DoTs or HP?

Aesthor - Heavens Tear
Aesthor - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,845 Arc User
edited November 2010 in Archer
I'm curious what gems the math wizzes put into their armor o.o. I personally haven't calculated whether DoTs are worth it, but at the time I figured since Perfect Citrines and DoTs were similar in price, I went with DoTs for the damage instead of the ~190HP (my armors are 3 socket), but I haven't done the math on whether that was actually better.

What's your take on attack level vs. HP?
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Post edited by Aesthor - Heavens Tear on

Comments

  • Boogiepanda - Raging Tide
    Boogiepanda - Raging Tide Posts: 4,682 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    I think the balance point is 6000 HP without sharding. Since DoT (assuming 24 sockets) gives 24% extra attack, full perfect citrine sharding around 1.5k HP, increasing your HP by 25%.
  • Kaste - Sanctuary
    Kaste - Sanctuary Posts: 1,353 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    In my opinion:

    HP/Vit stones = PvE

    DoT/Jade = PvP


    For PvE having DoT makes you susceptible to die when getting agro (what i doubt) so i'd go for HP there makes heal easier too ^^. As I'd say you need some HP for PvP, having DoT makes you kill people faster so you will be hurt less. So depending on your goals, choose the shards ^^.
    Feel free to PM me for help.
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  • Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973
    Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 Posts: 7,881 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Keep in mind if you already have 30 attack level from the facebook blessing, 24 more will take you to 54.

    154 / 130 = 1.18 so 18% more damage, not 24.

    It really comes down to personal preference. If you find yourself split you can do half and half.
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  • Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,385 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    who cares about hp... go all dots. cost wise... dots are more or less that of a perf hp (62 hp... i think). in my case it would be an average 180 raw dmg vs 62 hp. factoring in my natural crit of 1/3... that would average out to be 240 raw dmg vs 62 hp (60 pvp dmg vs 62 hp). and finally... both of the r8 archers in your squad are all dots.... peer pressure anyone. need i say more.
    1. If I kill you; do something about it yourself, don't go complaining to my wife.
    2. If you have less kill counts then me, don't expect me to take pk advice from you.
    3. If you are hiding behind an alt, don't expect me to acknowledge your existence.

    Tokichiro - Heavy Armor Fish / Kiyoshi - Dual Blade Elf
  • Aesthor - Heavens Tear
    Aesthor - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,845 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    peer pressure anyone. need i say more.



    b:shedtear Okay *goes squishy build*
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  • Demon_EA - Harshlands
    Demon_EA - Harshlands Posts: 294 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    attack level gems? omg i love attack level gems... how do i get them...? i probably can not afford it :(
    The one and only... demon_troll... i will be pwn when i go demon again >)
  • Ninnuam - Sanctuary
    Ninnuam - Sanctuary Posts: 1,086 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    attack level gems? omg i love attack level gems... how do i get them...? i probably can not afford it :(

    They can't be obtained through legitimate means anymore I'm afraid. There is a trick however. First you must get ahold of a boot up floppy or a cd. Insert it into the appropriate drive in your pc and restart your computer. Wait a bit until it does its thing, and once you're able to type you must type in "format C:"

    Then restart your computer again and when you log onto PWI you will be able to buy them at any merchant for 50k.
    b:dirty
  • Egaenil - Heavens Tear
    Egaenil - Heavens Tear Posts: 853 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Any serious twer/pvper will have a mix of jade gem AND vit gems.

    +24 def is just perfect after that, extra def effect quickly drop off

    +1 vit not only give you extra hp, it also gives you extra def

    you really should aim for 10k+ unbuffed hp with 20-30 def lvl

    in saying that, you need both rings and beck/belt highly refined, otherwise it is a waste of def lvl, if you gona stay low refined, well.. you might as well use vit gem.b:pleased
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  • volst
    volst Posts: 180
    edited November 2010
    Why bother with hp/def shards for pvp? You'll probably just get 1 shotted by some wiz as long as you don't have your damage reduction buff up anyways.
  • Egaenil - Heavens Tear
    Egaenil - Heavens Tear Posts: 853 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    volst wrote: »
    Why bother with hp/def shards for pvp? You'll probably just get 1 shotted by some wiz as long as you don't have your damage reduction buff up anyways.

    So that you don't get 1 shotted by some cleric b:laugh
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  • Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,385 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Any serious twer/pvper will have a mix of jade gem AND vit gems.

