any weapon.0 -
KhaosShadow - Sanctuary wrote: »ummm, what are GS? there are so many short hands for this game that full words are rarely used and keeping everything separate gets rather confusing.
And I did follow my build after capping my vit, at 3 =P.
Vit is highly overrated for most aspects of this game. I've never had an issue in pve. Things I can't tank a barb is needed for and a BM with high vit still doesn't have the hp to tank them. I'm not on a pk server and don't have to worry about randomly getting pk'ed so I dont need vit for that reason. And in TW's I have enough hp to live threw quite a bit. by the time they manage to kill me and vit BM would probably live 2-3 seconds longer making no significant difference at all.
Personally I think people should just build there character how they want. If you don't play to your playstyle you're gonna get bored and quit probably.
im agree with u im a fist bm and my build is 5 strg 5 dex and i do just fine i need some life powder but with sutra i dont need nothing more, i like the item who give u 50 mp per second because is like i have infinite mana b:laugh (and i dont use charm i never need it)0 -
Where is the Lost City troll to LOL @ the 3 vit BM builds b:chuckle0
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Forget Dex.. Just pump Vit and get Misty Forests.. Lol. Zerk Axes will make up for the Crit you lose.
Then Refine your weapon big time to make up for the STR you missed out on.BM PvP Guide: pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1320761
YouTube channels: youtube.com/TheDan912 and youtube.com/TheDanPWI0 -
Forget Dex.. Just pump Vit and get Misty Forests.. Lol. Zerk Axes will make up for the Crit you lose.
Then Refine your weapon big time to make up for the STR you missed out on.
"Don't you think Zerk Axes + Crit will be much better?" was what I was thinking when I wrote OP.
But looking at the stat requirement of 282 Str at level 99, my build will not reach that. I will have 255 Str I believe (at lvl 100). And that kind of gap is not exactly easy to close.
But since there are Zerk 1-hand blade, that will do it. I know the weapon damage may not be comparable, but hit more often = crit more often. I have my mind set on 1-handed blade now.
Though constant AoE critting with Axes sound pretty awesome too, as each hit may result in 5-6 crits when your are AoE grinding... but the thought of doing that with 5 base Vit scares me b:shockedb:shockedb:shocked0 -
DishyWiggles - Harshlands wrote: »2 words. Get GS :P. GS > TT90
GS? GX you mean? and HH90 Gold is GX @_@;"you want 1by1 go play tekken la"0 -
Damn, an axe user with 6 STR | 4 DEX build...would be pretty cool to see them dish it out! Risky, but very cool!0
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While using a weapon like Single Blade with Berserker, requires something like Triple Spark+Crit+Berserker or Triple Spark+Berserker to kill, Axes have a much superior damage and it only requires Beserker alone or Triple Spark+Berserker to kill.
The damage itself makes up for the criticals, reason why most high level Axe users choose to go with VIT build instead of DEX.0 -
GS is... idk the actual name. Its the lvl90 version of Calamity Axes. Nuff said :PKhaosShadow - Sanctuary wrote: »ummm, what are GS? there are so many short hands for this game that full words are rarely used and keeping everything separate gets rather confusing.
EDIT: HAHAHA posted @ 4:20 :PPPP0 -
DishyWiggles - Harshlands wrote: »GS is... idk the actual name. Its the lvl90 version of Calamity Axes. Nuff said :P
EDIT: HAHAHA posted @ 4:20 :PPPP
so you mean GX, not GS, like someone said. Which are TT90 legendary duel axes...which is what I said and you said GX are better =3
Having low vit can make things harder. But you don't NEED vit for anything. My opinion would probably be different if I was on a pvp server, but then if I was on a pvp server then I probably wouldn't use axes because I think fists are more fun =P0 -
Saffon - Dreamweaver wrote: »"Don't you think Zerk Axes + Crit will be much better?" was what I was thinking when I wrote OP.
But looking at the stat requirement of 282 Str at level 99, my build will not reach that. I will have 255 Str I believe (at lvl 100). And that kind of gap is not exactly easy to close.
But since there are Zerk 1-hand blade, that will do it. I know the weapon damage may not be comparable, but hit more often = crit more often. I have my mind set on 1-handed blade now.
