Current research on phoenix/bee bleed

Ayano-chan - Sanctuary · January 2009

K folks here's my current research on phoenix or bee so called bugged bleed.
Now for starters the bug every1 is talking about,"ignores physical defense", is just something made up.
Now I tested both phoenix and bee bleed's dmg in duels with and withouth armors.Now the difference was huge,i'm lvl 72 LA build wiz 4.4k phy deff self buffed,lvl 85 phoenix hit me for 902 bleed per tick with lvl 4 bleed,i got most of my parts off,went down to about 600 phy rez and guess what..i got about 1720 bleed per tick.
K now the thing is there still may be a glitch but I'm not yet sure about it wich is why i'd like every1 to share they'r oppinions.

- You all noticed about player bleed skills or even other DoT skills description:"does base dmg(wich is just 1st hit)+ xxx dmg over xxx seconds.
- Now the pet bleed look's like this:"does base dmg + xxx% of pet's atack dmg over xx seconds,so basically the only difference is that player DoTs have a number of dmg points while pet DoT relies on it's atack as a dmg multiplier but the important thing is they r both DMG OVER TIME SKILLS wich do the dmg they say over the specified number of seconds.
-All seem's great till now huh?Well don't count your chickens before they'r hatched; i figured out that maybe the glitch relies on the bleed from pets doing the dmg they state for the whole duration of the skill on doing it JUST PER TICK.

Now I'm still researching this whenever I get the chance as I'm not yet sure about it so I ask you again to post your thouths and opinions on this.

senovit · January 2009

Pet's bleed ignores PvP damage reduction. Normal damage reduction between players and normal pet skills is 25%. Each tick of the pet bleed completely ignores this and thus does 4 times the damage it should.

Mua - Lost City · January 2009

A Phoenix's bleed can **** anything except a werebeast in seconds (and even them if they're not buffed), and you will die if you get hit by one that's anywhere near your level.

I don't know the technical side of it, but it is way overpowered and no amount of research will justify it in PVP.

Ayano-chan - Sanctuary · January 2009

Pet's bleed ignores PvP damage reduction. Normal damage reduction between players and normal pet skills is 25%. Each tick of the pet bleed completely ignores this and thus does 4 times the damage it should.

K...now this seem's to make perfect sense and I now see why ppl get it mixed up with the "bleed ignores physical rez" as it still ignores something but it wasn't the phy deff it was the pvp dmg reduction.

Thx,I guess with this it's case closed.I can finnally stop worrying about this,lol.
But what about the rumor of phoenix bleed ignoring archer's wing shell and cleric's plume shell? Is that true? I want confirmation pls from more than 1 player.

PS:That's not totally accurate mua lvl 85 phoenix who's like 13 lvls higher than me bleed doesn't kill me with charm tho I'm like 1-2 hits away depending on what hit,after bleed ends it's good for me that atleast the "put phoenix on me let it bleed me than pull phoenix back" tactic will not kill me b:victory.

Mua - Lost City · January 2009

Ayano-chan - Sanctuary wrote: »

PS:That's not totally accurate mua lvl 85 phoenix who's like 13 lvls higher than me bleed doesn't kill me with charm tho I'm like 1-2 hits away depending on what hit,after bleed ends it's good for me that atleast the "put phoenix on me let it bleed me than pull phoenix back" tactic will not kill me b:victory.

Whose Phoenix was it, and more importantly, what class are you?

If you're a WB or BM, that's not totally insane but still fail on the veno's part.

If you're anything else well... I guess you should come to Lost City for some real Phoenix tests because if FieryDevil, Cancer, MeLoveYou (all BL) or AssassinFox (CQ b:victory) targets you in pvp, it's over. Wave goodbye to a doll.

senovit · January 2009

Maybe that phoenix was at 0 loyalty.

Ayano-chan - Sanctuary · January 2009

I'm a lvl 72 LA wiz 4,4k phy deff self-buffed with about 6% extra phy reduce from items(total 66% phy reduce),hp is 2.7k ,now I know it did same dmg to me(or less if I was full buffed) in TW when we fought the guild(Legendary) from wich the veno(Akasera) who had it was and it's a bit hard to believe that it was unloyal even then,also note her bleed was lvl 4.

You may be right or you may be wrong ,I know the phoenix bleed ticks about 4 times right?or was it 3?Anyway deffinetly not 5 so even if it was 1.3k dmg per tick and not 902 it would go like this:

1.3k+1.3k (charm ticks) +1.3k+1.3k, yay i'm left with 100 hp so I do not die from just bleed and let's say the phoenix get's 1 extra hit or 2 even on me it did 400 dmg per hit in air as I said,I'll always use pots the minute I see it starting bleeding me so a pot will heal about 1k hp in 10 secs while the bleed last's about 12.

There you have it either way I'm 50-100 hp safe from the bleed, +max 2 hits(usually 1 or 0 since I blink as soon as I see it near me,tho usually run when I see it from miles away) a phoenix could get on me so unless I get hit by another player fast I'm safe.

