So why don't you want to do NW anymore?

Antaeus - Dreamweaver

This is created as sort of a Signature sheet. so please if you reply put what level you are, why you are thinking about not doing NW, and any ideas you have.


NW has been getting more and more one sided and is becoming like TW in my opinion. NW has no longer become about skill it is all about who has the better armor. In TW there is always a faction that has almost everyone in the best armor with the best weapons and +12. Now we have squads of 6 R9rr+12 holding off 20 G16 armor people in NW. Also it seems that all the R9's get put into the same nation so the other Nations bases get locked.

My ideas for possible solutions.

1. 20 min before NW people can enter a holding area for the random nation they are put in. only in the holding area can you form a squad for NW. Makes high powered squads harder to make.

2. Split the NW and make a NW for 100+ only. seen a lot of R9 players go through a lot of trouble to avoid other R9 players. make them fight each other so they don't prey on the weak.

Zanryu - Lothranis

103 BM.

****'s boring, the reward doesn't justify the cost, and it's boring. 'nuff said.

bluestuffzzz

Zanryu - Lothranis wrote: »

103 BM.

****'s boring, the reward doesn't justify the cost, and it's boring. 'nuff said.

Each week the market is getting more flooded with cannys and raps, and there is becoming such an influx of these mats, that the prices have dropped dramatically. Over time, I would expect to see Nation War's much like TT - farmed for gear, but not much else. I mean, I make about 20m for 2 hours of constant PvP, and this is a total of 4 hours of PvP each weekend for about 40m coin.

That's better profit than Nirvana, but you have to realize a lot of that coin is spent on charms and apoth. By the time I factor all of that in, my total profit is more like 27-32m coin each weekend. This profit margin is decreasing each week, as I struggle to sell my mats off in a catshop. Less people are buying the mats, because as each week passes, more of the mats are being obtained.

Fast-forward five or six months, and the instance will be worthless along with cannys and raps. That is, unless the upcoming content patch fixes this by doing something.

Is it fun? Yeah, I guess. One can only get so much enjoyment from repeating the process of kill-farming people each weekend. I do however, feel bad for the Euro-zone people, as they must be up in the late, late night (almost morning hours), or they are unable to make coin each week by actively farming and playing.

Serpistica - Sanctuary

102 veno

Yup, the Squads should be made once inside, and yea, its getting boring, 1 or 2 R999 can solo a battle against 20 G16/R8r people, and they just hold the flag until time is over to lock base the opponent.

I noticed one time a toon using the lvl 43 armor of the Dreamchaser pack inside a battle, obviously he was just wasting space, I can bet it was an alt of another nation just to **** the other nations, i can bet it happens a lot, duel client in NW (with the 2 toons inside NW) should be bannable.

And a lot of people are not getting back what they invested to go into NW, soon a lot will just stop going.

Suikyo - Raging Tide

101 barbie, i'm still doing nw on my barb, even whent is getting too boring some times, but yeah, we need a nw for 100+ and other one for 99-, the market here isnt the most important, the thing is that lvl 90- almost cant get any token, they also need some other mats on the nw forges, like TT and lunar mats(just the higher lvl ones, like tt99 gold, and tinders, they r available for chips anyway) that's isnt gonna break the market as some ppl think, that can actually make that lower lvls can farm their own almost endgame gears for a not that higher price, and can stop some complains for the non cash shoppers, ur fist idea is good, actually pretty good if is mixed with the separates nation wars(one lvl 60-99, another one for 100+)

TieIer - Dreamweaver

if you amke it 100+ it will go from the r9s qqing about tt geared ppl to them qqing about anyone without r9

Toomaga - Heavens Tear

Well in all honesty, I am not surprised NW has become this way. In a sense, it was already going to happen it just took time for certain players to develop a strategy for NW, and now that it has been realized by most, it's very simple for even 2 stage 3 r9 players to hold off the opposing side as long as they don't consist of r9's or s3 r9's themselves. I actually had a battle last night 20v3, was 1 stage 3 r9 sin,1 stage 3 r9 veno and 1 partial s3 r9 Archer, needless to say that was enough to hold off our 20 until eventually they had a full 20 as well.

