Axes + Swords a Good Combo?

Diva - Dreamweaver · April 2009

I am a level 63 BM that is almost solely PVE (I say this because sometimes I go PK mode just for fun), I was all Swords until level 45, when I decided it would be fun to have Axes as well, but I didn't want to Sacrifice my blades for the ugly Axes. I also enjoy the gameplay of Swords and have heard from a very reliable source that End Game Swords are rockin.

At my current level I am low Vit but High Str and Dex, I don't have too much trouble with dying, but I do live on HP Charms. I also pad up my stats with +str Equips, and I am starting to look into Refining Armor for added HP. How should I stat my points? Also Should I cap my Vitality at a certain number? I was thinking around 60 by level 80. I would like opinions. No flaming or telling me I'm an idiot, I think I have a good grip on this. I just want some other peoples ideas.

bashusilly · April 2009

I took a similar route with my other BM. I was strict swords till my early 40's then branched off into axes too. I found that straight grinding, 1V1 I used swords, Partly because I had to used a slightly lower level set of axes, due to my STR being too low for the latest. But even at the slightly lower level, the axes damage Vs. multiple mobs was pretty nice in FB's, That and If I was ganked by multiple mobs, I was able to switch to Axes. I do believe it saved my life several times, and eliminated my need to take off and run for my life quite so much.

Swords Ultimate Skill is pretty impressive, if you dont have it yet, it is a must have, I think.

As far as VIT. I capped mine at 55, some people don't until 70, some people don't add any VIT at all. If you don't feel like you need anymore, just stop. It is all gonna depend on how you play, how willing you are to let your charms take a beating. Diamond sutra management and Pots.

At 55 VIT, in my mid-60's, I had a stretch when I didn't have a charm, and although it is definately a lil more tricky, the amount of VIT seemed to be plenty.

At this point, if you wanna keep adding VIT, I would figure you would go with something like a 6str/3dex/1vit every two levels.

But, to make sure your using your points wisely, just make sure you dont have too much STR for carrying the latest Axes, You can look here:http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/itype/9/page/3
If your STR is too high, juggle your points till it is correct, having more STR than needed is not as beneficial as having extra VIT or extra DEX.

But, Those are just my opinions. That Toon is only a level 68 BM and not much further ahead of you. He is a PvE on HT and I never did any Pk'ing. So, if your planning on any of that, I have no way to give an opinion.

GL

AdvanceZero - Heavens Tear · April 2009

I am an axe BM who is dabbling with my TT sword right now. At level 66 my stats are as follows. 204 str, 100 dex, 36 vitality. That's without all my bonuses from armor. Almost all my armor is 3 star; rank equipment; or quest equipment. I have most of them sharded with HP shards and some with MP defense shards.

I die very rarely. In all actuality my last few deaths have been because of inattention. (i have two kids). I get distracted. I don't have any problems with my total HP. Its at a very good level (once again due to great equipment bonuses). I now keep charms on at all times. But when I was in my 5x's i wasn't using charms that often and i was still doing just fine.

As i grow higher in level I am not looking at adding anymore points into vitality(for a minute i thought i was going to) instead I will start to refine my armor. Specifically my TT armor when I get it (at least +1). And continue to use HP shards. Perhaps move up from average to beauts.

With all that being said. For the next few levels I will be adding enough strength to wield my TT70 axes and the rest into Dex. I aoe a lot. And the less i miss the better. In groups one of my jobs is to grab the stragglers that get by the tank...and preferable group them around the tank so I can aoe efficiently as many mobs as possible. And if I always hit they won't go after the cleric. If one breaks off I chase it down and take aggro back.