Though constant AoE critting with Axes sound pretty awesome too, as each hit may result in 5-6 crits when your are AoE grinding... but the thought of doing that with 5 base Vit scares me b:shockedb:shockedb:shocked
The damage is definately comparable with the GX on the HH90gold FireLotus, don't let anybody tell you otherwise. They are simply Ignorant. Of course the Max ddamage on the GX will be a little higher, but blade's are the worst weapon out of the whole path to begin with. Keep that in mind, so they own. ^^
With that being said,
ಥ_ಥ Lyndura0 -
Maddrox, I have a few questions for you...
1) Firelotus requires Mold: Dragon blade to make, but will only decompose into Mirage Celestones...
If you use the Mold: Dragon blade to make the Devilblade instead. According to database that has a chance to decompose into Souledge: Devilblade, which you can make the Mirage Scimitar with the Berserk (NOT Berserker) effect.
Wouldn't that be better?
What I mean is, making Firelotus with Mold: Dragon blade seems to be a waste when you can ultimately get Mirage Scimitar from it and making Firelotus is going down a 1-way street.
Also, since Berserk last a while, but Berserker is totally random. With Berserk, you can wait til Berserk is activated before you use a Myriad sword dance making sure the damage IS increased. Not like with Berserker, you will have to hope it activates when you cast Myriad sword dance.
2) Even though I have my mind set for 1-hand blade, I want to see what you think of this...
I still do 5 Str 5 dex per 2 lvl, but I'll cap my Str at 212...
So I can use 2 weapon:
Mirage Scimitar
Calamity Axes of Blood
In that case I will get skills from both paths so I will have some AoE skills at my disposal when needed. And since Calamity Axes of Blood has Berserker effect, I can also do Berserker+Crit AoEs even though it will be weaker than the Pure-Axe BM version because it is only a lvl 70 weapon, but my chance of Berseker+Crit will be higher because of my dex. If I wait til Berserk (NOT Berserker) activates, then switch to Axe and do the AoEs, I might be able to make up for the damage loss? Or if Berserk & Berserker stack, then OMG.
So, if I went 5 Str per 2 lvl, I should have 255 at lvl 100. After I cap at 212, the remainder will either go into vit to get about 40 vit for better survival, or I could dump them all into dex for even better acc/eva/crit.
You think this will work? What would you do with the spare points? Into vit? Or dex?
Thanks in advance for sharing b:thanksb:thanksb:thanks0 -
What would really be ownage if someone used mirage scimitar and waited for berserk, and then switched to firelotus and did a berserk berserker crit xD0
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What would really be ownage if someone used mirage scimitar and waited for berserk, and then switched to firelotus and did a berserk berserker crit xD
That's what I was thinking... but with Calamity Axe you can do AoE. Since each hit in the AoE has a chance to Crit, you will be looking at a 50% (yoru crit chance as a high dex BM) chance to Berserk+Berserker+Crit anyone in the AoE.
But since I am a n00b, I'll am not sure if this is too good to be true.
I am looking forward to what Maddrox would say b:laugh0 -
Maddrox - Harshlands wrote: »The damage is definately comparable with the GX on the HH90gold FireLotus, don't let anybody tell you otherwise. They are simply Ignorant. Of course the Max ddamage on the GX will be a little higher, but blade's are the worst weapon out of the whole path to begin with. Keep that in mind, so they own. ^^
With that being said,
ಥ_ಥ Lyndura
My in-game experience has not borne this out. Sycke completely destroys me (+5 gx iirc) while szaku_cy is a joke and can't kill me (+7 firelotus). Assuming base stat point distribution is the same (for simplicities sake), I think the DoT might be the same, but spike dmg would be different:
gx: 582-1358 (.83/sec) dps - 805.1
lotus: 494 - 918 (1.11/sec) dps: 783.66
This might as well be identical overall, but there are other things to consider... I will need to hit more with the lotus, so I have to repair it more. I can't aoe that well. Also, in hitting more, I proc more, losing more life and burning more heiro.
With different stat distribution, say a vit build axe and a dex sword, the lotus' dmg per HIT would go down compared to the gx, but accuracy may be an issue at that point. And the evasion a BM receives is very good... I would say sword BM's would be better at fighting other BM's/WB perhaps, but the spike dmg is over 400 different between the weapons (800 with crit, 1600 with crit/zerk, 3200 if you count dragon/zerk/crit) so they aren't as good PvP.
