Fist Fighter -- need help

ky1e
ky1e Posts: 0 Arc User
edited May 2009 in Blademaster
hey im looking to make a fist fighter, i think there rare, and looks fun

if any one has any infomation on them, plz plz do share =]]]


what should i put stats 2? whats skills should i avoid,,... ect
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

ky1e
winged elf archer
pvp pwnge
Post edited by ky1e on

Comments

  • Eirel - Sanctuary
    Eirel - Sanctuary Posts: 15 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    My first advice is to ignore any forum "advice" from someone who's never played a fist/claw bm past level 20. That should honestly go for any class/path, but it needs to be stated here....for various reasons.

    Stat wise:
    2 str, 3 dex is the build I go with. Throw in ocasional vit when you feel it's necessary, but not too much. This will give you enough Strength and Dexterity to wear heavy armor, and equip whatever weapon you chose (fists or claws).

    So far, this has worked for me...however, it's not a guarentee. Due to the rarity of high level fist BMs, there's not really anything concrete on the "correct" build for fist/claw BM. Feel free to mess with your stats as you deem necessary - the only certian thing is that you should have enough STR and DEX to equip your weapon and armor.

    Skills:
    From the look of your signature, you probably play either on a PvP server or PK a lot. I can't really tell you what to do with that, however, I highly, highly recommend getting Aoelian Blade up as fast you can - it's an amazing opener. Other skills to watch: Diamond Sutra, and Alter Marrows. Everything else I don't worry too much about - basic attacks are faster then skills, and by the time I could get a skill off, the mob's more than likely dead.

    Other than that...I just got into my path skills, so I'm not entirely sure what works and what doesn't.

    Everything else:
    Be prepared to stand up for yourself. I've had guild members who've been literally booted from parties - even at low level - for the sole reason of being a fist BM. If you read through the forums, most people will tell you to take up another path, as you're absolutely useless. If you want to do it, don't let anyone else tell you not to - that's your choice to make, not theirs.
    Proud member of the "Fist/Claw Cult" :p
  • Lumies - Lost City
    Lumies - Lost City Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    I agree with her build, thats a really good and basic Build, and yes fist/claw masters are rare on the higher levels since { I have seen}, low level claw users just give up on claws and go a different path, but yeah don't let anybody push you around! also your Shadowless kick is a godly skill to block casting, its really helpful against Pvp and some magic Mobs Also, is there a Claw Cult? { read your signature Eirel} XD
    b:beatup
  • Granrey - Sanctuary
    Granrey - Sanctuary Posts: 2,050 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    Only add STR to meet HA requirements only.

    Get any skills you want, but these I recomend at least level 1:

    Shadowless kick*
    Leap back*

    These two skills will allow you to cancell magic mobs attacks. Use leap back to aproach the mob, it will cancell first mag attack. then use shadowless kick to cancell the 2nd attack.

    Max ultra marrow physical.
  • Eirel - Sanctuary
    Eirel - Sanctuary Posts: 15 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    Granrey - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Welcome to the "Fist Cult". We are made of bunch of BM's that think that we can own by using fists more by faith than by any prove b:laugh.

    ^ I liked the idea
    Proud member of the "Fist/Claw Cult" :p
  • Fleuri - Sanctuary
    Fleuri - Sanctuary Posts: 1,763 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    I do not like talking about PvP subjects. (I have never entered pk mode and do not plan on ever doing so, but I have found myself fighting in PvP rather frequently and I want to retain my few miserable advantages while I can.)

    However, if anyone on Sanctuary levels up a fist blademaster, and wants to join Outlaw, please talk with me. (Currently, we want level 70+ recruits, but this may change and so will your level.)