Averian - Lost City · April 2009

well i am a sword BM purely and i cap my vit at 50 which what i read on the forums where most people do. However I have many BMs in my guild who are like me, uses sword but as far as i know, those pretty high lvl which is 60-70 have this axe and sword combo which cost them a lot of vit. One of my clan mate actually only have 15vit and he go with both axe and sword and even if you say it dont bring out the weapons full potential, his would be so close it is negligible. You might think about the survival rate and i can tell you that he is doing really great so yeah you can try this if you want lol

BUt of course your equips have to be really good like add lots of HP you know to increase survival rate

Granrey - Sanctuary · April 2009

bashusilly wrote: »

I took a similar route with my other BM. I was strict swords till my early 40's then branched off into axes too. I found that straight grinding, 1V1 I used swords, Partly because I had to used a slightly lower level set of axes, due to my STR being too low for the latest. But even at the slightly lower level, the axes damage Vs. multiple mobs was pretty nice in FB's, That and If I was ganked by multiple mobs, I was able to switch to Axes. I do believe it saved my life several times, and eliminated my need to take off and run for my life quite so much.

Swords Ultimate Skill is pretty impressive, if you dont have it yet, it is a must have, I think.

As far as VIT. I capped mine at 55, some people don't until 70, some people don't add any VIT at all. If you don't feel like you need anymore, just stop. It is all gonna depend on how you play, how willing you are to let your charms take a beating. Diamond sutra management and Pots.

At 55 VIT, in my mid-60's, I had a stretch when I didn't have a charm, and although it is definately a lil more tricky, the amount of VIT seemed to be plenty.

At this point, if you wanna keep adding VIT, I would figure you would go with something like a 6str/3dex/1vit every two levels.

But, to make sure your using your points wisely, just make sure you dont have too much STR for carrying the latest Axes, You can look here:http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/itype/9/page/3
If your STR is too high, juggle your points till it is correct, having more STR than needed is not as beneficial as having extra VIT or extra DEX.

But, Those are just my opinions. That Toon is only a level 68 BM and not much further ahead of you. He is a PvE on HT and I never did any Pk'ing. So, if your planning on any of that, I have no way to give an opinion.

GL

This is a really good adviceb:victory

Guardgodess - Sanctuary · April 2009

why sword and axe? why not pole and axe?

can any sword bms explain to me why sword is so superior?

for as far as i can see, pole has the highest single target damage and it has 2 ranged skills. on top of that, it has straight line aoes while still have knockback like swords.

to top it off, pole has similar stats with axe

so isn't it better to have pole and axe combo? pole for 1vs1 and axe for aoe grinding?

am i failing to see some areas of sword bms?

can anyone plz explain this, as i want to make a pve bm but go pk later on.

thank you for any replies

Granrey - Sanctuary · April 2009

Guardgodess - Sanctuary wrote: »

why sword and axe? why not pole and axe?

can any sword bms explain to me why sword is so superior?

for as far as i can see, pole has the highest single target damage and it has 2 ranged skills. on top of that, it has straight line aoes while still have knockback like swords.

to top it off, pole has similar stats with axe

so isn't it better to have pole and axe combo? pole for 1vs1 and axe for aoe grinding?

am i failing to see some areas of sword bms?

can anyone plz explain this, as i want to make a pve bm but go pk later on.

thank you for any replies

I've never heard bad news for lack of many about pole. That probably means that the weapon is easier/better to use than sword.

I rarely see a player using this weapon.

I agree they might be closer related stats wise but I dont see the great benefit of having two builts based on AOE skills. Of couse, Pole is linear attack while axes is circular.

Myself, I use Sword and fists. They are related statwise and they complement each other where the other lacks. Still, I have some Axes AOE to make my built better.

Please, don't see BM as particular weapon path. You can combine builts and make a great BM out of your toon. You might start with a particular path for instance sword, later change to Axes and them become all round in the paths.

The choice is up to you, based on your likes and play style.

Seablue - Sanctuary · April 2009

Guardgodess - Sanctuary wrote: »

why sword and axe? why not pole and axe?

can any sword bms explain to me why sword is so superior?

for as far as i can see, pole has the highest single target damage and it has 2 ranged skills. on top of that, it has straight line aoes while still have knockback like swords.

to top it off, pole has similar stats with axe

so isn't it better to have pole and axe combo? pole for 1vs1 and axe for aoe grinding?

am i failing to see some areas of sword bms?

can anyone plz explain this, as i want to make a pve bm but go pk later on.

thank you for any replies

Sword isn't superior. Assuming that you use all weapons, you'll be using fist for dps, axe for aoe and stun, and pole for range. I dare say that the only time you'll ever pull out a sword if you use all 4 weapons is when you need to use myriad. Sword lack individuality that's why it can be a substitute but once you have the others you'll probably never use it again.