    +24 def is just perfect after that, extra def effect quickly drop off

    +1 vit not only give you extra hp, it also gives you extra def

    you really should aim for 10k+ unbuffed hp with 20-30 def lvl

    in saying that, you need both rings and beck/belt highly refined, otherwise it is a waste of def lvl, if you gona stay low refined, well.. you might as well use vit gem.b:pleased

    considering everyone has a +30 atk blessing... any def level up to 30 will be canceling out blessings. So theoretically you can have 48 def level and still not be really affected by the decreasing returns of def levels (as long as blessings are in play).
    1. If I kill you; do something about it yourself, don't go complaining to my wife.
    2. If you have less kill counts then me, don't expect me to take pk advice from you.
    3. If you are hiding behind an alt, don't expect me to acknowledge your existence.

    Tokichiro - Heavy Armor Fish / Kiyoshi - Dual Blade Elf
  • Fyren - Heavens Tear
    Fyren - Heavens Tear Posts: 72 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    or be cheap and use immac citrines like me, only that godoffrenzy +12 bm and that r8 psy hurts anyway b:chuckle
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  • Egaenil - Heavens Tear
    Egaenil - Heavens Tear Posts: 853 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    considering everyone has a +30 atk blessing... any def level up to 30 will be canceling out blessings. So theoretically you can have 48 def level and still not be really affected by the decreasing returns of def levels (as long as blessings are in play).

    b:bye yes, it is all 100% true, IF you attack yourself, otherwise no

    your def index is independent of what other's attack indexb:pleased
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]"wink wink"
  • Boogiepanda - Raging Tide
    Boogiepanda - Raging Tide Posts: 4,682 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    JoSD is better suited if you have high refines on your armours, since the HP bonus from cit/vits would be less in proportion to your HP already.
  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    In TW survival is important. If you have a good weapon your presence won't be ignored by enemy archers, and just when you think you're rich or you're the best, there's about 5 average archers ordered to target you on sight. This isn't 1v1 fights where you gotta kill someone before he kills you, if they ganged up on you and managed to kill you but lost 1, or even 2 of their cheap archers, well i'd say the other team won out.

    Good archers last long in a fight, those are the effective archers. there's also these people with +7 gear +10 wep, but they die fast and never really stand out. Survival has a lot to do with skill and experience, but having a bunch of vit stones certainly helps. Well, if you're so good that you can walk out of ganks alive to keep killing, then go ahead and shard whatever you want. Otherwise, sharding defensively is the way to go.
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  • Egaenil - Heavens Tear
    Egaenil - Heavens Tear Posts: 853 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    JoSD is better suited if you have high refines on your armours, since the HP bonus from cit/vits would be less in proportion to your HP already.

    EERRR.... no

    JoSD is better suited if you have high refines on your rings/neck/belt, since we have a very low defence to start with, to fully gain the extra defence we gain from JoSD we need to refine those things rather high. Of course high refine on armours also helps.

    Always go for vit gem, simply because for each vit you also gaining def bonuse. 14hp x 10 vs 120hp, Vit gems win easily. b:bye
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]"wink wink"
  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    I thought vit for archers is 13 hp/vit.
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  • Borsuc - Raging Tide
    Borsuc - Raging Tide Posts: 1,526 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    EERRR.... no

    JoSD is better suited if you have high refines on your rings/neck/belt, since we have a very low defence to start with, to fully gain the extra defence we gain from JoSD we need to refine those things rather high. Of course high refine on armours also helps.

    Always go for vit gem, simply because for each vit you also gaining def bonuse. 14hp x 10 vs 120hp, Vit gems win easily. b:bye
    I'm sorry but boogie was right.
    Actually you BOTH were right.

    Say you have 10k HP. Adding a citrine gem, you get 1.15% more survivability. Now assuming 1 def = 1% damage reduction (which was proven in some other thread), then adding a JoSD gives you 2% more survivability. Obvious which is better right?

    Same with damage reduction, the higher you have it as base from refines, the more effective JoSD will be in contrast to sharding whatever def you need (pdef/mdef/etc).
  • Boogiepanda - Raging Tide
    Boogiepanda - Raging Tide Posts: 4,682 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    EERRR.... no

    Say you have 10k HP. Adding a citrine gem, you get 1.15% more survivability. Now assuming 1 def = 1% damage reduction (which was proven in some other thread), then adding a JoSD gives you 2% more survivability. Obvious which is better right?

    Say what?
  • Teppeii - Dreamweaver
    Teppeii - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,206 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    I've said it before. and I'll say it again.

    Diminishing returns.

    Get HP/Vit stones. Get your hp up. Survive better. Suck less.
    On indefinite hiatus :3
  • Paramedic - Dreamweaver
    Paramedic - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,801 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    so much missinfo in this topic b:faint
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