    Also, if you get stuck on cultivation quests, or whatever, we can help (maybe not right then, but with a little planning we can probably put something together for you within a few days -- and if you can bring lots of friends also needing your quest please do -- our time in helping you mostly winds up being flight time and "waiting for people" time and if we can help lots of people for a small investment of our time we would prefer to do so). [However, you quite possibly do not need us -- if you spend time near your quest monster for a few hours you can often find another party with helpful people and/or not quite full squads. And we have a lot of good and friendly people on this server.]
  • Granrey - Sanctuary
    Granrey - Sanctuary Posts: 2,050 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    Fleuri - Sanctuary wrote: »
    I do not like talking about PvP subjects. (I have never entered pk mode and do not plan on ever doing so, but I have found myself fighting in PvP rather frequently and I want to retain my few miserable advantages while I can.)

    However, if anyone on Sanctuary levels up a fist blademaster, and wants to join Outlaw, please talk with me. (Currently, we want level 70+ recruits, but this may change and so will your level.)

    Also, if you get stuck on cultivation quests, or whatever, we can help (maybe not right then, but with a little planning we can probably put something together for you within a few days -- and if you can bring lots of friends also needing your quest please do -- our time in helping you mostly winds up being flight time and "waiting for people" time and if we can help lots of people for a small investment of our time we would prefer to do so). [However, you quite possibly do not need us -- if you spend time near your quest monster for a few hours you can often find another party with helpful people and/or not quite full squads. And we have a lot of good and friendly people on this server.]

    Sorry, not trying to be offensive here but:

    are you implying fists BM's need more help than others?b:chuckle

    Or that you are recruiting BM fists because they are not acepted in any other guild?b:chuckle

    or are you simply recruiting?b:laugh
  • Nayiro - Sanctuary
    Nayiro - Sanctuary Posts: 1,275 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    I'm a fist BM :D

    Alright for your build cap vit at 40, 3 str 2 dex every level.

    Get as many +str equips as you can so you can use axes later, because you will have a hell of a time grinding with out them, if you don't care about grinding then get minimum dex for wep, and minimum str for heavy armor then the rest into vit

    As for skills you will only need 2 fists skills:
    Shadowless kick (lvl 1)
    Cyclone heel (max)
    Eirel wrote:

    Due to the rarity of high level fist BMs, there's not really anything concrete on the "correct" build for fist/claw BM.

    So am I not high level? D:
    Back.
  • Eirel - Sanctuary
    Eirel - Sanctuary Posts: 15 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    Nayiro - Sanctuary wrote: »
    So am I not high level? D:

    I said they were rare, not non-existant :)

    Thanks for the skill advice though ^^
    Proud member of the "Fist/Claw Cult" :p
  • Therondy - Sanctuary
    Therondy - Sanctuary Posts: 23 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    the main power as a fist bm is i am Never low on spark's (unles i just started for the day) i usualy can double spark soon as it comes up and still have a spark left for sutra. baswicy on boss mosb once i know the Barb has a decent agro lead i start spaming adv spark eruption every 15 seconds or so when it comes up. Can't wait to try it at the heaven and Hell levels.
    One a side not the annilator of souls imho is beter that the TT 60 weapon. and Dark Flash is comparable dps to the tt70 fist and great for grinding.
    as a Fist Bm Hp charms seem pretty mutch optional(as i am almost never wo spark for Sutra _ but i woudl recomend Mana Charms unles you don;t mind poping a Ton of mana pots.
    My typical attack on magic mobs
    Shadowless kick Cyclone heal Spark if high def or hps then lions Roar at like 35% to stop the next spell. for pure physical mobs is basicly Cyclone and spark.
    Btw double sparking in the first 10 seconds of a Boss fight is a Bad idea unless you really want to be tanking haha.
    on a side note i was Spear till switching to fist at 60.
    Therondy
  • Postman - Lost City
    Postman - Lost City Posts: 26 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    Lumies - Lost City wrote: »
    I agree with her build, thats a really good and basic Build, and yes fist/claw masters are rare on the higher levels since { I have seen}, low level claw users just give up on claws and go a different path, but yeah don't let anybody push you around! also your Shadowless kick is a godly skill to block casting, its really helpful against Pvp and some magic Mobs Also, is there a Claw Cult? { read your signature Eirel} XD