I uses both axe and sword. Sword just make single target grinding a bit more comfortable than pole and I don't have enough refining in my armor to ignore the vit i need making me unable to use fist of my lvl. For pk I'll be using axe like most anway so i can take advantage of the stun lock.

Lyndura - Lost City · April 2009

Sword is the only weapon that can be called "useless".

Fists are used for building Chi, damaging and skill cancelling when killing bosses.

Polearm gives range and bleed which are used during PvP. Pre-level 89 it has the highest DPS of all the weapons, so it is much better to use this weapon to fight single target mobs.

Not only that, it also provides one important AoE that is Meteor Rush, which knockbacks the opponents, and can be used in combination with the Axe AoE skills (plus, Meteor Rush is a very important skill during TW at 99+ levels).

Arguably the best end-game main damaging weapon for PvP (because end-game you use a combination of different weapons to get the best out of them. Like if you use Spear to damage, you will use Axes for stunlock and using heaven's flame, plus AoE'ing).

Axes give the highest amount of AoE skills that can be used by a single weapon; therefore, the best to use for this kind of grinding. They have Drake Bash which is necessary for stun locking, and Heaven's Flame which amplifies the damage the opponent recieves, which is another must skill for any BM.

The best PvP weapon up to level 90-95. And fastest leveler 6x+.

Sword is only required for Myriad and the effect of decreasing the opponent's magical/physical attack.

So with that, you can pretty much see that you will be using Axes for AoE'ing, Fists for getting Chi and bosses, and Polearm for complementing AoE's and single target damaging.

So you will need Axes, that requires: 6 STR and 1 DEX every two levels.

Polearm is very close to those stats (it uses 5 STR and 2 DEX every two levels), so using a combination of both will give you a very good build which would be:

6 STR, 2 DEX and 2 VIT every two levels.

Following this, you will have the best PvP and arguably PvE build.

You can't use a high level Fists with this build, so you will be using a lower level ones (or just go unarmed), which still do the work.

If you really want to stick with Swords (which I don't suggest you), then your build would be:

6 STR, 3 DEX and 1 VIT every two levels, and you don't need to cap VIT.

Granrey - Sanctuary · April 2009

Lyndura - Lost City wrote: »

Sword is the only weapon that can be called "useless".

Fists are used for building Chi, damaging and skill cancelling when killing bosses.

Sword is only required for Myriad and the effect of decreasing the opponent's magical/physical attack.

If you really want to stick with Swords (which I don't suggest you)
.

b:angryMore ecouregement for me to research and use sword/fists.b:angry

LOL, I have been finding the secrets of fists. I have to make more progress on swordb:victory

Lyndura - Lost City · April 2009

Granrey - Sanctuary wrote: »

b:angryMore ecouregement for me to research and use sword/fists.b:angry

LOL, I have been finding the secrets of fists. I have to make more progress on swordb:victory

There are no secrets.

This game has been out for many years now, and everything has been tested already. All the builds, all the weapons.

Going from CV weapons, to - attack interval uses, to HH Orange weapons and of course 8jun weapons. Using the highest refinement levels, and best possible equipment.

Everything that you know, you will know, and you wont know has been done already.

Even then, it is always the same result. Is it coincidence that it always end up being the same way?

All the high levels from this and other versions always end up with the same (best) uses for the weapons.

AdvanceZero - Heavens Tear · April 2009

Lyndura - Lost City wrote: »

Sword is the only weapon that can be called "useless".

Fists are used for building Chi, damaging and skill cancelling when killing bosses.

Polearm gives range and bleed which are used during PvP. Pre-level 89 it has the highest DPS of all the weapons, so it is much better to use this weapon to fight single target mobs.

Not only that, it also provides one important AoE that is Meteor Rush, which knockbacks the opponents, and can be used in combination with the Axe AoE skills (plus, Meteor Rush is a very important skill during TW at 99+ levels).