The problem mostly was I was the only flag capable carrying person(I was playing my barb) in that instance, everyone else was either a low HP BM or a squishy arcane, so easy 1 shots for the veno and archer. Really and truly NW is almost no different from any pvp setting, if you don't have the gear to compete you really wont manage a victory especially when you are majorly out geared and dealing with players that actually know what they are doing.

Zanryu - Lothranis

bluestuffzzz wrote: »

Each week the market is getting more flooded with cannys and raps, and there is becoming such an influx of these mats, that the prices have dropped dramatically. Over time, I would expect to see Nation War's much like TT - farmed for gear, but not much else. I mean, I make about 20m for 2 hours of constant PvP, and this is a total of 4 hours of PvP each weekend for about 40m coin.

That's better profit than Nirvana, but you have to realize a lot of that coin is spent on charms and apoth. By the time I factor all of that in, my total profit is more like 27-32m coin each weekend. This profit margin is decreasing each week, as I struggle to sell my mats off in a catshop. Less people are buying the mats, because as each week passes, more of the mats are being obtained.

Fast-forward five or six months, and the instance will be worthless along with cannys and raps. That is, unless the upcoming content patch fixes this by doing something.

Is it fun? Yeah, I guess. One can only get so much enjoyment from repeating the process of kill-farming people each weekend. I do however, feel bad for the Euro-zone people, as they must be up in the late, late night (almost morning hours), or they are unable to make coin each week by actively farming and playing.

At under 10k a canny and 50k a rap on Lothranis it's not worth it. The best most people get would be 350ish tokens per NW on average, most people average 150 or lower. If you're on an american server then you're lucky enough that as of right now your people haven't lowered their prices so dramatically, but it's on its way. As you said, in a few months prices will be at an all time low and hey.. all things considered, they'll just keep getting lower and lower.

Suikyo - Raging Tide

TieIer - Dreamweaver wrote: »

if you amke it 100+ it will go from the r9s qqing about tt geared ppl to them qqing about anyone without r9

if u r lvl 100 and dont even have tt99 gear, u r doing something wrong...(tt99 is almost automatic t2 vanna)

Yin - Momaganon

Because two hours intensive playing on computer is just too much and I got all tokens I need.

Yuniryu - Raging Tide

Antaeus - Dreamweaver wrote: »

This is created as sort of a QQ thread

Fixed

Sister_Warui - Raging Tide

I feel like asking for 100+ NW instance is kind of silly. Seriously. Last NW in TT90 +2/3 gears I made 50 tokens. Not much? No. Not really. But it was the most fun I have ever had. Because i learned to play my role. On offense I made sure the carrier had no traceability across the pond in sin territory. I stunned/immobilized every chance I got on the flag. AoE the main damage dealers...I am way under geared for the instance but I helped my nation out at least a little. Even in low gears and getting farm killed you can be a lot of help with a little planning.

Antaeus - Dreamweaver

Please people try to stay on subject b:thanks

Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973

If the reward for doing NW drops enough for people to stop doing then there will be more tokens for the others that remain. It should be impossible for it to drop enough so that noone would do it.

TieIer - Dreamweaver

Suikyo - Raging Tide wrote: »

if u r lvl 100 and dont even have tt99 gear, u r doing something wrong...(tt99 is almost automatic t2 vanna)

lol guess you didnt understand what i was saying if its 100+ they are going to switch from qqing about tt to qqing about g15 and 16 that isnt r9

also some people cant afford the tailor skills or whatever so they wait till they have all the mats to go straight from tt90 to g15

Sister_Warui - Raging Tide

Antaeus - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Please people try to stay on subject b:thanks

b:surrender sorry. I get kind of carried away with the 100+ instance QQs

Annonrae - Sanctuary

102 Cleric.

Participated a few times before the heavy baselocking and clique-killing started, just to see what it's like, then stopped going. It's just not fun to me. I rolled on a PVE server for a reason: I have absolutely no interest in PVP/PK, no matter if I lose experience or not, drop things or not. I don't even duel.