    Fist is also pretty useful in hh and fb's such as 69 where the cancel is appreciated, not a fist bm but i have shadowless kick lvl 1. Fist is also a pretty funny way to die in pvp, i will auto attack squishies to deathb:pleased
  • Sylvae - Sanctuary
    Sylvae - Sanctuary Posts: 1,018 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    Nayiro is correct in what the build should be at high lvls: 3 str 2 dex is the best build a fist BM can have. Sacrificing str for dex to get more crits is as useless as the crit boosting skill. For every 1% extra crit you get, you sacrifice 4% dmg. And a crit is a crit, having a higher crit does nothing unless you just barely hit it. Even in short bursts, the higher str will mean better DPS and better spikes as well.

    A 3 dex 2 str fister does about 80% of the dmg of a 3 str 2 dex build at lvl 98. With gear and available boosts from celestial skills and such, the 5% crit difference isn't worth the loss. Especially for the spike combo fisters are capable of with Tyrseus. No other skill comes close to the potential spike that one skill can do, and it only costs one spark. After I have fun with it, I'll post for others to copy. Will be months down the road though.

    The 60 and 70 molds are best for grinding, since they reduce costs. But we have so many fists in the 80s and 90s that I plan on having 5 different claws for my character to swap between as needed. We have some special abilities that are just flat out amazing in what can be done with them, that people looking at just the weapon dmg and not thinking about refines and what can be done with them will be in for rude awakenings later on.

    Also, Fisters are able to use negative interval more effective than any other class. We start at .7 interval. Just -.2 will put you at 2 atks per second. A further -.2 is 3.33 atks. One more, and you have 10 per second. Grinding made easy at that point. Toss on our atk speed skill and demon spark, and things die quickly. I can't wait to toss off AoEs when equipping the determination fists either :)
  • Lyndura - Lost City
    Lyndura - Lost City Posts: 829 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    Sylvae - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Nayiro is correct in what the build should be at high lvls: 3 str 2 dex is the best build a fist BM can have. Sacrificing str for dex to get more crits is as useless as the crit boosting skill. For every 1% extra crit you get, you sacrifice 4% dmg. And a crit is a crit, having a higher crit does nothing unless you just barely hit it. Even in short bursts, the higher str will mean better DPS and better spikes as well.

    A 3 dex 2 str fister does about 80% of the dmg of a 3 str 2 dex build at lvl 98. With gear and available boosts from celestial skills and such, the 5% crit difference isn't worth the loss. Especially for the spike combo fisters are capable of with Tyrseus. No other skill comes close to the potential spike that one skill can do, and it only costs one spark. After I have fun with it, I'll post for others to copy. Will be months down the road though.

    The 60 and 70 molds are best for grinding, since they reduce costs. But we have so many fists in the 80s and 90s that I plan on having 5 different claws for my character to swap between as needed. We have some special abilities that are just flat out amazing in what can be done with them, that people looking at just the weapon dmg and not thinking about refines and what can be done with them will be in for rude awakenings later on.

    Also, Fisters are able to use negative interval more effective than any other class. We start at .7 interval. Just -.2 will put you at 2 atks per second. A further -.2 is 3.33 atks. One more, and you have 10 per second. Grinding made easy at that point. Toss on our atk speed skill and demon spark, and things die quickly. I can't wait to toss off AoEs when equipping the determination fists either :)

    The max you can have is -0.3 interval between attacks, which is only at level 99 using HH99 gold set, and having to "nerf" yourself by using a combination of Light Armor and Heavy Armor.
  • Sylvae - Sanctuary
    Sylvae - Sanctuary Posts: 1,018 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    Lyndura - Lost City wrote: »
    The max you can have is -0.3 interval between attacks, which is only at level 99 using HH99 gold set, and having to "nerf" yourself by using a combination of Light Armor and Heavy Armor.