Arguably the best end-game main damaging weapon for PvP (because end-game you use a combination of different weapons to get the best out of them. Like if you use Spear to damage, you will use Axes for stunlock and using heaven's flame, plus AoE'ing).

Axes give the highest amount of AoE skills that can be used by a single weapon; therefore, the best to use for this kind of grinding. They have Drake Bash which is necessary for stun locking, and Heaven's Flame which amplifies the damage the opponent recieves, which is another must skill for any BM.

The best PvP weapon up to level 90-95. And fastest leveler 6x+.

Sword is only required for Myriad and the effect of decreasing the opponent's magical/physical attack.

So with that, you can pretty much see that you will be using Axes for AoE'ing, Fists for getting Chi and bosses, and Polearm for complementing AoE's and single target damaging.

So you will need Axes, that requires: 6 STR and 1 DEX every two levels.

Polearm is very close to those stats (it uses 5 STR and 2 DEX every two levels), so using a combination of both will give you a very good build which would be:

6 STR, 2 DEX and 2 VIT every two levels.

Following this, you will have the best PvP and arguably PvE build.

You can't use a high level Fists with this build, so you will be using a lower level ones (or just go unarmed), which still do the work.

If you really want to stick with Swords (which I don't suggest you), then your build would be:

6 STR, 3 DEX and 1 VIT every two levels, and you don't need to cap VIT.

Are you saying then that polearms out DPS swords with no skills or with skills?? And if you are using fists for damage on boss's but don't have the dex for good fists. Wouldn't it be better to use swords for DPS (since you have a better chance of having the dex requirement to use the best sword for your level). And then set up a combo to use shadowless kick when needed to cancel AoE's?? With the sword you will build still build chi relatively fast, while dealing descent damage, so you can unleash your AoE's (i am an axe user i love my fire dragon)

Please clarify.

Sunspot - Lost City · April 2009

Everyone should listen to Lyndura, that is drop the swords - the only weapon that is useless - and get axes/pole (restat if you need). BMs don't make other people think that you are noobs get rid of those swords cause you will be getting nowhere with that kind of weapon. Yeah.

Granrey - Sanctuary · April 2009

Sunspot - Lost City wrote: »

Everyone should listen to Lyndura, that is drop the swords - the only weapon that is useless - and get axes/pole (restat if you need). BMs don't make other people think that you are noobs get rid of those swords cause you will be getting nowhere with that kind of weapon. Yeah.

Yeah, If i want my toon to look like everybody else. I would say yes, you are right.b:bye

I have no problem with Axes being better than any BM weapon vs multiple opponents. My concern is 1v1.

I consider "Atmos Strike" and "Myriad of sword Stance" being pretty usefull in 1V1.

Saying that, I still continue switching weapons as I consider appropiate on the fight. Sticking to one weapon is putting the BM on a box.

My favorite skills in 1V1 still are: Shadowless Kick, Atmos Strike, Drake Bash, Cyclone heel and Myrad of Sword Stance. In other words, 2 skills from sword, 2 skills from fist and 1 skill from Axes.b:victory

Lyndura - Lost City · April 2009

AdvanceZero - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Are you saying then that polearms out DPS swords with no skills or with skills?? And if you are using fists for damage on boss's but don't have the dex for good fists. Wouldn't it be better to use swords for DPS (since you have a better chance of having the dex requirement to use the best sword for your level). And then set up a combo to use shadowless kick when needed to cancel AoE's?? With the sword you will build still build chi relatively fast, while dealing descent damage, so you can unleash your AoE's (i am an axe user i love my fire dragon)

Please clarify.

Polearm outdamages Sword with and without skills.

I'm saying that use Fists for getting Chi and then change to Axe/Polearm and use Dragon/Glacial or even Sword to use Myriad, depending on the boss (99% of the time you will be asked for Dragon/Glacial).

If you don't have the requirement to use Fists (something that won't happen at high levels) just use Polearm, or using Axes is good enough.

The difference between the amount of Chi a Sword and Polearm weapons can make is not really different, but the damage is.

@Ganrey: Your character looks the same as lots that are out there. And at high levels it will be the same, what makes a difference is the money.

Anyways, Polearm is the best for 1 vs 1. When it comes to PvP it doesn't matter if you use Polearm or Axe, both hit higher and do much better than Sword.