This is my napkin math, of course, I'd be happy to look over any math you have on the subject I'm definitely open to discuss this, I'm just posting my current beliefs on the subject. 0 -
My in-game experience has not borne this out. Sycke completely destroys me (+5 gx iirc) while szaku_cy is a joke and can't kill me (+7 firelotus). Assuming base stat point distribution is the same (for simplicities sake), I think the DoT might be the same, but spike dmg would be different:
gx: 582-1358 (.83/sec) dps - 805.1
lotus: 494 - 918 (1.11/sec) dps: 783.66
This might as well be identical overall, but there are other things to consider... I will need to hit more with the lotus, so I have to repair it more. I can't aoe that well. Also, in hitting more, I proc more, losing more life and burning more heiro.
With different stat distribution, say a vit build axe and a dex sword, the lotus' dmg per HIT would go down compared to the gx, but accuracy may be an issue at that point. And the evasion a BM receives is very good... I would say sword BM's would be better at fighting other BM's/WB perhaps, but the spike dmg is over 400 different between the weapons (800 with crit, 1600 with crit/zerk, 3200 if you count dragon/zerk/crit) so they aren't as good PvP.
This is my napkin math, of course, I'd be happy to look over any math you have on the subject I'm definitely open to discuss this, I'm just posting my current beliefs on the subject.
Before any thing else, let me thank you b:thanks
Whether the numbers are right or not, I liked your un-biased, experience-based feedback. Those help me a lot as I am such a damn n00b with little game experience and no PvP experience. I am working hard to level, but it just doesn't happen overnight
Anywho, is there a skill simulator somewhere that we can just plug the numbers in and see?
On one hand I tend to believe that Axe do higher damage, like you have explained.
On the other, I tend to believe a 'miss' does 0 damage which is why I want to be high dex.
Maddrox, where are you when you were needed? b:laughb:laughb:laugh0 -
Saffon - Dreamweaver wrote: »Before any thing else, let me thank you b:thanks
Whether the numbers are right or not, I liked your un-biased, experience-based feedback. Those help me a lot as I am such a damn n00b with little game experience and no PvP experience. I am working hard to level, but it just doesn't happen overnight
Anywho, is there a skill simulator somewhere that we can just plug the numbers in and see?
On one hand I tend to believe that Axe do higher damage, like you have explained.
On the other, I tend to believe a 'miss' does 0 damage which is why I want to be high dex.
Maddrox, where are you when you were needed? b:laughb:laughb:laugh
You can be high DEX using Axes too, or use accuracy rings.
The problem is that regardless of what weapon you use, there is always a 10% chance to miss even if your opponent has just 100 evasion.0 -
Saffron~
I agree with the accuracy thing, but a couple things to consider...
1.) I am a 'dex axe' in the purest sense of the word... I have 30 vit and 160 dex, the rest str. I can use almost any BM weapon, and I hope by 90 to have enough dex for 90 fists. My accuracy would most likely be as high as a sword BM.
2.) Misty rings are +50% accuracy, HH90 gold ring +30% accuracy... and there are other accuracy modifiers and powders, etc. Finally, accuracy and evasion are (unlike modifiers to dmg from strength) logrithmic, much like the modifiers to defence. ie. 10k phys def doesn't stop twice as much dmg as 5x phys def. HOWEVER~ aoe'ing with low accuracy means you're going to take a lot more hits. I very much appreciate having high accuracy while I aoe, I actually kill the mobs faster than most BM's overall, saving mana.
3.) DPS is better for grinding, spike damage for PvP.
I am very torn on the issue of dex on BM's... I think there's a good tipping point somewhere. I think BM's with 50 dex gimp themselves overmuch, whle BM's with 200 dex probably have too much. But I need to run more tests to understand the actual accuracy/evasion formula.
[edit]Lyndura - Lost City wrote: »You can be high DEX using Axes too, or use accuracy rings.
The problem is that regardless of what weapon you use, there is always a 10% chance to miss even if your opponent has just 100 evasion.
Protip! I didn't know that. Now I see why archers complain a lot lol.0 -
.The problem is that regardless of what weapon you use, there is always a 10% chance to miss even if your opponent has just 100 evasion
That truly sucks. b:cryb:cryb:cryYou can be high DEX using Axes too, or use accuracy rings
That's what I was thinking, Lyndura. A few post back I have outlined a build I have in mind:Maddrox, I have a few questions for you...
1) Firelotus requires Mold: Dragon blade to make, but will only decompose into Mirage Celestones...
If you use the Mold: Dragon blade to make the Devilblade instead. According to database that has a chance to decompose into Souledge: Devilblade, which you can make the Mirage Scimitar with the Berserk (NOT Berserker) effect.
Wouldn't that be better?