( And a far more practical reason: NW happens at 5 in the night/morning for me. Most of the time, I'm at work. Nightshift ftw. )

Suggestion: it's probably impossible to implement, but I'd love to see what happens if racking up a certain number of personal credits auto-assigns you to a different nation - ideally the one that's lowest at the moment.

TieIer - Dreamweaver

Annonrae - Sanctuary wrote: »

102 Cleric.

Participated a few times before the heavy baselocking and clique-killing started, just to see what it's like, then stopped going. It's just not fun to me. I rolled on a PVE server for a reason: I have absolutely no interest in PVP/PK, no matter if I lose experience or not, drop things or not. I don't even duel.

( And a far more practical reason: NW happens at 5 in the night/morning for me. Most of the time, I'm at work. Nightshift ftw. )

Suggestion: it's probably impossible to implement, but I'd love to see what happens if racking up a certain number of personal credits auto-assigns you to a different nation - ideally the one that's lowest at the moment.

that just would not be far lol working hard to win only to get moved to the losing team...unless you mean something else

haywiz

103 Wizard

I strongly feel since PWI is full of glitches, big and small, how do we know when our personal credits have glitched in NW?

Until PWI releases some kind of equasion for the distribution of tokens, credits, lands, etc., thats definate, not players guessing, that because of possible glitches, it makes me not want to participate.

One cannot even submit a ticket because it would be based on guessing.
Why wont PWI give us the formula? It makes no sense.

seitori

=Haven't quite quit NW yet, though the crashing prices are making it less lucrative (and as such ~ less worth my time)...=


As for ways to improve it, theres other simple ways to begin to make it far more fair for the everyone else in the masses...


(Have a (sub-program) make records of token rewards given to all squads and when it finds a repeat clone Clique squad that always shows up and has an almost Identical Roster to it and it constantly is having the Lions Share of the token rewards (when compared to everyone else who was on the NWs) then have it lock out and prevent that clique squad from being able to reform & resquad ~ Again and Againn and Againnn and Againnnn! In later NWs) another words No Variety no Guarantee for Reforming Reliability)b:thanks



((But the others are still more correct in still saying that the highest level characters (just like all the rest) should be spread equally amongst all the nations before anyone should be allowed to make squads and that is actually still the best way begin to limit the overwhelming 'KING Squads' who rule over everyone else they face in NW with an absolutely closed Clique of Players who always seems too (Couffs*b:spit) somehow (By chance {my A**b:fatb} innocently ~,~*!? Squad with one another only just about All Of The Time that they squad....))


"reliable squads (with friends) are one thing.. But even that concept can be way too overly abused, as TW~proved long ago..." ~_~' x 2,000!



~Plus a bowlers average limiter locking type of program, being placed on squads for a (limited cumulative total (of any squads) ~ should also be used in preventing squads to be able to become exceedingly strong by setting a limit to the total combined levels any squads could have in their squads)~



For example: say a full (10-man squad) or (any combined squad under that number) was only allowed to have a limited level ceiling of (420 combined {levels/points}) you could still have a (4-man squad of {4 105th lvs} squaded with each other) but not any more then that, so that the squads didn't get to strong and undefeatable (though 4-R9rrrs can pretty much still be unstoppable if they want to be) something like this ~combined level limiter idea~ would still force the more equal (Fairly) spread base of the powerful throughout the Nations of NW and would make it more competitive since more limited numbered squads of R9RRRs would have to begin to truly compete against one another rather then always being allowed to team together for easy Dibs & Bogarting on the rewards of those Nacho's...b:victoryb:bye

Suikyo - Raging Tide

TieIer - Dreamweaver wrote: »

lol guess you didnt understand what i was saying if its 100+ they are going to switch from qqing about tt to qqing about g15 and 16 that isnt r9

also some people cant afford the tailor skills or whatever so they wait till they have all the mats to go straight from tt90 to g15

wait, afford? b:surrender lazy ppl, i've farmed my manufacturing skills

Annonrae - Sanctuary

TieIer - Dreamweaver wrote: »

that just would not be far lol working hard to win only to get moved to the losing team...unless you mean something else

No, that's exactly what I mean.