Granrey - Sanctuary · April 2009

Lyndura - Lost City wrote: »

@Ganrey: Your character looks the same as lots that are out there. And at high levels it will be the same, what makes a difference is the money.

Anyways, Polearm is the best for 1 vs 1. When it comes to PvP it doesn't matter if you use Polearm or Axe, both hit higher and do much better than Sword.

I will confirm that later then either by winning or losing. However, if your argument was totally true, they should remove all the weapons and leave axes and polearms only.

As somebody said b:angry "Fear the fists and fear the swords" b:angry

and welcome to the fists/sword cult. b:laugh

complexx · April 2009

sigh more baddies using swords.

shakaboom · April 2009

is there any chance that Axe outdamaged sword/spear DPS without skill ?
because of its "spike damage" that far greater than sword/spear's

anyway im sword user before but then i try change to axe..

SleipnirX - Lost City · April 2009

Lyndura - Lost City wrote: »

Polearm outdamages Sword with and without skills.

That is only true for Single swords. Dual swords have higher attack than spears fyi, that, plus the already high damage skills from the sword tree, well...make the math yourself

Diva - Dreamweaver · April 2009

I jsut do not like how Polearms handle. The one I got from teh FB 19 was unfun and I just didn't like it.

I am mostly swords becuase it fits my play style. After reading all of your guys' posts, I have started to fall into a position that I really, really adore my build. I have found that I am not very good at playing without either my sword of my Axes. In PVP people Q.Q at me all of the tiem becuase I switch weapons constantly for certain attacks.

I really love my build now. As for the Vit, I did sacrafice some but ATM I have 50 Vit (with Equips), and I have enough Str and Dex for my levle TT weapons. And by Levle 68, I will have enough for the TT70 things. I got really lucky with some gear drops that added Strength and Dex. All of my Gear is 3* and has 3+ sockets with HP HP/Mag Def Shards. I have Sutra timing down, so yay!

Thanks guys I think I will become a successful BM yet!

Lyndura - Lost City · April 2009

SleipnirX - Lost City wrote: »

That is only true for Single swords. Dual swords have higher attack than spears fyi, that, plus the already high damage skills from the sword tree, well...make the math yourself

Key word: Spear. Not Poleblade or Shaft. (The difference is too little anyways).

Anyways, Spear outdamages Dual Swords/Blades with single attacks, that, plus the 2 seconds lower cooldown on the main skill, (which, is not limited to meele range) and the higher base damage of both secondary skills and the high damage of the ultimate plus the effect that allows to deal much more damage than Myriad.

Yeah, pretty much outdamaged. Make the math yourself and be sure if you really want to prove something wrong.

AdvanceZero - Heavens Tear · April 2009

Lyndura - Lost City wrote: »

Key word: Spear. Not Poleblade or Shaft. (The difference is too little anyways).

Anyways, Spear outdamages Dual Swords/Blades with single attacks, that, plus the 2 seconds lower cooldown on the main skill, (which, is not limited to meele range) and the higher base damage of both secondary skills and the high damage of the ultimate plus the effect that allows to deal much more damage than Myriad.

Yeah, pretty much outdamaged. Make the math yourself and be sure if you really want to prove something wrong.

Ahh...in single attacks yes; but the damage difference between the TT70 spear and blade really isn't that much. And the blade attack 11% faster. I would really appreciate if a math wiz out there would take the time to actually calculate variable damage per weapon over a set period of time. Say 10 seconds 30 seconds, 5 minutes, 30 minutes (for those long boss fights in TT.) I am not convinced that your statement is true.

AdvanceZero - Heavens Tear · April 2009

Okay. So I took the time to actually do some math to figure out some DPS with regular attacks.

This is basic algebra. A true physics/calculus equation would be more accurate including level of character, strength stats and dex stats..etc..etc... As well as stats for a creature (I would use a TT boss; magic mob; and physical mob). But hey we work with what we got.

It seems to me that the weapons are very balanced. And that preference for one or another will all fall down to what skills you want to be using. And how you want to set up your stats.

Axes + Swords a Good Combo?

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