What I mean is, making Firelotus with Mold: Dragon blade seems to be a waste when you can ultimately get Mirage Scimitar from it and making Firelotus is going down a 1-way street.
Also, since Berserk last a while, but Berserker is totally random. With Berserk, you can wait til Berserk is activated before you use a Myriad sword dance making sure the damage IS increased. Not like with Berserker, you will have to hope it activates when you cast Myriad sword dance.
2) Even though I have my mind set for 1-hand blade, I want to see what you think of this...
I still do 5 Str 5 dex per 2 lvl, but I'll cap my Str at 212...
So I can use 2 weapon:
Mirage Scimitar
Calamity Axes of Blood
In that case I will get skills from both paths so I will have some AoE skills at my disposal when needed. And since Calamity Axes of Blood has Berserker effect, I can also do Berserker+Crit AoEs even though it will be weaker than the Pure-Axe BM version because it is only a lvl 70 weapon, but my chance of Berseker+Crit will be higher because of my dex. If I wait til Berserk (NOT Berserker) activates, then switch to Axe and do the AoEs, I might be able to make up for the damage loss? Or if Berserk & Berserker stack, then OMG.
So, if I went 5 Str per 2 lvl, I should have 255 at lvl 100. After I cap at 212, the remainder will either go into vit to get about 40 vit for better survival, or I could dump them all into dex for even better acc/eva/crit.
You think this will work? What would you do with the spare points? Into vit? Or dex?
Thanks in advance for sharing
As much as you may hate this, mind letting me know what you think, Lyndura?
What I was thinking is, Calamity Axe is the lowest axe that has Berserker effect. If I put barely enough strength to use those, all the rest into Dex (maybe some vit to survive), that would max out my chance for getting a Berserker+Crit. Or if Berserk (from Mirage Scimitar) stacks with Berzerk, then I can have a Berserk+Berserker+Crit, hopefully activated on top of a AoE skill.
Well, even if they don't. Or as other said Mirage Scimitar is soooooo hard to get that it is 'irrelevant' (don't ask me why)... More crit chance = easier to trigger Berserker+Crit, right?
What I propose for a Dex build Axe BM is actually NOT getting the Str to use the most up to date Axe, but rather max Dex to maximize Crit chance.
My main weapon will still be a 1-hand blade, will only switch to Axe after Berserk kicks in and do the AoEs. Hope this makes sense.0 -
Saffon - Dreamweaver wrote: »As much as you may hate this, mind letting me know what you think, Lyndura?
What I was thinking is, Calamity Axe is the lowest axe that has Berserker effect. If I put barely enough strength to use those, all the rest into Dex (maybe some vit to survive), that would max out my chance for getting a Berserker+Crit. Or if Berserk (from Mirage Scimitar) stacks with Berzerk, then I can have a Berserk+Berserker+Crit, hopefully activated on top of a AoE skill.
Well, even if they don't. Or as other said Mirage Scimitar is soooooo hard to get that it is 'irrelevant' (don't ask me why)... More crit chance = easier to trigger Berserker+Crit, right?
What I propose for a Dex build Axe BM is actually NOT getting the Str to use the most up to date Axe, but rather max Dex to maximize Crit chance.
My main weapon will still be a 1-hand blade, will only switch to Axe after Berserk kicks in and do the AoEs. Hope this makes sense.
Well...where to start?
You're talking about two main weapons, Mirage Scimitar and Calamity Axes of Blood (XS). The first problem I find is the big level difference between both weapons, first one is level 99 while the other is level 70.
Meaning you won't be able to use that combo until level 99, and leaves the question open to: What will you use before that?, also, level 99 is something pretty far for someone who is still low level.
As you said, your build will be based on having enough STR to use XS which is 212, the problem now is that you're talking about using this combo at level 99, which means you will be using higher grade armors and level 90 ones need 227 STR to be used, while level 99 armors need 250 STR. That means you will be forced to have higher STR.
The second problem is that using Calamity Axes of Blood at level 99 is a joke, they won't be dealing any good damage, even if you Crit+Berserker. The damage without Crit+Berserker will be just something to laugh at.
Even if you use Mirage Scimitar's effect, getting double physical attack (yes, it is NOT double damage) for the price of getting a lot more damage from opponents (50% more) will just increase your chances to get killed much faster (specially running a low VIT build).
So I would suggest you to keep leveling up (using a "normal" build) and find out how the game really is, so you can consider what your build/weapon will be at level 99 (which is a long way and most people won't even make it to level 99).0
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