The most complaints I've heard from others about NW isn't so much about being facerolled by some R9r3 squads, but being baselocked and thus being unable to participate in any further fights for a prolongued span of time. On Sanctuary at least it seems that some of these R9r3 squads are responsible for baselocking, with everyone else happily trailing in their wake. And so far, short of completely disabling squads, or somehow force-distributing the high-levels or well-geared players equally across all nations by some magical mathematics that somehow calculate SF based not only on what they've equipped but also on what could be lurking in their inventory, there's no way to stop that from happening.

NW is 2 hours long; how long do you think it will take these high-powered toons to reach, say... 6-10k ( or any number in that ballpark, a HIGH number, to be sure ) personal credit, especially if they're moving in a squad?

What I'd like to see is a 1-hour "breaking point" whereafter people or squads who've accumulated a high amount of personal credit are automatically assigned to a nation that is low on the list. Wouldn't that automatically break the baselock, since the ones who set it up in the first place are now forced to fight against it? It'd give the powerful toons something to actually work for as well as those who've been baselocked a chance to pick up the cudgels again.

*shrug* It's just an idea, probably impossible to implement and unlikely to ever happen.

plusonepostcount

Suikyo - Raging Tide wrote: »

101 barbie, i'm still doing nw on my barb, even whent is getting too boring some times, but yeah, we need a nw for 100+ and other one for 99-, the market here isnt the most important, the thing is that lvl 90- almost cant get any token, they also need some other mats on the nw forges, like TT and lunar mats(just the higher lvl ones, like tt99 gold, and tinders, they r available for chips anyway) that's isnt gonna break the market as some ppl think, that can actually make that lower lvls can farm their own almost endgame gears for a not that higher price, and can stop some complains for the non cash shoppers, ur fist idea is good, actually pretty good if is mixed with the separates nation wars(one lvl 60-99, another one for 100+)

Sorry but I can't agree with the fact of anyone below 100 going simply put because theres nothing they can get and use from the reward forges from it other than if they want to make an 80 twink with a warsoul weapon which we all know isn't gonna happen as even with tokens its around 400 mil and 5500 tokens for the 2nd cast warsoul weapons. Other than the warsoul fragments there is absolutely nothing anyone below lvl 100 can use for anything as they can't use NV gear yet so they dont need rap's canny's and so on.

If anything they should change the requirements on forges to make the items lvl specific.

Also a few more things I think should be added to the forges that those lvls of players can actually use for there lvls especially if a lvl tiered nw is created at some point in the future. As it is though with the amount of tokens at the moment theres still a bit for profit left to be made after repairs/charm/pot costs though that will soon drop to a point where it costs more to do the event than you can get out of it.

If anything there should be some sort of stuff added like extasy cards or something without a coin cost but a decent amount of tokens required to get it. Though it shouldn't be too out there to make it still not worth doing but don't put something like 10 mil big notes in it either. ecasty and excitement cards would be more than enough.

However charms are not required they're a luxury irregardless of how you look at it this is the plain and simple truth of it. They are not required to do the event so this idea of a charm cost is a fallacy in itself. Sure they help tremendously and almost every player that can afford it makes sure to have 1 sometimes even 2 charms per nw they use cause it can significantly change the tide of a battle at times. But again its not required its something an individual purchases from the boutique to have an advantage over other players where and when and how its used is the discretion of the player.

As for people not wanting people to be able to squad outside of nv I strongly dissagree I run with my guild every time we are all in vent and coordinating with one another one where were at where help is needed and so on. It wouldn't be so neccisary if when chatting there wasn't 1: a 10k fee to talk in nation chat 2: everytime there was some sort of update on the map such as g5 is under attack or we have successfully defended b4 from light nation etc etc didn't interupt the chat process forcing players to click back down on the chat box unable to even hit enter to finish typing a message to communicate between battle fields.

