BM v.s phoenix veno

Akiratojo - Heavens Tear · April 2009

Okay.... I think I have posted enough insignificant BM PVP threads, but I have gotten the oppertunity to get a phoenix.

Before I was BM on harshlands I was a happy-go-lucky 61 veno with a crystal mag on HT, which was not a PVP server, so I did no PVPing, just PVE.

So the oppertunity has come to me to get a phoenix.

Up till now I really enjoyed playing a BM, I adore the skills, especially the stuns, and AOE. (minus thr lvl100 skill that requires swords to use=( )

What I am wondering; Generally, who wins in a 1v1, or even TW, BM or Veno with a phoenix?

I know that this is a veno related.bm related thingy, but How much typically does a phoenix hit in PVP, or even on single mobs? (obviously depending on level)...
But I just can't decide, I want to PVP, and I can't pick which class is better for TW, or PVP, any help is greatly appreciated on this matter!

Thank you!

PXRage - Heavens Tear · April 2009

if the pheonix and bm are the same level, pheonix has a higher change of winning 1v1.

depends on bm's build etc.

but of course in tw, duel etc bm never goes for the pet. venoes them selves are much easier to take down. so 1v1 veno vs bm (without bramble), bm wins 75% of time I'd say (again, providing the bm know how to use stuns)

Mothergoose - Sanctuary · April 2009

PXRage - Heavens Tear wrote: »

if the pheonix and bm are the same level, pheonix has a higher change of winning 1v1.

depends on bm's build etc.

but of course in tw, duel etc bm never goes for the pet. venoes them selves are much easier to take down. so 1v1 veno vs bm (without bramble), bm wins 75% of time I'd say (again, providing the bm know how to use stuns)

It's hardly 75%. When under attack, venos who don't bramble (very rare) tend to turn into foxform, run and jump around at the same time while pheonix is attacking. It's just not easy to catch...

ShadowxBlade - Heavens Tear · April 2009

depends who jumps who if its straight 1v1 veno has higher chance because they can send phoenix and fly off or cast their skills

XAsch - Sanctuary · April 2009

PXRage clearly has no experience PVPing 90+, so ignore him. Veno's 90+ have a high chance to win. Why? cause if they manage to stun you, the battle's over before you realize it's begun. Even if you get the first hit in, it's impossible to kill the Veno's in 1 stun, even if you manage to get off a 2nd stun, you need incredibly good equipment to win one 1v1. It's why you should never PK alone. =D

Akiratojo - Heavens Tear · April 2009

Thanks XAsch and ShadowxBlade!
And I do agree with PXRage statement that in a duel a BM would never go for the pet, it would just be stupid to do so
But for exapmle, how much damage does a phoenix do? I don't think that they can 1-hit BM or Barbs, can they? I have no doubt that they can 1-hit archers and robes, but not so sure about BMs and barbs. So far I am leaning on staying a BM, I just feel as if I got used to the class and have a good feel for it, but just out of curiosity, are nixies really that good for PVP, I realize that high level venos are good (well along with all high level classes for that matter), but just wondering how good they are.

I also noticed that venos are the top PKers (according to PVP rankings) and if they arent #1, they are sure up there - I assume they are using nixies.

And lastly, I was also told my a 7X bm the follwoing:

"BM v.s a Veno with a nix, BM will allways lose becuase the nix will 1hit him" I dont really think that is credible, but does a BM, say lvl 90 stand a good chance against a veno with a nix (not sure waht skills, but I heard that level 5 flesh ream is good) also level 90, if their gear was of equal grade (however to put it, just basically if they were both of the same TT level with the same refining level)?
Or would the BM be at a disadvantage?
The way I think of it is that all you would have to do is use leap forward on the veno, and along with cloud sprint, stunlock the veno, and kill her? But then again this is easier said then done, but you never know right?
So what are the odds of the BM winning?

Thanks again guys!

ShadowxBlade - Heavens Tear · April 2009

the phoenixes bleed damage is bugged so it will take a chunk off ur hp every second or so. idk if this is true but someone told me that if your p.def is over 20k phoenix wont hit u much

XAsch - Sanctuary · April 2009

hahah. HAHAHA! Since when does a Phoenix 1hko a BM of the same level?

complexx · April 2009

venos will normally win, Several reasons.

1. Ranged
2. Bugged pet bleed
3. Debuff
4. Amp dmg
5. Fox form
6. 2 Stuns

I mean come on. Not even close, Good venos can solo barbs with ease.

Single target pk = Veno > Warrior

Shamino - Sanctuary · April 2009

Its best to have some friends nearby if you plan on fighting a pheonix veno, while the nix wont kill you very quickly its very very hard to land enough hits on the rapidly running veno to kill them through a charm, get a cleric for sleeping the veno is an option to allow you to position for the stunlock better and the cleric can use his paralyze if the veno gets away for a second.

The aim of course is to keep the pet fighting you though as without the venos assistance it wont take you down (as long as your charmed and roar occasionally the nix cant kill you without the venos help).

Tagteam is the best way to take down most classes though as its very hard for any 1 character to overpower a charm on a well built character of any other class. Well unless they just stand there and let you beat on them but most people move around.