Either way it's something I really really think it's ruining the game,guess who's 1st ranked pvper on sanctuary? A veno with phoenix as expected and there r just a few venos I know there who actually know how to play a veno (debuff at the right time and all,switch from forms whenever need etc)while the rest just relly on a overpowered pet like Heleina(1st ranked) does.
I always stand up for alot of venos when ppl say they r useless w/o bugged bleed pets using the very few venos I know that truly know how to play they'r class as an example but not much result there ........I wish I checked into this before playing this game.If I knew a simple overpowered pet would do this much for players who don't know nothing about they'r class I woud've never played it and no I have nothing with venos that have phoenix and were known as good players before they got phoenix just so I won't get any accusations here:P

TigerLily - Lost City · January 2009

Bleed is dot dmg like poison, thats why shields dont work. Looks so sad when clerics ( that never faced phoenix before in pvp) in panic activated plume shield and tries to heal themselves... still drops in 1 sec.

It also does full dmg from air to ground, since its dot dmg. Damage reduction pots also dont work against bleed since its dot dmg from a pet skill. Actually purify pots dont work either, i tried several times and bleed is still ticking my life away even tho the pot is used.
Actually nothing works very well, high lvl pvp pots that restores 6000 hp might save your life if they actually kick in, and spending alot of money getting your gear to atleast +7 +8.

And thats pretty much while i prefer getting attacked by a GX +12 or any 90+ weapon thats so heavily refined it can 1 shoot people. Cuz u can defend other classes attacks, while bleed is so bugged its just ridiculous.

But i do think venos need some other skill if bleed ever gets fixed. Cuz without they might be a little to weak endgame, even with phoenix.

Maiya - Lost City · January 2009

My phoenix is level 79. I tested it at max loyalty and buffed on one of my guild members in a duel, he was either level 73 or 74 (health in high 3000s, maybe 4000s) WR. I used the Flesh Ream (lvl 4) skill only, and his health dropped just a bit past half.

blo0dyyay · January 2009

i tested it with my buddy also

she ; lvl 62
me ; lvl 48 (or something like that)

phoenix killed me in less than 7 seconds, i had my marrow on and 3k+ hp

dekciw · January 2009

If they can't fix ripping bite (flesh ream) they should at least make the Phoenix like a Mob.

- Takes full damage, (PVE damage(non reduced), therefore it would die in a few hits)

- Make it so it deals half-damage if it hits a target on the ground (it's a flying pet ffs) That would also make Land pet maybe more useful in some situations

stuff like that

Mua - Lost City · January 2009

They already do reduced damage to the ground, and purify pots do work. Me and PandaLord have both used the pots to survive it, and the only mage near my level (one lol) that successfully survived my bleed was running on the ground.

Just some info there.

Soda - Lost City · January 2009

We all know this and the Gm Don't care

The **** people thats all it to it.

Melodia - Lost City · January 2009

It ticks 3 times over 9 seconds with 15 second cooldown right?

And the first tick comes out on the 3rd second, so if you haven't been stunned, you have anytime before the 3rd second to use a pot to take off bleed. And Dew of God Protection does work. I'm a 7x Robe mage and I use it to survive Phoenix attacks all the time. It still does good dmg.. like around 400~600 dmg with the God protect pot, so I have to use HP pots to survive, and make sure I'm still running from the Veno (who will try to use scarabs on me).

But anyways, I think Flesh Ream and Ripper Bite, shouldn't work on Humans at all until further notice.. Instead decrease the cooldown time on stun so veno's can at least chain stun a bit along with their own spells to help them kill.

Stickygreen - Heavens Tear · January 2009

chain stun? ........ no..... thats why we have bms and why only not work on humans? you mean it should work on elves and untamed?

TigerLily - Lost City · January 2009

I know people claim purify pots work and i really wanted to belive them. But after trying to remove bleed caused by pet using a purify pot (tried many times), i got negative result, it just did not work.
Bleed still kept ticking even tho the pot was used. And i know several people with the same experience b:surrender. It didnt have any effect at all, the bleed status was still there. And a pvp-pot that only work sometimes is kinda pointless.
Maybe the pot is luckbased + glitched or random like most broken stuff in this game b:shocked.
Purify pots do work when barbs used their flesh ream skill, like anyone would need to purify that lol.
Dew of star protection helps a little against phoenix attack since you get higher mag def + phy def when u use it. But it really isn't that effective against bleed.

Mua - Lost City · January 2009

Yeah, it must be glitched because both times I've used it now it's worked perfectly, and I have noticed that sometimes in PVE the icons for a debuff (eg bleed, phys defense reduction) will stay on a mob even when those effects have worn off, so maybe the whole debuff system could use some maintenance.

Shaye - Lost City · January 2009

TigerLily - Lost City wrote: »

Looks so sad when clerics ( that never faced phoenix before in pvp) in panic activated plume shield and tries to heal themselves... still drops in 1 sec.

Plume Shell is the panic button. I'll admit I've popped it out of reflex when a mage hits me, realizing my mistake a second or two later. ;p

Current research on phoenix/bee bleed

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