All in all I'll keep doing nw for gearing out alts and making warsoul weapon eventually just because its always been a long time goal of mine as well as it gets our faction together to do things in the game other than just **** around in arch seeing what everyone else is not doing at that point in time.

Kinjeto - Raging Tide

bluestuffzzz wrote: »

Each week the market is getting more flooded with cannys and raps, and there is becoming such an influx of these mats, that the prices have dropped dramatically. Over time, I would expect to see Nation War's much like TT - farmed for gear, but not much else. I mean, I make about 20m for 2 hours of constant PvP, and this is a total of 4 hours of PvP each weekend for about 40m coin.

That's better profit than Nirvana, but you have to realize a lot of that coin is spent on charms and apoth. By the time I factor all of that in, my total profit is more like 27-32m coin each weekend. This profit margin is decreasing each week, as I struggle to sell my mats off in a catshop. Less people are buying the mats, because as each week passes, more of the mats are being obtained.

Fast-forward five or six months, and the instance will be worthless along with cannys and raps. That is, unless the upcoming content patch fixes this by doing something.

Is it fun? Yeah, I guess. One can only get so much enjoyment from repeating the process of kill-farming people each weekend. I do however, feel bad for the Euro-zone people, as they must be up in the late, late night (almost morning hours), or they are unable to make coin each week by actively farming and playing.

Sounds like PWI need to hire an economist. Oh wait that might cost them to much.

Kniraven - Lost City

My squad i go with every single NW does fantastic. I am the best geared person in pt with r9 wep and a mix of r8 recast and nv 3rd cast armor.
Nobody else has even a r9 wep.

Some of my squad is in nv 2nd cast and r8 gear. We consistently win wars even when its 20 vs just 6 of us. We base lock other nations. We play strategically and beat much better geared.players.

Stop the QQ. Learn to play.
My squad has been winning nation and a major factor in that fact for our last 8 wars.

Lingerie - Harshlands

I just wish it was shorter, 2 hours straight is a little much.

Vazil - Sanctuary

Lingerie - Harshlands wrote: »

I just wish it was shorter, 2 hours straight is a little much.

87 Veno

I absolutely agree with Lingerie. I've passed on the last 6 NW's because when I start thinking about how long it lasts and the intensity of trying to stay on the battlefield (avoiding base lock) and survive enough re-spawns to last a battle duration, bed sounds much better. I'm only lvl 87 and my gear, while quite decent for my level, is nothing compared to nearly everyone else. I HAVE to play harder and smarter in NW to compete.

I still do pretty well when I do participate - usually around 40-50 tokens. I cannot personally use the tokens; nor am I saving them for R9 or anything else - I use them for profit so I can buy supplies and gear as I level (contributing to the in-game economy). In a way, I think it is better I don't participate so that the people who can really use the tokens have more opportunity to get them. Unfortunately, it's really the only decent source of income for me. I am also a very casual player and spend maybe, on a good week, 10 hours in game. I want to make that time count for progress and enjoyment.

Sorry for getting a bit off topic at this point, but what I'd much prefer is content update to make the game exciting and interesting again. Questing and grinding are rediculous exercises in boredom and substandard rewards. I can kill 85 mobs for .5% experience in 45 minutes, or spend 15-40 minutes in FCC (when I can find a squad) for 15-25% experience. I really miss the days when I first started playing that leveling could be accomplished via quests and they were exciting because you got to see new content and feel like you were progressing at the same time. Everything now is just rinse and repeat until you level to rinse and repeat until you level and eventually get to new content that you can then start to rinse and repeat all over again.