Akiratojo - Heavens Tear · April 2009

But venos with phoenixes (mostly the nix) do hit a lot, so with the beloved fleash ream skill, death is immonent XD (from what I have heard)

Ganiju - Heavens Tear · April 2009

Akiratojo - Heavens Tear wrote: »

But venos with (mostly the nix) do hit a lot, so with the beloved fleash ream skill, death is immonent XD (from what I have heard)

yes they do hit hard but all you got to do is attack the veno itself. the nix knocked me down to a little bit less then half health by the time i beat the veno (which was running and was in fox form). thank goodness for high hp. but for bms use your speed run if the venos run away that way you can catch up and then stun them so you can take them down.

Akiratojo - Heavens Tear · April 2009

What level was the veno and nixie? And how many times did it hit you and for how much?
And it probably wasn't with the flesh ream skill either, because Flesh ream doenst suffer the PVP damage loss.

Sorry I am sounding like I am interrogating you, just want to know how much it was; so I can make an informed desiscion XD

Ganiju - Heavens Tear · April 2009

Akiratojo - Heavens Tear wrote: »

What level was the veno and nixie? And how many times did it hit you and for how much?
And it probably wasn't with the flesh ream skill either, because Flesh ream doenst suffer the PVP damage loss.

Sorry I am sounding like I am interrogating you, just want to know how much it was; so I can make an informed desiscion XD

the veno was lvl 41 with a lvl 40 nix when i was lvl 42 and it hit me twice like 500+ damage or something like that

Mothergoose - Sanctuary · April 2009

Shamino - Sanctuary wrote: »

Its best to have some friends nearby if you plan on fighting a pheonix veno, while the nix wont kill you very quickly its very very hard to land enough hits on the rapidly running veno to kill them through a charm, get a cleric for sleeping the veno is an option to allow you to position for the stunlock better and the cleric can use his paralyze if the veno gets away for a second.

The aim of course is to keep the pet fighting you though as without the venos assistance it wont take you down (as long as your charmed and roar occasionally the nix cant kill you without the venos help).

Tagteam is the best way to take down most classes though as its very hard for any 1 character to overpower a charm on a well built character of any other class. Well unless they just stand there and let you beat on them but most people move around.

That would be 2 vs 1, and only assuming that neither nix or veno is attacking the cleric instead. if it's 2 vs 2 your cleric would be dead.b:chuckle

Ganiju - Heavens Tear wrote: »

yes they do hit hard but all you got to do is attack the veno itself. the nix knocked me down to a little bit less then half health by the time i beat the veno (which was running and was in fox form). thank goodness for high hp. but for bms use your speed run if the venos run away that way you can catch up and then stun them so you can take them down.

They don't always run in straight line. A jumping fox bouncing back and forth isn't easy to catch even with the burst of speed.

The whole problem is, you're actually facing 2 opponents instead one. Okay, not really, more like one and a half.

If you attack any 1 person that's not veno, they can either stand and fight or flee. While fleeing, they can't deal damage. If you attack a veno, it bounces around while the nix hits you. If you attack the nix, it's even worse because the veno hits you. You can't split yourself in half and fight on 2 fronts.

Literature - Harshlands · April 2009

Ganiju - Heavens Tear wrote: »

the veno was lvl 41 with a lvl 40 nix when i was lvl 42 and it hit me twice like 500+ damage or something like that

lol do venos have that +25% speed buff at 40? Should have been easy to kite you while the nix killed you. Stuns can be avoided. You can attribute that kill to a crappy player. Most people don't know what to do at 40.

And that person might not even have had flesh ream yet. That would have taken you out in two seconds.

dencrypted · April 2009

what about spear bm they have longer range, farstrike and bleed with which ignores the jumping effects of the fox

Kinohki - Lost City · April 2009

dencrypted wrote: »

what about spear bm they have longer range, farstrike and bleed with which ignores the jumping effects of the fox

Yes and no. Farstrike and Drakes ray is a nice combo, but far from enough to off a veno quickly enough. Take in account Soul transfusion (swap HP and MP), their ability to stun and reflect, and it honestly surprises me how any BM can take out a well prepared veno.

Now if you dual spark and rush them with far strike, drakes ray and maybe a lucky meteor crush (forget the name off the top of my head, the pushback of the spear class) then you MIGHT have enough damage to off them. That's assuming they don't have a charm. If htey have a charm, well, depends on whether you have one or not. Sometimes it's best to know when to flee.

Nevlik - Heavens Tear · April 2009

reflect does not work in pk mode, though it works in duels and TW.

just a note

Postman - Lost City · April 2009

To aviod foxes stun, clerics sleep etc. Spark sprint its your best friend spam a lot of pots n skills and hope to keep her locked down. If she has a charm may or may not take a little while longer but the aoe from your attacks can either force him/her to heal pet, but still focus on the nixxer as soon as u try and attack the bird u die.

Nixxers for the most part are not that great at pvp if u have a strategy u can win. Ive fought venos with sawflies who are better at pvp than nixxers.

My Name Is Postman, I am Twelve years old and I can only pk lowbs. FFS think b4 u troll.

Aragorn - Harshlands · April 2009

I don't know if this helps but if I am alone and get attacked by a Veno I just run. No sense in dying and losing a doll for nothing.

They can run faster than we can (almost as fast as our run buff at lower levels)

While running you are taking about the same damage you would deal out from the Phoenix

Seriously.. If you are 1v1 it's not even worth taking the chance. Unless the guy is a lot lower level than you. Maybe 1 in a 10 chance of winning if you are lucky to creep up on him/her?

BM v.s phoenix veno

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