    I'm getting 5 top weapons, that will take months likely not counting getting my alt that lvl. By the time it happens, the other negative intervals will likely be released. And as in the other post on interval, there are many legendary eqs, charms, and weapons that will give the stats. Not counting the random craft bonus that I started hunting for in AH recently after picking up some wrists.

    Deicider for atk spd and max health debuff AoEs, Stun fists, Berserk fists, berserker fists, and the 5%health and increased phys and mag def fists. Will take a while, but game will still be around a year or two from now. And life everlasting will be out as well, along with galewind.
  • Nayiro - Sanctuary
    Nayiro - Sanctuary Posts: 1,275 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    I honestly wouldn't suggest berserk fists in PvE, only in PvP because those things might kill you.
    Back.
  • Sylvae - Sanctuary
    Sylvae - Sanctuary Posts: 1,018 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    Nayiro - Sanctuary wrote: »
    I honestly wouldn't suggest berserk fists in PvE, only in PvP because those things might kill you.

    The Berserk fists are for a 1 time spike only, pretty much weapon swaps for AoE. Most of the time will be using the stunners or Faith ability ones. It's why I want 5, 4 minimum. Each one will have a different role.
  • XAsch - Sanctuary
    XAsch - Sanctuary Posts: 855 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    You'll eventually end up pulling out axes to level. Even if they're not primary, you'll use them to aoe grind alot faster. Argue that all you like. =p
  • Sylvae - Sanctuary
    Sylvae - Sanctuary Posts: 1,018 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    XAsch - Sanctuary wrote: »
    You'll eventually end up pulling out axes to level. Even if they're not primary, you'll use them to aoe grind alot faster. Argue that all you like. =p


    Not gonna argue that one, I actually had every intention of getting calamity and TT90 gold axes. Thing is, when looking at what I can do with the fists, I'm not sure if they will be needed. I'll know better for sure once I get there and have Tyrseus, but fist AoE might be possible for grinding. Either way, I'll have calamities from my cleric even if it doesn't work out.
  • XAsch - Sanctuary
    XAsch - Sanctuary Posts: 855 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    aznxviet is lv84, and grinds at the wolves. He AoE's, then has to resort to using 1v1 skills and normal melee whilst waiting on the AoE's to cool down. That's why I'm saying he'll need to use Axes if he wants to make full use of the AoE's. How many AoE's do Axe BM have? 5?
  • ZakkusuFae - Heavens Tear
    ZakkusuFae - Heavens Tear Posts: 14 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    XAsch - Sanctuary wrote: »
    aznxviet is lv84, and grinds at the wolves. He AoE's, then has to resort to using 1v1 skills and normal melee whilst waiting on the AoE's to cool down. That's why I'm saying he'll need to use Axes if he wants to make full use of the AoE's. How many AoE's do Axe BM have? 5?

    Fist BM can easily use Poleblade secondary with fists for effective aoe grinding.
    Its easy to spam poleblade AoE combo after using fist AoE's.

    And how many AoE's we have now?
  • Averian - Lost City
    Averian - Lost City Posts: 138 Arc User
    edited April 2009
    I think thats all about the grinding only. Well is true that Axe BM lvl way way way way WAYYYYY faster than us but actually I dont care...( Sword/Blade BM BTW) Like AOE AOE-.-". Theres one and only one thing you must remember playing a game. Choose the one you like. They lvl way faster but it is not as if you actually play with them??? Like you dont start out at the same time and compete do you? So mind not arguing in the fist BM thread or put them down? Do your arguing **** somewhere else. This thread is only for BMs who can help the fist BMs.

    (I originally wanted to read this thread and this guys just had to ruin it for me... what a pain in the ****)
  • Bolinhas - Lost City
    Bolinhas - Lost City Posts: 117 Arc User
    edited May 2009
    Fist BMs are the only ones I get a hard time dealing with BELIEVE ME, unless the player is really REALLY good, or a lucky ... Axe BMs usually don't stand a chance.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Sylvae - Sanctuary
    Sylvae - Sanctuary Posts: 1,018 Arc User
    edited May 2009
    One thing I recently found out, Cyclone Heel has a max stack ability dependent on the level of the skill.