TieIer - Dreamweaver

Suikyo - Raging Tide wrote: »

wait, afford? b:surrender lazy ppl, i've farmed my manufacturing skills

some poeple dont have that kind of time as well you should be thankful you can spend alot of time in game while other may only get an hour a day or just a few hours on the weekend theres also no harm in having someone else make **** for you

plusonepostcount wrote: »

Sorry but I can't agree with the fact of anyone below 100 going simply put because theres nothing they can get and use from the reward forges from it other than if they want to make an 80 twink with a warsoul weapon which we all know isn't gonna happen as even with tokens its around 400 mil and 5500 tokens for the 2nd cast warsoul weapons. Other than the warsoul fragments there is absolutely nothing anyone below lvl 100 can use for anything as they can't use NV gear yet so they dont need rap's canny's and so on.

If anything they should change the requirements on forges to make the items lvl specific.

Also a few more things I think should be added to the forges that those lvls of players can actually use for there lvls especially if a lvl tiered nw is created at some point in the future. As it is though with the amount of tokens at the moment theres still a bit for profit left to be made after repairs/charm/pot costs though that will soon drop to a point where it costs more to do the event than you can get out of it.

If anything there should be some sort of stuff added like extasy cards or something without a coin cost but a decent amount of tokens required to get it. Though it shouldn't be too out there to make it still not worth doing but don't put something like 10 mil big notes in it either. ecasty and excitement cards would be more than enough.

However charms are not required they're a luxury irregardless of how you look at it this is the plain and simple truth of it. They are not required to do the event so this idea of a charm cost is a fallacy in itself. Sure they help tremendously and almost every player that can afford it makes sure to have 1 sometimes even 2 charms per nw they use cause it can significantly change the tide of a battle at times. But again its not required its something an individual purchases from the boutique to have an advantage over other players where and when and how its used is the discretion of the player.

As for people not wanting people to be able to squad outside of nv I strongly dissagree I run with my guild every time we are all in vent and coordinating with one another one where were at where help is needed and so on. It wouldn't be so neccisary if when chatting there wasn't 1: a 10k fee to talk in nation chat 2: everytime there was some sort of update on the map such as g5 is under attack or we have successfully defended b4 from light nation etc etc didn't interupt the chat process forcing players to click back down on the chat box unable to even hit enter to finish typing a message to communicate between battle fields.

All in all I'll keep doing nw for gearing out alts and making warsoul weapon eventually just because its always been a long time goal of mine as well as it gets our faction together to do things in the game other than just **** around in arch seeing what everyone else is not doing at that point in time.

you mean you have to be a high enough level to sell what you make with tokens? :O guess im haxxing

plusonepostcount

TieIer - Dreamweaver wrote: »

some poeple dont have that kind of time as well you should be thankful you can spend alot of time in game while other may only get an hour a day or just a few hours on the weekend theres also no harm in having someone else make **** for you



you mean you have to be a high enough level to sell what you make with tokens? :O guess im haxxing

No I meant you have to be a high enough lvl to actually use the items you can make with tokens NW wasn't made as some sort of business venture for people to make money from otherwise they'd just outright put coin in the forges for you to make with the tokens its about people actually being able to use those items not sell them.

opkossy

plusonepostcount wrote: »

ts about people actually being able to use those items not sell them.

If that was true it wouldn't be tradable and it would be for level 100+ alone.

So you're completely wrong and just because you don't like that others can use it to try and make some coin doesn't mean that wasn't a consideration and part of the design.

Irca - Harshlands

TieIer - Dreamweaver wrote: »

some poeple dont have that kind of time as well you should be thankful you can spend alot of time in game while other may only get an hour a day or just a few hours on the weekend theres also no harm in having someone else make **** for you

wrong...

my husband and I worked our butts off to farm our manu skills.

It also took us a year and a half (it would be much shorter time now) because when we started the game we couldn't play as often. This was also farmed before nw was around and not very long after nirvana was implemented. Hell I am working on my apoth now...the last one to do (luckily he already has it)

Just because people don't have the time to get it in 1 week doesn't mean it's not a reasonable goal to reach. qq People with the instant satisfaction problem. (not saying you have it by any means, just have a problem with people saying exactly what you just said in that quote. Manage the little time you have in game a little better to potentially help you in the future)