    Lvl 1 does jack.
    Lvl 2 will stack with -.05, does nothing with -.1 already on gear
    Lvl 3 stacks with -.1

    It most likely continues from there, but just something of an FYI for any fist BM who gets the right gear for their character. Almost sent in a ticket, until I tried out increasing Cyclone and seeing that it finally stacked properly.
  • Nick - Harshlands
    Nick - Harshlands Posts: 3 Arc User
    edited May 2009
    guys, im going to start a fist bm but i dont want to make a topic, wanna know, what is better for fist deamon or sage and why?

    thanks for your attention
  • Lyndura - Lost City
    Lyndura - Lost City Posts: 829 Arc User
    edited May 2009
    Sylvae - Sanctuary wrote: »
    One thing I recently found out, Cyclone Heel has a max stack ability dependent on the level of the skill.

    Lvl 1 does jack.
    Lvl 2 will stack with -.05, does nothing with -.1 already on gear
    Lvl 3 stacks with -.1

    It most likely continues from there, but just something of an FYI for any fist BM who gets the right gear for their character. Almost sent in a ticket, until I tried out increasing Cyclone and seeing that it finally stacked properly.

    It happens with any attack speed buff too, like Hell Spark is 2, with -0.05 is 2 too, etc.
  • Granrey - Sanctuary
    Granrey - Sanctuary Posts: 2,050 Arc User
    edited May 2009
    Bolinhas - Lost City wrote: »
    Fist BMs are the only ones I get a hard time dealing with BELIEVE ME, unless the player is really REALLY good, or a lucky ... Axe BMs usually don't stand a chance.

    Sorry if I ofend anyone since I will do a expeculation based on my experience but:

    "The most axes a player uses, the most likely is that he ignores the benefits of the other weapons."

    Fist, sword, Pole users will most likely use their weapons when needed and turn to axes when needed too. As the benefits from axes are obvious while the benefits of the other weapons are not that obvious.

    However, the opposite is not always true. Axes users rarely use other weapons.

    So, my other expeculation on this is that when you deal with a fist guy, you are dealing most likely with a good BM.

    Just my opinion and again sorry if I onfended anyone.
  • Sylvae - Sanctuary
    Sylvae - Sanctuary Posts: 1,018 Arc User
    edited May 2009
    With the genies, and from info posted in other threads, fist masters could stand to really benefit from the dragon bane skill now. We can have it up permanently during attacks, just using the genie skills to make us immune to the 50% dmg debuff. In short, a 25% crit boost that only costs 1 spark for 30 sec duration.

    Also, seems weird that Cyclone Heel with 5% increased speed will stack with my -.1 interval wrists, but a 25% increased speed won't stack with the gear. Do you have a run down of which boosts will stack with -interval gear for higher speed attack rate, Lyndura? It would be very helpful for how to properly skill up my character as it levels, so any information you have would be very appreciated. Also, if you know, does the 260% base damage part of Bolt of Tyrseus count only the normal amount from phys atk, or does it use the physical attack from character window to base it off of? Weapon would be static, but if it take the window version, it should be possible to use boosts and skills to increase physical attack before using Tyrseus for a very powerful spike skill.

    As for people talking about fist masters being a pain to level, in low to mid 60s it is obscenely easy. At lvl 61, earn 23%+ an hour on xp scroll. Cost is repair only, no need for potions or charms during the grind on foxwing supremes. Kill rate of 4 per minute, meaning an axe master must collect, kill, and have the mobs respawn at least 5 a minute to keep up with the xp gain. Unlikely to be possible solo, and they spend a lot of money for charms to be able to do it. Also, the foxwings don't even live long enough to start casting their spell usually, meaning no magic dmg.

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